Paramilitary Unit in SG
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Hi guys,
I understand that in Tim Huxleys's "Defending the Lion City",it was quoted that the National Cadet Corp (NCC) is to be considered as a Paramilitary Unit.
Now I have a few questions here...Hope you guys can help clarify my doubts.
1st:In war,will the NCC be activated to guard installations or engage in combat with the invaders as a reserve force as we have like 16,000 cadets?
2nd:Who will be leading the NCC cadets?Will it be the teacher officers,cadet lieutenants and cadet specialists?Or will SAF Officers and Specialist will command them?
3rd:Will teacher officers,cadet lieutenants and cadet specialists be granted the same power and authorities of those of the same rank in the SAF?
4th:If any member of the NCC is caught and made a POW,will they be subjected to the same rules under the Geneva Convention?
5th:Where will the NCC units from the various schools be drawing their weapons and ammunition from in the event of war?As from my understanding,HQ NCC only has an armoury of a couple hundred AR-15s and M-16s for training and live firing.And the magazines are also limited, \also the bayonets available there are for ceremonial use.
6th:Where will equipment like SBO,helmet etc...be drawn?As they do not have personal issued equipment like SBo,helmet all that. -
Er.. I dunno abt the NCC, but in 1915, Singapore scouts rendered service by taking over from the Army and the Police force, the duties of dispatch riders, telephone operators, and clerks during the period of the Sepoy Mutiny by the Indian Light Infantry.
Also in 1941, the boy scouts took up positions of responsibilities by qualifying as Air Raid Wardens, Fire Watchers, First Aid Men and Police Officers, serving in their respective units until disbanded with the fall of Singapore to the occupation forces of the Japanese Imperial Army.
I think its gonna be more along those lines instead of sending those boys out to war in full battle order. -
wld singapore send 12-16 year old ppl into battle?i guess not..
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can we afford to get into a battle in the first place???Originally posted by beavan:wld singapore send 12-16 year old ppl into battle?i guess not.. -
SpecOps87
Check private message. -
haha NCC only know how to hide in the bush with their dummies, not even fully equip
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Last resort : Child soldiers..like in Africa..
Whereby...those occupier troops when they are walking..suddenly a civilian dressed small kid..come up to them and fires at them. -
think we wld have surrenedered b4 that happens..
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nope, ncc is not used in war under any situation.
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Isn't the NCC's predecessor the Singapore Volunteer Corps? Im not sure so dun quote me on that.
Anyway, NCC cadets nowaways are a joke! NCC has moved very very far from being a paramilitary unit nowadays. The move started soon after the adoption of the "Army 21" or Army 2000(?). That would be around 1995 i think.
Up till the early 90s NCC seniors were pretty fit and tough! Many could do 20+ pull ups each! After that though, discipline has been deemphasized and to be honest, (and i had the opportunity of seeing NCC cadets trg just recently) they look like a bunch of pu.ssys now!
So i do not think these guys/gals will be tasked with any form of combat anytime soon. Maybe they will be put to work delivering and sorting mail! -
YEahyeahyeah...Originally posted by lwflee:Isn't the NCC's predecessor the Singapore Volunteer Corps? Im not sure so dun quote me on that.
Anyway, NCC cadets nowaways are a joke! NCC has moved very very far from being a paramilitary unit nowadays. The move started soon after the adoption of the "Army 21" or Army 2000(?). That would be around 1995 i think.
Up till the early 90s NCC seniors were pretty fit and tough! Many could do 20+ pull ups each! After that though, discipline has been deemphasized and to be honest, (and i had the opportunity of seeing NCC cadets trg just recently) they look like a bunch of pu.ssys now!
So i do not think these guys/gals will be tasked with any form of combat anytime soon. Maybe they will be put to work delivering and sorting mail!
CLT saiful from YISS
CLTs Quek Chin Seng and Augustine from St Gab...
blardee mad legends of the past...kekekekeke
wonder where they are now -
NCC? Those who have yet to ROD please standby.
