USA, Crotia, Australia... and lot's of countries also using China players.
I think it's a trend we can't reject.Either you accept or die die also had to accept the fact that, China produce top table tennis players and they are all over the world.Either you use them or you loose them.Simple as that!
So, now i surrender and i accept what our government is doing.
No use arguing anymore!!!
I have copied your comments and link here:
http://newsintercom.org/index.php?itemid=612#16499
If this is the way to go for Singapore, then dun even dream of a Singaporean* even competiting in Table tennis... budding TT players can forget abt joining the team and do something more productive instead.
*tsk... I mean a true Singaporean born here, as oppose to one that is bought over.. Singaporean used to be something you could be proud of... now... have to do a footnote to clarify the meaning.
Then might as well forgo NS and hire Mercenaries to defend Singapore instead.... Same theory what.... If they can pay for foreigners to represent Singapore in sports, might as well pay mercenaries to defend Singapore as well....
Originally posted by deathwish:Then might as well forgo NS and hire Mercenaries to defend Singapore instead.... Same theory what.... If they can pay for foreigners to represent Singapore in sports, might as well pay mercenaries to defend Singapore as well....
they are called gurkhas..... but they are not citizens.
nsmen are cheaper than mercenaries and are better trained. they also have no voice of oppinion, so theyr pretty much disgruntled but obedient dogs.
Originally posted by ivebeenhad:nsmen are cheaper than mercenaries and are better trained. they also have no voice of oppinion, so theyr pretty much disgruntled but obedient dogs.
Jackpot!!!
Would Singaporeans prefer another 45 years without an Olympic medal with our local players or greater sporting successes with FT? It's the same issue with the import of foreign scientists, doctors, musicians and fund managers.
There are 2 types of citizens that SSC must answer to, for it is from them where the funding comes from.
!st type:- Belief that sports are a social interaction, to learn and gain from the benefits of sports. Competitions which are friendly, without fear or favour to anyone - white, black, religions, etc - to celebrate the joy of living and being human, a celebration of youthful endeavours and achievement, each a showcase of their national spirit in their attempts at competition, flaws and all. Participation is the ideal, and not the prize.
2nd type:- Belief that sports are coldly calculative gambles to win medals, nothing else. Full stop. Either you win, or there will be no funding. It is hard earned money by taxpayers, and not to be frivously spent and indulging in 'fun games'.
Thus SSC has to balance between the 2 categories of citizens.
My personal belief that STTA management team is made up of the 2nd type of citizens. There is no democracy practised. Fully authoritarian, with only one goal in mind - winning, regardless of whatever excuses given. Only the best gets in, and no such thing as 'love for the sport'. This is sport's 'darkside'.
The darkside is real and not some star wars religion. Each and everyone of us posses it, and had been seduced by it, by one thing or another, at one time or another, hidden behind our smiles.
It occurs when we have to make a decision that go against our principles, moral values, and religious teachings, in order to achieve something. No one, being a mortal being, can claim they had never given in to the darkside, not even just once.
It is the darkside that trainers and sportsperson must embrace, if they want to excel, more so if they don't have that precious gift or talent in them. Hours daily 24/7 spent to achieve something that is often beyond known limits of human ability. The win is all that counts, everything else is a lie.
This is the darkside of sports. It's not something to be proud of. But a reality no less in this day and age of international competition. My personal belief is that STTA is engaging in such. So if you want to play table tennis, be prepared to go into the darkside. It is not for fun and games. It is for real. A justification for taxpayers hard earned money.
My personal take - sports should be fun and games, a celebration of youth, but then, heck! i don't have the money to fund such games.:-P
Originally posted by oxford mushroom:Would Singaporeans prefer another 45 years without an Olympic medal with our local players or greater sporting successes with FT? It's the same issue with the import of foreign scientists, doctors, musicians and fund managers.
for me i dont mind waiting. no medal then no medal lor. worse come to worse is dun participate in olympic if we dont have the people to participate. our country is study first place, the rest is not important. with good education then will have good career and good life in the future.
