'If I don't collect cans, I will not have food'
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Originally posted by redDUST:
cleaners' job are basically taken up by foreign workers already, imo. they are deemed cheaper and `quicker'.
for the fastfood industry, i suspect there is a ratio or quota they enforce when hiring seniors. after all, all the macs and kfcs need to project a youthful, vibrant image. there is so many seniors they can hire without jeopardising their image.
lastly, i think many of the seniors we see collecting cans are also illiterate. it makes them barely employable in today's context.
Ok. Thanks to both of you.
But still, i believe that there still must be a better alternative then collecting cans
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please lor
can organise things that dun involve cans or not?
no other ideas meh?
明明 know that old ppl rely on cans for their livelihood -
Originally posted by 4sg:
Sad state of affair for our old, uneducated and poor, isn't it?Sorry double post.
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Originally posted by crimsontactics:
Ok. Thanks to both of you.
But still, i believe that there still must be a better alternative then collecting cans
The old, uneducated and poor are hardy and strong-willed ppl who want to be independent.
The truth of the matter is that they face structural unemployment and it is not easy to solve.
In today context, there is no place for illiterate ppl but sadly, they are here. -
Originally posted by crimsontactics:
Ok. Thanks to both of you.
But still, i believe that there still must be a better alternative then collecting cans
No, there isn't. The employer would rather employ young and cheap foreigner workers if there are any other jobs around.
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Originally posted by 333225520:
No, there isn't. The employer would rather employ young and cheap foreigner workers if there are any other jobs around.
So basically its those FTs fault again?
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Originally posted by crimsontactics:
Ok. Thanks to both of you.
But still, i believe that there still must be a better alternative then collecting cans
Imagine this - if there is no job as cleaner and dishwasher, what alternative? better or worse.
I tell you a sad story. I saw one very old woman, single without husband or child. Her job as a toilet cleaner was replaced by foreigners. She was very worried sick about her living expenses.
She went to MOM for help. She was there to begged, cried and even shouted. But as a govt org, there was little MOM could do to help her gained back her job. Remember seeing the officers looking dumbly at her and doing nothing for her.
Tears well-up in my eyes when I witnessed this incident. And I have to hide myself to prevent embarassing myself. -
Originally posted by crimsontactics:
So basically its those FTs fault again?
The way I see it. It is not purely FT fault. It should be combination of factors at play. The global world, the policies of the govt, the blatant, exploitive employers, the MOM, the ambivalent attitude of the ppl etc ....
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Originally posted by 4sg:
Imagine this - if there is no job as cleaner and dishwasher, what alternative? better or worse.
I tell you a sad story. I saw one very old woman, single without husband or child. Her job as a toilet cleaner was replaced by foreigners. She was very worried sick about her living expenses.
She went to MOM for help. She was there to begged, cried and even shouted. But as a govt org, there was little MOM could do to help her gained back her job. Remember seeing the officers looking dumbly at her and doing nothing for her.
Tears well-up in my eyes when I witnessed this incident. And I have to hide myself to prevent embarassing myself.Hold on, don't be so emotional.
Yes i agree, there are plenty to be done for our seniors who may not fully benefit from the CPF system due to late introduction.
But i also think that they themselves, being strong-willed and determined as they used to be, should seek our better alternatives rather than the gathering cans. For example maybe working at a hawker center as a part time stall helper.
I know its stupid of me to comment so much about this when im sitting in the comfort of my home behind my com, but i do think that this is the time their past ideology comes into play.
With our help and their never-say-die attitude, they will surely come out of their poverty cycle, to hell with whatever the govt may provide.
It surely beats the routine collection of cans.
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Originally posted by crimsontactics:
Hold on, don't be so emotional.
Yes i agree, there are plenty to be done for our seniors who may not fully benefit from the CPF system due to late introduction.
But i also think that they themselves, being strong-willed and determined as they used to be, should seek our better alternatives rather than the gathering cans. For example maybe working at a hawker center as a part time stall helper.
