Do you think the opposition will get to win GRCs this time?
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Bravo to all forumnites,
By your suggestions to form a sgforums party to look into those issues and problems so far unsolved, Singapore youths have shown their true understanding of problems.
May be one day, we will see some of them forming a really objective opposition to help us to the next lap.
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ok robertteh your job is to sum up everything, print it out, then deliver it to LHL by hand.
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How do you know if they're not already adults? Or maybe members among the ranks of the opposition are present here already?Originally posted by robertteh:Bravo to all forumnites,
By your suggestions to form a sgforums party to look into those issues and problems so far unsolved, Singapore youths have shown their true understanding of problems.
May be one day, we will see some of them forming a really objective opposition to help us to the next lap. 
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Who do you support ?Originally posted by noel:How do you know if they're not already adults? Or maybe members among the ranks of the opposition are present here already? -
There ought to be cohesiveness and esprit de corp for Singapore or any venture to be successful, right?
I see the need for common purpose or intent or vision for Singapore to be successful. Irrespective of background, it does not matter as long as they are citizens and share collective values and visions for the common good of all.
How old or how young is also in my opinion not so important.
However all must have good basic and fundamental prerequisites and do not have an axe to grind with anyone. They must be able to serve selflessly.
All must achieve this first and must pass the first test.
They can start making friends and socializing with all who share the same common objective and vision to go to the next lap.
They can contribute their ideas here through the ideas circles or clubs. Any one can serve as long as he or she is able and capable and energetic and passionate and has passed the above-mentioned tests. It is important to achieve active citizenry for our country to take to the next lap. -
hai there muse...sorry for saying this..but do u really need to ask this QUESTION...specially in singapore? does it make any difference?
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Talking about it is better lor at least you know you are not suffering alone.Originally posted by malarica:hai there muse...sorry for saying this..but do u really need to ask this QUESTION...specially in singapore? does it make any difference?
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yea....we are not alone! thanks!
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More Singapore Shares in the bext election !Originally posted by malarica:yea....we are not alone! thanks! -
Originally posted by paperchicken:
If you will read carefully my post again, and break your reading speed according to the well spaced paragraphs, and not try to read faster then the focus speed of your eyes, you will perhaps grab the message.
You seem to be contradicting yourself.
One moment you say that the govt should spend more to help people. Another moment you say that Singapore Shares is a waste of govt funds. So what is your stand ?
Did I hint that the Government SHOULD spend more to help people ?
Did I mention anywhere that Singapore Shares is a waste of Government Funds ?
How did you draw such conclusion from a piece that basically explain the purpose of the GST, its 'MULTIPLIER EFFECTS' in collecting revenue, and how the Small Businesses can either opt in or out of the GST scheme ? -
Originally posted by oldbreadstinks:
This piece below is extracted from your previous posting:
maybe you should look at what i quoted?Originally posted by Atobe:
????
I thought so, no wonder there exist a proverb that says "empty vessels make the most noise".
The red colored ???? was your posting.
Does your response in abstract intended to mean something or simply to show your confused state of mind ? -
Chicken have eyes on the sides unlike PIGS so they dun read as well.Originally posted by Atobe:If you will read carefully my post again, and break your reading speed according to the well spaced paragraphs, and not try to read faster then the focus speed of your eyes, you will perhaps grab the message.
Did I hint that the Government SHOULD spend more to help people ?
Did I mention anywhere that Singapore Shares is a waste of Government Funds ?
How did you draw such conclusion from a piece that basically explain the purpose of the GST, its 'MULTIPLIER EFFECTS' in collecting revenue, and how the Small Businesses can either opt in or out of the GST scheme ?
Chickens have small brains unlike PIGS with have enormous ones.
You post this yourself :
http://www.sgforums.com/?action=thread_display&thread_id=71199
You not only contridict yourself, you keep wavering your stand to suit yourself. You are the type who want to create trouble and want to oppose for the sake of opposing. -
Originally posted by paperchicken:
Unfortunately, while chickens and pigs have eyes and brains, 'chickens' that are made of 'paper' are flat - with similar flat vision; or if they are 'paperchicken' they will be like 'paper wrapped chicken' - with vision blurred by the paper bag that they are wrapped in, and with their brains fried as 'paper wrapped chicken' will finally end in a wok full of oil.
Chicken have eyes on the sides unlike PIGS so they dun read as well.
Chickens have small brains unlike PIGS with have enormous ones.
You post this yourself :
http://www.sgforums.com/?action=thread_display&thread_id=71199
You not only contridict yourself, you keep wavering your stand to suit yourself. You are the type who want to create trouble and want to oppose for the sake of opposing.
