Joining the French Foreign Legion
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Yeah, it's good to be back. I've just discovered an Oz Army Signals museum a few minutes' drive away from where I'm staying. I'll go check it out and see if I can take a few photos. Gotta go visit the Armour Museum at Puckapanyal some time - they've got everything from the old WW1 clankers to captured Iraqi T-72s there.Originally posted by LazerLordz:Haha indeed.So how's Australia treating you?
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Okay, so now it is my reading deficiencies.
Fine, I am "reading deficient" then.
But to get it through that very thick skull of yours once more:
You rubbished the FFL cos you say your neighbour was one but you, Mr Singaporean Commando, scared him shxtless.
I am saying that if you had met a real Legionnaire in that situation, you would be in a hospital somewhere. I'm not saying Legionnaires are the toughest unit on earth. I am not comparing them to the SAS or Green Beret.
I am, sigh, sayin g that you are bullshxtting. You are probably Mr Armchair Commando, and you have never met a Legionnaire. And stop playing with your imaginary friends Mr SAS and Mr Green Beret, OK?
And don't refer to the author's use of the word "epitome". (OK OK you understand the meaning of that word, lollipop for you.) Stop referring to other topics in this thread. I'm calling your bluff. Defend that. -
I can vouch that he is an actual commando.From the posts and discussions in the late 2SG Hu threads, certain events and info can prove that he is.Originally posted by tvdog:Okay, so now it is my reading deficiencies.
Fine, I am "reading deficient" then.
But to get it through that very thick skull of yours once more:
You rubbished the FFL cos you say your neighbour was one but you, Mr Singaporean Commando, scared him shxtless.
I am saying that if you had met a real Legionnaire in that situation, you would be in a hospital somewhere. I'm not saying Legionnaires are the toughest unit on earth. I am not comparing them to the SAS or Green Beret.
I am, sigh, sayin g that you are bullshxtting. You are probably Mr Armchair Commando, and you have never met a Legionnaire. And stop playing with your imaginary friends Mr SAS and Mr Green Beret, OK?
And don't refer to the author's use of the word "epitome". (OK OK you understand the meaning of that word, lollipop for you.) Stop referring to other topics in this thread. I'm calling your bluff. Defend that.
Anyway, let's cool it shall we.Legionnaires are tough but there will be weaklings in every Army.Maybe that Czech fellow was retired from the Legion for 15-20 years?
Cheers dudes. -
Captured Iraqi T-72s?Heh, they actually brought them back for display eh..Originally posted by Gedanken:Yeah, it's good to be back. I've just discovered an Oz Army Signals museum a few minutes' drive away from where I'm staying. I'll go check it out and see if I can take a few photos. Gotta go visit the Armour Museum at Puckapanyal some time - they've got everything from the old WW1 clankers to captured Iraqi T-72s there.
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armchair commando? don't assume. Ged is an actual, Red-Bereted commando.Originally posted by tvdog:Okay, so now it is my reading deficiencies.
Fine, I am "reading deficient" then.
But to get it through that very thick skull of yours once more:
You rubbished the FFL cos you say your neighbour was one but you, Mr Singaporean Commando, scared him shxtless.
I am saying that if you had met a real Legionnaire in that situation, you would be in a hospital somewhere. I'm not saying Legionnaires are the toughest unit on earth. I am not comparing them to the SAS or Green Beret.
I am, sigh, sayin g that you are bullshxtting. You are probably Mr Armchair Commando, and you have never met a Legionnaire. And stop playing with your imaginary friends Mr SAS and Mr Green Beret, OK?
And don't refer to the author's use of the word "epitome". (OK OK you understand the meaning of that word, lollipop for you.) Stop referring to other topics in this thread. I'm calling your bluff. Defend that.
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Ok - did some lightining research.
s.3 SAF Act:
3. The following persons shall be persons subject to military law and this Act shall, subject to such exclusions or variations in relation to non-uniformed servicemen as may be prescribed, apply to them:
(a) regular servicemen and full-time national servicemen in the Singapore Armed Forces from the time their liability to report for enlistment or service arises until such time as they are lawfully discharged or released;
(b) operationally ready national servicemen from the time that they are ordered to report for enlistment or service, whether they have complied with such order or not, and while in uniform or performing service in the Singapore Armed Forces or the PeopleÂ’s Defence Force pursuant to section 14 of the Enlistment Act (Cap. 93), and while called out for mobilised service pursuant to sections 16 and 17 of that Act or when called out to duty in aid of the civil power;
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So NSmen are only liable under the act when they have been recalled or mobilised. AFAIK, There is no direct prohibition on the joining of a foreign army in the act, unless that army happens to be the enemy. (Look under mutiny, AWOL, and Desertion.)
-- Treason --
SINGAPORE (Penal Code, Chapter VI)
CHAPTER VI
OFFENCES AGAINST THE STATE
Waging or attempting to wage war or abetting the waging of war against the Government. 121. Whoever wages war against the Government, or attempts to wage such war, or abets the waging of such war, shall be punished with death, or with imprisonment for life, and shall also be liable to fine.