Originally posted by freedom4ever:for me i dont mind waiting. no medal then no medal lor. worse come to worse is dun participate in olympic if we dont have the people to participate. our country is study first place, the rest is not important. with good education then will have good career and good life in the future.
I don't mind Singapore not winning a medal too. Don't see the GDP going up a point by winning a gold medal anyway. But it's the view of the majority that matters and I guess they do want to win. Football fans want to support a winning team like Man U or Chelsea, not Barnsley.
I agree, I prefer singapore to win a medal with our locals, not imports.
imagine what message we are sending out..
"can't do well in your country, come singapore, we will make you millionaires".
Originally posted by xtreyier:There are 2 types of citizens that SSC must answer to, for it is from them where the funding comes from.
!st type:- Belief that sports are a social interaction, to learn and gain from the benefits of sports. Competitions which are friendly, without fear or favour to anyone - white, black, religions, etc - to celebrate the joy of living and being human, a celebration of youthful endeavours and achievement, each a showcase of their national spirit in their attempts at competition, flaws and all. Participation is the ideal, and not the prize.
2nd type:- Belief that sports are coldly calculative gambles to win medals, nothing else. Full stop. Either you win, or there will be no funding. It is hard earned money by taxpayers, and not to be frivously spent and indulging in 'fun games'.
Thus SSC has to balance between the 2 categories of citizens.
My personal belief that STTA management team is made up of the 2nd type of citizens. There is no democracy practised. Fully authoritarian, with only one goal in mind - winning, regardless of whatever excuses given. Only the best gets in, and no such thing as 'love for the sport'. This is sport's 'darkside'.
The darkside is real and not some star wars religion. Each and everyone of us posses it, and had been seduced by it, by one thing or another, at one time or another, hidden behind our smiles.
It occurs when we have to make a decision that go against our principles, moral values, and religious teachings, in order to achieve something. No one, being a mortal being, can claim they had never given in to the darkside, not even just once.
It is the darkside that trainers and sportsperson must embrace, if they want to excel, more so if they don't have that precious gift or talent in them. Hours daily 24/7 spent to achieve something that is often beyond known limits of human ability. The win is all that counts, everything else is a lie.
This is the darkside of sports. It's not something to be proud of. But a reality no less in this day and age of international competition. My personal belief is that STTA is engaging in such. So if you want to play table tennis, be prepared to go into the darkside. It is not for fun and games. It is for real. A justification for taxpayers hard earned money.
My personal take - sports should be fun and games, a celebration of youth, but then, heck! i don't have the money to fund such games.:-P
sports administration is very much like politics, singapore included.
stta's decision is not its own. it is done in consultation with ssc to take the path it did. in fact, they are one of the earliest nsas to adopt the FST scheme. soccer, singapore's most popular sports, for e.g. will continue to receive good money regardless of its performance. the country cannot see soccer languishing at the cellar. other sports are more dispensable. think squash, where once it dominates the sports pages here; now it hardly had a whisper of say in the media.
i wouldn't call it a darkside of sports either. it is just a choice a nsa make. all nsa would want to win at all cost if they have a choice. but reality bites. the key is, you can choose `winning at all cost' as the way forward, but you must also have a development plan in place so the flow of talent and continuity is there. otherwise, the citizens will also lose faith in the sports if the performance is inconsistent.
importing players is a costly affair. even if professional sports like the english football league for instance, there is an emphasis in the clubs on youth development becos it makes economic sense to groom someone rather than pay alot for one. singapore too cannot ignore this. if other nsa were to take leaf from stta and start fielding all foreigners for its sports, then it will indeed be a dark day for singapore. it is costly and the emotional attachment is not there. i would even pronounce the demise of sports for singapore. luckily, it is not the case, the singapore sports school is a step in the right direction. singapore needs to follow it up with an aussie version of AIS (australia institute of sports) model to groom the elite sportsperson. now, this just being a unit of ssc is not sustainable.
sports for fun or fitness aside, the element of winning is integral in sports. otherwise, the shiok-factor is not there.
my take is singapore sports now is at a crossroad. it has only embrace sporting excellance recently, and over time, i am pretty sure it will find its own footing and choose a path that will not only bring glories to the country, but warm the hearts of all singaporeans at the same time as well.