Surely you can do better then simply quoting an entire page from a thread, just to " prove (???) " my wavering and contradicting positions in my postings ?
Why do you not take the trouble to pick out the relevant piece of my post, and breakdown the entire piece, and point out the parts of the posts (which is clearly paragraphed) that you would like to EXPOSE and PROVE my contradiction and wavering positons ?
Or are you simply living up to your reputation of being a 'paperchicken' - as flat as a piece of " paper ", and too " chicken " to face a challenge ? -
HA ! You fall flat on your face with your arguements. Origamis are three-demensional by the way. Even kindergarten kids also know. Duh !Originally posted by Atobe:Unfortunately, while chickens and pigs have eyes and brains, 'chickens' that are made of 'paper' are flat - with similar flat vision; or if they are 'paperchicken' they will be like 'paper wrapped chicken' - with vision blurred by the paper bag that they are wrapped in, and with their brains fried as 'paper wrapped chicken' will finally end in a wok full of oil.
Surely you can do better then simply quoting an entire page from a thread, just to " prove (???) " my wavering and contradicting positions in my postings ?
Why do you not take the trouble to pick out the relevant piece of my post, and breakdown the entire piece, and point out the parts of the posts (which is clearly paragraphed) that you would like to EXPOSE and PROVE my contradiction and wavering positons ?
Or are you simply living up to your reputation of being a 'paperchicken' - as flat as a piece of " paper ", and too " chicken " to face a challenge ? -
Originally posted by paperchicken:
Well, you are the expert in flatness, and must be quite dextrous with your hands to come up with an 'origami' piece of chicken.
HA ! You fall flat on your face with your arguements. Origamis are three-demensional by the way. Even kindergarten kids also know. Duh !
Not surprising that only you know that kindergarten kids are so expert in playing with paperchickens, as most adults would have moved on to more important issues on paper.
Is this all that you will respond to - paper folding origami - and skip the more important issues of proving how and where my posting have deviated and contradicted myself ?
It only shows the triviality of thinking and accusations, the shallowness of thought process, and the clear inability to comprehend statements made. -
Hi there Malarica,Originally posted by malarica:hai there muse...sorry for saying this..but do u really need to ask this QUESTION...specially in singapore? does it make any difference?
First of all thank you for your Good Question.
Secondly, thanks to all forumites for their views.
Thirdly. this is my answer:
Most of the time, i have been a silent observer and i have been thinking, for i have certainly leaarned alot from the previous threads but i don't know how the forumites think as to such specific questions, so hence my thread.
It was indeed revelating to see the exchange, from this i realised i can achieve a few things:
1. get more information and views from passionate and learned individuals in the forum;
2. allow this information exchange to all interestred forumites;
3. invoke some awareness in all our forumites with exchange and discussion and debates on respective views;
In my view, Singaporeans generally lack passion with regards to their political destiny. This passion (or rather the lack of) has allowed the ruling PAP to drive the country to its present state today.
Now look here, i am not discounting what the PAP has done before in the leadership of the nation till early 1980s. However, the continued hegemony over parliament by the PAP is in my opinion going to drive the country to ruin.
The nation building PAP members did well. BUT most of them are gone.
DID they make lives difficult for people? No.
Did they achieve for Singapore? YES
What about the present PAP members and the Swollen cabinet of theirs?
What have they achieved for Singapore?
What can they promise for Singapore's future?
They claim that we are no good and we need foreign talent, we must welcome competition with foreign talent and compete with the world players and in the world market. We must move out of our comfort zone.
But they claim to be the brightest and the world's best and nobody can compete with them that is why they deserve the world's highest salaries amongst political leaders. They dislike and are intolerant of compeition, everyone knows i need not say more.
Are they leading by example? Our so called mighty leaders?
They brought the country to a crossroads then they claim to open up and try to remake Singapore yet they have the cheek to ask us for ideas to undo the wrangle they made.
How many ideas actually get implemented?
If they are the ones having the salary and the power and they dont have ideas, what are they there for?
When they attempted to remake Singapore, they claimed that no stone will be left unturned.
After 1200 man years spent by the Remaking Singapore committee, our PM then DPM said: Its not that no stones were left unturned, its that we carefully put the stones back in place.
In my humble opinoin, if life does not seem to be getting better for most people, it is time to check the PAP government seriously.
The high costs and pressure cooker society is taking a toll on the people and their livelihood their sense of civic mindeness and their future. everyone for himself, talk about nationhood and nation beilding?
I wholly agree with RobertTeh for his remark that for the Govt to be loved it must first love the people. It must realise that It was elected (however remote in history when that happened) to SERVE THE PEOPLE.
