Singaporeans are fools!
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\Originally posted by Medicated Oil:Dear Mr Relevation,
You have spend your time and effort in writing the great essay.
There will always be supporters and opposition opinion about your essay.
So, take heart when the critics hit back.
Welcome them with open hand, they have took their time to read what you have written.
In that aspect, you are already a victor.
Keep up the good essay coming !
Dear Medicated Oil,
You have a great point.
My replies and refutation are meant to ensure that whatever I have written is not taken lightly. Yes today is the new year 2004 and surely all of us want a light moment. I am aware and probably its a good time to reflect amongst us our future and how the lives of Singaporeans will change if we stay aloof and continued being fooled.
So dear all, if I am too blunt- please forgive me. I am just so passionate when speaking up.
Cheers and no hard feelings. -
\Originally posted by Medicated Oil:Dear Mr Relevation,
You have spend your time and effort in writing the great essay.
There will always be supporters and opposition opinion about your essay.
So, take heart when the critics hit back.
Welcome them with open hand, they have took their time to read what you have written.
In that aspect, you are already a victor.
Keep up the good essay coming !
Dear Medicated Oil,
You have a great point.
My replies and refutation are meant to ensure that whatever I have written is not taken lightly. Yes today is the new year 2004 and surely all of us want a light moment. I am aware and probably its a good time to reflect amongst us our future and how the lives of Singaporeans will change if we stay aloof and continued being fooled.
So dear all, not trying to sound apologetic but if I am too blunt- please forgive me. I am just so passionate when speaking up.
Cheers and no hard feelings. -
\Originally posted by Medicated Oil:Dear Mr Relevation,
You have spend your time and effort in writing the great essay.
There will always be supporters and opposition opinion about your essay.
So, take heart when the critics hit back.
Welcome them with open hand, they have took their time to read what you have written.
In that aspect, you are already a victor.
Keep up the good essay coming !
Dear Medicated Oil,
You have a great point.
My replies and refutation are meant to ensure that whatever I have written is not taken lightly. Yes today is the new year 2004 and surely all of us want a light moment. I am aware and probably its a good time to reflect amongst us our future and how the lives of Singaporeans will change if we stay aloof and continued being fooled.
So dear all, not trying to sound apologetic but if I am too blunt- please forgive me. I am just so passionate when speaking up.
Cheers and no hard feelings. -
Dear SingaporeMarcoss,Originally posted by SingaporeMacross:So we have no choice but to trust PAP. But what happens if they fail? We die already ah?
You are absolutely right. If PAP fails- we have only ourselves to blame. So before they fail- let us not be too critical of oppositions and lets give the oppositional forces a good breather, let them develop and grow for our benefit.
Cheers! -
All in all, quality oppostion is hard to build up. But like business, sporting clubs and even CCAs, there must be so called competition.
Why? It gives PAP a run for their money...haha
Without a competition, credible or not, if PAP do not find themselves challenged, they might go slack. Without Pepsi, Coke might not maintain the quality of their drinks and safety mark. Similarly, if PAP are not challenged, two things. Self assurance and slackness.
Self assurance is already happening. Examine the political arena nowadays, and we will know. NCMP Steve Chia has already challenged the government on several issues, and PAP has stumbled on these cases. Yet examining the speeches most ministers give, there are air of assurance gahmen has done things rite. Hell, we can take up speeches from 90s till now, there are tendency for flowery and politically correct speeches, yet lack in substance. I gave up reading minister answers to many reporters questions regarding any cases here. The remarks became more and more mundane.
Without oppostion = no check and balance = self assurance = slacking.
This is what I am worried about. Lets not just see the political arena.NSFs can see their officers displaying "PAP style of thinking"
Urm, what I meant, I think there is a good reference here in Military Nuts or SAF forums. A medic challenged his officer who cock up a training programme. Most officers, by right could charge the medic, if they do go by book, even if its the medic is in the right.
Another case, my friend's friend who is a driver for a BG. However, the BG used the car alone one day came back drunk, with the GP car in wreck. The driver was charged for negligence. Logically, the BG is in the wrong. But "going by the book'. the driver is chargeable for the above offence. Lets not talk about LPPL, lets talk what would happen if the driver legally challenge this case. No matter what, educatedly speaking and going by book, the driver is in the wrong.
