Western democracy should just go to hell, LKY is Right
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If singapore had stuck to the british, we would undoubtedly be forever exploited. As for the economic situation, every country views it differently. Now people are even saying islamic banks like those in iran are the way to go in the depression
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Originally posted by dadeadman1337:
If singapore had stuck to the british, we would undoubtedly be forever exploited. As for the economic situation, every country views it differently. Now people are even saying islamic banks like those in iran are the way to go in the depression
Are you sure the British would have held on?
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Originally posted by MINIGUN2000:
to socialist;
have u seen the condition of the hum in fried kuay teow today???
is lky or lhl going to solve the hum problem for starters??
the hum in fried kuay teow of previous years were bigger n fresh!
hum today looks like its been runned over by a lorry.
This is the finest post I have seen for a while. Hammered the nail on its head.The hum in fried kuay teow today is pathetic. The hum in fried kuay teow in the 80s were fresh, nice, big and JUICY. hum today machiam like rubber and tiny rubber.
This is the REAL reason why we in Potong Pasir have been voting for Mr Chiam. It is a collective protest as to the state of the hum in fried kuay teow. All Mr Seetoh need to do is realise this fact and promise big fat juicy hum in fried kuay teow in Potong Pasir coffeeshops and he will WIN by a landslide I tell you.
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Gedankan, It is easier to look back on our past and judge based on HINDSIGHT, and condemn what went wrong, what should have been done and how our lives would be better today. BUT it takes great foresight for someone back then to do what they had to do to ensure we all survived. No one could have predicted the future.
The 80s were equally of boom and bust stages. Recession and wars. Economic disorders. Japan and Taiwan expanded their entreprenuerships and was was caught in massive recession and the battle with US, a major importer, over inequality over their exports and dollar spending.
We in SIngapore had only our port and tourism, which would hardly had paid for social spending of the likes we enjoy today.Malaysia was exerting and flexing its muscles and never failed to rattle its sabres at us.
How many graduate and scholars were there in the 80s? How productive and educated were we back then, let alone to have an entreprenuerial mind in the face of better educated and progressive and matured societies such as Japan, Taiwan and korea?
What could we do that can be cheaper and better than resource rich Malaysia or Indonesia?
Had you ever and even ask yourself this fact?
Things were no better in the 80s than anytime now in 2009. The only difference is that back then our treasury was only in millions, now it is billions. Somebody certainly sweated and saved it, instead of spending it lavishly the way US does each year.
Had we not have this billions, it would have been tougher for many of us today. Point is, right or wrong, necessary decisions made in the past ensured our survival today and one must give credit where it is due, not condemnation based on hindsight even a village idiot can mouthed out.
More vital is our tomorrow. Where do we go from here? Is it too late for us to rebuild our billions for our next generation? All I know nothing is ever too late if we use what we have - our hands and our brains. So curb that angst and let us all crack our brains on how we can collectively improve our economy, what will work for us as a society, thru discussion and not finger pointing or ridiculing each other. -
I guess the FT dont have it easy either. So from your post, i see you dissent as you feel you deserve more. Perhaps you are not so capable.
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Originally posted by Ah Chia:
Foundations were already there in 1930s.
It is incorrect to say that PAP developed Singapore out from nothing.
Singapore - Crossroads of the East 1938
Depend on the racists and cowardly fleeing jap fearing Brits for our asian welfare? What a joke!
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Brits came here for the money and trade routes, not to care about the people. It would be like northern ireland in asia
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Originally posted by dadeadman1337:
I guess the FT dont have it easy either. So from your post, i see you dissent as you feel you deserve more. Perhaps you are not so capable.
And why should one not feel they deserves more ?
perhaps our school has too much to do with why our newer generations have such self-defeatist thinking.
Can this be good for our future ?
To constantly compare ourselves with the poor and weak..and not push forward to better our lives and for our children ?
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Rebuild our billions by taxing alot and not providing any social welfare.
Ever wonder why insufficient funds is always provided to social organisations and these organisations have to rely on canvassing for donations on tv?
Are these organisations the responsibility of the government or her citizens? If it's the responsibility of her citizens then they should enact laws to make everyone accountable.