Can Singaporean afford/allow to send their childrens to train on table tennis and forgo all other academy and technical skills?? This foreign players are trainned since as young as 4-5 years old, can we do that??? Guess not?? what happen if the child fail to do it, what happen if the child cannot make it..all future gone.
We are so kiasee and kiasu people here becos the enviroment is not conducive for sport, a child who fail to shine in sport will be lack behind in study, lack behind in making money. All parents want their child to be in the best school, get educated, get a stable 8 to 5 good job, get married, set up a family and life goes on, very straight forward. We are not expose to championship feeling, winning and sporting spirit.
As for a country like china which has a sporting culture,..for their parents, it is an honour to send their child to sport school and allow trainner to train and torture them, becos the parents got nothing to loose, it either kampong/village life or success in sport. Thousands enrolled but in the end only top 10 selected, that is the spirit of sport. The parents hv to praise the coaches and allow them to train their child in pain and tormenting stamina. If it is for a typical singaporean parents, I think they most would had complained to the sport minister, MP, Newpapers, and all other media. So how to nurture a Singapore child to be a champion, i think like me, pick ping pong balls can lah, play cannot lor.
Originally posted by angel7030:Can Singaporean afford/allow to send their childrens to train on table tennis and forgo all other academy and technical skills?? This foreign players are trainned since as young as 4-5 years old, can we do that??? Guess not?? what happen if the child fail to do it, what happen if the child cannot make it..all future gone.
We are so kiasee and kiasu people here becos the enviroment is not conducive for sport, a child who fail to shine in sport will be lack behind in study, lack behind in making money. All parents want their child to be in the best school, get educated, get a stable 8 to 5 good job, get married, set up a family and life goes on, very straight forward. We are not expose to championship feeling, winning and sporting spirit.
As for a country like china which has a sporting culture,..for their parents, it is an honour to send their child to sport school and allow trainner to train and torture them, becos the parents got nothing to loose, it either kampong/village life or success in sport. Thousands enrolled but in the end only top 10 selected, that is the spirit of sport. The parents hv to praise the coaches and allow them to train their child in pain and tormenting stamina. If it is for a typical singaporean parents, I think they most would had complained to the sport minister, MP, Newpapers, and all other media. So how to nurture a Singapore child to be a champion, i think like me, pick ping pong balls can lah, play cannot lor.
also, for some of these Chinese kids, sports is the way out of poverty. So they piah until die to get a good life ahead.
Singapore kids? piah a bit only pant. then complain stress. then complain about strict coach, then parents write to MP, how to win!
Originally posted by angel7030:Can Singaporean afford/allow to send their childrens to train on table tennis and forgo all other academy and technical skills?? This foreign players are trainned since as young as 4-5 years old, can we do that??? Guess not?? what happen if the child fail to do it, what happen if the child cannot make it..all future gone.
We are so kiasee and kiasu people here becos the enviroment is not conducive for sport, a child who fail to shine in sport will be lack behind in study, lack behind in making money. All parents want their child to be in the best school, get educated, get a stable 8 to 5 good job, get married, set up a family and life goes on, very straight forward. We are not expose to championship feeling, winning and sporting spirit.
As for a country like china which has a sporting culture,..for their parents, it is an honour to send their child to sport school and allow trainner to train and torture them, becos the parents got nothing to loose, it either kampong/village life or success in sport. Thousands enrolled but in the end only top 10 selected, that is the spirit of sport. The parents hv to praise the coaches and allow them to train their child in pain and tormenting stamina. If it is for a typical singaporean parents, I think they most would had complained to the sport minister, MP, Newpapers, and all other media. So how to nurture a Singapore child to be a champion, i think like me, pick ping pong balls can lah, play cannot lor.
actually have, but more the exception than the norm.
that's why sports school exists, to ensure the education bit is not sacrificed.