If you see the way this is going, one worrying aspect would be everyone adopting this mode of talking "Using the laws of economics blah blah, examing this psychological aspect using blah blah theory....."
PAP has been going on this mode already. Thats why the meaning of "effective" thoughts and actions has been lost. Truthfully, the only person whom I seen so far who apply thought and actions effectively are the Old Guard, especially LKY, with their policies which has shaped SG into what is it today
We should worried what PAP will be like in the near future, coz its affecting us all. -
Dear laurence82,Originally posted by laurence82:All in all, quality oppostion is hard to build up. But like business, sporting clubs and even CCAs, there must be so called competition.
Why? It gives PAP a run for their money...haha
Without a competition, credible or not, if PAP do not find themselves challenged, they might go slack. Without Pepsi, Coke might not maintain the quality of their drinks and safety mark. Similarly, if PAP are not challenged, two things. Self assurance and slackness.
Self assurance is already happening. Examine the political arena nowadays, and we will know. NCMP Steve Chia has already challenged the government on several issues, and PAP has stumbled on these cases. Yet examining the speeches most ministers give, there are air of assurance gahmen has done things rite. Hell, we can take up speeches from 90s till now, there are tendency for flowery and politically correct speeches, yet lack in substance. I gave up reading minister answers to many reporters questions regarding any cases here. The remarks became more and more mundane.
Without oppostion = no check and balance = self assurance = slacking.
This is what I am worried about. Lets not just see the political arena.NSFs can see their officers displaying "PAP style of thinking"
Urm, what I meant, I think there is a good reference here in Military Nuts or SAF forums. A medic challenged his officer who cock up a training programme. Most officers, by right could charge the medic, if they do go by book, even if its the medic is in the right.
Another case, my friend's friend who is a driver for a BG. However, the BG used the car alone one day came back drunk, with the GP car in wreck. The driver was charged for negligence. Logically, the BG is in the wrong. But "going by the book'. the driver is chargeable for the above offence. Lets not talk about LPPL, lets talk what would happen if the driver legally challenge this case. No matter what, educatedly speaking and going by book, the driver is in the wrong.
If you see the way this is going, one worrying aspect would be everyone adopting this mode of talking "Using the laws of economics blah blah, examing this psychological aspect using blah blah theory....."
PAP has been going on this mode already. Thats why the meaning of "effective" thoughts and actions has been lost. Truthfully, the only person whom I seen so far who apply thought and actions effectively are the Old Guard, especially LKY, with their policies which has shaped SG into what is it today
We should worried what PAP will be like in the near future, coz its affecting us all.
I am very encouraged. Well said. -
just wondering.. say if there is no more opposition.. then if got problem. can rise again right?
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Actually, I hope opposition is not a seasonal thing. Having a constanly strong and credible opposition is a good thing, as it keeps PAP on the edge and maintain proficiency in whatever they are doing. In that way, PAP wouldnt be slacking as it is now.Originally posted by dumbdumb!:just wondering.. say if there is no more opposition.. then if got problem. can rise again right?
Having cases like the 2SG Hu case or the RSS Courageous case are not enough. These are merely antsy cases in PAP eyes. They are just disasters waiting to happen, and when it does, the gahmen just have to solve them. If it doesnt, everyone will be left clueless.
If a credibly strong opps rises up , it can tell the PAP "Hey look, we are here to kick your ass, if you dont perform, we will be able to throw you to oblivion."
Now, here it is a matter of survival already. PAP is threatened, and it will then seriously do self examination to see whats wrong. Grievances will then be solved, instead of merely explained. Whether or not the oppostion is enough to take over gahmen, it doesnt matter. It keeps the gahmen on the edge. If its stronger, we have better gahmen. Good deal though.
What I meant by strong doesnt mean having lots of opp members who knows how to KBKB well. Singaporeans are smart, and it doesnt take an idiot much to discern a strong opposition or a credible opposition -
Singaporeans are fools ?
Hardly.
Singaporeans have been lulled to sleep by LKY's philosophy of 'Fill the stomach, and dull the mind'.
The present situation faced by Singaporeans, will soon result in the stomach going hungry - if it has not already affected many jobless Singaporeans since early 2003.
The mind cannot afford to be dull any longer.
