Why US is right
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Why use the US as an excuse? Simple. Because the US is the sole superpower, the home of freedom or democracy, a free and independent press and a shining example to the world, as the US would like to emphasize to the rest of the world frequently. So if the world sees that the US can stoop to violating international law, then they're just following the US example. Like it or not, the US has put itself into a position of the standard bearer of the whole world. No one put them there BTW, they put themselves thereOriginally posted by gasband:Are you sure that USA will do it again, i may ask you then? Oh, just because they bandy some names about, it is truth? Then all the more I am convinced Saddam needs to be taken out fast, because he OPENLY supports Terrorists, he openly ask sucidal bombers to do their jobs, oh this man is dangerous, he really must be taken out.
Once again, please stop labelling it Pandora's box. I already said, if others wanna open their PANDORA's BOX, they can use any excuse, what makes you think only USA exclusively can be used as an excuse? IS that bias against the USA or what? If these countries choose to open their own Pandora's box, why should we blame it on USA since they have done the right thing as I emphasized.
It just like I slap a person because he needs to snap out of his misery, and the next moment people around me start saying, hey since he can slap other people who seem miserable, i shall go around slapping anyone who look miserable. So, is that my fault for doing the right thing?
By using you analogy, what if we disregarded the laws of our land and started carrying out vigilante justice to suspected criminals without going through due process? In the eyes of crminal law, two wrongs don't make a right, so why should international law be any different? -
ok sorry i knew immediately that EVIL will be up for debate.Originally posted by duotiga83:gasband: define EVIL in political term thnx and GOOD
Maybe I should have use REAL THREATS TO THE WORLD. -
And I also agree that sometimes war is necessary, but within the bounds of international lawOriginally posted by gasband:Each war is needed for different reasons and are always different. . -
Actually, no one suggested it WILL happen. What has been said, here at least, is that it MIGHT.Originally posted by gasband:So to suggest so QUICKLY that this war is bad and will cause major ripple effect sounds to me a bias towards USA rather than being objective. -
SO what if they are the biggest, strongest or whatever, richest...so it means its their fault? Because you are that, you must get used to being used as an excuse for people to committ crimes? What kind of fair logic is that?Originally posted by Viper52:Why use the US as an excuse? Simple. Because the US is the sole superpower, the home of freedom or democracy, a free and independent press and a shining example to the world, as the US would like to emphasize to the rest of the world frequently. So if the world sees that the US can stoop to violating international law, then they're just following the US example. Like it or not, the US has put itself into a position of the standard bearer of the whole world. No one put them there BTW, they put themselves there
By using you analogy, what if we disregarded the laws of our land and started carrying out vigilante justice to suspected criminals without going through due process? In the eyes of crminal law, two wrongs don't make a right, so why should international law be any different?
Yeah you said it, 2 wrongs do not make 1 right, I feel that USA is right and i did say that every war is different and for different reasons. If India wans to attack Pakistan, just go ahead. They use USA as an excuse and so you say its USA's fault? I did not know you trust India so much. And what did USA do wrong? For being strong, rich, big and wat more? The co-relation is too forceful. -
there will b huge masaccare n racism ard the east asianOriginally posted by gasband:If India wans to attack Pakistan, just go ahead. . -
ya so it might and it might not. It still remains to be seen what good has USA done for Iraqis but i am more sure that Iraqis would not be happy under Saddam, i can say that at least for most women in Iraq. So, why be so fast to raise doubts about this war? It may have broken international laws, but as many like to say about our "Singapore Outdated colonial Law", "its time to review the law.Originally posted by Viper52:Actually, no one suggested it WILL happen. What has been said, here at least, is that it MIGHT. -
You seem to forget that weather plays a role in the possibility of fighting the war and winning it fast. . .what sort of weather would the troops encounter should the US wait ? You'd rather a war amid the desert winds and sand storms?Originally posted by Viper52:It began in 1991, got barred in 1998. The UN forced open Iraq's doors in November 2002, the US forced it shut in February 2003 to fulfil Dubya's agenda. During this time, the UN reported that satisfactory progress has been made, yet the inspectors were forced out by the US.
Force buildup might have ongoing, but don't forget who's dictating the pace, the Yanks can slow it down had they been sincere about waiting for 1441 to run its course. But as it was they had made up their minds, and had they been given the choice, they wouldn't want to wait for 1441 to work -
yes and i forgot that India will then have to bear all consequences. And if India attacks Pakistan, one has to remember that this will bear no BENEFITS for anyone else but India themselves, thus it is really a selfish war. As for USA, whatever secret agenda they may have, at least Iraqis have a CHANCE for a better life.Originally posted by duotiga83:there will b huge masaccare n racism ard the east asian -
The problem is the US has a history of using their might to demand the world follows their standards, so by doing what they have done now coupled with what they have said in the past, is now coming back to haunt them. Like I said, no one put them on the pedestal, they put themselves up there.Originally posted by gasband:SO what if they are the biggest, strongest or whatever, richest...so it means its their fault? Because you are that, you must get used to being used as an excuse for people to committ crimes? What kind of fair logic is that?
