Outsourcing is not the right way all...

• 2004Lancer

  28 Sep 04, 10:39

  Ask what is the definition of IT services? How can IT be one of the possible outsourcing list? Today, almost everything is IT-run. We use IT to manufacture, to file, to plan, to defend, to write, to run our transportation system, car, etc.
  
  IT services is very vast. Just outsourcing IT alone is vast enough.
  
  And is outsourcing safe? Especially at such a time when terrorism is happening everywhere.
  
  We have enough Bangladesh, Sri Lankan, Chinese, Indo, Philippino foreign cleaners, construction workers, tuition teachers, etc. They are residing in one of our HDB flats. They don't live in Namly Avenue nor Bukit Timah area. Seriously they are of security concern to us.
  
  What happen when all these IT segments are ousourced? Will our info be compromised further? Will our National Info be leaked to CIA, etc? Thus exposing our weaknesses to foreign countries?
  
  I understand Singapore is facing some kind of hidden crisis as it seems. And when has our 5-day week working life has become some kind of endless nightmare of ours? How many of us are starting to experience working late into the evenings and nights when you are supposed to be home enjoying family bonding?
  
  Will there be a day when only the foreigners appreciate what our government has done for them and will be eligible to vote?
• FireIce

  28 Sep 04, 10:43

  oei!
  u know wat it outsouce bo?
  
  it does not necesary mean ask foreigners to do leh
  it means this dept is not handled w/in the govt body, but sub to pte sectors to handle....and the company or organisaion is usually local, with local workers....
  
  dun think cheng hoo stoopid lah
• eutjin

  28 Sep 04, 10:48

  he may not be all wrong ...... though his concept is wrong
  
  outsourcing is aimed at saving money. how to save? squeeze the small ones like us.
  
  how to get more profits? hire seemingly cheaper employees, namely foreigners. i use the word "seemingly" cause not all of them are cheap.
  
  in fact, some are damn highly paid ....
• 2004Lancer

  28 Sep 04, 10:51

  Originally posted by FireIce:

  oei!
  u know wat it outsouce bo?
  
  it does not necesary mean ask foreigners to do leh
  it means this dept is not handled w/in the govt body, but sub to pte sectors to handle....and the company or organisaion is usually local, with local workers....
  
  dun think cheng hoo stoopid lah

  has it ever occured to you that once outsourced, your year of service will be reset, meaning, once u r terminated, u will be compensated base on your new year of service....
  
  and also current management can also play the good guys....instead of retrenchment exercise, they can now pass the bad job to private limited......see beh wise move but a little underdog...
  
  like i say we the ground people are not stoopid ok....we can see through their schemes.....until any big big incident then perhaps they will relook and review not to outsource again....*sigh*
• 2004Lancer

  28 Sep 04, 10:53

  take note that the whole of Singapore will soon be 'sold'.....sold to who? no other then mostly USA companies......and we all know what is happening now.....*sigh*.........USA companies and employess seem to be the targets...
• eutjin

  28 Sep 04, 10:54

  Originally posted by 2004Lancer:

  take note that the whole of Singapore will soon be 'sold'.....sold to who? no other then mostly USA companies......and we all know what is happening now.....*sigh*.........USA companies and employess seem to be the targets...

  target of?
• FireIce

  28 Sep 04, 10:56

  if govt dun outsource, which means they mus pay the high cost for such small things.....then have to squeeze more tax outta u.......u want onot?
  
  it's jus a shift to let pte sectors have a part to play in the govt operations......
  
  u think too much
• Fluffy.white.sheeP

  28 Sep 04, 10:59

  Originally posted by FireIce:

  if govt dun outsource, which means they mus pay the high cost for such small things.....then have to squeeze more tax outta u.......u want onot?
  
  it's jus a shift to let pte sectors have a part to play in the govt operations......
  
  u think too much

  ditto
  everything should be run in the most efficient manner wad...
  dun think u want higher taxes...
  anyway outsourcing means letting the pte sector get a share of the project and tt doesn't mean only foreign companies can take get a slice of the pie wad.
• Ito_^

  28 Sep 04, 11:01

  its a tight economy, can you think of a better way to maintain productvity and revenue?
  
  well, if you got affected, than too bad.
• eutjin

  28 Sep 04, 11:02

  working in outsourcing for govt is a pain ....
  
  anyway, he has a point, the current 3 big players in govt outsourcing are NCS, IBM and HP
  
  no prizes for guessing where IBM and HP are from ....
• BÃ¥seline

  28 Sep 04, 11:09

  Take for instance the recent SIA thingy.
  