Originally posted by Chin Eng:also, for some of these Chinese kids, sports is the way out of poverty. So they piah until die to get a good life ahead.
Singapore kids? piah a bit only pant. then complain stress. then complain about strict coach, then parents write to MP, how to win!
Exactly, our enivorment is not right for Sport yet, we dun nurture the youngs, we pick them when they are in Secondary or JC or for guys, in NS. Then from there. we sponsor and train them, and they had to balance between study, work and Training. Get injured, got case, more worst, may have to suffer the rest of your life. So who want excel in it?? The young ones like us rather chiong Disco and hip hop then to chiong on a field or court. If train too hard, maybe the trainer also kenna sued. So, as typical as our singaporean mentality, we like to buy ready made stuff, cos we are not inventive nor creative, we only know how to work and work and made money, and to satisfy ourselves with our working gain, we buy and buy.
Originally posted by redDUST:actually have, but more the exception than the norm.
that's why sports school exists, to ensure the education bit is not sacrificed.
Ya, recently, but a sport school must produce result and champion in about 10 to 20 years time, otherwise, no one will enrol.
Originally posted by Chin Eng:also, for some of these Chinese kids, sports is the way out of poverty. So they piah until die to get a good life ahead.
Singapore kids? piah a bit only pant. then complain stress. then complain about strict coach, then parents write to MP, how to win!
agree, this is one way out of poverty, like african footballers.
if there are more millionaire sportsmans there, i am sure the kids here will aspire.
fandi is one in a million. however, he proves that it can be done. with the system in place, the gahmen support and your personal will, we should see more locals exceling
Originally posted by angel7030:
Ya, recently, but a sport school must produce result and champion in about 10 to 20 years time, otherwise, no one will enrol.
if you take track & field now, the national age group records are tumbling like bowling pins. this shows that there is progress already.
as i mentioned, there must be an extension of the sports school that these elite athletes are continued to b nurtured. otherwise, it will be wasted as the intensity cannot be sustained.
one area not discuss that the gahmen must address is national service for the guys. if they are strict, all the investments will be undone by wearing the army uniform. these group of elites must be able to serve the nation in `other' ways.
Originally posted by redDUST:
if you take track & field now, the national age group records are tumbling like bowling pins. this shows that there is progress already.as i mentioned, there must be an extension of the sports school that these elite athletes are continued to b nurtured. otherwise, it will be wasted as the intensity cannot be sustained.
one area not discuss that the gahmen must address is national service for the guys. if they are strict, all the investments will be undone by wearing the army uniform. these group of elites must be able to serve the nation in `other' ways.
As i said again, by teenage, it maybe too late to recruit a sport person unless he/she is damn talented. It should start at lower kindergarden ages ie 4 to 5 years old. That is how the chinese were trained.
We must learn to build talents in sport, we should NOT learn to spot talent ya
Originally posted by angel7030:We must learn to build talents in sport, we should NOT learn to spot talent ya
it should really be BOTH, imo.
Originally posted by angel7030:
As i said again, by teenage, it maybe too late to recruit a sport person unless he/she is damn talented. It should start at lower kindergarden ages ie 4 to 5 years old. That is how the chinese were trained.
we need to be realistic. the current environment does ot allow talent to be spoted as 5 yo. maybe 1 or 2, but not enmasse. singapore is not a sporting nation.
Originally posted by redDUST:we need to be realistic. the current environment does ot allow talent to be spoted as 5 yo. maybe 1 or 2, but not enmasse. singapore is not a sporting nation.
Then me better go learn how to read the stock markets and economy better,..at least it guarantee a future, for sport,..very vague. Singaporeans are smart pple, they plan and do thing that are worth to earn money, as for sport, there is no guarantee of fame and money.
We have been singing praises for the Table Tennis gals/aunties, how about the badminton guy, that Susilo, what a waste of our investment.