Illustration
A joins an insurrection against the Government. A has committed the offence defined in this section.
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Offences against authority. 121B. Whoever compasses, imagines, invests, devises or intends the deprivation or deposition of the President from the sovereignty of Singapore, or the overawing by criminal force of the Government, shall be punished with imprisonment for life, and shall also be liable to a fine.
Abetting offences under section 121A or 121B. 121C. Whoever abets the commission of any of the offences punishable by section 121A or 121B shall be punished with the punishment provided for those offences.
Intentional omission to give information of offences against section 121, 121A, 121B or 121C by a person bound to inform. 121D. Whoever knowing or having reason to believe that any offence punishable under section 121, 121A, 121B or 121C has been committed intentionally omits to give any information respecting that offence which he is legally bound to give, shall be punished with imprisonment for a term which may extend to 7 years, or with fine, or with both.
Collecting arms, etc., with the intention of waging war against the Government. 122. Whoever collects men, arms or ammunition or otherwise prepares to wage war, with the intention of either waging or being prepared to wage war against the Government, shall be punished with imprisonment for life or imprisonment for a term not exceeding 10 years, and shall also be liable to fine.
Concealing with intent to facilitate a design to wage war. 123. Whoever by any act, or by any illegal omission, conceals the existence of a design to wage war against the Government, intending by such concealment to facilitate, or knowing it to be likely that such concealment will facilitate, the waging of such war, shall be punished with imprisonment for a term which may extend to 10 years, and shall also be liable to fine.
....
Waging war against any power in alliance or at peace with Singapore. 125. Whoever wages war against the government of any power in alliance or at peace with the Government, or attempts to wage such war, or abets the waging of such war, shall be punished with imprisonment for life, to which fine may be added; or with imprisonment for a term which may extend to 7 years, to which fine may be added, or with fine.
Committing depredation on the territories of any power in alliance or at peace with Singapore.
126. Whoever commits depredation, or makes preparations to commit depredation, on the territories of any power in alliance or at peace with the Government, shall be punished with imprisonment for a term which may extend to 7 years, and shall also be liable to fine and to forfeiture of any property used, or intended to be used, in committing such depredation, or acquired by such depredation.
Receiving property taken by war or depredation mentioned in sections 125 and 126. 127. Whoever receives any property knowing the same to have been taken in the commission of any of the offences mentioned in sections 125 and 126, shall be punished with imprisonment for a term which may extend to 7 years, and shall also be liable to fine and to forfeiture of the property so received.
....
Again, deosn;t seem to be a prohibition on the joiining of a foreign army. There are, however, some sections that may be of concern. Eg. When the army you join goes to war against Singapore, or when that army attacks a nation at peace with singapore.
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Need more reserach. -
Originally posted by HENG@:armchair commando? don't assume. Ged is an actual, Red-Bereted commando.
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Imagine a SG Marine backing out of an invasion of Iraq because he had to come back for ICT...
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Oh, you've met?Originally posted by HENG@:armchair commando? don't assume. Ged is an actual, Red-Bereted commando. -
i find it funny hor, some of the law says that in addition to being sentenced to death u will be fined as well. wtf?
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It says Death or imprisonment or fine mah. They can have it anyway they want.Originally posted by HENG@:i find it funny hor, some of the law says that in addition to being sentenced to death u will be fined as well. wtf?
Dun commit treason.... eheh -
To put it simply..if you want to join the Marines, be prepared to give up your pink IC.Originally posted by lwflee:It says Death or imprisonment or fine mah. They can have it anyway they want.
Dun commit treason.... eheh -
Offences against authority. 121B. Whoever compasses, imagines, invests, devises or intends the deprivation or deposition of the President from the sovereignty of Singapore, or the overawing by criminal force of the Government, shall be punished with imprisonment for life, and shall also be liable to a fine.
HEY! That sounds a lot like a thought crime! -
no it says death OR imprisonment for life, ALSO liable to a fine. does that mean u will kenna fine regardless of whether u get death or life imprisonment?Originally posted by lwflee:It says Death or imprisonment or fine mah. They can have it anyway they want.
Dun commit treason.... eheh -
Originally posted by lwflee:
Offences against authority. 121B. Whoever compasses, [b]imagines, invests, devises or intends the deprivation or deposition of the President from the sovereignty of Singapore, or the overawing by criminal force of the Government, shall be punished with imprisonment for life, and shall also be liable to a fine.
HEY! That sounds a lot like a thought crime! [/b] 
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EDIT: Sheesh, there have been a lot of posts while I was writing this. To tvdog:
Hey, it's OK, you don't know me from a bar of soap, so I suppose it's fair of you to assume that I'm bullshitting.
Tell you what. I'll be back in town at the end of the month, and I'll be meeting up with some of my old company mates - why don't you join us and they can tell you who I am? I'll even bring along my Reserve Service Booklet, just for you.
Even better, if you happen to know anyone who was in 2 Coy from December 1990 to June 1993, ask them about James. My name's already a matter of public knowledge on Club 30, so I've got no qualms about revealing it.
