Singapore delays $1 bln fighter contract until Q2
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Last minute "negotiations “
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Singapore delays $1 bln fighter contract until Q2
Thu Mar 3, 2005 02:27 AM ET
By Jan Dahinten
SINGAPORE (Reuters) - Singapore is delaying a $1 billion contract for 20 combat jets by up to three months as Eurofighter, Boeing and Dassault tussle for the well-armed island's biggest fighter order, people close to the talks said.
Despite industry speculation that Singapore was leaning towards one of the two European suppliers rather than Boeing, aerospace analysts and sources said the outcome was too tough to call.
The Southeast Asian nation had been expected to decide on a replacement for its ageing A-4SU Super Skyhawk jets in the first quarter of this year, but people at two of the three shortlisted groups told Reuters a decision was now expected between April and June.
"The Singaporeans have been asking a lot of questions regarding the planes. There's a lot of activity," one source said.
A defence ministry spokeswoman said the deal was still being evaluated. She did not give a time frame for an announcement.
The Eurofighter consortium, Boeing Co. of the United States and French aircraft and defence group Dassault Aviation are vying for the contract.
Singapore, which spends more on defence than any Southeast Asian nation relative to the size of its economy, is known as a sophisticated arms buyer and its choice of jet could influence others countries considering new fighters.
One source at a supplier said Singapore was a tough client and that "it's one of the hardest campaigns we have worked on".
PITCHING HARD
The Eurofighter consortium includes BAe Systems, Airbus parent EADS and Italy's Finmeccanica. Britain lent support for the bid last year by sending two of its Eurofighter Typhoon jets to Singapore for evaluation.
French Defence Minister Michele Alliot-Marie urged Singapore's leaders to pick Dassault's Rafale fighter plane during a visit to Singapore this week, echoing comments made by President Jacques Chirac during an October visit.
The Rafale has yet to win its first export order after Dassault lost out on orders from Norway, the Netherlands and South Korea.
Singapore has also tested the F-15 fighter jets built by Boeing, which is under pressure to win a deal that would help it extend F-15 production beyond 2008.
All three of those multi-mission aircraft are much larger and more effective than the old Skyhawks, which are considered good, light bombers but are not fighters at all.
Singapore is armed to the teeth relative to its size of just 697 square km (436 square miles) and sees its modern weaponry, which includes submarines, stealth frigates and combat jets, as a necessary protection against all sorts of perceived threats.
At nearly a third of its US$18.3 billion budget, or 5 percent of its US$110 billion economy, Singapore's defence spending is also higher in relative terms than that of military superpowers such as the United States, Britain and France when compared to total government spending.
The tightly-controlled, predominantly ethnic Chinese city-state of 4.2 million people, is on the doorstep of mostly Muslim neighbours Malaysia and Indonesia and believes it is a prime target for regional group Jemaah Islamiah (JI), a network linked to Osama bin Laden's al Qaeda.
Last month, Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong unveiled plans to spend S$9.26 billion ($5.7 billion) on defence in Singapore's current budget, up 7.4 percent from 2004. -
It's got to be F-15. Common sense says they are in the best position to offer the most cost effective solution. Just like the S-70B.
Theirs is the deal to break for sure.
I will be very suprised if SAF gets suckered into a European deal. -
Dun tell me it is another Sth Korea case?
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The question is whether the shortlisted contenders can meet the key requirement of defeating potential threats, i.e. not just immediate threats but possibly within the next 10 to 15 yrs.
Only when all the contenders are able to meet perceived threats, then life-time costs and other considerations will come into the picture. -
Yes the winner has got to do the job.......but then what is the percieved threats? Is it static or fluid over the next 10 to 15 years?
Getting the job done actually depends a whole lot more on the 'software' rather than the hardware(or more appropriately the vessel).
Something like Victory class versus Formidable.....I think. -
I would bet my money on SAF buying Eurofighter.
Dassualt's Rafale hadn't been picked up by any countries despite intensive efforts by the Frogs marketing it......reasons of which i am not sure but if no other countries choose this fighter, i doubt we should also.
F15 is a capable platform but it is near the end of its life liao.....so unless we can get a good deal....if not leh..we can forget about it. -
i got a feeling it's gotta be Rafale... because I think their publicity efforts have been most intensive... considering Eurofighter has got some tecnical probs and F15 dunno whether can last for the next 20 years. But anyway, no guarantee, anything unexpected may happen
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But... The qn now comes, F-35 is coming in 10 yearsOriginally posted by Bejean:I would bet my money on SAF buying Eurofighter.
Dassualt's Rafale hadn't been picked up by any countries despite intensive efforts by the Frogs marketing it......reasons of which i am not sure but if no other countries choose this fighter, i doubt we should also.
F15 is a capable platform but it is near the end of its life liao.....so unless we can get a good deal....if not leh..we can forget about it. -
double post
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hmm...what about the F-23?
ok...juz daydreaming...i'll talking crap anyway...since SBSK isn't around for some time... -
should realli spent the money reserching HKs.....Hunter Killers.....Fully Automated....heat and motion sensitive.....like in the Terminator series.....pple tell me all this for movie only but it might be possible after all to have this......
