Anwar is acquitted
-
http://straitstimes.asia1.com.sg/latest/story/0,4390,270532,00.html?
What does this say about the political scene during Mahathir's era? Hmm... -
He was a victim in M's era
-
It shows that the Malaysian Court is not subjected to any guiding hands of the Political Rulers.
There is a clear distinction of the Rule of Law, where the Government is itself subjected to the rulings of an INDEPENDENT Judiciary - free from political guidance of the Political Party that form the Government.
Can Singapore achieve the same level of independent Judiciary Standard, where politics do not affect the independence of the Judiciary System ? -
Can but as long as a old guy is around, no way...Originally posted by Atobe:It shows that the Malaysian Court is not subjected to any guiding hands of the Political Rulers.
There is a clear distinction of the Rule of Law, where the Government is itself subjected to an INDEPENDENT Judiciary - free from political guidance of the Political Party that form the Government.
Can Singapore achieve the same level of independent Judiciary Standard, where politics do not affect the independence of the Judiciary System ?
This is very clear to everyone -
Coast clear. Abdullah position secure. Can release Anwar liao. That is what it means.
-
did Dr M migrate out olaydi?Originally posted by Qitai:Coast clear. Abdullah position secure. Can release Anwar liao. That is what it means. -
Originally posted by boy in blues:did Dr M migrate out olaydi?
-
X2Originally posted by Qitai:Coast clear. Abdullah position secure. Can release Anwar liao. That is what it means.
-
finally.
-
Anwar will be leaving for Germany for medical treatment
-
I never believed in the sodomy charges anyway...
Well hope he will find something meaningful to do... he is still young -
The American democracy has been the true democracy. No matter how we look at it, it is the greatest democracy.
In such a democracy, people can express their true views and opinions without being taken to tasks or being in fear of consequences. Why, because the basic and fundamental rights or citizens including freedom of speech and association are enshrined in the constitution.
All Asian models do not enshrine such freedoms in the constitution. The normally copy the election and other aspects of democracy without going to the root of democracy - enshrine citizens' basic rights in the highest document of governance in the land. As such various Asian professed democratic governments can use defamation, taxation and company laws and regulations as cover or excuses to deal with difficult citizens.
When government has recource to such laws and use them as ultimate means to deal with oppositions or dissents, a great deal of problems will accrue to the society. No doubt the government can technically or legally put up a case to deal with citizens regarded as difficult, there will be various abuses. Governments can learn from American system of democracy and focus their laws and regulations in preventing crimes and oppressions by the powerfuls etc instead of using them as instrument to tackle dissent.
I feel that it is best to adopt American model of democracy. How about your views. -
If Anwar is acquitted now, this shows precisely that the Malaysian Court IS subjected to guiding hands of the political rulers, Under Dr. M, Anwar is guilty, under Pak Lah, he is not. If the Judiciary is indeed INDEPENDENT, why the change now?Originally posted by Atobe:It shows that the Malaysian Court is not subjected to any guiding hands of the Political Rulers.
There is a clear distinction of the Rule of Law, where the Government is itself subjected to the rulings of an INDEPENDENT Judiciary - free from political guidance of the Political Party that form the Government.
Can Singapore achieve the same level of independent Judiciary Standard, where politics do not affect the independence of the Judiciary System ? -
well... i m a malaysian... and what i know is... lucky... anwar never b the prime minister... to what i know if he was post up to prime minister... the 1st plan is to ..... demolish all the chinese and idian school, and not allowed to use it.
[/url] -
I don't admire Americas Media - too much agenda based reporting with no social responsibilityOriginally posted by robertteh:The American democracy has been the true democracy. No matter how we look at it, it is the greatest democracy.
In such a democracy, people can express their true views and opinions without being taken to tasks or being in fear of consequences. Why, because the basic and fundamental rights or citizens including freedom of speech and association are enshrined in the constitution.