Now, if you've got any guts, you can take these measures to acsertain that I'm not bullshitting about who I am. Somehow, though, I suspect you're just going to clutch for some lame excuse to say that you're right.
As for the guys that I know from other units, well, I'm afraid I can't help you there. Some of them are still serving members, and I doubt they'll appreciate me naming names.
And you're still the one who went off-topic. I addressed lwflee's statement, and if you want to question if my experience is relevant, feel free. Any other tangents are your doing. Get that through your thick skull. -
Not sure, need to look at case law, which i do not have access to.Originally posted by HENG@:no it says death OR imprisonment for life, ALSO liable to a fine. does that mean u will kenna fine regardless of whether u get death or life imprisonment?
Anybody want to call mindef and ask them straight: "Hi, i am an NSman and i would like to join the army of a foreign country. Is that illegal and will i be exempt from service until such time as i have left that army?" -
Originally posted by lwflee:Not sure, need to look at case law, which i do not have access to.
Anybody want to call mindef and ask them straight: "Hi, i am an NSman and i would like to join the army of a foreign country. Is that illegal and will i be exempt from service until such time as i have left that army?"
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Btw, i am not taking part in the discussion btw Ged and TVdog because i have stated my Pov and Ged has already stated that he disagrees.
I stand by my opinions. -
Uh - In case anyone wants to have a go...
International Law Practice
Head Mr Yeo Bock Chuan 6768 2466
Deputy Head Mrs Rena Lee 6768 2232
Military Law Practice
Head Mr Jon Ong Soon Wah 6768 2267
Legal Support Staff
Head Mr Ivor Pereira 6768 2695
From DMG Legal Services Website (http://www.mindef.gov.sg/dmg/ls/abt_ls/contact_us.htm)
I am not in singapore so please dun say "You try lah!" -
Hey, that's cool by me, dude.Originally posted by lwflee:Btw, i am not taking part in the discussion btw Ged and TVdog because i have stated my Pov and Ged has already stated that he disagrees.
I stand by my opinions.
To your point, the FFL does have a long history of combat, and if you stay in a business long enough your name will become known regardless of your performance. To a great extent, the Legion's rep is like the US Marines and based largely on their body count (their dead, not the enemy's). The Legion lost seven battalions at dien Bien Phu and ultimately lost, but it sure did add to the romance of the Legion mystique.
What I'm saying is that certain landmark operations, such as those of the SAS during the Malayan campaign, or the US Marine CAPs in Vietnam, or the Israeli Paras at Entebbe, set them as the benchmark in their field. While the FFL has had successful operations, such as that in Kolwezi in 1978, it really hasn't carried out an operation that can be added to the textbook, in a manner of speaking. -
there is that incident where that captain whatshisname and his wooden hand...Originally posted by Gedanken:Hey, that's cool by me, dude.
To your point, the FFL does have a long history of combat, and if you stay in a business long enough your name will become known regardless of your performance. To a great extent, the Legion's rep is like the US Marines and based largely on their body count (their dead, not the enemy's). The Legion lost seven battalions at dien Bien Phu and ultimately lost, but it sure did add to the romance of the Legion mystique.
What I'm saying is that certain landmark operations, such as those of the SAS during the Malayan campaign, or the US Marine CAPs in Vietnam, or the Israeli Paras at Entebbe, set them as the benchmark in their field. While the FFL has had successful operations, such as that in Kolwezi in 1978, it really hasn't carried out an operation that can be added to the textbook, in a manner of speaking. -
duh.Originally posted by tvdog:Oh, you've met? -
A civil discussion like this and you are threatening me with words like "if you've got any guts..." James, I am not the kind to miss an oppotunity like this. When the time comes to meet, we'll see how scary you (and your imaginary friends) really are.Originally posted by Gedanken:EDIT: Sheesh, there have been a lot of posts while I was writing this. To tvdog:
Hey, it's OK, you don't know me from a bar of soap, so I suppose it's fair of you to assume that I'm bullshitting.
Tell you what. I'll be back in town at the end of the month, and I'll be meeting up with some of my old company mates - why don't you join us and they can tell you who I am? I'll even bring along my Reserve Service Booklet, just for you.
Even better, if you happen to know anyone who was in 2 Coy from December 1990 to June 1993, ask them about James. My name's already a matter of public knowledge on Club 30, so I've got no qualms about revealing it.
Now, if you've got any guts, you can take these measures to acsertain that I'm not bullshitting about who I am. Somehow, though, I suspect you're just going to clutch for some lame excuse to say that you're right.
As for the guys that I know from other units, well, I'm afraid I can't help you there. Some of them are still serving members, and I doubt they'll appreciate me naming names.
And you're still the one who went off-topic. I addressed lwflee's statement, and if you want to question if my experience is relevant, feel free. Any other tangents are your doing. Get that through your thick skull.
But you have to have your friends along just to make sure? Damn, you not man enough to show up by yourself?
Meanwhile, tone down your stories and if you want to carry this further, let's not do it here. Use PM. -
double. crap.