Public Transport Fare Increases? Oil $150 then, now $100
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Originally posted by simnatic:
Seriously, this is really crap. I read the ST yesterday and they made it sound as though the fare increase was a positive happy thing! It showed how a pathetic family was actually not paying higher. What about the other millions of us who would be paying higher?
And seriously, all excuses given by the govt is because they want to "help the lower income". From subsidies to GST to transport vouchers increase. Have they forgotten totally who are the ones paying for the running of this country? So what do majority middle income citizens stand to gain from all these increases?
Its sad that the people are now taking all these price increases as though it is a annual tradition that should not be opposed. Is there anything else we can do to besides discussing it? Feelin so helpless...don't know what to do
Yes, we can do something. Vote PAP out.
Pay and pay will come out with all craps to justify the increase. Media is their favourite and useful tool for such propaganda/brainwashing.
Life will not get better if we continue to vote them in.
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As long as the asspots persecute dissidents and opposition; grab public money for themselves, continue to curse them until they end up in hospital under life support.
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Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:
As long as the asspots persecute dissidents and opposition; grab public money for themselves, continue to curse them until they end up in hospital under life support.
so far none ended up in hospitals. Ming da! Fireice locked the lee kuan yew when a
re you going to die Part 2 thread. Want to lock, should do it earlier, now do it, very funny. -
all that crap about "commuters changing mutiple services will pay less" is bull lo..
what if i want to take a direct bus and slp on the way? i dunwan change here change there waste time + no place to sit leh..
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Originally posted by purpledragon84:
all that crap about "commuters changing mutiple services will pay less" is bull lo..
what if i want to take a direct bus and slp on the way? i dunwan change here change there waste time + no place to sit leh..
The number of people changing multiple services is not great. They just want to ease their conscience by making such statement and take it that all singaporeans are easily fooled by them.
Vote them out is the best solution for now.
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Guys I suggest we stop complaning.. Later they cut all the direct flight how, cos we complain we never make use of the transfer, then they help us again by making us die die need to transfer how??? THeir pattern always liddat
In singapore got one rule- Do not complain. -
Originally posted by whiskers:
Guys I suggest we stop complaning.. Later they cut all the direct flight how, cos we complain we never make use of the transfer, then they help us again by making us die die need to transfer how??? THeir pattern always liddat
In singapore got one rule- Do not complain.U think you don't complain they will be kind??? Ha ha ha u must be joking.
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Originally posted by Fantagf:
U think you don't complain they will be kind??? Ha ha ha u must be joking.
We complain we want car = ERP
Complain singapore boring = Casino
Complain bus too crowded = Increase bus fare
Complain no jobs = Bring in FT to create jobs
Complain roads many cars = ERP
Complain Uni no places = bring FT in
Liddat how.... Sometimes i really dun want to complain, later new pattern come out even worse. -
Originally posted by whiskers:
We complain we want car = ERP
Complain singapore boring = Casino
Complain bus too crowded = Increase bus fare
Complain no jobs = Bring in FT to create jobs
Complain roads many cars = ERP
Complain Uni no places = bring FT in
Liddat how.... Sometimes i really dun want to complain, later new pattern come out even worse.
I don't think the govt really take us seriously. U worry so much might as well migrate go elsewhere so you need not worry about pap. -
Originally posted by Fantagf:
U worry so much might as well migrate go elsewhere so you need not worry about pap.
Best -
The formula of fare hike takes into account factors like consumer price index, and cpf contribution rate.
Now the inflation is high and CPF not fully restored how come the PTC never exercise its power to do the following (underlined sentence) :
"Application for approval of fares
(2) In considering any application for approval of any bus, taxi or rapid transit system fare, the Council shall take into account —
(a) the need for the applicant to remain financially viable; and
(b) the need for public interest to be safeguarded.
[21[29/99](3) The Council may —
(a) reject the application;
(b) approve the application, subject to such conditions as the Council thinks fit; or
(c) at any time, revise any bus or rapid transit system fare in accordance with the fare adjustment formula set out in the Third Schedule.
- Frankly speaking u think PTC is good in regulating these GLC transport companies?
