The Complications of National sERVICE
-
Originally posted by av98m:NS: 2.5 yrs of my life I'm never getting back. *cries*
^5 -
Whether NS is useful to you or not depends on what you do and learnt in NS.
If you are a technican or medic at least you learnt some useful knowledges and skills but if you are a storeman.............. -
In general i think personally that there's is nothing much relevance that you can attained in national service...ARMY in partiular that woul;d be of much relevance to the real world.I think it's more of being conforming to guidlines so outdated and unneccesarry and of course taking up our youth away.
Yes,the time we spent could have been better used to study for a degree,get a better paying job and doing much more other creative activities...making full use of ourselves.cAN'T BELIEVED THAT SOMEWHERE IN OUR nsf LIVES there would be a time or another where pple like the regulars would be lecturing u to be "spending and making full use of your army life"Try saying that to themselves with a mer 3 digit pay to your pocket every month and drooling the actual thoughts that you could have been making more money outside to mee your needs...
Sleeping in the army...HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAA.....if army is all abuiot sleeping more than anything else...oh God..would any sensible person after graduating from a polytechnic or Alevels,take this as a job..getting paid 3 digit salaries for just sleeping mmuch of the time....yeah that would be a good break from the years of studying spent before enlisting...wake up la...when are our girls ever going to grow up sometimes...... -
Well,
NS could be beneficial, depending on our superiors.
But it will certainly NOT be if we have:
1) Miserable superiors who haven't even gone for basic management courses.
2) Miserly superiors who make life difficult for NSFs by introducing all sorts of stupid rules that's as senseless as the people who introduced them.
3) Superiors who backstab and thus destroy the cohesiveness in the unit.
Ain't happening for you? Well, these situations are well alive and kicking in my unit. Not only that, they're starting to mutate beyond our control.
I think we would generally be satisfed if we were working under compentent superiors. People who know how to motivate and show concern for NSFs. Some units operate as if there were only 6 SAF core values. Even 2 years can seem like 2 days, if you are working under the right superiors. Or it can seem like 20 years.
That's besides the fact that we have to live through the monotony of regimentalism for 2 freaking years! It may be true that NS prepares us for the aftermath, but it also must be true that if I had to choose between 2 regimental jobs that pay me $350 and $3500 respectively, I'd be happier to put up with the rules for a more substantial pay. Which is sadly, not the case in NS. Sometimes, my unit's NSFs are told to report at a particular place by 7am. Usually, this place would be in Tuas, since we manage NSmen who have their in-camp training there. Some of us live as far away as Pasir Ris, and there's no way we could have gotten there even if buses came with ten wheels. Not mentioning those who own vehicles, the only way the rest of us can get to Tuas by 7am is to take a cab. A one-way trip would easily cost $20 if we are living in the East. However, standing SAF directives are such that we can only make transport claims if we are travelling from camp to camp. Fantastic, isn't it? We earn less than what an illegal immigrant from China would have earned in a month here, and yet we're expected to be so generous.
Never mind if we had to go through this crap for people who appreciated our work, who even bothered about our welfare. However, the sad truth is that many superiors in SAF only bother about their careers. They expect NSFs to do the sh*t they don't want to do and to tie up their loose ends for them. When they've attained whatever they wanted to attain, we do not get a pay rise or other benefits. All we get are more rules and more sh*t from them. Ungrateful? Well, maybe we could look on the brighter side... maybe it's because they haven't any management credentials, that's all.
Hey I better not talk too much more, if I already am. Who knows, maybe they installed spy cameras in my room. And by the way, insubordination is not equal to NSF being rude to superiors. It is equal to NSF stating facts that face-seeking superiors cannot accept.
Have a pleasant day ahead
-
Maybe they should do a review on NS like what is happening in education.
See what is not relevant, drop it. Then maybe can cut the time spend in NS even shorter. The rest can make up in reservist. -
I want to highlight the actual rationale behind our NS.
Part of the reason and concept of NS was owed to the numerous confrontations Government had with student in the 50's and 60's. There were riots and protests in the streets.
So learning from experience our Dear Leader started NS- to put our young men in safe keeping, prevent them from getting in the way of political ambitions.
Indonesia and Philippines leaders tasted People's Power. Who led the 'revolution'? Young men, mostly university student leaders between 18-25 years old.
So you see the relevance of NS to the ruling party's uninterrupted rule?
As for defending the country being the purpose of NS, save it, dont tell me about it!
Unless every man has a stake in the assets of a nation, he is NOT prepared to die for his country. -
I want to highlight the actual rationale behind our NS.
Part of the reason and concept of NS was owed to the numerous confrontations Government had with high school and university students in the 50's and 60's. There were riots and protests in the streets.
So learning from experience our Dear Leader started NS- to put our young men in safe keeping, prevent them from getting in the way of political ambitions.
Indonesia and Philippines leaders tasted People's Power. Who led the 'revolution'? Young men, mostly university student leaders between 18-25 years old.
So you see the relevance of NS to the ruling party's uninterrupted rule?
As for defending the country being the purpose of NS, save it, dont tell me about it!
