Air Defence
-
hi, am a new member here and i've been following the threads with great interest, decided to post something as well... more often than not, the emphasis in RSAF has always been on the pilots and aircraft side, do you think there should be a need to purchase some new equipment for the Air Defence side? what i know is that the most recent piece of equipment for ADA is the Igla... or am i wrong? and what are the possible platforms the RSAF could look at? is there a need to purchase a weapon to replace the Bloodhound (retired quite some time back) which has a range of 100km, since the longest range in the current arsenal would be the I-HAWK, with a range of 40km.
-
I don't think so. Otherwise, I'm sure there'll be one already.Originally posted by Lost:hi, am a new member here and i've been following the threads with great interest, decided to post something as well... more often than not, the emphasis in RSAF has always been on the pilots and aircraft side, do you think there should be a need to purchase some new equipment for the Air Defence side? what i know is that the most recent piece of equipment for ADA is the Igla... or am i wrong? and what are the possible platforms the RSAF could look at? is there a need to purchase a weapon to replace the Bloodhound (retired quite some time back) which has a range of 100km, since the longest range in the current arsenal would be the I-HAWK, with a range of 40km.
There doesn't seem to be a threat in the region that would require such a system. What would you want to shoot down with long range SAMs around here??
What I feel is that there is still a lack of very short range air defense systems for the army units. Would love to see every IFV with a Igla, like the Russians... -
Igla? from what i've heard, its hit probability is not that fantastic, as compared to the RBS 70 and Mistral, wonder if any one has the figures to back this up? and i'm also quite curious why RSAF chose to purchase the Igla, a russian system... perhaps due to cost?
about the pt of not having enough short range missiles, i read somewhere that singapore is actually the most heavily defended piece of area, if u go by the number of systems per sq metre, so perhaps we shouldn't be focusing on the quantity, but rather the quality of the systems which we possess, which goes back to my original query, shouldn't we be upgrading our present ADA systems since they aren't exactly very new anymore... -
Argh... Heck care.. Just shoot our enemy planes down with productivity is good enough.
-
I think long time ago there is a rumour about getting the Patriot. Sometime in the early 90s. Suppose to replace the bloodhood.
I think Spore is already very well defended.
Air base point defence - 35mm Oeilikon (sp?)
Army ADA - Mistral, Igla and RBS70
Area Air Defence - I-HAWK
Sector (??) Air Defence - Rapier
If we buy more SAMs and ADA guns. do we really have place to mount them? -
Rapier will be replaced soon......
-
replace by ??Originally posted by YourFather:Rapier will be replaced soon...... -
spencer99>> agreed, that's why i was interested in the upgrading of our old systems, and not the quantity of the systems...
any idea which platforms are in the pipeline? and any time line given for the replacement of the rapiers? -
I do not know. I first heard this info from a friend in the rapier squadron. But naturally the replacement should be in the same class as the rapier system.
-
The Igla is a simple weapon to use;a typically point-and-shoot weapon. The price is affordable, (as compared to the Stinger) and from what I've heard from my friend in the ADA, they are going to, or have already begun licence-production of the Igla in S'pore. I hope that they have it in every combat unit in the future though...Hopefully have an army air defence platoon in every battalion. We should make it a part of training in Infantry courses.Originally posted by Lost:Igla? from what i've heard, its hit probability is not that fantastic, as compared to the RBS 70 and Mistral, wonder if any one has the figures to back this up? and i'm also quite curious why RSAF chose to purchase the Igla, a russian system... perhaps due to cost?
about the pt of not having enough short range missiles, i read somewhere that singapore is actually the most heavily defended piece of area, if u go by the number of systems per sq metre, so perhaps we shouldn't be focusing on the quantity, but rather the quality of the systems which we possess, which goes back to my original query, shouldn't we be upgrading our present ADA systems since they aren't exactly very new anymore... -
Some sneaky reasoning is behing the purchase of the Igla.
The rationale is that while each Igla has a lower hit probability then the Stinger, if two of them will have a higher hit probability then the Stinger, and still at a lower cost. Hence the idea is to buy Iglas and mount them on buddy rail systems two each to create a point defence system or have more of them about our forces that can have a higher rate of hit then the amount of stingers we can buy with the same amout of cash.