BY THE PEOPLE, FOR THE PEOPLE.
Does the present PAP government love the people? or do they love themselves? You'll have to decide for yourself.
Remember:
Singaporeans when they grow old will not assured of State welfare for them despite their massive contributions in direct taxes or indirect costs.
Any retirement income by way of compulsory CPF savings which is difficult to achieve by most Singaporeans will be whittled down by high land cost and cost of living.
If all of these were to happen by way of the "choice" by the people, i submit to the rule of the majority but how often has "Choice" been on the Menu for singaporeans?
The choice will only come if there is a challenger, the challenger may not come forward if the people prove to be too meek and obedient for the challenger to feel that there is a worthwhile cause.
For the able and the educated feel that if they can still survive and maybe prosper, why find trouble, why challenge the incumbent?
If cannot tahan already, just pack up bags and leave. Leave the rest to fend for themselves. This is happening already.
For good opposition to emerge, the people must signal at the coming GE that they want an opposition and they want it bad. Its the chicken and egg thingy.
Passion is lacking in all stratas of the Singapore society, from the leaders to the people. Its passion that we lack. its passion that i am trying to invoke. I apologise if any quarrels were caused amongst the forumites. Its my little attempt to make it all happen for Singapore.
I am only Singaporean and i am small but i nurse a hope. -
Bravo to 'Muse' and 'robbertteh' for the clearly thought out written pieces of private political thinking that they are willing to put into print. -
To: Atobe,
So so only. Share your ideas as well. Together all in the forum too can in their own way serve to defend preserve and protect the constitutions and rights of citizens.
It is an ideal but all must have ideal and dreams. That is why we are here I think. -
Originally posted by Atobe:
someone as smart as you would surely know what i am trying to say
[b] ????
The red colored ???? was your posting.
Does your response in abstract intended to mean something or simply to show your confused state of mind ?
[/b]
i believe there is no need for me to stated it out
from what you have posted i believe its safe to say we're all people of at least average intelligence
no need to act stupid or say things that insult both yours and my intelligence
by going in circles and avoiding things that need to be said -
wei.......you can attack paperchicken...but dont insult PAPER!Originally posted by Atobe:Unfortunately, while chickens and pigs have eyes and brains, 'chickens' that are made of 'paper' are flat - with similar flat vision; or if they are 'paperchicken' they will be like 'paper wrapped chicken' - with vision blurred by the paper bag that they are wrapped in, and with their brains fried as 'paper wrapped chicken' will finally end in a wok full of oil.
Surely you can do better then simply quoting an entire page from a thread, just to " prove (???) " my wavering and contradicting positions in my postings ?
Why do you not take the trouble to pick out the relevant piece of my post, and breakdown the entire piece, and point out the parts of the posts (which is clearly paragraphed) that you would like to EXPOSE and PROVE my contradiction and wavering positons ?
Or are you simply living up to your reputation of being a 'paperchicken' - as flat as a piece of " paper ", and too " chicken " to face a challenge ? -
Originally posted by oldbreadstinks:
Unfortunately for you, my tolerance towards insults is far higher then all the stupidity that you can come up with.
someone as smart as you would surely know what i am trying to say
i believe there is no need for me to stated it out
from what you have posted i believe its safe to say we're all people of at least average intelligence
no need to act stupid or say things that insult both yours and my intelligence
by going in circles and avoiding things that need to be said
If '????' is all that you can come up with, it shows the questions that need to be asked about the standards that you prefer to follow in a place of clear discussion. -
Is there any difference if the chicken is made out of paper ?Originally posted by paperduck:wei.......you can attack paperchicken...but dont insult PAPER!
Even toilet paper serves a purpose, but "paperchicken" ? -
hi muse.. i very much agree with you..but we as the 'small' people..hmmm...nothing much can be done my friend!Originally posted by Muse:Hi there Malarica,
First of all thank you for your Good Question.
Secondly, thanks to all forumites for their views.
Thirdly. this is my answer:
Most of the time, i have been a silent observer and i have been thinking, for i have certainly leaarned alot from the previous threads but i don't know how the forumites think as to such specific questions, so hence my thread.
It was indeed revelating to see the exchange, from this i realised i can achieve a few things:
1. get more information and views from passionate and learned individuals in the forum;
2. allow this information exchange to all interestred forumites;
3. invoke some awareness in all our forumites with exchange and discussion and debates on respective views;
In my view, Singaporeans generally lack passion with regards to their political destiny. This passion (or rather the lack of) has allowed the ruling PAP to drive the country to its present state today.