Unless every man has a stake in the assets of a nation, he is NOT prepared to die for his country. -
Dont give stupid ideas man. I rather serve one shot, reservist sucks. It disrupt your work.Originally posted by gerrykoh:Maybe they should do a review on NS like what is happening in education.
See what is not relevant, drop it. Then maybe can cut the time spend in NS even shorter. The rest can make up in reservist.
-
It should rather be the injustices of National Service on Sg males.
If I were parent, I'd rather be the one discipline my son at home
and just before NS age, send him to study and eventually
work overseas. If possible, give up his Singapore citizenship and
come back here as a foreign talent PR without the need to serve
NS.
I'd rather Sg gov not happy than me and my son unhappy.
NS is just full of bullshit these days.
-
hahahahahahahaOriginally posted by greengoblin: 
-
hahahahahOriginally posted by Sudaimiki:Ask them to serve Thailand National Service.
Men become monks and women become prostitutes
-
Then do it before your child turns 11 or he will be bonded by then.Originally posted by macjoe:It should rather be the injustices of National Service on Sg males.
If I were parent, I'd rather be the one discipline my son at home
and just before NS age, send him to study and eventually
work overseas. If possible, give up his Singapore citizenship and
come back here as a foreign talent PR without the need to serve
NS.
I'd rather Sg gov not happy than me and my son unhappy.
NS is just full of bullshit these days.
What you suggest is something that many South Korerans have been practicing. A lot of them have been born in the USA and only returned to their homeland when they are well into their 20s or early to mid 30s. The only reason they do so is to avoid the conscription draft. -
Love it or not the idea of wasting pur 2 and a half years of time is not as feasible and the idea of it all has been declining over he years.
It has become a cheapskate way of manning a very sizable force of our armed forces with very little money spent on wages.Is this substantial enough for us to believe in this NS doctrine.No.I dun think so.
Even if we have to work under the umbrella of security and self-defence due to insufficient population,we cuold have at least emulated the idea of the US army reserves,where a soldier are being paid higher than the pennies we get in NS and have to clock a minimal number of hours of training ,excercises and whatever there is to it and with a very tangible and considerate timing.Perhaps the first 3 months or so upon enlistmen,it would be straight trainings in camps and nothing else and upon graduation mbark on a hour by hour training ant considerate timing.
Well,just perhaps it would be a better alternative,but still i think the bullshit about loving your family and defending your nation dogma is getting crap and hey when do we ever had lessons on extreme patriatism to spur us on and beleive in the rationale behind it all as it takes our 2 half years away.Simply unmotivated and full-pledging advatage taken by regulars to make use of NSFs strength, ability ,yuoth and time.
For example,when you have a driving license,well your are BOUNDED at anytime to drive the military GP cars.All these years with our parents our our own sweat,money and time taking the rigorous driving lessons are now being fully taken advantage of..Possess technicakl skills..and ur damm BOUNDED to lay our your expertise in army where force and threats are being constantly used against you.Continue this trend of uniformity through forceful ways and extreme conformity,trust me,our youthful talents are are going to fast disappear from this land and earth we once called home. -
basically, you clowns can be divided into 4 groups.
fire, earth, water and air.
paracelsus.*
earth people probably enjoy the military.
all they have to do is follow orders.
they like it that way.
fire people won't like national service.
but it does good for them.
teaches them to control their namesake.
not destroy the society we have built with their overtly zeal for excitement.
the water people are going to whine about the military.
because murdering is not their style.
lovers, not fighters.
air people are going into the military, saying "yeah yeah, its going to do me good" but in their minds is "bullshit." and its true. they should be in somewhere else.
now you idiots must realise that people are interested in different things.
if you like ns, good for you.
there are those who don't.
if you insist that people should like ns, go screw yourself.
and the reverse is true...
*and don't talk to me about how people are different individually
dogs, cats, hamsters, and snakes are different, right?
we can tell the difference.
how about different breeds of dogs?
they are all dogs, but are they not different in some ways?
same concept. -
How abt Ice ppl ?
-
are there ice people?
...
probably a mix of wind and water.
your question is like.
red, blue and yellow.
waht about purple?
... -
I agree with Chicky. There are people with a mix of attributes. Finding someone who is fully earth, water, fire or air is like searching for rocking horse $hit. I feel I can fit into the profiles of fire, water and a bit of air, so what does it make me?Originally posted by apollo861:are there ice people?
...
probably a mix of wind and water.
your question is like.
red, blue and yellow.
waht about purple?
... -
A chameleon?
-
and wth did you think i meant when i saidOriginally posted by iveco:I agree with Chicky. There are people with a mix of attributes. Finding someone who is fully earth, water, fire or air is like searching for rocking horse $hit. I feel I can fit into the profiles of fire, water and a bit of air, so what does it make me?*and don't talk to me about how people are different individually
???
dogs, cats, hamsters, and snakes are different, right?
we can tell the difference.
how about different breeds of dogs?
they are all dogs, but are they not different in some ways?
same concept.
face it.
no matter how complex you think humans are, they are not.
and no matter how simple you think humans are, they are not.
look.
i am most a mix of air and water. but i also got a slight tinge of fire.
hmm.. that makes me ice.
anyway.
i understand your point that people will be different.
but let me tell you this.
i am the first one who pointed that out first.
me.
so back off.
even if it doesn't mean that one element entirely dominates our personality.
but it is a start in checking out our basic make up.
most people have two temperament that have the most control.
even contradictory ones.
but in the end, people will be different, so they will LOOK AT THINGS DIFFERENTLY.
