If you do not know how to read the TWO posts of 11 March 2004 on Page 1, no one can help you.Originally posted by panja_v:Are you PAP supporter? Please don't use
PILOT : Capt Goh PR status revoked
and turn it into the Young PAP ministers are OK thread.
Go and start your own thread leh...
This is Internet age, you cannot fool all the people all the time.
my guess is they already haf been, and they r prob closely monitored daily.Originally posted by Viper52:Just a interesting angle, if by holding a PR of another country, or having properties overseas, constitutes a "fall back" position to escape to should Singapore fail, as SM has suggested, then might I suggest, for the sake of good governance of Singapore, EVERY leader of Singapore, starting from the Perm-Secs of the Ministries to the Ministers of the Cabinet themselves, be audited by an independent external agency for overseas Permanent Residency status, as well as foriegn assets and interests. After all, going by the SM's logic, theres nothing stopping them from having from having an "escape clause" should they muck up Singapore, is there?
Yup, like THAT'S gonna happen.
Again wuming78, are we watching people with different standards here? Isn't that statement just a tad presumptious?Originally posted by wuming78:my guess is they already haf been, and they r prob closely monitored daily.
hm. i cant comment cos i dun haf sufficient knowledge. do u? my previous statement is presumptious. and i made it based on watever little knowledge i haf of the ppl up there and whoever manages them.Originally posted by Viper52:Again wuming78, are we watching people with different standards here? Isn't that statement just a tad presumptious?
Besides, who is watching? And who are watching the watchers? A lot of people here have already said, a government should ultimately be answerable to the people. Can we say that for ours?
Exactly! I don't. And thats the problem with the system here isn't it? At the end of the day a democratically elected government is supposed to be accountable ultimately to the people who voted them into office, but as have been asked several times here, is that the case in Singapore?Originally posted by wuming78:hm. i cant comment cos i dun haf sufficient knowledge. do u? my previous statement is presumptious. and i made it based on watever little knowledge i haf of the ppl up there and whoever manages them.
hm.. interesting question.. brings to my mind the time when the late president ong teng cheong went public wif his experience as the president when his term was ending and he was contemplating a second term.Originally posted by Viper52:Exactly! I don't. And thats the problem with the system here isn't it? At the end of the day the government is supposed to be accountable ultimately to the people who voted them into office, but as have been asked several times here, is that the case in Singapore?
Precisely! The Ruling Party is unwilling to follow through on the original promises it made when it came up with the Elected President's Bill, stonewalling and playing games President Ong's attempts to fulfil his duty as stated by nothing less the the Consitution of Singapore by getting a clearer picture of the state of Singapore's Reserves (otherwise known as the People's Money) so he could effectively be the 2nd of the "Dual Keys" to the Reserves. And after he failed in his attempt, the Consitution was quietly re-written to make sure that the elected President will not be able to make another attempt to gain a clearer picture of Singapore's Reserves.Originally posted by wuming78:hm.. interesting question.. brings to my mind the time when the late president ong teng cheong went public wif his experience as the president when his term was ending and he was contemplating a second term.
but what would u see as the government showing accountability to the public? accountability in wat sense? monetary? others? how shud they do it?
i guess to the ruling party and personalities in it, their view is tt: as long as we deliver our promises, and ensure singapore's survivability and competitiveness and maintain our stds of living etc, (most of these r tied to economic well being, not really quality of life) they do not haf to show and tell everything they do - in the name of national interest or simply cos they noe best.Originally posted by Viper52:Precisely! The Ruling Party is unwilling to follow through on the original promises it made when it came up with the Elected President's Bill, stonewalling and playing games President Ong's attempts to fulfil his duty as stated by nothing less the the Consitution of Singapore by getting a clearer picture of the state of Singapore's Reserves (otherwise known as the People's Money) so he could effectively be the 2nd of the "Dual Keys" to the Reserves. And after he failed in his attempt, the Consitution was quietly re-written to make sure that the elected President will not be able to make another attempt to gain a clearer picture of Singapore's Reserves.
