Water Strategy -- Key to Healthy Citizens
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This is a 1999 report on New water technology used in US. Nope. They are not ready to drink directly from reclaimed shit water, as many pro-New Water people are suggesting.
http://www.waterindustry.org/New%20Projects/drink-flush.htm
Flush with water:
An unusual recycling project is sure to raise eyebrows in Centre County
Monday, May 31, 1999
By Don Hopey, Post-Gazette Staff Writer
The sewage authority for five fast-growing Centre County communities and part of Penn State's main campus plans to recycle water from the toilet to the tap. It will be the first large-scale municipal project in the state to turn wastewater into drinking water. As such, it will have to suppress the public gag reflex.
Dubbed "Beneficial Reuse," the $20 million waste water recirculation project floated last month by the University Area Joint Authority was prompted by discharge restrictions into Spring Creek, a nationally famous, cold-water trout stream.
"Waste water is always looked at as a disposal problem, but we're treating it as a resource," said Cory Miller, authority executive director. "We're going to treat it to drinking water standards -- beyond clean -- so we can do anything with it."
Other locales -- Centerville, Va.; El Paso, Texas; and six California communities including San Diego and Orange County -- recycle waste water to supplement scarce drinking water supplies.
State College has plenty of drinking water, but is facing restrictions at the other end of the water pipe. The solution is the same, however, and that may be hard for some Happy Valley residents to swallow.
"We've done enough research to know it can work here, but we're at the beginning of what we expect will be a rather intensive public process," Miller said. "When you're doing something this different, it's important to get citizens involved early."
The proposal is to process the water using new membrane technology -- microfiltration and ultra-filtration -- possibly in combination with reverse osmosis units that operate like kidney dialysis machines. Ultraviolet or ozone treatment will be used to disinfect the treated waste water.
The authority won't pipe the ultrafiltered waste water directly into the communities' water lines, even though it would meet federal drinking water standards. Instead, the water will be pumped seven miles up into the hills and discharged into Slab Cabin Run, a tributary of trout-rich Spring Creek, and into a nearby wetland, recharging both surface water and the underground aquifer.
The discharge location is one mile from the State College Water Authority drinking water wells. Such indirect recirculation is common among all the communities reusing waste water.
"I don't think there's any community in Pennsylvania that's ready to say 'Let's drink the water that was yesterday's sewage,' until we prove we can make the water that clean," Miller said. "So we'll pump it up into the watershed and establish a history."
A direct connection to the drinking water supply would be possible after several years, he added.
The authority, which serves a growing population of 38,000 people, discharges 5 million gallons of treated sewer water into Spring Creek every day and is limited to 6 million gallons a day. Any more would warm the creek water, harming the trout population and, in turn, the thriving local sport-fishing economy.
"Our disposal options are to pipe the discharge seven miles downstream, out of the High Quality fishery section and discharge there, or go seven miles upstream so we get to use the water again," Miller said.
Miller said the authority chose the reuse option even though it will cost $6 million more over the project's 20-year life span.
"This will extend our water resources. Every drop we reuse is one more drop we're not taking out of the ground," Miller explained. "It's drought-proofing even though we've never come close to running out."
But Slab Cabin Run has. Last summer, the combination of a statewide drought and the pumping of 2.5 million gallons a day from wells caused the creek to run dry. Local sportsmen rescued trout from shrinking pools in the drying creek bed and carried them to streams that contained flowing water.
"It should ease the depletion of Slab Cabin Run's base flow. By keeping 2 or 3 million gallons a day in the loop, that much doesn't have to come from the creek," said Richard Adams, state Department of Environmental Protection regional water management program permit chief.
The major impact, however, will be on the Spring Creek trout, which require cool water to thrive. The authority's warm discharges into Spring Creek at last September's low flow were almost equal to the volume of water in the creek.
"Trout are uncommonly prolific in that creek, and preserving their habitat is important to the economy of the area, as well as a cultural issue," Adams said. Spring Creek's trout fishery, which includes a special regulation area known as "Fisherman's Paradise," is important as a regional, state, even a national, resource.
The project is so cutting-edge that the DEP doesn't have rules to regulate it.
Similar recirculation projects have been done by some private industries and businesses in Pennsylvania -- Knoebel's Amusement Park in Northumberland County heavily chlorinates its waste water for reuse in park bathrooms -- but those are much smaller and don't involved reuse as tap water.
