Homosexual
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Interesting topic.
Btw, why is homosexuality abnormal? It's 'abnormal' to us because for thousands and thousands of years, guys have been screwing gals and gals have been screwing guys and that instilled the idea of what's supposed to be normal. So because homosexuals doesn't screw and love people of the opposite gender which is supposed to be normal, they are deemed as 'abnormal', 'sinners', 'lunatics' and a dozen other not-so-nice terms.
And just because they are 'abnormal', doesn't mean we should discriminate against them. We might get uncomfortable with homosexual but there's no need to get so hostile with them. They don't really hurt us. They are just humans like us who are trying to live the life they wanted. We can't force someone to be heterosexual, neither could we force someone to be homosexual. -
I don't advocate discrimintating against gays.
For some gays,they want to have change-sex op,there wear woman dress and they do 'business'.As men,they want to become women.Are they normal?Or are they just the extreme cases of gays?Even they had sex-op,i don't know whether women would accept them as women. -
Originally posted by TLK:
is that so? homosexual isn't a modern phenomenon... there are documented occurances throughout history... in both western AND eastern cultures.
Interesting topic.
Btw, why is homosexuality abnormal? It's 'abnormal' to us because for thousands and thousands of years, guys have been screwing gals and gals have been screwing guys and that instilled the idea of what's supposed to be normal.
the idea of sexual "norm" however, is a distinctly modern notion.So because homosexuals doesn't screw and love people of the opposite gender which is supposed to be normal, they are deemed as 'abnormal', 'sinners', 'lunatics' and a dozen other not-so-nice terms.
each of these terms can be traced to a distinct point in history.
"abnormal" and "sinners" were christian notions that can be traced to the spread of christianity during the roman empire and more recently, to the middle ages.
"lunatic" as a clinical condition can be traced to the birth of psychology to the time of freud. homosexuality as a clinical condition is even MORE recent, and can be traced to victorian england... one of the most prudish and hypocritical eras of western history.And just because they are 'abnormal', doesn't mean we should discriminate against them. We might get uncomfortable with homosexual but there's no need to get so hostile with them.
this whole idea of "abnormality" is questionable to begin with... its not a question of discriminating against them, but do we even have a claim to call them "abnormal" in the first place?They don't really hurt us. They are just humans like us who are trying to live the life they wanted. We can't force someone to be heterosexual, neither could we force someone to be homosexual.
i couldn't agree more... -
wrong again there, Mr "Try so hard" men who are gay, love men. men who have a sex change op, are trans and they are not necessary gay. men who are gay are not necessary trans, men who wear women's clothes are called crossdressers and they may be straight, bi or gay. some crossdressers become trans in the end, some do not. some trans become lesbians, some become bi and some become "straight". Its a great big complex and diversified world out there, not as simple as it sounds when u lazily and conveniently label all these different people under one "gay" banner.Originally posted by PRP:I don't advocate discrimintating against gays.
For some gays,they want to have change-sex op,there wear woman dress and they do 'business'.As men,they want to become women.Are they normal?Or are they just the extreme cases of gays?Even they had sex-op,i don't know whether women would accept them as women.
pls. go do your research... u're sounding more and more ignorant.
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my impression is that his experience with what he thinks are "gay" people is limited to gawking at the street-walkers at changi village...
prostitution is a social problem can spawn a whole new topic by itself... lumping it together confuses the situation.
if anything at all, i sympathise with the street-walkers at changi v... given a choice, who would make a living selling their body???
for all we know, they are driven to the oldest profession known to human-kind precisely because this self-righteous and bigoted society has given them no other places to go. -
yeah... agreeOriginally posted by CX:my impression is that his experience with what he thinks are "gay" people is limited to gawking at the street-walkers at changi village...
prostitution is a social problem can spawn a whole new topic by itself... lumping it together confuses the situation.
if anything at all, i sympathise with the street-walkers at changi v... given a choice, who would make a living selling their body???