Well where can we start? For starters, the GIC and Temasek Holdings can open the books to public scrutiny, since the fact is that they (especially GIC) are using money that come directly from Singaporeans to conduct their activities. It might be arguable for Temasek's case, but until their books are open, we'll never know.
There are uncountable other areas, but if you consider that something full employment data for Singapore is kept classified supposedly for "national interests" (although what interests the Manpower Minister was strangely ambiguous) one can only see where the problem begins.
Is this true?Originally posted by Atobe:This matter sucks as much for Singapore Citizens, whose own Birth Right to be a Citizen is withdrawn if he stays away from Singapore for more then ten years.
Lingos, I might be wrong, but I believe that the government "reserves" the right to do so.Originally posted by Lingos:Is this true?
Originally posted by Atobe:let's face it. The 'smear campaign' is always employed as and when it is an opportune time to do so. In any organisation, so long as you have been blacklisted for whatever reasons, the management reserves the right to sack you with extreme prejudice. That includes covering you in whatever dirt they can dig up, even if it means invading yur personal life.
It was - and remain - disgusting when the news broke that Capt Ryan GohÂ’s PR status is being revoked, especially when this came soon after the sheer arrogance of SMÂ’s display of his seemingly omni potential knowledge of Capt Ryan GohÂ’s [b]private plans.
It is disgusting behavior coming so soon after a supposedly amicable meeting that SM had with ALPA-S that was supposed to have resolved the SIA Management problems with ALPA-S.
What is the purpose of making Capt Ryan Goh bend onto his knees to beg for a review of his PR status that is being revoked ?
Is there a hidden agenda and purpose in going to this full length of display of complete power in dictating a personÂ’s future ?
Is there no moral obligation of the Government towards a PR, who has given the best part of twenty years of his life contributing to the Profitability of SIA, and without any bad records on the scale of the SIA accident in Taipeh Airport ?
This matter sucks as much for Singapore Citizens, whose own Birth Right to be a Citizen is withdrawn if he stays away from Singapore for more then ten years.
Was Singaporeans consulted when this piece of Legislation was passed in Parliament ?
Did the Members of Parliament, who are supposed to represent the Singaporean Electorate, perform their roles with their conscience fully switched on, or have they sold their souls to the rule of the PAP's Political Interests ?
On the point of ownership of foreign properties, the GIC and Temasek have bought large stakes in overseas assets, and have even gone into joint ventures in ownership of real estates in UK, France, Germany, USA, China, Australia, New Zealand, and Japan.
See the thread 'Temasek Holdings'.
If Capt Ryan Goh is accused of preparing an escape route simply on the basis of his ownership of foreign property, should we see the massive investments by GIC and Temasek as a back door escape route for the Elites from the Ruling Party ?
There certainly is enough to spread around, as only these few Elites are the ones who know where each assets is located.
[/b]
Its a first small step of a VERY long journey. Which no less than President Ong failed to get the PAP to finish.Originally posted by wuming78:recently temasek holdings announced they wil be more open with their accounts and all tt? hope its a first (and not last) step in the right direction. but o cos we wil be interested to noe wat happens to our reserves too.
I reserve my judgement on that either way, until more accountability is inbuilt into the system.
i haf quite alot of confidence tt the government is not corrupt and not mis-using funds,
Well said, and as events have seen, ours is a Ruling Party which cannot be relied on to reduce its paranoia and secrecy unless pushed, and pushed very hard. And that is the reason why Singaporeans must continue to keep pushing for greater accountability and transparency in the system. And to do that more awareness must come from Singaporeans. For too long, we have assumed OUR MONEY is safely in the right hands, with nothing in the way of concrete proof, other than the promises from the government, that this is happening.
although they r not doing a real good job in their PR and showing accountability (they may be accountable, but not showing as such). the veil of secrecy should perhaps be lifted. they need not be so defensive all the time. i think singaporeans r mature enuff to noe more.
Give me some time, and I will dig out the reference site for your consideration.Originally posted by Lingos:Is this true?