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aye NCC, god noes why i joined that ECA last time ? Always remember 1 incident in Specialist course way back in 1995, where there was this NCC Staff Sergeant from YISS, think his name was Ang Ka Lun or something, made some junior cadets eat so much nightsnack 1 nite as he didn't like their face till the poor cadets threw up and were sent to hospital for overeating. Then the SAF 2LT had a hell of a time scolding till he cried and was sobbing like a child.Originally posted by sidestep1984:YEahyeahyeah...
CLT saiful from YISS
CLTs Quek Chin Seng and Augustine from St Gab...
blardee mad legends of the past...kekekekeke
wonder where they are now
Out of my entire batch of cadets, i only recalled 1 cadet who was a CLT in his younger days, and he was one of the most hated guys due to his elitist attitude as we were the poly batch, and he was from pretty gd JC in the East.His actions during cadet days wasn't very glamerous either. Some of which i shall not elebroate. -
well, form what i know in europe during world war 2 scouts(as in, boy scouts) was taughted and given a rifle(forgot if it is a winchester or something else) ti use, and these boys are machiam really use as scouts, well, thou for singapore case, i doubt our NCC cadets are even anything!
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off topic...Originally posted by snk86:taughted
verb is teach
past tense taught...
taughted?...past past tense har?
hehehehhehehhehehe
dont angry yuh?hehehehhe -
i am a NCC CLT but pls lar, we go war.... . if we ever reach those kind of despo stage, den might as well surrender. think if war they will also ask for volunteers for the army, maybe 16-18 yo can join if really needed. PLUS WE HAF A VERY CAPABLE AND STRONG ARMY FORCE WAD!
if u go see the ncc trg syallbus, not much is about fighting a war ( onli haf m-16 technical, live range/imt, basic IFC). the rest is drill and having FUN! ncc is jus a CCA not realli about building an army. -
it ain't very fun to begin with....
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if desperate, I think can mobilise NCC as a last resort lah....after all they undergo weapons training course and all.....
Sec 2 learn the Lee Enfied rifle already, and Sec 3 learn AR-15 shoot 5.56mm round. Utilised in Fibua, NCC cadets can be deadly cos' they know their backyard HDBs well and some are still katek katek can hide well like tunnel rat .....I reckon that they will wreak havoc on Malaysian or Indo commandoes foolish enough to intrude upon these NCC guarded HDB flats! 
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well....its up to their parents really...whether the parents wanna sign that underage form thingy to not hold the NCC responsible for anything happening to their child...Originally posted by mwk:if desperate, I think can mobilise NCC as a last resort lah....after all they undergo weapons training course and all.....
Sec 2 learn the Lee Enfied rifle already, and Sec 3 learn AR-15 shoot 5.56mm round. Utilised in Fibua, NCC cadets can be deadly cos' they know their backyard HDBs well and some are still katek katek can hide well like tunnel rat .....I reckon that they will wreak havoc on Malaysian or Indo commandoes foolish enough to intrude upon these NCC guarded HDB flats!
off topic...
i thought sec 1 learn m16s1 fundamentals?
sec 2 go 50m range?...
my.....how things have changed... -
Old chinese Saying....Originally posted by mwk:if desperate, I think can mobilise NCC as a last resort lah....after all they undergo weapons training course and all.....
Sec 2 learn the Lee Enfied rifle already, and Sec 3 learn AR-15 shoot 5.56mm round. Utilised in Fibua, NCC cadets can be deadly cos' they know their backyard HDBs well and some are still katek katek can hide well like tunnel rat .....I reckon that they will wreak havoc on Malaysian or Indo commandoes foolish enough to intrude upon these NCC guarded HDB flats!
'Beware what you wish for' -
no. yours is the modern ncc. he was talking about ncc much much much long ago. the lee enfield package was phased out in 1993.Originally posted by sidestep1984:well....its up to their parents really...whether the parents wanna sign that underage form thingy to not hold the NCC responsible for anything happening to their child...
off topic...
i thought sec 1 learn m16s1 fundamentals?
sec 2 go 50m range?...
my.....how things have changed... -
I have met Huxley before at a seminar. I believe much of his sources are not official. A lot is based on observation of our society and the SAF from an outside viewpoint. Hence, there is some element of speculation on his part. He did admit to the seminar audience that his books draws some from conversation with the "man in the street" who has either NS or reservist experience, and some ex-regulars. At the ground level, his facts are good.