Then every year you see the government supposedly deficit budget turn into a surplus the following year.
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Originally posted by dadeadman1337:
Brits came here for the money and trade routes, not to care about the people. It would be like northern ireland in asia
Care to elaborate Northern Ireland? Doesn't see the link here.
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Depend on the racists and cowardly fleeing jap
Lee Kuan Yew was a collaborator of the Japanese during WWII.
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Originally posted by deepak.c:
Rebuild our billions by taxing alot and not providing any social welfare.
Ever wonder why insufficient funds is always provided to social organisations and these organisations have to rely on canvassing for donations on tv?
Are these organisations the responsibility of the government or her citizens? If it's the responsibility of her citizens then they should enact laws to make everyone accountable.
Then every year you see the government supposedly deficit budget turn into a surplus the following year.
Sure why not rebuilding? Probably another round of GST or more ERPs or something that will promote some jokers to the million dollar cabinet.
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Originally posted by Ah Chia:
Lee Kuan Yew was a collaborator of the Japanese during WWII.
Sounds like a defamation
All you people egging on for social help, do you want to pay high taxes to support those that pay none? It has occured to me that those that need all these extras are actually insufficient to start with. All poor here? I doubt it.
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Originally posted by dadeadman1337:
Sounds like a defamation
All you people egging on for social help, do you want to pay high taxes to support those that pay none? It has occured to me that those that need all these extras are actually insufficient to start with. All poor here? I doubt it.
I'd rather pay to help the poor and needy.. than to line the fat pockets of the ministers.
At least, if one day I may fall.. there be a safety net for me. One that I had contributed to .. and that if I shall not need.. they be put to good use.
What will the fat cats politician do for me after them people fatten up their wallets ? They simply ask for more and claim they so deserved it..
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Originally posted by Chew Bakar:
Sure why not rebuilding? Probably another round of GST or more ERPs or something that will promote some jokers to the million dollar cabinet.
Don't think they can increase GST any more, it's more or less maxed out. If they do increase somemore, citizens will make comparisons with other countries. Why is it that other countries have similar GST but provide more social welfare?
What they have done right now is means testing, depriving some citizens from benefits? Means testing to me is like, when you go to a foodcourt, the supervisor there assess your ability to pay, refuses you entry to the foodcourt and force you to dine in Pontini. When they reduce the so called medical "subsidies" it increases their surplus, the less they spend, the more they make. Maybe set up more ERP gantries, higher fines, petrol tax, HDBs, lengthening withdrawal age for CPF, etc.
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Originally posted by jojobeach:
I'd rather pay to help the poor and needy.. than to line the fat pockets of the ministers.
At least, if one day I may fall.. there be a safety net for me. One that I had contributed to .. and that if I shall not need.. they be put to good use.
What will the fat cats politician do for me after the people fatten up their wallets ? They simply ask for more and claim they so deserved it..
Yes but when you visit some western countries with aid services, many people become lazy dont work and cause trouble
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Sounds like a defamation
Please lah, that is such a notorious fact.
Your knowledge of singapore history seems to be quite poor.
Lee was a third generation Straits Chinese, however, and grew up speaking Malay, English and the Cantonese dialect of his family's maid. Ever the pragmatist, he was later to teach himself Japanese, Mandarin and Hokkien as the political situation in Singapore required. During the Japanese occupation of Singapore he worked for a Japanese government propaganda department...
http://www.time.com/time/asia/asia/magazine/
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Wow im surprised that article also has some positive + negative points, usually they're all one sided
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Originally posted by dadeadman1337:
Yes but when you visit some western countries with aid services, many people become lazy dont work and cause trouble
I LIVE IN the "western" country now dude.
And dude.. I hate to say this.. but... don't believe EVERYTHING you read in the indoctrinated textbooks ya ?
Go out there.. and get a life... and see for your own eyes....
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Wow im surprised that article also has some positive + negative points
All negative point Lee Kuan Yew might sue wah.
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Originally posted by deepak.c:
Don't think they can increase GST any more, it's more or less maxed out. If they do increase somemore, citizens will make comparisons with other countries. Why is it that other countries have similar GST but provide more social welfare?