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you mean suppose too?Originally posted by sbst275:But... The qn now comes, F-35 is coming in 10 years
They are already having problems with the program being over weight. That if i'm not wrong, the VTOL version might get canned.
Anyway even if it's ready in 10 years time, considering the number of nations that are queuing up for it.....i highly doubt we'd get it that soon. -
STOVL F-35Bs must fly , by hook or by crook.Originally posted by |-|05|:you mean suppose too?
They are already having problems with the program being over weight. That if i'm not wrong, the VTOL version might get canned.
Anyway even if it's ready in 10 years time, considering the number of nations that are queuing up for it.....i highly doubt we'd get it that soon.
Becos it is the Harrier replacement, w/o that RN, US Marines will have no replacement for the old Harrier. -
think rafale will not clinch the deal, there surely is some reason why country after country dun wanna buy it. either its not value for $ or there is some factor dat put it down, think RSAF will also come up with the same decision after weighing the pros and cons.
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Latest !!!!! Heard Singapore will purchase the American made Brewster Buffaloes. According to the Straits Times, they are capable of turning more quickly than any other fighter yet designed...........sure win one...
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http://www.warbirdforum.com/buffsing.htm -
Nope... Only participating members incl SG gets it priorityOriginally posted by |-|05|:you mean suppose too?
They are already having problems with the program being over weight. That if i'm not wrong, the VTOL version might get canned.
Anyway even if it's ready in 10 years time, considering the number of nations that are queuing up for it.....i highly doubt we'd get it that soon. -
Priority over who ???Originally posted by sbst275:Nope... Only participating members incl SG gets it priority
SG is NOT a partner in JSF progarm.
We signed up only as a Participant in JSF- SDD phase which give us a right to look/ see only.
SG will ONLY get JSF early if one of the nine partner countries in JSF program released their aircrafts to us -
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Over those not in the prog AT ALLOriginally posted by sg1960:Priority over who ???
SG is NOT a partner in JSF progarm.
We signed up only as a Participant in JSF- SDD phase which give us a right to look/ see only.
SG will ONLY get JSF early if one of the nine partner countries in JSF program released their aircrafts to us -
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which ever aircraft we choose, i hope is for its capability rather than politics. That said i have a feeling that the decision was delayed because of the latter.
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I read from old article abt JSF.I think abt 1~2 years back.
SG may be among the first to get F-35s becos of our small initial requirement.
Someone here could recall? -
So with 9 parnters countries ahead of SG, how early can SG can get the JSF ?Originally posted by sbst275:Over those not in the prog AT ALL
See your below reply to 05 posting .
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Originally posted by |-|05|:
you mean suppose too?
They are already having problems with the program being over weight. That if i'm not wrong, the VTOL version might get canned.
Anyway even if it's ready in 10 years time, considering the number of nations that are queuing up for it.....i highly doubt we'd get it that soon.
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Reply by sbst275:
Nope... Only participating members incl SG gets it priority
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SG will ONLY get JSF early if US or some other countries in JSF program released their aircrafts to us .
That is provided that Sg is getting JSF when the time come . -
According the article , SG is looking to get 12 ??? JSF and the aircraft will come from USAF quota .Originally posted by gary1910:I read from old article abt JSF.I think abt 1~2 years back.
SG may be among the first to get F-35s becos of our small initial requirement.
Someone here could recall?
That is according my memory, so if any
please enlighten.
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Delayed till quarter 2, mebbe texan sheriff pull rank, with 3 contenders it will become a political decision.
Eurofighter good on paper, have flown and crashed, will take long time to reach production, delivery will take many more years to reach us, definately a pipe dream, you out here. If we get I be very surprised and I'll recommend the steering commitee be shot.
Rafale excellent bird and already operational with froggy, they desperate for funding to keep it in the program more importantly they need us to endorse it for them and they are most eager to please, for that they willing to give us the moon which is what we want. My feeling is with this one.
F-15, sure it's a good workhorse but an old one and doesn't outclass cheaper rivals like the advanced russian SU fighters that many have bought, other than extending the aircraft production program for a few more years which keep american people in jobs, there is no advantage or any benefit at all for us, no tech sharing or any goodies, and who knows if another president comes to power he won't Screw us over it again ... at a time when maybe we need it most. They need the program now as a interim but in the long run the yanks don't need this fighter anymore when they get more F-22 delivered and JSF comes fully online they will scrap the program, If we get it we doing the yanks a favor by subsidising them and helping keep the program alive, whether they return the favor in the end is anybody's wild guess. -
The problem is, nobody knows which one is the best out of the three.
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Other countries will not get it when it is out. Get what I mean? Like Malaysia wants it, only when the members off all degree gets it, only can they get itOriginally posted by sg1960:So with 9 parnters countries ahead of SG, how early can SG can get the JSF ?
See your below reply to 05 posting .
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Originally posted by |-|05|:
you mean suppose too?
They are already having problems with the program being over weight. That if i'm not wrong, the VTOL version might get canned.
Anyway even if it's ready in 10 years time, considering the number of nations that are queuing up for it.....i highly doubt we'd get it that soon.
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Reply by sbst275:
Nope... Only participating members incl SG gets it priority
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SG will ONLY get JSF early if US or some other countries in JSF program released their aircrafts to us .
That is provided that Sg is getting JSF when the time come .