All Asian models do not enshrine such freedoms in the constitution. The normally copy the election and other aspects of democracy without going to the root of democracy - enshrine citizens' basic rights in the highest document of governance in the land. As such various Asian professed democratic governments can use defamation, taxation and company laws and regulations as cover or excuses to deal with difficult citizens.
When government has recource to such laws and use them as ultimate means to deal with oppositions or dissents, a great deal of problems will accrue to the society. No doubt the government can technically or legally put up a case to deal with citizens regarded as difficult, there will be various abuses. Governments can learn from American system of democracy and focus their laws and regulations in preventing crimes and oppressions by the powerfuls etc instead of using them as instrument to tackle dissent.
I feel that it is best to adopt American model of democracy. How about your views.
I don't admire Americas Politics - funded by interest groups helped by media properganda
I don't admire Americas democracy - low turn up rate. Many people don't vote
I don't admire Americas justice system - Frivilous lawsuit like suing Mac Donald for overeating are even allowed. Laywers, once engaged cannot be dropped even both parties want to let it rest (in some cases if a certain agreement is signed)
I don't admire Americas tax system - 26% or higher income tax with at least 10% GST and other state taxes
I don't admire Americas social safety - walking alone out on the street is generally very unsafe
I don't admire Americas foriegn affair handling - "I am big, you listen to me. If the international law fits me, everyone must respect it. If the international law do not fit me, it is outdated"
I don't admire America civil sector finance - The country is in debt. The only reason they can get away with it is because they are big and powerful
I don't admite America free medical system - It is free, but you can wait for years before it is your turn to see the doctor. In the end, everyone goes to private medical and it is so expensive that medical insurance is one of the most important item in employment contract.
The list goes on......
In general, there is nothing great about America. Not that it do not have it's merit. But when someone compliments America, I just have to do the opposite and ask what is so great about America Democracy? I see so many flaws there. -
Nothing is perfect, but can you deny that their country is one of innovation and free-spirited thinking which is sorely needed in this age of fast-moving talent and capital flow.You cannot have that kind of society without a similar politicla climate.Name me a better alternative?Originally posted by Qitai:I don't admire Americas Media - too much agenda based reporting with no social responsibility
I don't admire Americas Politics - funded by interest groups helped by media properganda
I don't admire Americas democracy - low turn up rate. Many people don't vote
I don't admire Americas justice system - Frivilous lawsuit like suing Mac Donald for overeating are even allowed. Laywers, once engaged cannot be dropped even both parties want to let it rest (in some cases if a certain agreement is signed)
I don't admire Americas tax system - 26% or higher income tax with at least 10% GST and other state taxes
I don't admire Americas social safety - walking alone out on the street is generally very unsafe
I don't admire Americas foriegn affair handling - "I am big, you listen to me. If the international law fits me, everyone must respect it. If the international law do not fit me, it is outdated"
I don't admire America civil sector finance - The country is in debt. The only reason they can get away with it is because they are big and powerful
I don't admite America free medical system - It is free, but you can wait for years before it is your turn to see the doctor. In the end, everyone goes to private medical and it is so expensive that medical insurance is one of the most important item in employment contract.
The list goes on......
In general, there is nothing great about America. Not that it do not have it's merit. But when someone compliments America, I just have to do the opposite and ask what is so great about America Democracy? I see so many flaws there. -
Maybe its the secret term for his release. He must go into exile once he is released.Originally posted by sbst275:Anwar will be leaving for Germany for medical treatment
-
Maybe fate like Wang Dan, the famous student leader of Tiananmen incident. Go abroad treat illness and then later ban from returning to home country.Originally posted by paperchicken:Maybe its the secret term for his release. He must go into exile once he is released. -
Saw the interview on CNN. The poor guy seem to be physically abused while in jail. Is there any human rights in ML during Mahathir's rule ?
