BREAKING NEWS: THAILAND BUYS 12 SUKHOI SU-30s
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How short?Originally posted by storywolf:yes su-30s may look good, and sound good.
But it have its logistic problem - short airframe life, limited type of weapons ....
It sounds like you are saying that a very agile fighter is useless.Originally posted by storywolf:In a real war, so what you have a so call good fighter, that can out turn any planes. 1st you have to get intercept it first. If people play hide an seek, and hit other place and avoid confronting your planes all the time, they are useless.
Next even you have the most good fighter, so what you can outturn other planes, but in the end, you still cannot outturn the new generation of missiles. -
It was certainly true in the old Soviet days that their fighters are designed with a shorter airframe life than their western counterparts, the idea was to have cheap, easily mass-produced aircraft that's easy to maintain by poorly trained conscripted personnel in war time too ... but i suppose that has been changing ... since this doctrine would be unsustainable in modern warfare ...
and for the statement about agile fighters being "useless" , i'm not sure if that's entirely wrong too ... with HMS cueing systems and super agile next generation AA missiles, like the python 5, AIM 9X etc, and of course, the BVR missiles, the agility of an aircraft may be secondary to the stealth, speed, and electronics, one got to remember that no matter how agile an aircraft is, it's still limited by the amount of g forces a human body can take, but a thrust vectoring missile has no such limitations, in other words, the missile wins, all the time ...
what do you guys think ? ... -
That's true to a certain extent, but if that's really the case then why is the US consider putting into service the JSF and the Raptor? Apart from the added stealth and other vector thrust, STOVL etc, agility was way up high on the list of requirements.Originally posted by Fatum:and for the statement about agile fighters being "useless" , i'm not sure if that's entirely wrong too ... with HMS cueing systems and super agile next generation AA missiles, like the python 5, AIM 9X etc, and of course, the BVR missiles, the agility of an aircraft may be secondary to the stealth, speed, and electronics, one got to remember that no matter how agile an aircraft is, it's still limited by the amount of g forces a human body can take, but a thrust vectoring missile has no such limitations, in other words, the missile wins, all the time ...
what do you guys think ? ...
Apparently, in a dogfight agility still helps to prevent enemy from getting a missile lock. -
The Luch state design bureau in Ukraine is developing a 2.75-inch rocket for Singapore. Look it up on Jane's.Originally posted by Delta 5:Hmmm what kind of rockets did the SAF buy
For aircraft or infantry? -
In modern warfare, it is all about "who see first and who shoot first". There is no point buying something that can be very agile but "short sighted" can not shoot very far, or some equipment that can be jammed easily.
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Heh, theoretically, the Su-30Mkm series isnt very shortsighted... theoretically...
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its all about the support aircraft and air combat doctrine. especially AWACS. it allows fighters to engage enemy aircraft without turning on their own radar, and gives fighters a vast advantage in situational awareness. Pk of missiles, both BVR and WVR, are getting very high now, and outcomes of future air engagement between well equipped combatants would depend more on aerial warfare tactics, rather than individual pilot skill or aircraft capability
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I think UCAVs are the way to go in future air combat. Simply cos Pk of missiles are so high, that sending pilots into harm's way would be simply put, stupid.
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Russia offers copters for SU-30 deal
Large-size MI-17 matches army's needs
By Wassana Nanuam
The army, with only half of its helicopters still functioning, may refill its stock with Russian-made helicopters that will be offered at a special discount if the government, as expected, agrees to buy Russia's SU-30 jet fighters, a military source said. The Royal Thai Army source, who asked not to be named, said Russia might sell its four MI-17 helicopters at a special price or even ``give them free'' if the government goes ahead with its plan to procure the SU-30s, which have become a source of major controversy as the opposition has accused the government of hiding the details of the deal from the public.
Former army commander-in-chief Gen Prawit Wongsuwan reportedly visited Russia in the middle of this year to see the MI-17s himself, said the source. Moscow is keen on building a centre for aircraft spare parts and maintenance in Thailand in a bid to increase its arms exports to Southeast Asia.
``We are badly in need of helicopters because currently only 50% of our helicopters are airworthy. We want more because they are necessary,'' especially for missions in the restive far South, said army chief Sonthi Boonyaratglin.
The MI-17 is an efficient large-size helicopter that matches the army's needs, he said. Around half of the 286 helicopters have been grounded due to a lack of budget for maintenance, the source said.
Gen Sonthi said the army has already asked the government for a budget for its nine-year army development scheme, which will include plans to repair and buy new helicopters. The scheme will unfold next year.
``We have to be very careful on any arms deals because they could also affect friendly relations between Thailand and the US, our main arms supplier,'' said a general responsible for the army's logistics.
http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/25Dec2005_news12.php