THAT IS MY VERY POINT,
DO YOU NEED SOMEONE TO TRANSFER LOGIC INTO YOUR HEAD?
SOME HATE NATIONAL SERVICE! OTHERS DON'T!
THE REASON IS BECAUSE OF TEMPERAMENT!
IS THAT SIMPLE ENOUGH?
it is a major pet peeve of mine when people look down on others for not having the same mentality.
eg, those patriots, or even hedonists, melancholics, and intellectuals.
the moment you think someone is bad for hating ns,
i will hate you a lot.
and the reverse is true.
so my stand remains, that people view ns differently,
because they have different ways of looking at things.
that was my main point. -
National Service is an unavoidable part of life for every male Singaporean. Rather than sit and moan all day about all the things one has to do, why not sit up, and learn as much as you can? Enjoy yourself while you are about it, and soon, your active service period will be behind you.
I am currently in active service, and already, I have brought home many lessons in human interactions, about how people work, and many survival skills, not to mention practical skills on riding (see my blog in my signature for details), medical first aid, and more to come!
Who said National Service cannot be a personal learning experience? A person can learn all the time - it is just a matter of whether he wants to or not. -
What about citizens of states with no need for a military draft? Are they at a loss?Originally posted by pkchukiss:I am currently in active service, and already, I have brought home many lessons in human interactions, about how people work, and many survival skills, not to mention practical skills on riding (see my blog in my signature for details), medical first aid, and more to come!
Who said National Service cannot be a personal learning experience? A person can learn all the time - it is just a matter of whether he wants to or not.
The only thing I don't like is the travel restrictions. Our women have more time to see the world. They may end up marrying a red-haired gentleman with green eyes.
I'd rather spend the conscription time visiting a remote corner of the world and helping improve the local people's lot in life wherever I go. -
anywhere can be a learning experience..Originally posted by pkchukiss:National Service is an unavoidable part of life for every male Singaporean. Rather than sit and moan all day about all the things one has to do, why not sit up, and learn as much as you can? Enjoy yourself while you are about it, and soon, your active service period will be behind you.
I am currently in active service, and already, I have brought home many lessons in human interactions, about how people work, and many survival skills, not to mention practical skills on riding (see my blog in my signature for details), medical first aid, and more to come!
Who said National Service cannot be a personal learning experience? A person can learn all the time - it is just a matter of whether he wants to or not.
try locking yourself up in an empty room, with food, drinks and air coming from high up above you.
eventually, you will gain the skill of entertaining yourself with nothing with you. -
Well as a matter of fact, when you go out for your 3 months stint overseas to train, you do.Originally posted by iveco:What about citizens of states with no need for a military draft? Are they at a loss?
The only thing I don't like is the travel restrictions. Our women have more time to see the world. They may end up marrying a red-haired gentleman with green eyes.
I'd rather spend the conscription time visiting a remote corner of the world and helping improve the local people's lot in life wherever I go.
You get to help in remote villages in thailand ,build schools and distribute food and basic essentials. So itsn't that what you want?
And one more thing, just curious lah, instead of planning to travel round the world to those remote places and help the people there, why don't you help out in orphanages and old age homes locally? They are really in need for volunteers.
If you really want to help somebody, saying that national service impedes you is pure rubbish. I have friends who volunteer everytime they book out. It is just whether you are willing to do it or not. -
yup agree.... it sucks but in terms of pay we'll catch up coz aft NS we normally get 200-300 more.Originally posted by gerrykoh:I guess the worst is disruption from studies, having to pick up the studying momentum after 2 yrs lapse & finding changes in curriculum & behind the girls in studies & career
but seriously i miss my NSF dayz..... you think that life sux in there? welcome to the real world.
for those who havent been through it ... my advise make the best of it... make use of the time in there, get licence, go do some courses. -
Well, SAF trips are fully govt supervised anyway.Originally posted by CenturionMBT:Well as a matter of fact, when you go out for your 3 months stint overseas to train, you do.
You get to help in remote villages in thailand ,build schools and distribute food and basic essentials. So itsn't that what you want?
And one more thing, just curious lah, instead of planning to travel round the world to those remote places and help the people there, why don't you help out in orphanages and old age homes locally? They are really in need for volunteers.
If you really want to help somebody, saying that national service impedes you is pure rubbish. I have friends who volunteer everytime they book out. It is just whether you are willing to do it or not.
My bone of contention is the complicated system NSFs go through if they want to trsavel out of town. What's more, even as a reservist, one still has to apply for an exit permit even to visit Johor. Just compare and contrast this with Schengen member states. A Frenchman can travel from one end of EU to the other without passing through a Customs checkpoint. In short, it is easier to leave France than leave Singapore.