for all we know, they are driven to the oldest profession known to human-kind precisely because this self-righteous and bigoted society has given them no other places to go. -
u seem to have a very open and well-grounded understanding of sexuality... are u sure u're "homophobic" ?Originally posted by HENG@:yeah... agree
i guess there are varying extents of homophobia, but where do u stand on it?
what is it that u still fear? -
well, everytime i see a gay, my hair sort of stands on the end. its just like my dislike for eating "hum" just becos i think its disgusting dun mean i condemn the practice.Originally posted by CX:u seem to have a very open and well-grounded understanding of sexuality... are u sure u're "homophobic" ?
i guess there are varying extents of homophobia, but where do u stand on it?
what is it that u still fear? -
i can accept.. uncertain whether other ladies can anotOriginally posted by PRP:I don't advocate discrimintating against gays.
For some gays,they want to have change-sex op,there wear woman dress and they do 'business'.As men,they want to become women.Are they normal?Or are they just the extreme cases of gays?Even they had sex-op,i don't know whether women would accept them as women.
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it is true that different pple have visceral reactions to different things... no doubt, socialization has much to do with it.Originally posted by HENG@:well, everytime i see a gay, my hair sort of stands on the end. its just like my dislike for eating "hum" just becos i think its disgusting dun mean i condemn the practice.
my impression from speaking with many people is that they are disgusted by the idea of homosexual anal sex... strange that these same pple do not feel the same disgust when talking about hetrosexual anal sex.
not that i'm trying to psycho-analyse u or second-guess your views, but i think the very nature of homosexual sex has much to do with why people find it so objectionable...
plus the point that modern medicine had been quick to jump on the fact that anal sex is medically dangerous as anal tissues tear easily and anal sex is a major transmission vector for the HIV/AIDS virus, hepatitis, and other sexually transmitted and blood-borne diseases.
however, the perception that HIV is a "gay" disease, which is not all true... HIV was another disease that jumped the specie barrier, like SARS.
and it was incidental that the first identified "group" of HIV-infected patients were gay men in L.A... this proves to be one of the most enduring myths that had caught the popular imagination because no sooner had they been identified, other groups, including drug users who had shared needles came onto the radar screen as well...
but nobody remembers that... -
is that so? homosexual isn't a modern phenomenon... there are documented occurances throughout history... in both western AND eastern cultures.
I know that, but I'm not referring to documented history.
the idea of sexual "norm" however, is a distinctly modern notion. -
for me, its not so much the aids factor... its just that thinking of guys screwing guys is kinda gross for me... gives me goosebumps... but everyone's entitled to their decisions, and that is my stand on the whole issue.Originally posted by CX:it is true that different pple have visceral reactions to different things... no doubt, socialization has much to do with it.
my impression from speaking with many people is that they are disgusted by the idea of homosexual anal sex... strange that these same pple do not feel the same disgust when talking about hetrosexual anal sex.
not that i'm trying to psycho-analyse u or second-guess your views, but i think the very nature of homosexual sex has much to do with why people find it so objectionable...
plus the point that modern medicine had been quick to jump on the fact that anal sex is medically dangerous as anal tissues tear easily and anal sex is a major transmission vector for the HIV/AIDS virus, hepatitis, and other sexually transmitted and blood-borne diseases.
however, the perception that HIV is a "gay" disease, which is not all true... HIV was another disease that jumped the specie barrier, like SARS.
and it was incidental that the first identified "group" of HIV-infected patients were gay men in L.A... this proves to be one of the most enduring myths that had caught the popular imagination because no sooner had they been identified, other groups, including drug users who had shared needles came onto the radar screen as well...
but nobody remembers that... -
ah... ok... hee... i wonder if some of them feel the same way towards hetrosexual sex...Originally posted by HENG@:for me, its not so much the aids factor... its just that thinking of guys screwing guys is kinda gross for me... gives me goosebumps... but everyone's entitled to their decisions, and that is my stand on the whole issue. -
then how are we to decide what is normal and what is not? a "norm" requires a historical benchmark... they do not pop out of nowhere.Originally posted by TLK:I know that, but I'm not referring to documented history.
it is only through an enquiry into the historical context and the nature of the "norm" that we are enquiring into that we can have a better picture of why people think they way they do. -
maybe... u neber knowOriginally posted by CX:ah... ok... hee... i wonder if some of them feel the same way towards hetrosexual sex... -
Heng,
You said trans were not ncecessary gays.