LKY's philosophy is no longer valid for the Twenty First Century.
Singaporeans will need to think quick on the feet, in order to survive in the New Environment of the First World that LKY think that we are in.
The First World probably belong to the Singapore Ministers with their Million Dollar Salary that is equal to the CEO's of the Corporations in the First World.
Most Singaporeans still remain in the hard grind of Third World economics, eking a living in the most mundane jobs with a poor man's salary.
This situation can only be tolerated by fools, and Singaporeans can only be fools if they do not notice this gross discrepancies. -
Hi Revelation,
Regards to your post, I don't think that singaporeans agree to CPF cuts and pay cuts. But what can we do? Can we oppose? This is a very stupid thing to say.......
If we were to voice out, will there be any change? The answer is Hell NO!!!!! -
Perhaprs it was our shallowness and entrenched love for material satisfaction and the herd instinct to follow whoever that could promise us a living condition that has shiny new cars, a maid to do our household chores and a cool apartment to live in.l've seen people in poorer countries who lack these tangible stuff yet their minds and hearts are more free to pursue and reject whatever they wish.In fact, look around at your fellow people and ask yourself, haven't we sold our souls to the devil for a few bucks?
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Dear All,
Let me add on to how absolute power will fool Singaporeans.
Do you know what is the definition of Tyrants?
Tyrant is a cruel lord who by force or by craft.. has obtained power over the realm or country... they love rather to work their own profit, though it be to the harm of the land, than the common profit of all. (Alfoso the wise)
PAP fits this definition. By craft in enacting GRC so as to prevent oppositional forces from winning elections. In this way they prevent good man from being elected through 1 man 1 vote system under a single representative ward.
GRC has failed. Those MPs elected under the skirt of Ministers has been ineffective in taking care of the residents. They are unable to stand by themselves. Surely they must be weak to require a team of people. We need representatives of the people NOT representatives of the government- especially representative of PAP echelon!
PAP surely loves to profit themselves especially political games and increase the government's revenue rather than to care for the people's profitability. The GST increase to 5% is a great testimony. The government has so much money but the people are always struggling. Why? Something is surely wrong!
So why are we still so foolish to let them fool us? -
Democrats are people who believes in the patriotism, energy and initiative of the average man.
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Singaporeans are not fools, well not all of them, they are just people. And people don't care.
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Unfortunately, people who do not care are 'FOOLS'.Originally posted by men_@_arms:Singaporeans are not fools, well not all of them, they are just people. And people don't care. -
Originally posted by relevation:Dear All,
I have found that SIngaporeans are fools from various episodes.
Let me elaborate with the following:
1) We allow an absolute party to rule us for 44 years without any opposition to ensure an alternative government
2) We readily agree to take unfavorable measures like CPF cuts, higher cost of payments for HDB, and any increment of fees by our government without question or protest.
3) We fight among ourselves - trying to gain favors from the PAP echelon.
4) We laugh and cheer when oppposition leaders fail.
Now the supporting details:
1) I think other than Japan's LDP and Taiwan's KMT, Singapore is the only state that gives up oppositional power willingly. What makes us so sure after LKY's demise, Singapore is as safe and as uncorrupt? Who will guarantee us that the Lee Family will continue to be honest and will continue to give us the prosperity that was delivered for the last 44 years?
Next, we are a full fledge democracy with full democratic institutions with 1 man 1 vote and we willingly surcum ourselves to unfavourable policies to make us poor and less rich. We willingly surcome under a democratic dictatorship where there is no force or coersion like Taiwan who was under martial law. Why are we so willing to listen to the PAP and refuse to give oppositional forces a chance to develop. Very much we laugh at them and seem to want them to fall from grace.
Do remember they are our hope if PAP ever fails us. They are also working for our national interest. Without them what is the difference between Singapore and Communist China?? Just so much similarities- ONE PARTY STATE and RULE OF MAN. LKY>GCT>LHL- all MAN. So we are fools- all of us whether smart or stupid, including me because I am not there to prevent this. But whether me or any oppositional forces are useless without the support of the people and worse when Singaporeans are naive and foolish. Look at how happy we are to see JBJ, CHIAM SEE TONG, Chee Soon Juan and STeve Chia fall from grace.