I know its stupid of me to comment so much about this when im sitting in the comfort of my home behind my com, but i do think that this is the time their past ideology comes into play.
With our help and their never-say-die attitude, they will surely come out of their poverty cycle, to hell with whatever the govt may provide.
It surely beats the routine collection of cans.
Oh, I am not emo......just recapping on one incident, that all.
I sure hope the govt and our society can be more embracing, more accommodating to this group of ppl.
Hope in tomorrow NDay speech, there would be something for them.
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Originally posted by 4sg:
Oh, I am not emo......just recapping on one incident, that all.
I sure hope the govt and our society can be more embracing, more accommodating to this group of ppl.
Hope in tomorrow NDay speech, there would be something for them.Yeah! Its not hope, it a must!
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Originally posted by 4sg:
Oh, I am not emo......just recapping on one incident, that all.
I sure hope the govt and our society can be more embracing, more accommodating to this group of ppl.
Hope in tomorrow NDay speech, there would be something for them.cash ? solution ? or policy ? own pocket more impt.
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Originally posted by crimsontactics:
Yeah! Its not hope, it a must!
Yeah, I agree.
After that incident, whenever I visit toilet and seeing that it is an old woman cleaner. I always try to aim properly, make sure the paper drop neatly into the flush bowl etc.
It is my way of doing my little bit for them lah... -
see lar , study study lor ...
everyone was born kind and smart ... education ruined it all ...
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Originally posted by HeiHao:
cash ? solution ? or policy ? own pocket more impt.
This my personal tots only huh - so dun flame me if you dun agree.
Cash for them - can work short term but not sure of long term.
Policy change - would be very good. Maybe some quota/control system.
- in hiring, certain percentage must be Sg and the rest foreigners?
- if MOM recommends these ppl to the employer, the employer can't resist hiring them without valid/ good reason?
- more interventing power given to MOM to protect working senior citizens? -
Originally posted by dragg:
i wonder who suggested breaking this record in the first place. isnt it common knowledge that a lot of old folks are collecting cans for a living?
its ok to suggest this record breaking project.but why need to go around collect cans? i bet they themselves buy can drinks too. so many schools involved, just get the students in the participating schools to help la. like set up bins for cans in school compounds which will be used for this project la. like that also cannot figure out meh. with mediacock invovled, they also can get at their canteen mah.
so much for education.
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Originally posted by yong93:
see lar , study study lor ...
everyone was born kind and smart ... education ruined it all ...
Sorry, I don't agree with your view. It has nothing to do with studying.
The problem is the opposite. The lack of studying/learning opportunity for this old folk. And this problem is compounded by their age.
Remember, they were mostly born during the WWII. What we have now as basic, were luxury or unheard of to them then. -
Originally posted by 4sg:
Sorry, I don't agree with your view. It has nothing to do with studying.
The problem is the opposite. The lack of studying/learning opportunity for this old folk. And this problem is compounded by their age.
Remember, they were mostly born during the WWII. What we have now as basic, were luxury or unheard of to them then.However, i find that education is not the real solution, moral values are.
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Originally posted by crimsontactics:
Hold on, don't be so emotional.
Yes i agree, there are plenty to be done for our seniors who may not fully benefit from the CPF system due to late introduction.
But i also think that they themselves, being strong-willed and determined as they used to be, should seek our better alternatives rather than the gathering cans. For example maybe working at a hawker center as a part time stall helper.
I know its stupid of me to comment so much about this when im sitting in the comfort of my home behind my com, but i do think that this is the time their past ideology comes into play.
With our help and their never-say-die attitude, they will surely come out of their poverty cycle, to hell with whatever the govt may provide.
It surely beats the routine collection of cans.
Yes, it is stupid. Like the Chinese saying "who want to be bald if have hair"? You think the old folk would prefer to go collect trash can if they can have a proper job as a stall helper (which probably pay at least 10 times more than what they are earning!!!).
If you are a store owner, would you hire an elderly who is slow and take like 5 min to clear 1 table and have problem remembering order?