"Only a few states -- California, Texas -- actually have regulations for this type of thing," Adams said. "As we review the project with the authority, the standards we develop will become stepping stones for new state regulations."
He said those waste water reuse regulations could also be applied to the state's new anti-degradation rules for rivers and streams, which require that industries and businesses must consider all alternative treatment methods before they can get a permit to discharge wastewater into protected streams. "DEP is very high on this project," Adams said.
"If this project proves feasible, it would be my hope that it could be used in other situations to reduce stream discharges."
The authority kicked off its public education and comment period for the waste water project last month on Earth Day. Local officials will review and vote on it by February. Miller said approval is expected, with construction to begin next May. Target date to open the first valve is March 2004.
Initially, 3 million gallons will be sent through the advanced treatment process and then through twin 15-inch pipes to the Slab Cabin Run discharge location. The authority will continue to discharge the remainder of its flow as it always has, directly into Spring Creek. When the Spring Creek discharge grows toward the 6 million gallon a day limit again, the authority will expand the amount it sends through the advanced treatment system. "In 20 years I believe we will be discharging little or none into Spring Creek," Miller said. "I fully expect 100 percent of our discharge will be reused." He also expects acceptance of the water reuse plan to follow the example set when the authority began marketing compost made from sewage bio-solids-human waste. "At first people didn't want it. Now we can't keep enough around to fill all our orders," he said. "In Central Pennsylvania, once something is proven to work and it's economical, people will latch on to it and not let go."
And once State College proves the water conservation technology will work, Miller believes other places around the state will use it too. "I don't see it used in the Ohio River valley. Pittsburgh or Philadelphia won't do it because they have big rivers to discharge into," Miller said. But some smaller cities that want to grow and don't have the luxury of a big river running through them will find it useful. "Some of those smaller cities in the interior of the state are not growing because they're strapped by discharge limitations," Miller said. "For them, this approach will be useful. "And once we show it can be done, other communities will latch on and use it as an economical tool to attract industries. If this can provide clean, cheap water, I'm sure they will use it." -
How about using the NEWwater on toilet flush only? Think everyone will feel better about this, plus it will not corrode the pipes like the seawater experiment they did earlier. Only problem is that having two pipes may cost more. Not sure about that though. Actually, if that is possible, maybe we can even have a lower grade water purification just for flushing purpose. We don't need top quality water for flushing toilet.
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I have no problem of using New water on toilet flush, but it will cost more. I was told by some more informed individual that PUB is laying an alternative pipeline to supply non-portable water to our flushing system.
Goh Meng SengOriginally posted by Qitai:How about using the NEWwater on toilet flush only? Think everyone will feel better about this, plus it will not corrode the pipes like the seawater experiment they did earlier. Only problem is that having two pipes may cost more. Not sure about that though. Actually, if that is possible, maybe we can even have a lower grade water purification just for flushing purpose. We don't need top quality water for flushing toilet. -
I have no problem of using New water on toilet flush, but it will cost more. I was told by some more informed individual that PUB is laying an alternative pipeline to supply non-portable water to our flushing system.
Goh Meng SengOriginally posted by Qitai:How about using the NEWwater on toilet flush only? Think everyone will feel better about this, plus it will not corrode the pipes like the seawater experiment they did earlier. Only problem is that having two pipes may cost more. Not sure about that though. Actually, if that is possible, maybe we can even have a lower grade water purification just for flushing purpose. We don't need top quality water for flushing toilet. -
I did a search on recycled water and there were 21,000 entries which came up. I looked at 4 and all these indicated that recycled water technology is being used for drinking not just in california orange county but other states like arizona texas and florida as well...for many decades too. the following is a ***government*** website which says clearly recycled water is mixed with freshwater before drinking:
http://www.sannet.gov/water/waterreusestudy/geninfo/faq/where.shtml
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Where else is recycled water used in California and the United States?
In southern California, the Irvine Ranch Water District has distributed recycled water for over thirty years. Recycled water is used in high-rise office buildings for toilet and urinal flushing. In Los Angeles and Orange counties, recycled water is injected into groundwater storage basins to prevent saltwater intrusion into the basins near the coastline. Additionally, in Orange County, recycled water that has undergone additional advanced treatment is added to groundwater supplies that are used as a source of drinking water.