That is of course, just a matter of probability, time will tell if this really works out. -
If they are really so freaking cheap, then it really make sense, trained and issue it to every front-line unit and they can use it whenever they are under air-attack.Originally posted by SingaporeTyrannosaur:Some sneaky reasoning is behing the purchase of the Igla.
The rationale is that while each Igla has a lower hit probability then the Stinger, if two of them will have a higher hit probability then the Stinger, and still at a lower cost. Hence the idea is to buy Iglas and mount them on buddy rail systems two each to create a point defence system or have more of them about our forces that can have a higher rate of hit then the amount of stingers we can buy with the same amout of cash.
That is of course, just a matter of probability, time will tell if this really works out.
This would act as a deterrent to enemy CAS a/c.
But then the RSAF pilots will be concern about flying low over friendly unit in Wartime. accurate IFF will be a concern. -
Malaysia test-fires new multiple rocket system
Army chief says the expansion of nation's modern weapons arsenal is not an attempt to establish an offensive military capability
LUMUT (Perak) - Malaysia has test-fired its newly acquired multiple rocket launching system, which has been touted as a new addition to its deterrent defence capability, at a cost of RM17 million (S$7.8 million).
The Malaysian army fired a total of 48 live rockets towards a designated sea area about 80 km from the launching site in Tanjung Hantu near Lumut on Thursday.
The event was held in conjunction with the 70th anniversary of the army which was celebrated on March 1.
The test was done to ascertain the handling by the local personnel of the system newly-acquired from Avibras Aerospacial, based in Brazil.
The demonstration involved the firing of 24, 300-mm SS-60 rockets and 24, 300-mm SS-80 rockets into the sea.
The 300-mm SS-60 rockets have a range of 60 km, while the 300-mm SS-80 rockets have a range of up to 89 km.
Known as the ASTROS II or Artillery Saturation Rocket System, the multiple rocket launching system was acquired by Malaysia in October last year to enhance its surface-to-surface combat missions.
Speaking to reporters after the test, army chief Wira Mohamed Shahrom Nordin said Malaysia's expansion of its modern weapons system should not be interpreted as an attempt to establish pre-emptive or offensive military capability.
He said the purchase of new weapons systems was part of the armed forces move to equip themselves with 'deterrent defence capabilities' in the face of mounting threats and uncertainties in global security.
'Of course, our recent purchases have been more artillery weaponry for ground and air defence to increase our military capabilities, but due to recent political developments in the region, the move has been generally misunderstood.'
The army chief said the armed forces would continue to expand their 'deterrent defence capabilities' in the coming years by purchasing powerful weapons such as the IGLA, ANZA and JERNAS air defence missile system and domestic warning radar system.
General Shahrom said the purchase of more lethal and accurate weapons systems was important to ensure the army - the backbone of the country's defence - and other units of the armed forces are well equipped in every combat mission in the future.
He said the army was preparing an infrastructure development framework to organise the distribution of the acquired and soon-to-be-acquired weapons systems to each unit under its wing.
The event was also attended by the Sultan of Kelantan, Sultan Ismail Petra, who is the Colonel-in-Chief of the Royal Artillery Regiment and Raja Perempuan Kelantan Tengku Anis.--New Straits Times, TheStar/Asia News Network -
... and Singapore now also license produces the missiles. This means that we can build quite a stockpile rather cheaply, plus we get to learn the missile (IR seeker and rocket) technologies. Who knows, maybe one day, Singapore will produce its indigenous WVR air-to-air missiles like a copy of Python 4/5, etc.Originally posted by SingaporeTyrannosaur:Some sneaky reasoning is behing the purchase of the Igla.
The rationale is that while each Igla has a lower hit probability then the Stinger, if two of them will have a higher hit probability then the Stinger, and still at a lower cost. Hence the idea is to buy Iglas and mount them on buddy rail systems two each to create a point defence system or have more of them about our forces that can have a higher rate of hit then the amount of stingers we can buy with the same amout of cash.
That is of course, just a matter of probability, time will tell if this really works out. -
Perhaps a ground-based Barak system? Why not just upgrade the Rapier instead?Originally posted by YourFather:I do not know. I first heard this info from a friend in the rapier squadron. But naturally the replacement should be in the same class as the rapier system. -
There are some published articles then in the early 90s that SIngapore was interested in the Russian S300 SAM systems.
This was one deadly system that could render the airspace "BLACK" to enemy inbound fligths as the probability of hits/kills for both low and high flight profiles are very high! And it can actually be used to hit high altitude "rockets".