  Airline is a delicate industry, will outsourcing reduced the overall safety and quality of machine parts since majority of the projects will have to go on the cheap? Will the companies outsourced provide adequate knowledge and skills such delicate projects?
• FireIce

  28 Sep 04, 11:12

  outsourced companies are speclalised in wat they are doing.....it's actually an advantage.....so quality and efficiency is not so much of a prob.....
  
  the main concern is to learn the adapt to the govt way of doing things......
• eutjin

  28 Sep 04, 11:18

  Originally posted by FireIce:

  outsourced companies are speclalised in wat they are doing.....it's actually an advantage.....so quality and efficiency is not so much of a prob.....
  
  the main concern is to learn the adapt to the govt way of doing things......

  it seems like it ...... not always is the case
  
  in fact, because of a lower budget for that same dept, the outsource companies need to cut corners on the salaries. trust me, this is the case ...
  
  so, this is what happens ....
  
  lower budget - first bummer
  outsource company wants to make a profit - 2nd bummer
  
  in the end, the poor guy who is actually doing the work gets even lower salary and hardly any benefits ..... this 1st affected the IT industry, and is now moving to other industries
• BÃ¥seline

  28 Sep 04, 11:18

  Quality and efficiency comes in a premium price. No doubt outsourced companies can pledge that they will promised quality and efficiency on the cheap... how long can they substain? If the outsourced companies has a bigger staff base, perhaps. If it's small and it's willing to cut the price to accomodate quality and efficiency, it will bleed.
  
  At the back end, it's staff will see that they have more work to do but not getting any much pay. Sounds familiar?
• FireIce

  28 Sep 04, 11:21

  outsourced companies are contracted, so they are protected......
  
  a fixed income is still better than unknown income if they are on their own
  
  bigger companies can have both sides......contracts with govt as well their own operations with other companies......
  
  it oso looks better on their portfolio if they are serving govt bodies.....which is a hidden reputation boost
• BÃ¥seline

  28 Sep 04, 11:23

  As what I can see... the smaller pte sector will really struggle to get hold of the outsourced projs. The bigger fishes will have more say. And perhaps... in the IT industries... it is quite apparent that there are cheap but knowledgeble IT personnels and it's not in LOCAL. Go figure.
• eutjin

  28 Sep 04, 11:28

  from the IT point of view, and this is actually happening.
  
  govt agency outsources the dept.
  outsourcing company hires a contract company to get contract staff in.
  contract staff does the work, mind you, even the manager is a contract staff.
  
  not naming any company in particular, but it's 100% true. govt agency thinks they hired the best, based on the company's name. but, who is doing the work?? it's sad .....
• FireIce

  28 Sep 04, 11:29

  of cos the govt would give the job to a more reputable company with good track records.....
  it's on a tender basis......
  in fact, it's the govt tt approach the company, not the company go advertise to the govt...............
  there will be a pool of so-called "headhunters" to go out and do industrial research and review the companies' financial reports and projects
  these chosen co will have to do up a proposal and quotation and the govt will then decide who to sign on the contract....
  
  sad to say small companies are neber in this pie in the 1st place, so there isn't anything to fight about wat.....
  
  
• FireIce

  28 Sep 04, 11:34

  whether outsource onot......most IT specialists in singapore are not locals......but usually the head is local, the ka kias are from ur friendly neighbouring countries.....
  w/in govt body oredi got such contract workers.....but bcos with the "govt body " tag....they cost more....
  
  it's not who do the work, it's who can do the work well......
  
  if we have to bow to foreign talent, then so be it
  
  singaporeans shd pull up their socks!
• eutjin

  28 Sep 04, 11:35

  agreed, that's the way it works.
  
  and of coz, as with almost all tenders, price is almost 100% the deciding factor
• eutjin

  28 Sep 04, 11:37

  Originally posted by FireIce:

  whether outsource onot......most IT specialists in singapore are not locals......but usually the head is local, the ka kias are from ur friendly neighbouring countries.....
  w/in govt body oredi got such contract workers.....but bcos with the "govt body " tag....they cost more....
  
  it's not who do the work, it's who can do the work well......
  
  if we have to bow to foreign talent, then so be it
  
  singaporeans shd pull up their socks!

  not all are really that good u know
  
  only a handful are. lots of them are just bluffing their way through
  
  anyway, singaporeans should move up the corporate ladder. can't win them in numbers, so aim for mgmt-related jobs which so far, most of them lack in
• BÃ¥seline

  28 Sep 04, 11:38

  Singapoerans defintely has the talents out there but our living standards are also higher than our neighbouring countries. Of cos one dun mind taking a lower pay if the living standards back home ain't that high where SG1500 can do wonders in their homeland.
• eutjin

  28 Sep 04, 11:42

  hmm .... this brings out one point
  
  singapore shouldn't need to worry so much abt india and china, viewed as the source for skilled foreign talent
  
  be more worried abt malaysia, which has similar cultures, languages and increasing number of skilled workers.
  
  some MNCs are already moving operations across the border, after some dissappointing attempts at other countries ...
  
  am i right to say that Aust suffered this same trend some yrs back? haven't been around that long to confirm that
• FireIce

  28 Sep 04, 11:45

  singapore too high labour cost
  land oso expensive
  
  notice tt we are usually housing the HQ or regional office.....but operations and productions are in other parts of Asia......
  
• BÃ¥seline

  28 Sep 04, 11:49

  Ni Keeee's way of doing things are just like that. Head office back in the states but loads of factories in many parts of Asia. Cheap labour, lower taxes.