Recycled water is used in many ways and in many states across the country. In Arizona, Texas, Virginia and Florida, recycled water is added and blended with water sources in reservoirs and underground storage basins that are used as drinking water supplies.
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i rad your articles: first article suggests orange county residents not drinking recycled water yet even though other sources including govt ones say they are..... dunno why..... maybe it is referring to recycled water not being drunk directly, but mixed with fresh water...which is what the govt is doing now.
second article really confirms that recycled is safe, and it is psychological barrier that should be overcome. and in sg newater is to be mixed with fresh water in reservoir oso..oso not drinking recycled water directly.
oso no health risks brought up in both articles....and thios thread really about public health risk from drinking recycled water as you say rite -
ok no time to reply anymore now....must go revise for exams...bye bye!
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Dear SilverKris,
Recycled water mentioned in these articles are not exactly "New Water", which is a reclaimed sewage water. Most probably this "recycled water" refers to the something similar to our longkang water being recycled.
Besides, there is no suggestion of "direct" drinking of such "PURE" water as claimed. They are being pumped back into the fresh water system.
They have only started the project of reclaimation of sewage water in 1999. And even so, this water is not for portable usage, but for non-portable usage.
Unless you are suggesting that we be the very first one to drink directly from reclaimed sewage water?
As I have said, we should have independent researchers, not connected to commercial entities that might have vested interests in these projects, to ascertain the safety and quality aspects.
When New Water was introduced, there was a frenzy going on in Singapore, and it seems that PAP is promoting it like hot cakes, drinking directly from it! And we have misleading reports on how California people drinking "recycled water" which is very much different from reclaimed sewage water. And the fact that, they did not drink these recycled water directly. These recycled water was pumped back into the fresh water system.
I think that is why later on, instead of keep selling the idea of "safe to drink" New Water, PAP govt says that these New Water would be pumped back into the reservoirs, which is what the advanced country, USA, is doing.
The proper, conventional way is to develop the "recycle water" water first, not the reclaimation of sewage water! We are doing it on the reverse! Never mind about that, as long as New Water, as in reclaimed sewage water is used for non-portable business, that's alright. The next step is to develop a more advanced "recycle water" from the dams and pump them back into reservoirs.
There is one Hokkien saying, "Kiang jiu hor, mai Kie Kaing". Meaning, be smart, not smart Alex. This is a matter of public health concerns. Don't need to jump the gun. There is no report on whether drinking reclaimed sewage water will affect pubic health or not; using "proxy" claim of drinking recycle water no harm means New Water no harm, is commiting a philosophical sin.
Reclaiming Sewage water only advanced to our New Water level in recent times, not decades ago.
Goh Meng SengOriginally posted by SilverKris:I did a search on recycled water and there were 21,000 entries which came up. I looked at 4 and all these indicated that recycled water technology is being used for drinking not just in california orange county but other states like arizona texas and florida as well...for many decades too. the following is a ***government*** website which says clearly recycled water is mixed with freshwater before drinking:
http://www.sannet.gov/water/waterreusestudy/geninfo/faq/where.shtml
----------------------------------------------
Where else is recycled water used in California and the United States?
In southern California, the Irvine Ranch Water District has distributed recycled water for over thirty years. Recycled water is used in high-rise office buildings for toilet and urinal flushing. In Los Angeles and Orange counties, recycled water is injected into groundwater storage basins to prevent saltwater intrusion into the basins near the coastline. Additionally, in Orange County, recycled water that has undergone additional advanced treatment is added to groundwater supplies that are used as a source of drinking water.
Recycled water is used in many ways and in many states across the country. In Arizona, Texas, Virginia and Florida, recycled water is added and blended with water sources in reservoirs and underground storage basins that are used as drinking water supplies.
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i rad your articles: first article suggests orange county residents not drinking recycled water yet even though other sources including govt ones say they are..... dunno why..... maybe it is referring to recycled water not being drunk directly, but mixed with fresh water...which is what the govt is doing now.
second article really confirms that recycled is safe, and it is psychological barrier that should be overcome. and in sg newater is to be mixed with fresh water in reservoir oso..oso not drinking recycled water directly.
oso no health risks brought up in both articles....and thios thread really about public health risk from drinking recycled water as you say rite -
This is a very old subject now. Water supplies have been a strategic issue closely related to our survival. Search for alternative started long long time ago but nothing came to surface until 2003 when relationship with malaysia soured and looks like we must have additional sources of supplies by 2011 and be completely self reliance by 2065. It was then the new water came on stage, more a morale booster for singaporean than anything else. Alternative water supplies were extensively discussed in all media. Apparently Mr. Goh was not in singapore or he cannot recall some of the facts that were revealed.Originally posted by goh meng seng:Dear SilverKris,
Recycled water mentioned in these articles are not exactly "New Water", which is a reclaimed sewage water. Most probably this "recycled water" refers to the something similar to our longkang water being recycled.