Now look here, i am not discounting what the PAP has done before in the leadership of the nation till early 1980s. However, the continued hegemony over parliament by the PAP is in my opinion going to drive the country to ruin.
The nation building PAP members did well. BUT most of them are gone.
DID they make lives difficult for people? No.
Did they achieve for Singapore? YES
What about the present PAP members and the Swollen cabinet of theirs?
What have they achieved for Singapore?
What can they promise for Singapore's future?
They claim that we are no good and we need foreign talent, we must welcome competition with foreign talent and compete with the world players and in the world market. We must move out of our comfort zone.
But they claim to be the brightest and the world's best and nobody can compete with them that is why they deserve the world's highest salaries amongst political leaders. They dislike and are intolerant of compeition, everyone knows i need not say more.
Are they leading by example? Our so called mighty leaders?
They brought the country to a crossroads then they claim to open up and try to remake Singapore yet they have the cheek to ask us for ideas to undo the wrangle they made.
How many ideas actually get implemented?
If they are the ones having the salary and the power and they dont have ideas, what are they there for?
When they attempted to remake Singapore, they claimed that no stone will be left unturned.
After 1200 man years spent by the Remaking Singapore committee, our PM then DPM said: Its not that no stones were left unturned, its that we carefully put the stones back in place.
In my humble opinoin, if life does not seem to be getting better for most people, it is time to check the PAP government seriously.
The high costs and pressure cooker society is taking a toll on the people and their livelihood their sense of civic mindeness and their future. everyone for himself, talk about nationhood and nation beilding?
I wholly agree with RobertTeh for his remark that for the Govt to be loved it must first love the people. It must realise that It was elected (however remote in history when that happened) to SERVE THE PEOPLE.
BY THE PEOPLE, FOR THE PEOPLE.
Does the present PAP government love the people? or do they love themselves? You'll have to decide for yourself.
Remember:
Singaporeans when they grow old will not assured of State welfare for them despite their massive contributions in direct taxes or indirect costs.
Any retirement income by way of compulsory CPF savings which is difficult to achieve by most Singaporeans will be whittled down by high land cost and cost of living.
If all of these were to happen by way of the "choice" by the people, i submit to the rule of the majority but how often has "Choice" been on the Menu for singaporeans?
The choice will only come if there is a challenger, the challenger may not come forward if the people prove to be too meek and obedient for the challenger to feel that there is a worthwhile cause.
For the able and the educated feel that if they can still survive and maybe prosper, why find trouble, why challenge the incumbent?
If cannot tahan already, just pack up bags and leave. Leave the rest to fend for themselves. This is happening already.
For good opposition to emerge, the people must signal at the coming GE that they want an opposition and they want it bad. Its the chicken and egg thingy.
Passion is lacking in all stratas of the Singapore society, from the leaders to the people. Its passion that we lack. its passion that i am trying to invoke. I apologise if any quarrels were caused amongst the forumites. Its my little attempt to make it all happen for Singapore.
I am only Singaporean and i am small but i nurse a hope. -
The GRCs institutionalise a multi racial parliament. The surveys and trends tabulated by the government indicated that if the previous SMCs electoral system is not changed,minority candidates will gradually have little chance to win any seats because of the ppl's tendency to vote along ethnic lines.
However a GRC system can also be a double edge sword.While presently they work to the advantage of the PAP and appear to be the opposition's grave yard in the short term, in the longer run they may actually enable the opposition to win more seats faster than was possible when they have to fight it out, one-to-one in SMCs.
Eg in a 6 member super GRC an opposition team can anchor it with two charismatic leaders one of whom is an ethnic minority + 4 other team members one of which could preferably be a women.
With a underlying 20% discontended voters, the opposition need to capture another 15% minority votes + 15% of the middle ground + 1% luck to succed.
GRCs are not as invincible as they seem. All the opposition need are credible candidates of high calibre. -
What is a parliament for?
Isn't it for members to debate and fight passionately for the people? What do we see in most of our parliament debates? A big orchestrated charade of views from MPs and ministers mostly working against Singaporeans.
The handful opposition has no chance against them. That we all already know because many unpopular and unjust constitutions have been approved with great ease.
Yet, inspite of that, give Singaporeans a few free money, like NSS and CPF top ups, and many will continue to fall over each other to vote for the ruling party.
Dont they realise in doing that, they are destroying democracy and the voice of the common people?
Isnt it better to have more opposition in parliament in order that our voices be heard?
Of course we shouldnt support opposition politicians who get into parliament to seek personal revenge, like JBJ for eg.
Let's give good opposition parties a chance to get into parliament and make life better for citizens - and difficult for PAP to do as they like.
The People's views must be respected - not ignored!