Oh yes, I remember there's still a job around for them. Nowadays, everywhere I go, I see old people starting to sell tissue papers too. But seriously, people who buy from them is usually due to compassion more than the need (it's cheaper and quite convenient to go and buy tissue paper from any convenient store instead when needed anyway).
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Anyway, I am really interested to know how the gov is helping these group of people. Is the help sufficient? If yes, why they still need to go and collect trash?
I heard some arguments before that some of the elderly do it as they are fiercely independent and don't want to reply on other people or are too free (which I simply think is crap).
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Originally posted by 333225520:
Anyway, I am really interested to know how the gov is helping these group of people. Is the help sufficient? If yes, why they still need to go and collect trash?
I heard some arguments before that some of the elderly do it as they are fiercely independent and don't want to reply on other people or are too free (which I simply think is crap).
yes, there is but these group of people are either unaware of it or dun understand how to apply for it. even if you can apply for it, be prepare to wait for at least a few months + countless of forms to fill up and wait for approval + they keep give u incomeplete infomation of what things to gather (e.g pay slip, ez link card, IC, birth cert etc.. so that when u got the things they want, they tell u that u dun have that then u go back again to gather) + monthly spot check from them.
what i hate the most is them giving you incomplete information of what things is needed to apply and hope that you will give up bothering them.
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Originally posted by freedom4ever:
yes, there is but these group of people are either unaware of it or dun understand how to apply for it. even if you can apply for it, be prepare to wait for at least a few months + countless of forms to fill up and wait for approval + they keep give u incomeplete infomation of what things to gather (e.g pay slip, ez link card, IC, birth cert etc.. so that when u got the things they want, they tell u that u dun have that then u go back again to gather) + monthly spot check from them.
what i hate the most is them giving you incomplete information of what things is needed to apply and hope that you will give up bothering them.
ya lor.
always like that one. when time to pay, no need to apply. when time to get money, must apply, otherwise it'll be forfeit.
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There are lots of can collectors out there. Many need not collect them for a living. Most collect them because it can be collected and there is a side income. The ones that are really down and out, will not be collecting cans. Simply because collecting cans cannot sustain a person, anyway it is just not worth the effort to collect enough to sustain life. It is to supplement their income. Whatever that may be. The specially challenged who are collecting cans are doing so for their minders.
The poor can never be eradicated, no matter what government does, some will always go that way, down and out.
If the government were to give $1million to each and every citizen, it would just be a matter of time before the poor would emerge again, and start collecting cans. And of course the government would be blamed for that too.
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Originally posted by mancha:
There are lots of can collectors out there. Many need not collect them for a living. Most collect them because it can be collected and there is a side income. The ones that are really down and out, will not be collecting cans. Simply because collecting cans cannot sustain a person, anyway it is just not worth the effort to collect enough to sustain life. It is to supplement their income. Whatever that may be. The specially challenged who are collecting cans are doing so for their minders.
The poor can never be eradicated, no matter what government does, some will always go that way, down and out.
If the government were to give $1million to each and every citizen, it would just be a matter of time before the poor would emerge again, and start collecting cans. And of course the government would be blamed for that too.
So your hobby is also collecting can?
The poor has to collect can to supplement their income because it is not enough to survive. Alternative is to go begging (which is illegal) or start selling tissue (begging ppl to buy tissue which most don't need but is legal?).
Strange that the gov keep saying there plenty of help available for the very poor yet it seem it is not enough. So what our gov doing?
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Originally posted by 333225520:
So your hobby is also collecting can?
The poor has to collect can to supplement their income because it is not enough to survive. Alternative is to go begging (which is illegal) or start selling tissue (begging ppl to buy tissue which most don't need but is legal?).
Strange that the gov keep saying there plenty of help available for the very poor yet it seem it is not enough. So what our gov doing?
So are you also collecting cans?
If the government do enough for the poor, believe me there will be more poor.
I am a beer drinker at hawker centres, and the coffee stall owner has stories to tell about each can collector at the centre. Not all are needy as they make out to be. And these can collectors know about government payouts through the CPF better than I do.