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Originally posted by maurizio13:
Losses they suffered? Are you sure it's losses or supernormal profits? SMRT had a Return on Equity** (ROE) of 22.1% for Financial Year 2007, while Hong Kong's MTR had a Return on Equity of 10.2% for Financial Year 2007. If you want to talk about investment risk (beta) for this stable industry, what is the appropriate return? Another comparable MTR is operating in the region of 10.2%, while SMRT is operating at more than 2 times the returns for this industry every year. Doesn't it prove to you that the government is exploiting us?**Return on Equity (ROE, Return on average common equity, return on net worth) measures the rate of return on the ownership interest (shareholders' equity) of the common stock owners. ROE is viewed as one of the most important financial ratios.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Return_on_equity
http://www.mtr.com.hk/eng/investrelation/financialinfo.php
http://www.smrt.com.sg/investors/annual_reports.asp
Obviously you do not understand the meaning of the term productivity gains.
"Productivity in economics refers to measures of output from production processes, per unit of input."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Productivity
What you describe here is law of dimishing returns, not productivity gains. How can one say that the maintenance schedule has increased per km travelled, yet claim that as a productivity gain? If you operated the trains at 10,000 km per maintenance schedule, subsequently it dropped to 5,000 km per maintenance schedule, it is a productivity loss.
When compared to MTR (HK), SMRT (SG) not only make profits, they made extremely supernormal profits, twice the industry average for ROE. The sad thing is, some Singaporeans are still hoodwinked into thinking that the government has been fair in it's dealings with the Singaporean public.
Well, you cannot expect shareholder to be contend with a 22% ROE, ROE MUST and I repeat MUST increase every year. Shareholders were the ones that invested money in the company when SMRT First listed 8 years ago. SMRT has a duty to deliver increasing returns to shareholders every year, otherwise, why would the shareholders have invested in SMRT in the first place.WIthout the money from shareholders, where do you think the new trains and improved service would have come from?
When I talk about productivity gains, Im referring to the formula used by the PTC to determine the fare increase. SMRT has mentioned that their buisness of advertising and retail is included in the calculation of their productivity gains. They adopt a broader definition of the term productivity. It does not solely refer to the train buisness only.
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Don't be surprise even utility bills that we are using daily will be increased even when oil price is dropping. Thanks to Temasek and PAP that have sold it to private companies in the name of benefitting the public. They will work almost the same as privatising public transport to answer share holders. Singaporeans it's not over yet there are more suffering awaiting for you. This is so called more good years for voting PAP.
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Originally posted by maurizio13:
Losses they suffered? Are you sure it's losses or supernormal profits? SMRT had a Return on Equity** (ROE) of 22.1% for Financial Year 2007, while Hong Kong's MTR had a Return on Equity of 10.2% for Financial Year 2007. If you want to talk about investment risk (beta) for this stable industry, what is the appropriate return? Another comparable MTR is operating in the region of 10.2%, while SMRT is operating at more than 2 times the returns for this industry every year. Doesn't it prove to you that the government is exploiting us?**Return on Equity (ROE, Return on average common equity, return on net worth) measures the rate of return on the ownership interest (shareholders' equity) of the common stock owners. ROE is viewed as one of the most important financial ratios.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Return_on_equity
http://www.mtr.com.hk/eng/investrelation/financialinfo.php
http://www.smrt.com.sg/investors/annual_reports.asp
Obviously you do not understand the meaning of the term productivity gains.
"Productivity in economics refers to measures of output from production processes, per unit of input."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Productivity
What you describe here is law of dimishing returns, not productivity gains. How can one say that the maintenance schedule has increased per km travelled, yet claim that as a productivity gain? If you operated the trains at 10,000 km per maintenance schedule, subsequently it dropped to 5,000 km per maintenance schedule, it is a productivity loss.
When compared to MTR (HK), SMRT (SG) not only make profits, they made extremely supernormal profits, twice the industry average for ROE. The sad thing is, some Singaporeans are still hoodwinked into thinking that the government has been fair in it's dealings with the Singaporean public.
So what is a good price to buy SMRT stocks given this case?
I mean, if we feel they overcharge and is unfair, then maybe we should look into buying the shares ourselves, so any price increases which results in an increase in profit will go towards helping increase any dividends paid to shareholders
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Originally posted by (human):
Don't be surprise even utility bills that we are using daily will be increased even when oil price is dropping. Thanks to Temasek and PAP that have sold it to private companies in the name of benefitting the public. They will work almost the same as privatising public transport to answer share holders. Singaporeans it's not over yet there are more suffering awaiting for you. This is so called more good years for voting PAP.