Besides, there is no suggestion of "direct" drinking of such "PURE" water as claimed. They are being pumped back into the fresh water system.
They have only started the project of reclaimation of sewage water in 1999. And even so, this water is not for portable usage, but for non-portable usage.
Unless you are suggesting that we be the very first one to drink directly from reclaimed sewage water?
As I have said, we should have independent researchers, not connected to commercial entities that might have vested interests in these projects, to ascertain the safety and quality aspects.
When New Water was introduced, there was a frenzy going on in Singapore, and it seems that PAP is promoting it like hot cakes, drinking directly from it! And we have misleading reports on how California people drinking "recycled water" which is very much different from reclaimed sewage water. And the fact that, they did not drink these recycled water directly. These recycled water was pumped back into the fresh water system.
I think that is why later on, instead of keep selling the idea of "safe to drink" New Water, PAP govt says that these New Water would be pumped back into the reservoirs, which is what the advanced country, USA, is doing.
The proper, conventional way is to develop the "recycle water" water first, not the reclaimation of sewage water! We are doing it on the reverse! Never mind about that, as long as New Water, as in reclaimed sewage water is used for non-portable business, that's alright. The next step is to develop a more advanced "recycle water" from the dams and pump them back into reservoirs.
There is one Hokkien saying, "Kiang jiu hor, mai Kie Kaing". Meaning, be smart, not smart Alex. This is a matter of public health concerns. Don't need to jump the gun. There is no report on whether drinking reclaimed sewage water will affect pubic health or not; using "proxy" claim of drinking recycle water no harm means New Water no harm, is commiting a philosophical sin.
Reclaiming Sewage water only advanced to our New Water level in recent times, not decades ago.
Goh Meng Seng
1. NewWater is the recycled water, from sewage system. Water from the sea, longkang and canal are reclaimed (not recycled, its not been used yet.) The difference is both technical and psychological. Water from longkang, canal and reservoirs comes from collection of rain water. It has no salt content and no (supposed to be) contaminated, treated in the normal way and is what we have been using, no technology needed and no psychological effect. Sea water requires filtration and desalination to get rid of salt, technology available but very high energy costs, no psychological effect. Newwater is recycled from sewage, water used by human, technology is available and costs have come down below desalination process but very high psychological factor, "you drink your urine." All these processes are being used in singapore. I don't know where but there are 3 newwater plants now and the first of 5 desalination plants contract has been awarded.
2. Some facts about newwater:
a. it is actually very pure water. The process of microfiltration, reverse osmosis and UV light treatment actually get rid of the minerals needed for our body, giving it a different taste from what we are used to. Besides averting the psychological effect, this is the reason why it needs to be pumped into the reservoir before sending to households.
b. Many commercial water filteration and desalination systems, used for expedition, military...use similar technologies such as 0.2 micron ceramic microfilter and reverse osmosis. Such systems were proven effective for many years, approved by NATO.....
c. Because it is pure, it is most suitable for use in aircon system and in wafer plants, and this is its main usage now, leaving the water from reservoir for human consumption.
3. If I am not wrong, there is no separate piping systems to bring recycled newwater or reclaimed or desalinated water directly to household for human consumption. I read that all such water, recycled or reclaimed will go straight to the reservoirs and from the reservoirs, after further but normal treatment, the water then goes to household. So, I never heard that newwater is likely to be used for direct consumption.
4. All rivers in singapore will finally become reservoirs and all water from longkang will be directed there, and there is a strict rule about discharging dirty water into drainage system. All water from dish washing and laundry must go into the sewage and not the drain. The final processes for treating these water are different. Understand pipes will be built to link all the reservoirs to pump water from the high water level reservoir to those with lower water level, don have to pump into the sea. Collection of sewage water started years ago but it was only in 1999 that contract was awarded to a French company to build a 70 kilometer underground sewage system!! Details i don know.