-
dont tok abt human right in jail leh...Originally posted by Jason Bourne:Saw the interview on CNN. The poor guy seem to be physically abused while in jail. Is there any human rights in ML during Mahathir's rule ?
dr.M can say anwar is abuse by other prisoner mah. -
If my recall correctly, he was beaten up by the police. It was reported in the news way back.Originally posted by paperduck:dont tok abt human right in jail leh...
dr.M can say anwar is abuse by other prisoner mah. -
To:qitai,
American democracy is not like you have written, full of crimes, problems, power plays, manipulations, and lawsuits etc.
Far from it, it is full of promises, freedom of choice, entrepreneurship, soaring spirits and motivations,
The perception you have painted might be the result of many years of mental conditioning or brain washing by our system of ego-centric governance where the press have been telling us plenty of bad things about America in order to make our system look good.
The whole world cannot be wrong. They are increasingly turning to America to emulate its freedoms, and rights to participate in all aspect of governance. The basic rights of citizens being upheld to the highest pinnacle of constitutional laws allow spirits to soar to the greatest height. Given maturity of system, there is no problem at all to criticise or take the Presidents to task. Can we say we are mature and should be left to think like adult instead of being subject to so many controls and little freedoms to decide or check on government. Anything wrong with giving these basic freedoms if communalists and communists are no longer a threat ?
-
What I have posted are information I have read in various sources including numerous U.S. sources as well as U.S. citizens opinion. Stop praising U.S. in this thread about Anwar. I have been to U.S. enough times to know what is going on there. It is not all bad there, but it is far from what you have painted.Originally posted by robertteh:To:qitai,
American democracy is not like you have written, full of crimes, problems, power plays, manipulations, and lawsuits etc.
Far from it, it is full of promises, freedom of choice, entrepreneurship, soaring spirits and motivations,
The perception you have painted might be the result of many years of mental conditioning or brain washing by our system of ego-centric governance where the press have been telling us plenty of bad things about America in order to make our system look good. -
Originally posted by sgdiehard:
Under Dr M - the judiciary was guided by legal minds that were compliant and allowed themselves to be "influenced" to co-operate with the Executive Branch, and to meet "National Agenda".
If Anwar is acquitted now, this shows precisely that the Malaysian Court IS subjected to guiding hands of the political rulers, Under Dr. M, Anwar is guilty, under Pak Lah, he is not. If the Judiciary is indeed INDEPENDENT, why the change now?
Hence, the Malaysian Judiciary was "influenced" by a strong political leadership to see thing in the "correct way".
Under Pak Lah, he "allowed" the judiciary to act independentlay, without fear of any political repercussion for decisions made that are NOT in favor of the Executive Branch.
This hands-off approach by Pak Lah is a sea change from the manner that the Executive Branch involve themselves directly with the Malaysian Judiciary.
This maybe deliberately done by Pak Lah, as he enjoy an overwhelming support from Malaysians, which allowed him to win back two critical states that were controlled smugly by the Opposition Party - PAS.
By allowing the Judiciary to act independently without fear of recrimination from the Political Leadership, Pak Lah has managed to win the respect even from members of the Malay Opposition Party - Keadilan.
The situation is a total contrast when compared to Malaysian politics of the 1960s to that of the 1990's and to current events.
Malaysian politics are full of "behind the scene" intrigues, schemes, side deals, and double deals - much like the Malay kampong cultural shows - Wayang Kulit (or Shadow Plays). -
With all the perceived ills that you have stated from your preferred narrow view of USA, how does it compare to a Political System of a paternalistic government that rule with a strong arm ?
Originally posted by Qitai:
Would you prefer to have a public media that is muzzled by a Government, impotent to report on mismanagement issues - until such issues are reported by overseas media, and forcing the local media to respond to blunt the importance of the event by making "corrections" ?
I don't admire Americas Media - too much agenda based reporting with no social responsibility
Would you prefer a public media that shy away from issues of Government, and give one sided bias views that serves more as propaganda ?