Then we also go buy those utility stocks lor. :D
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Originally posted by shade343:
Well, you cannot expect shareholder to be contend with a 22% ROE, ROE MUST and I repeat MUST increase every year. Shareholders were the ones that invested money in the company when SMRT First listed 8 years ago. SMRT has a duty to deliver increasing returns to shareholders every year, otherwise, why would the shareholders have invested in SMRT in the first place.WIthout the money from shareholders, where do you think the new trains and improved service would have come from?
When I talk about productivity gains, Im referring to the formula used by the PTC to determine the fare increase. SMRT has mentioned that their buisness of advertising and retail is included in the calculation of their productivity gains. They adopt a broader definition of the term productivity. It does not solely refer to the train buisness only.
I love your statements.
1) ROE MUST increase every year.
ROEs are like benchmarks in particular industry. MTR (HK) which is equivalent to MRT has an ROE which approximates to 10%. You idea that ROE MUST increase every year, to what level may I ask? 100%, 200%, 300%? The ROE for Singapore Power is also extremely high by industry standards.
2) Is it without money or without supernormal profits that trains cannot be acquired?
When you buy trains, you can always take a loan from banks. Every year with your financial reporting, in the income and expenditure statement there is a deduction of depreciation. i.e. If your train say cost $100, with a useful life of 5 years, a straight line depreciation will charge $20 to the income & expenditure account for 5 years. Therefore the ROE (which uses profits from the income & expenditure account) already has a charge of the trains in the figure.
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adn when oil goesto 150 again.. they will rise again :D
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Originally posted by youyayu:
adn when oil goesto 150 again.. they will rise again :D
Without oil goesto 150, they will think of other reasons to rise it again. For economy, to help the poor, and even for your safety. They just did not said out loud for personal profits.
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Originally posted by (human):
Don't be surprise even utility bills that we are using daily will be increased even when oil price is dropping. Thanks to Temasek and PAP that have sold it to private companies in the name of benefitting the public. They will work almost the same as privatising public transport to answer share holders. Singaporeans it's not over yet there are more suffering awaiting for you. This is so called more good years for voting PAP.
price of utility bills already increased by a lot recently. -
Originally posted by shade343:
Well, you cannot expect shareholder to be contend with a 22% ROE, ROE MUST and I repeat MUST increase every year. Shareholders were the ones that invested money in the company when SMRT First listed 8 years ago. SMRT has a duty to deliver increasing returns to shareholders every year, otherwise, why would the shareholders have invested in SMRT in the first place.WIthout the money from shareholders, where do you think the new trains and improved service would have come from?
When I talk about productivity gains, Im referring to the formula used by the PTC to determine the fare increase. SMRT has mentioned that their buisness of advertising and retail is included in the calculation of their productivity gains. They adopt a broader definition of the term productivity. It does not solely refer to the train buisness only.
Why can't the government subsidise the procurement of trains sets?
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Originally posted by (human):
Don't be surprise even utility bills that we are using daily will be increased even when oil price is dropping. Thanks to Temasek and PAP that have sold it to private companies in the name of benefitting the public. They will work almost the same as privatising public transport to answer share holders. Singaporeans it's not over yet there are more suffering awaiting for you. This is so called more good years for voting PAP.
more good years for them nia.
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Originally posted by eagle:
So what is a good price to buy SMRT stocks given this case?
I mean, if we feel they overcharge and is unfair, then maybe we should look into buying the shares ourselves, so any price increases which results in an increase in profit will go towards helping increase any dividends paid to shareholders
Don't think it's possible to make profits this way, because once the company goes public with IPO, the shares would already have been priced at the market level.
i.e. If you own a company with an earning of say $200 and equity $1,000, your ROE is 20%. If say you own all the 1,000 shares, each share will give you a 20 cents (20%) earnings per share.
But if you release the 500 shares into the market, the market will trade up the price of your $1 share to say $2, thereby making your earnings per share of 10%. The winners are the original owners, they have already profited from the difference.
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maybe it's time u people give up writing such un-intelligent or in short "dumb" replies in forums..can't u people juz look at the big picture..?or is it u're juz too simple minded...?or small brained..?choose one...
either way or so..u are insulting one of the better and stronger transport systems in the world..use ur brains and think...don't juz get erected and start screwing the tree...
"People are like teabags, you'll never know how strong are they till u put them in hot water"
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A transport system that thrives on packing in the commuters like sardines.
They teaching non SAF folks to "SQUEEZE".
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Hehehe.....
They are stronger because they overcharge us, then make us squeeze like sardines, so they can get more profits. Above 20% ROE as compared to MTR (HK) 10%.
SQUEEZE!!!!