5. Ultimately, Singapore will have 4 main water supplies, the new water (recycled water), the desalinated water (from the sea), own reservoir and from malaysia. Future price of water, raw or treated that we buy from malaysia, must not be more expensive than our costs of recycling or reclaiming water. With time, technologies improve, our costs of water will come down. The microfilter membrane today costs less than 10% of what it used to be! If malaysia don take care of their water resources, we may sell them water next time.
6. Chlorine is added to kill bacteria and/or germs. It makes no sense to get rid of it before pumping through the pipes to households. If water is contaminated along the way, whose problem?
Water without cholrine is plentiful. You can buy mineral water or distilled water from supermarket or the friendly 7 11 stores. you can also boil the water before drinking, chlorine is dissolved so it evaporate when water is boiled. Very health conscious people have no problem with portable water in singapore.
7. You can also buy water filter systems like ALL ,yes ALL my friends in KL do, in order to get clean water from their taps. AMWAY has a very effective system and is selling like hot cake. In KL, Klang area, you clean the filter once every 2 weeks and change every 3 months. You can also buy those systems to magnetise your water before you drink, for the comfort of your mind, another psychological effect. To me, those are all waste of money. I have not found how cancer is linked to drinking water.
So far, me and my family, drink straight from the taps. I don't work for newwater, no share in HYFLUX!
Happy drinking!! -
Dear Sgdiehard,
I don't really dispute what you say. Looking for alternative water sources, like alternative energy sources, is very old subject. And I really agree with you that the 2003 "show off" of New Water is actually a political wayang to boast confidence.
I really do not see how we could be self reliant on water if we are going to aim for a population of 7 to 8 million. Water demand will be more than doubled. If we cannot handle it now at this population level, you expect us to handle a double growth in demand?
I might have missed out some news articles, but there isn't a "vision" or published full idea of our water strategy. And it is really amazing that we skip the step of recycling (or reclaiming as you preferred) of water from our drainage system and go straight into sewage recycling.
You are right about "being pure" in New Water but there is process risk involved. If simple things like safe boxes could also cause a blunder, how about microscopic filtration monitoring? Besides, being "PURE" doesn't necessary mean good for healthy drinking.
Reverse Osmosis has proven to be effective in distilling sea water and cost only one third of conventional desalination system; why not use it? Why use it on sewage treatment instead? Any logic for that?
They are building an additional pipe system to bring non-portable water to the households. That's what I have been told.
Apparently you are taking the risk of chlorine water too lightly. Just pray that you are not the nearest household to the distribution system of treated water.
Goh Meng Seng -
Drainage water, if properly collected, need no recycling. If you look around all the private housing estates you will find that all the drainage system is now covered with metal grille to screen off leaves....As far as I know, this exercise is island wide to ensure only rain water goes into the drainage system which lead to the reservoir and the treatment is conventional and need no expensive reverse osmosis. We din skip recycling drainage water, we just reclaim it, in the cheapest way. If rain water does not go in and choke the sewage system then we deal with the sewage water, more thoroughly but at higher costs. I think this make sense.Originally posted by goh meng seng:Dear Sgdiehard,
I don't really dispute what you say. Looking for alternative water sources, like alternative energy sources, is very old subject. And I really agree with you that the 2003 "show off" of New Water is actually a political wayang to boast confidence.
I really do not see how we could be self reliant on water if we are going to aim for a population of 7 to 8 million. Water demand will be more than doubled. If we cannot handle it now at this population level, you expect us to handle a double growth in demand?
I might have missed out some news articles, but there isn't a "vision" or published full idea of our water strategy. And it is really amazing that we skip the step of recycling (or reclaiming as you preferred) of water from our drainage system and go straight into sewage recycling.
You are right about "being pure" in New Water but there is process risk involved. If simple things like safe boxes could also cause a blunder, how about microscopic filtration monitoring? Besides, being "PURE" doesn't necessary mean good for healthy drinking.
Reverse Osmosis has proven to be effective in distilling sea water and cost only one third of conventional desalination system; why not use it? Why use it on sewage treatment instead? Any logic for that?
They are building an additional pipe system to bring non-portable water to the households. That's what I have been told.
Apparently you are taking the risk of chlorine water too lightly. Just pray that you are not the nearest household to the distribution system of treated water.