2) Whay are we so happy to take pay cuts. Let me define happy. Happy is a state of happiness to the extend of having become contented with the situation or relent with the situation without any action taken to prevent it. That's happy. CPF cuts, increase fees during our worst times, SIA pliots being bullied by the government and LKY, ERP and COE to increase our running cost, artificially inflated property prices to satisfy developers like Far East and CDL. All these to make SIngaporeans POOR so that we have no choice to to squeeze ourselves here. Worst of all PAP always justify their pay increment to keep good man. Good man are good because they are willing not when they are not willing and have to be seduced. When good man refused to expose evil man, that 's when a nation will ultimately fail. We are all so foolish!
3) You won't believe it, so many people are happy that Steve Chia falls. Do we know that for every oppoistional force that fails, it makes Singapore worse off. How are we so sure that PAP is really doing a great job. They are good in cosmestics- upgrades, $ in CPF etc, how are we sure that they are really that good. Who in us audit them? Where are their statements? Where are they financial and performance records? If they are so clean, why are they not publishing the performance of GIC and Temasek holdings? Where are our money and how are they performing? Isn't Singapore Tech, Singtel, SPH, SIA all public companies that belong to Singaporeans? Why are we not getting any dividents from these companies. What have they done to make us better in our livelihood? Are we not fools? We have lost people are who there to help us and make our lives better. PAP had given us a standard life but never a comfortable one! They always make our lives difficult.
4) Singapore is the only country where political awareness is the lowest. Without oppositional forces, tehre is no way we can ever ensure that our interest are secured. We will only have the PAP's views and actions. We lost the chance to explore issues and ensure that our ineterest is secured. How are we so sure that the decisions the PAP make is not Pro-PAP and their members or pro-a certain group of people? So stop cheering and being so happy when our opposition leaders fail and fall, because we all will lose out. Let us see things beyond what is show to us by the PAP and learn to see things in our own way. Lets be open minded and accept diversity. Its only when there is choice that we have the power. For now we are all just FOOLS , all to willing and happy to be fooled.
Relevation.
Poor chap....you must have been suffering all these years. Two options for you my dear friend -
1. Join an opposition party and articulate your grievances to the whole nation. I am sure there are many like minded individuals out there who will worship you......."No action Talk only" will bring you nowhere.
2. Leave the country and throw stones from afar, hopefully it will hit some people you hate very much.
Of course the other option is to continue staying here and suffer. What is the word for a person who enjoyed suffering ???
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Dear Relevation,
Glad to inform you that another form of voicing the opposing comments have been suppressed.
Mr Yang Jun Wei of UMF1003 have started a nite talk show since 6 months ago.
He is a thinker and brave enough to voice out his and the listener's dissent about certain government policy.
The radio show was well received by the listeners.
But, he have just received a notice to stop his talk show.
So much for "open policy" adopted by the Government.
Guess they have fear of their "own supporters" cross examining their policy.
Maybe you may be banned from the Forum for your "honest" opinion soon. -
Maybe you may be banned from the Forum for your "honest" opinion soon.
[/b][/quote]
Dear MedicatedOil,
I will be sad for the forum if ever I am banned from uttering my frank opinion.
Thank you for adding another point to demonstrate that SIngaporeans are fools to allow the government to shut down dissent.
Frankly if we allow the PAP to continue as such, there is no future for Singapore in a globalised world. Where is the free exchange of information? By shutting down the station, PAP has demonstrated that it is weak and incompetent. It is unable to withstand the challenges and the pressure information brings.
If PAP is smart, it should not shut dissent down but challenge the dissent. By the way dissent helps PAP to win votes if they adopt and overcome the dissenting views. -
Poor chap....you must have been suffering all these years. Two options for you my dear friend -
1. Join an opposition party and articulate your grievances to the whole nation. I am sure there are many like minded individuals out there who will worship you......."No action Talk only" will bring you nowhere.
2. Leave the country and throw stones from afar, hopefully it will hit some people you hate very much.
Of course the other option is to continue staying here and suffer. What is the word for a person who enjoyed suffering ???
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Dear thinkloud2004
I like to thank you for reading my posting and happy that you have responded with some interesting remarks.