Would you prefer the local media to spy on the Citizens and give extreme exposure of some odd behavior of a Citizen's preferred life style, instead of "spying" on the Government - so as to keep them on their toes ?continuing post by Qitai:
How else does Political Parties survive unless with donations or funding from groups that are interested in the survival of the Political Party, and also of themselves ?
I don't admire Americas Politics - funded by interest groups helped by media properganda
How do you think a party like the Singapore Ruling Party get its funding - if not from donations and funding from interest groups that hope to get political mileage from such "carpet begging" activities.continuing post by Qitai:
How did you come to such a conclusion - that American Democracy suffer from a "low turn up rate" and that "Many people don't vote" ?
I don't admire Americas democracy - low turn up rate. Many people don't vote
Do you think that Democracy as practised in Singapore Politics produce a higher turn up rate in the participation of the political process in Singapore ?
Singapore Citizens are required by LAW to participate in the election process, failing such participation they shall lose all subsequent rights to be involved with any and all future election processes - what is the percentage of the Singapore population that actually get the opportunity to participate in the process ?continuing post by Qitai:
Allowing frivolous lawsuits does not equate with the acceptance by the Court to proceed further into hearing and due process of deliberation.
I don't admire Americas justice system - Frivilous lawsuit like suing Mac Donald for overeating are even allowed. Laywers, once engaged cannot be dropped even both parties want to let it rest (in some cases if a certain agreement is signed)
Does it not allow justice to the lowest income group, whom may not have sufficient finance to pay for all the charges imposed - as practised by the Singapore Courts - to hear the merits of a case ?continuing post by Qitai:
At least with such taxes, an American will enjoy the benefit of a health care and social welfare system.
I don't admire Americas tax system - 26% or higher income tax with at least 10% GST and other state taxes
While Singapore's Personal Tax is also about the same percentage, and the 5% GST is payable across all economic activities, how much of these public collected taxes will find its way back to benefit the Singapore Citizens ?continuing post by Qitai:
If you want to attract attention while walking in a supposedly unsafe area, you are only inviting trouble to yourself.
I don't admire Americas social safety - walking alone out on the street is generally very unsafe
Are the streets in Singapore any safer, when a 16 year old can lose his life due to some petty staring incident ?continuing post by Qitai:
Will you allow Singapore to be ruled by the overwhelming majority that vote against you ?
I don't admire Americas foriegn affair handling - "I am big, you listen to me. If the international law fits me, everyone must respect it. If the international law do not fit me, it is outdated"
The Singapore Government pulled Singapore out of the alliance of countries that believe and practise Socialist Democracy, when the majority in this political movement decided that the Singapore Government do not sincerely practise the principles of Socialist Democracy, but lean more towards authoritarianism - with a dark shade of dictatorship.continuing post by Qitai:
How does big and powerful help a country to get out of its debt ?
I don't admire America civil sector finance - The country is in debt. The only reason they can get away with it is because they are big and powerful
The liberal finance sector of the US economy, that allow a Central Banker total independence from the Executive Branch, reveal its dynamism in coping with the huge debt incurred by the Executive Branch.
With the closed economy and political systems of China or India, can they out perform the USA ?continuing post by Qitai:
Where do you get your information from - concerning the state of affairs with the US Medical System ?
I don't admite America free medical system - It is free, but you can wait for years before it is your turn to see the doctor. In the end, everyone goes to private medical and it is so expensive that medical insurance is one of the most important item in employment contract.
Singapore's PUBLIC medical system is not free either, and any medical procedures can easily wipe out one's savings, and scare the insurers from renewing one's policy.continuing post by Qitai:
There is nothing great about any country or person, except when one wants to believe in such greatness.
The list goes on......
In general, there is nothing great about America. Not that it do not have it's merit. But when someone compliments America, I just have to do the opposite and ask what is so great about America Democracy? I see so many flaws there.
However, if one can only desire to nit pick, split hairs, and seek ONLY the flaws of a system in microscopic details, can one see anything else that is greater then one's narrow view ?
Can you differentiate the "tree from the forest" ?