This thing about NCC cadets is a pretty obvious guess. During an all-out war, any person in uniform (young or old) is going to be drafted in to help. Whether it be air raid wardens, despatch rider, first aider ..... this is part of what TOTAL DEFENCE is all about. -
Firstly, the modern NCC was never designed to be a fighting force in any sense and I pray there never comes a day when Singapore will be in such desperation that Cadets must be called up.Originally posted by snk86:well, form what i know in europe during world war 2 scouts(as in, boy scouts) was taughted and given a rifle(forgot if it is a winchester or something else) ti use, and these boys are machiam really use as scouts, well, thou for singapore case, i doubt our NCC cadets are even anything!
But with it's 104 years of history the NCC has contributed much to this country and on two desperate occasions, cadets have been called up for duty.
History Lesson:
Historical Call-Ups
World War II:
Cadets from the various School Cadet Corps [now incorporated into the NCC], were chanelled into the Singapore Volunteer Corps (Now part of the People's Defense Force), to fight the Japanese.
Indonesian Komfrontasi: The Confrontation with Indonesia
For those unfamiliar with this historical event, during Singapore's years in Malaysia as well as the period just after our independence, Indonesia waged a limited conflict against Malaysia and Singapore. As part of this conflict, Indonesian commandos were sent into Singapore as well as parts of Malaysia.
After several bombings in Singapore itself, where Indon forces bombed the targets such as the Ambassador Hotel and MacDonald House (along Orchard Rd), many Singaporeans were trained in Civil Defence procedures and the Singapore Volunteer Corps (SVC), Vigilante Corps (VC) were called up to assist our only 2 units at the time, the 1st & 2nd Singapore Infantry Regiments.
In addition to these, senior members of the Cadet Corps and teacher officers were allowed to join the fledgling SAF in a special scheme. These were largely deployed to assist in guarding civilian structures against Indon attack (Similar to what NSmen are doing at Jurong Island & Changi Airport since the War on Terrorism started).
Non-Conflict Assistance
Officers of the Army Cadet Corps, Singapore Air Training Corps (SATC) and Sea Training Corps (all incorporated into NCC) were attached to the then Ministry of Interior & Defence (MID). Due to a shortage of trained manpower, the fledgling SAF turned to these British-trained officers for assistance as their was a distinct shortage of educated personnel in the new force. Many soldiers barely had secondary education at that time and educated Volunteer Officers (not all Corps officers were teachers at the time) were in demand.
Members of the Air Training Corps also played a role in the formation of the Air Force as many held private pilots licenses (No YFC back then either). -
Sorry for long post, I joined the Corps in secondary school and had a good run. While the Corps may not be what is used to be and many cadets these days are immature in their thinking, it is unfair to assume all cadets past and present bear the same standard. A few black sheep shouldn't be allowed to spoil the flock that has produced many a success story including all three service chiefs and the Defence Minister himself.
Personally, I hate these very public pieces of nonsense from cadets who dream about an "NCC fighting force" but don't bother to read their own Core Values and Pledge which they swore to observe and uphold. But please keep in mind that at the end of the day, the majority of those in the Corps are students (mostly kids below 16 years of age) -
Errm - i believe you got it wrong. Its more like the majority cannot make it rather than the other way around.
Before the mid 90s, NCC training was on par with military trg in terms of physical exertion and discipline.
Eg. in the mid 90s, it was common to be subjected to 400+ pushups in the course of each trg session. The push ups were done on the hot tar road under the blistering afternoon sun; the pushups also varied from diamond to knuckle to the std pushups. The cadets were also subjected to punishment like "touch the backgate and come back", ranger jumps, change parades and the like.
In terms of discipline, cadets were expected to jump to every command, however absurd. I remember when 20+ cadets were told to squeeze into a toilet cubilcle as punishment! I also remember instances where cadets were awoken at night for PT!
Now, it would be difficult to get the cadets just to shut up! The change is amazing!