I doubt what u said is true.Tran is a male has op to become a 'female.'If a tran wants to look for a sexual partner,surely he would look for a man and not a woman.So trans are mostly gay -- unless he doesn't have sexual partner at all. -
even you yourself said "MOST", in your above post. that means u don't doubt what i said. because i said not necessary. so if u do doubt it, wun u be saying all?Originally posted by PRP:Heng,
You said trans were not ncecessary gays.
I doubt what u said is true.Tran is a male has op to become a 'female.'If a tran wants to look for a sexual partner,surely he would look for a man and not a woman.So trans are mostly gay -- unless he doesn't have sexual partner at all.
but do u dare say 100% all? no one in their right mind argues like that i think, so by the extrapolation of logic, i am right. remember. there have been a few cases reported of trans who have an op to become lesbian. so by evidence i am right again. -
Ya la ya la,To each his own.Settled!
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The main issue for this topic is: Is homosexual right?
I think it is not.By nature,the purpose of sex is for procreation.So if a person want to find a sexual partner, he or she should look from the oppposite sex.Between the same sex, they should only be friend but not for sexual relationship. -
there is no right and wrong for this topic.Originally posted by PRP:The main issue for this topic is: Is homosexual right?
I think it is not.By nature,the purpose of sex is for procreation.So if a person want to find a sexual partner, he or she should look from the oppposite sex.Between the same sex, they should only be friend but not for sexual relationship. -
heres my food analogy:
Some people hates durians , some pple love it ...BUT I dont condemn pple who loves durians, while i find it disgusting in smell..
Peace out!!!!! -
this implies that there is a "right" and "wrong" in a very clear "black" and "white" manner...Originally posted by PRP:The main issue for this topic is: Is homosexual right?
I think it is not.By nature,the purpose of sex is for procreation.So if a person want to find a sexual partner, he or she should look from the oppposite sex.Between the same sex, they should only be friend but not for sexual relationship.
and we have all pointed out that the reason for this "right" and "wrong" is essentially invented. by religion, by culture, by people.
is sex only for procreation? that itself, is debatable... nobody can deny the pleasures of an orgasm... are we to say that pple will stop procreating if sex wasn't so much fun???
instead of thinking about it as a black and white issue, maybe we can think of sexuality as existing on a plane,
like so:
-10 ---------------------------------------------------------------- 10
with an extreme point that represents homosexuality, and another extreme that represents hetrosexuality, but with many points in between that represents all the varying degrees of preferences.
most here agree at the very least that it is improper to judge pple for their choices and call them names.
if u insist on judging pple for something that is essentially none of your business, and which u do not understand, then there's nothing left to say. -
yes this has been what i was saying all along. glad to see other people with good sense around.Originally posted by tooled_up:heres my food analogy:
Some people hates durians , some pple love it ...BUT I dont condemn pple who loves durians, while i find it disgusting in smell..
Peace out!!!!!
peace out to ya dude -
CX,
Probalby u don't know,that's why u think there is no right or wrong on this issue.
In the past and even today,majority of the ppl think homosexuality is not right.Are their belief wrong?Why do so many ppl think like that?
I have given by reaon why i think homosexuality is wrong.Your rebutal is not convincing to me.Originally posted by PRP:The main issue for this topic is: Is homosexual right?
I think it is not.By nature,the purpose of sex is for procreation.So if a person want to find a sexual partner, he or she should look from the oppposite sex.Between the same sex, they should only be friend but not for sexual relationship. -
Heng,
U said some tran became lesbian.
I don't believe what u said.Tran is a man who do sex op to become a 'woman'.If he can have sexual relationship with a woman,why did he have sex-change op?