Goh Meng Seng
It is agreed that being "pure" without all the minerals is not good for health. I mentioned earlier and that is the reason why newwater needs to be mixed with water in the reservoir. Risk of process error is bound to be there, but to what extend? If microfiltration, reverse osmosis and UV light plus the conventional checks ALL fails, you are talking about 1% of sewage water going into the reservoir (the current mixing rate), it is like all security checks fails and somebody manage to bring a bombs into Orchard MRT, what can we do? damage control management then.
Whether the plan we have can quench the thirst of 7 million or not, or if the plan is meant for 7 million or 5 million, i don know. At least we now have more alternatives than we did 10 years ago. With desalination plants we will have one more alternative. If Malaysia agree to sell at reasonable prices, better! but have to bear in mind that Malaysia had to go on water rationing in certain states in recent years. They may not have enough. so what else can we do?
I take at least 2 liter of water a day, for ......years (can't tell you how many or I will be revealling my age ), but there is no sign that chlorine has affected me, so far so good. Doctor tells me it is better to drink tap water than can of cola which contain 7 teaspoon of sugar in each can. Coffee should not be more than 3 cups a day. Too much beer no good, alcohol limited to two glasses of wine every evening. sigh....there must be more important thing to worry in life. -
Dear sgdiehard,
You are really lucky that you are not staying any nearer to water distribution network controls.
The little rain water collection methodology cannot solve a larger scale problem. Most of the rain water from built up area went to waste throught the canal system, into the few rivers mentioned to be dammed.
I think there is a risk involved if the filters are not properly monitored. To make sure that the filters will not deteriorate in the process needs good monitoring technique. To reduce such process risk is to pump these water back into reservoirs or the underground storage system (they are using it in US). In such a process, it dilutes the effect. There has been instances of poisoning due to improper water treatment in US. Such thing cannot be taken lightly as public health is concerned.
I also doubt we could depend on Malaysia for our strategic long term supply of water. Yes, it is good that we have alternatives right now. But a population of 7 to 8 million with uncertainties over water supply? No thanks. I don't think it is possible to be self sufficient.
We will ultimately explore the need for treating seawater through the reverse osmosis methodoly. Oil will be scarce for the next few decades.
But many people feel that we would be spending too much monies on the variety of water system we are talking about here. I say, it is necessary and strategically important for us to spend these monies; instead of the $600million Durians with $50m annual maintenance. Water is critical to our nation's survival.
Goh Meng SengOriginally posted by sgdiehard:Drainage water, if properly collected, need no recycling. If you look around all the private housing estates you will find that all the drainage system is now covered with metal grille to screen off leaves....As far as I know, this exercise is island wide to ensure only rain water goes into the drainage system which lead to the reservoir and the treatment is conventional and need no expensive reverse osmosis. We din skip recycling drainage water, we just reclaim it, in the cheapest way. If rain water does not go in and choke the sewage system then we deal with the sewage water, more thoroughly but at higher costs. I think this make sense.
It is agreed that being "pure" without all the minerals is not good for health. I mentioned earlier and that is the reason why newwater needs to be mixed with water in the reservoir. Risk of process error is bound to be there, but to what extend? If microfiltration, reverse osmosis and UV light plus the conventional checks ALL fails, you are talking about 1% of sewage water going into the reservoir (the current mixing rate), it is like all security checks fails and somebody manage to bring a bombs into Orchard MRT, what can we do? damage control management then.
Whether the plan we have can quench the thirst of 7 million or not, or if the plan is meant for 7 million or 5 million, i don know. At least we now have more alternatives than we did 10 years ago. With desalination plants we will have one more alternative. If Malaysia agree to sell at reasonable prices, better! but have to bear in mind that Malaysia had to go on water rationing in certain states in recent years. They may not have enough. so what else can we do?
I take at least 2 liter of water a day, for ......years (can't tell you how many or I will be revealling my age ), but there is no sign that chlorine has affected me, so far so good. Doctor tells me it is better to drink tap water than can of cola which contain 7 teaspoon of sugar in each can. Coffee should not be more than 3 cups a day. Too much beer no good, alcohol limited to two glasses of wine every evening. sigh....there must be more important thing to worry in life. -
To think about it, I never smell chlorine when i drink. When I say drinking from the tap, I actually mean filling a bottle with tap water and drink as and when necessary. Drinking directly from the tap waste water. May be allowing the water to settle after leaving the tap helps. Anyway, no issue here.Originally posted by goh meng seng:Dear sgdiehard,
You are really lucky that you are not staying any nearer to water distribution network controls.