What they have done right now is means testing, depriving some citizens from benefits? Means testing to me is like, when you go to a foodcourt, the supervisor there assess your ability to pay, refuses you entry to the foodcourt and force you to dine in Pontini. When they reduce the so called medical "subsidies" it increases their surplus, the less they spend, the more they make. Maybe set up more ERP gantries, higher fines, petrol tax, HDBs, lengthening withdrawal age for CPF, etc.
Never knows. If they can blow billions away stupidly, ignoring the market; they too can increase GST ignoring the citizens.
Yes, mean testing, I forget. Thanks for reminding. Before election promise no, after election implement.
Anyway more money in the coffer doesn't mean better living overall for the people.
People are just too afraid to go out of the pot that is slowly heated up, not to kill but scald.
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Originally posted by jojobeach:
I LIVE IN the "western" country now dude.
And dude.. I hate to say this.. but... don't believe EVERYTHING you read in the indoctrinated textbooks ya ?
Go out there.. and get a life... and see for your own eyes....
Oh its not in the textbooks, but abt one article i saw before on the BBC, where a boy claims money from the state for running away from home.
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Originally posted by Ah Chia:
Please lah, that is such a notorious fact.
Your knowledge of singapore history seems to be quite poor.
Lee was a third generation Straits Chinese, however, and grew up speaking Malay, English and the Cantonese dialect of his family's maid. Ever the pragmatist, he was later to teach himself Japanese, Mandarin and Hokkien as the political situation in Singapore required. During the Japanese occupation of Singapore he worked for a Japanese government propaganda department...
http://www.time.com/time/asia/asia/magazine/
I am a nobody and would not presume to be an apologist for any man. But what i do know and accept are people whom had been in error and rehabilitated back to society, and more so if he can contribute to it, and no longer redoing what he had done before.
The 1940s was a turbulent time, more so for many whom had seen their protectors fled, their loved ones molested or murdered and kept in poverty. There can be no excuse for dishonour and loss of integrity, but such words are easily spoken today when you and I are living in independence, intelligence and peace, rather than someone else suffering the horrors of war.
Each live with his own conscience, and let others judge his contributions.
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Originally posted by xtreyier:
Had you ever and even ask yourself this fact?
Yeah, I have and I did. By the time I was in JC something already struck me as being not quite right, and as I went along I looked at how excessive control was being exerted in a situation where the example of Japan's expanding economy had already shown five years prior that people needed to be pushed forward, not yanked back by leashes. Yet Singapore's culture was one of adamant complacency that "yes sir, no sir, three bags full" was the way to go, and actively went out of its way to stamp out independent thought.
That was 1992, and that's when I decided that my energy was better spent a place without control freaks who would evetually run the ship aground, and I started putting together my plans to leave. I'm not going to rub it in by describing my circumstances in detail, but suffice to say I'm living very comfortably, and this is the product of foresight, not of the hindsight with which you assume I speak. Let me know if you ever come to Melbourne and I'll show you exactly what I mean.
Originally posted by xtreyier:Point is, right or wrong, necessary decisions made in the past ensured our survival today
You don't see it, do you? After all of this talk about Singapore being an economic miracle, making it to First World status and all that jazz, don't you think that by definition, it's out of place for a First World country to be talking about mere survival?
I do wish people would make up their minds - has Singapore made it, or has Singapore not made it?
If Singapore has made it, it's time to get past the "we must do this to survive" nonsense because the name of the game need to be advancement, and not survival.
If Singapore hasn't yet made it, then for the love of God can we stop drinking the "LKY made Singapore a miracle" Kool-Aid?
Either way, you're right. The past doesn't count. You know as well as I do it's today, and the MoM figures I've posted already show that trouble's past brewing, it's spilling over the edge. It's time to wake up and smell the coffee instead of falling back on rose-tinted recollections of the 60's - 80's.
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Originally posted by dadeadman1337:
Oh its not in the textbooks, but abt one article i saw before on the BBC, where a boy claims money from the state for running away from home.
One case mean all? Ignorant or feigning it?