By the way, if there are enemy aircrafts flying over or doing CAS continuously here in our motherland, it meant one thing, OUR mighty AIRFORCE HAS FAILED in their quest to maintain AIR supremancy. So it doesn't really matter what SAM systems we have, becos we should then be already losing our cutting edge over our "enemy"!!!
My 2 cents worth...Originally posted by ETboy:replace by ?? -
I always have this idea. PUT THEM ON TO THEM ON TOP OF THE HDB FLATS!Originally posted by spencer99:I think long time ago there is a rumour about getting the Patriot. Sometime in the early 90s. Suppose to replace the bloodhood.
I think Spore is already very well defended.
Air base point defence - 35mm Oeilikon (sp?)
Army ADA - Mistral, Igla and RBS70
Area Air Defence - I-HAWK
Sector (??) Air Defence - Rapier
If we buy more SAMs and ADA guns. do we really have place to mount them? -
no need lah... following the tragedy involving the lampost which collapsed at the b-ball court, all lamp posts will be throughly "inspected"...
its a cover story by MINDEF to actually disguise SAMs as lamposts all over Sg so good luck to any clowns who wants to test the effectiveness of Sg's air-defence coverage
-
i would for one... hold back RSAF and let RMAF come and kill themselves admist SADA's defence wall...Originally posted by Tweeker:There are some published articles then in the early 90s that SIngapore was interested in the Russian S300 SAM systems.
This was one deadly system that could render the airspace "BLACK" to enemy inbound fligths as the probability of hits/kills for both low and high flight profiles are very high! And it can actually be used to hit high altitude "rockets".
By the way, if there are enemy aircrafts flying over or doing CAS continuously here in our motherland, it meant one thing, OUR mighty AIRFORCE HAS FAILED in their quest to maintain AIR supremancy. So it doesn't really matter what SAM systems we have, becos we should then be already losing our cutting edge over our "enemy"!!!
My 2 cents worth...
then .. once.. they limited fighters are depleted... we can send RSAF in.... -
How can it be possible... the lamppost i see everyday so thin... even if u say it fires 30mm rounds also impossible rite, not to mention any kind of missiles....Originally posted by CX:no need lah... following the tragedy involving the lampost which collapsed at the b-ball court, all lamp posts will be throughly "inspected"...
its a cover story by MINDEF to actually disguise SAMs as lamposts all over Sg so good luck to any clowns who wants to test the effectiveness of Sg's air-defence coverage 
anyway, I also thought of the idea of air-defence system on the rooftops, like wad the Iraqis did in the Gulf War...
I think the reason for no replacement for the bloodhounds until now is because RSAF jets can already fill up the gap in the range. We simply have more than enough jets to pound our enemy on the ground and in the air i would say, so we still have some more for CAP at the borders rite?
and i think that the purchase of the Igla is for forging ties... defence ties. If Igla is really so cheap like u guys say, then maybe our government is thinking that spending a little money on "not so capable" weapons is worth it for future larger contracts? U guys get wad i mean? hee.
i mean... maybe the government is laying the groundwork for more purchase of russian equipment next time...more clearer now. But Igla also not bad wad... if it is included in armour. BTW... Malaysians have attack helicopter anot? i think last time i heard ppl from here saying that Malaysians operates the Eurocopter Tiger or some South African helicopter rite??? -
MAF selected the South African Rooivark but got no money to buy it.
-
ya..... judging from the number of hdb blocks in singapore... one area like Tampines or Yishun enuff for airdefence liao... imagine how much AA fire is there when enemy overflies....Originally posted by Eiizumi:I always have this idea. PUT THEM ON TO THEM ON TOP OF THE HDB FLATS! -
uh huh...and then the enemy can bomb all the HDB's as military targets and not civilian targets...smart smart smarOriginally posted by Moonstriker:ya..... judging from the number of hdb blocks in singapore... one area like Tampines or Yishun enuff for airdefence liao... imagine how much AA fire is there when enemy overflies....
-
actually, its RooivalkOriginally posted by eurofighter:MAF selected the South African Rooivark but got no money to buy it. -
Ermh... i thought the plan is to destory them all on the ground at the very first hours of war?Originally posted by tripwire:i would for one... hold back RSAF and let RMAF come and kill themselves admist SADA's defence wall...
then .. once.. they limited fighters are depleted... we can send RSAF in....