The little rain water collection methodology cannot solve a larger scale problem. Most of the rain water from built up area went to waste throught the canal system, into the few rivers mentioned to be dammed.
I think there is a risk involved if the filters are not properly monitored. To make sure that the filters will not deteriorate in the process needs good monitoring technique. To reduce such process risk is to pump these water back into reservoirs or the underground storage system (they are using it in US). In such a process, it dilutes the effect. There has been instances of poisoning due to improper water treatment in US. Such thing cannot be taken lightly as public health is concerned.
I also doubt we could depend on Malaysia for our strategic long term supply of water. Yes, it is good that we have alternatives right now. But a population of 7 to 8 million with uncertainties over water supply? No thanks. I don't think it is possible to be self sufficient.
We will ultimately explore the need for treating seawater through the reverse osmosis methodoly. Oil will be scarce for the next few decades.
But many people feel that we would be spending too much monies on the variety of water system we are talking about here. I say, it is necessary and strategically important for us to spend these monies; instead of the $600million Durians with $50m annual maintenance. Water is critical to our nation's survival.
Goh Meng Seng
have no disagreement on your final post. We need to constantly look out for technological breakthrough in water collection, purification, reclaimation, and most important of all, water desalination.
Cheers. -
The two porcupines may not make money by themselves but they bring in other benefits like tourist dollars and attracting world class arts talents to Singapore.Originally posted by goh meng seng:Dear sgdiehard,
You are really lucky that you are not staying any nearer to water distribution network controls.
The little rain water collection methodology cannot solve a larger scale problem. Most of the rain water from built up area went to waste throught the canal system, into the few rivers mentioned to be dammed.
I think there is a risk involved if the filters are not properly monitored. To make sure that the filters will not deteriorate in the process needs good monitoring technique. To reduce such process risk is to pump these water back into reservoirs or the underground storage system (they are using it in US). In such a process, it dilutes the effect. There has been instances of poisoning due to improper water treatment in US. Such thing cannot be taken lightly as public health is concerned.
I also doubt we could depend on Malaysia for our strategic long term supply of water. Yes, it is good that we have alternatives right now. But a population of 7 to 8 million with uncertainties over water supply? No thanks. I don't think it is possible to be self sufficient.
We will ultimately explore the need for treating seawater through the reverse osmosis methodoly. Oil will be scarce for the next few decades.
But many people feel that we would be spending too much monies on the variety of water system we are talking about here. I say, it is necessary and strategically important for us to spend these monies; instead of the $600million Durians with $50m annual maintenance. Water is critical to our nation's survival.
Goh Meng Seng
.....and its not just about money. If you have to lay pipes to let ppl use seawater for flushing toilets you think ppl will not kpkb when HDB come in to hack their toilets ? -
Dear Paperchicken,
There are really ways to do it without the need of going into your flat to hack your toilet.
BTW, what about these porcupines? What's that? ;?
Goh Meng SengOriginally posted by paperchicken:The two porcupines may not make money by themselves but they bring in other benefits like tourist dollars and attracting world class arts talents to Singapore.
.....and its not just about money. If you have to lay pipes to let ppl use seawater for flushing toilets you think ppl will not kpkb when HDB come in to hack their toilets ? -
How are they going to supply seawater for flushing without hacking and laying a seperated pipe ?Originally posted by goh meng seng:Dear Paperchicken,
There are really ways to do it without the need of going into your flat to hack your toilet.
BTW, what about these porcupines? What's that? ;?
Goh Meng Seng
the porcupines are the theatre by the bay. -
Two years ago the joints of the seawater chiller cooling pipes at Marina made of special epoxy material gave way. None of the Singapore contractors could repair them so the seawater pipes were finally modified at great costs for future maintenance purpose.Originally posted by paperchicken:How are they going to supply seawater for flushing without hacking and laying a seperated pipe ?
the porcupines are the theatre by the bay. -
conclusion : suggestion by Goh Meng Seng to use piped seawater is a bad idea.Originally posted by robertteh:Two years ago the joints of the seawater chiller cooling pipes at Marina made of special epoxy material gave way. None of the Singapore contractors could repair them so the seawater pipes were finally modified at great costs for future maintenance purpose.