Though your arguement that I should join a political party is correct but sad to say the political ground is still a pro-PAP one. That's the reason why the topic here is "Singaporeans are fools"! So the subject is not about me but about how we as Singaporeans should change to be smarter and not continue to be foolish. Yes I may join political party or even form my own party one day but for now it is to change the mindset of people first.
I take offense that you suggest me to the leave the country. If ever I want to leave this country, I would not have bothered even raising such a controversial topic. As such I disagree that all talk and no action brings me nowhere. Singapore and even PAP profess that we are a democracy with freedom to speak. Your implied notion to ask me to shut up is an insult to yourself. Surely you have decided to suffer and there again fits the bill of this topic of " Singaporeans are fools".
Therefore, thinkloud2004, as your name implied that you are able to think loudly, stop your suffering and you may like to start joining a political party. You seem pro-PAP and maybe you can line up all the way to the back to join them.
Thank you again and I welcome further challenges. -
Dear BLIM,Originally posted by BLIM:Hi Revelation,
Regards to your post, I don't think that singaporeans agree to CPF cuts and pay cuts. But what can we do? Can we oppose? This is a very stupid thing to say.......
If we were to voice out, will there be any change? The answer is Hell NO!!!!!
Singapore has many areas to bring out dissent and displeasure and of course to be heard. This forum is one of them. Others like the political parties'commentaries, Chamber of commerce, business groups, interest groups etc. Singapore's existience and survival lies with the business community. Whatever the business community wants especially the MNCs, the government will listen.
If that's a hint, you are able to do something! -
i wouldn't really say they are fools...
singaporeans do think for themselves like you do...
it's just that no one takes any actions to prove their point... -
x 2Originally posted by relevation:Dear BLIM,
Singapore has many areas to bring out dissent and displeasure and of course to be heard. This forum is one of them. Others like the political parties'commentaries, Chamber of commerce, business groups, interest groups etc. Singapore's existience and survival lies with the business community. Whatever the business community wants especially the MNCs, the government will listen.
If that's a hint, you are able to do something!
the worst thing tt can happen is singaporeans perceive tt their voices go to nothing and become indifferent and dont even bother to feedback.
there are avenues where ur voice can be heard! if u realli care and realli feel strongly abt something pls do voice them out! -
Dear dumbdumb,Originally posted by dumbdumb!:just wondering.. say if there is no more opposition.. then if got problem. can rise again right?
Why let serious problem start or even bring us to a stage like our economic situation today?
Do you know that since the 1980s our opposition as well as the public have been lobbying for government to increase efforts in developing local entrepreurs? Our PAP government waited for 20 years before they acted on it and only when our economy is now suffering as our highly depended MNCs moves to China and other low cost countries.
In the 1980s, our government's response was that SIngapore's survival largely lies with the MNCs and even Mr Goh acknowledge and use MNCs investing here as a threat to entice Singaporeans to vote for PAP in the 1991, 1997 and to a lesser extend in 2001's general election.
Had we have a strong opposition, we would not have waited 20 years to start singing the entrepeurer song.
Let me remind all Singaporeans, Singapore is a small nation. Any mistake that is made by the government has serious consequences. Issues that are not well thought of and due to ease of majority in Parliament and the PAP WIP (where members of PAP backbenches are NOT allowed to express differing opinions), result in many failures. The failures of Investment in Suzhou, 2 child policy, dependency on MNCs, COE, ERP and GST have now seen serious consequences.
Had we have a dual party system in parliament, we may have a better chance of preventing these failures.
So far we are lucky to have survived all these failures. Will survive a fatal one?
DumbDumb, let me remind you, if we have a fatal blow, will we survive? I seriously doubt with a single party system. -
Dear RevelationOriginally posted by FireIce:why are u still in singapore then?
I think its pretty refreshing yet worth pondering about.
Though I hardly knows of anything about the workings of the local government, then again I'm sure not many ppl know and understand either.
Therefore pls continue with the threadings though it may or may not be not true its worth debating about and any considerable comments alike from others are definetely wellcome
A topic worth debating and sharing makes more sense than 1 line nonsenses! Not only are they totally off track, it irks the ppl with the real intention of getting the right stuff and voicing concerns! -
It would be good if our government is like pre-war Germany & former Iraq. At least we get to invade our neighbours ...
but ours is so pu.ssy ... gotta kow-tow to US ...