Yeah you said it, 2 wrongs do not make 1 right, I feel that USA is right and i did say that every war is different and for different reasons. If India wans to attack Pakistan, just go ahead. They use USA as an excuse and so you say its USA's fault? I did not know you trust India so much. And what did USA do wrong? For being strong, rich, big and wat more? The co-relation is too forceful.
"If India wans to attack Pakistan, just go ahead."
And have a nuclear confrontation 5 hours flying time from Singapore? Is that really what you want, or are those words borne out of frustration?
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To be frank, when i said go ahead, it is not that i am indifferent to the situation. But it is a fact that if India insists on using USA as an excuse and go ahead and attack Pakistan, can we really stop them? But as I said, just like Iraq invade Kuwait for pure selfish reasons and got sanctioned, India will have to bear any consequences it any arise.Originally posted by Viper52:The problem is the US has a history of using their might to demand the world follows their standards, so by doing what they have done now coupled with what they have said in the past, is now coming back to haunt them. Like I said, no one put them on the pedestal, they put themselves up there.
"If India wans to attack Pakistan, just go ahead."
And have a nuclear confrontation 5 hours flying time from Singapore? Is that really what you want, or are those words borne out of frustration?
USA have a history of making unreasonable demands? I dun remember, maybe you can tell me. And even so, what major wrongs came out from that? I wun vouch for the future but so far, i seen no bad aftereffects of whatever USA has been doing. -
bye bye gotta go out, nice discussion with all of you, no offences to anyone.
I just would like to think I am an objective person and I am not pro-usa in everything, i take things one by one into consideration. So just chill cos in the end, at this point, we dun really know whether it was for the good or for the worse, just have to wait and see. -
no bad after effects? the middle east still as chaos, NK wans to show its force to USA to comply wad they wan, India- pakistan on kashmir as usal wif terror killings? the world has not fulli change yet.Originally posted by gasband:I wun vouch for the future but so far, i seen no bad aftereffects of whatever USA has been doing.
USA is a superpower, yes, but that does it means wadever they do is rite all the time. They are not super heroes or wad so ever -
uh. . errrr. sorry but i have to disagree on this one. . consider the invasion of Latin American countries in the early 1900s. . .their attempt to install democracy in this places turned out to be a very big failure. . .Originally posted by gasband:To be frank, when i said go ahead, it is not that i am indifferent to the situation. But it is a fact that if India insists on using USA as an excuse and go ahead and attack Pakistan, can we really stop them? But as I said, just like Iraq invade Kuwait for pure selfish reasons and got sanctioned, India will have to bear any consequences it any arise.
USA have a history of making unreasonable demands? I dun remember, maybe you can tell me. And even so, what major wrongs came out from that? I wun vouch for the future but so far, i seen no bad aftereffects of whatever USA has been doing.
unreasonable demands part i'm not very sure, haven't heard any yet. . .but i think every country has its failings. . . just the magnitude of it is different. . . -
I got to go too. . . most engaging discussion ever. .
I ain't pro-US on everything too. . . but sometimes I think people try to hard to dig at what is the norm. . . eg. That Bush spread sars. . .Bush is devil incarnate cos thru some funky calculation the numbers of his birthday adds up to 666. . .general media is lying and putting up fake photographs (despite the fact that it is media agencies from all over the world and a faking would have to involve the silencing or bribing of reporters from every major agency in the world). . .etc etc. . .
some times, going along with what u are fed is rite. . . though there are always loopholes and mistakes in there too, but there must be something useful in it that people often overlook. . . -
[quote]Originally posted by gasband:
To be frank, when i said go ahead, it is not that i am indifferent to the situation. But it is a fact that if India insists on using USA as an excuse and go ahead and attack Pakistan, can we really stop them? But as I said, just like Iraq invade Kuwait for pure selfish reasons and got sanctioned, India will have to bear any consequences it any arise.
No we can't, but like I've said, there would have been no preceedent to give the Indians quasi-legitimacy(in their eyes). Without this quasi-legitimacy they will not be so quick to suggest it
USA have a history of making unreasonable demands? I dun remember, maybe you can tell me. And even so, what major wrongs came out from that? I wun vouch for the future but so far, i seen no bad aftereffects of whatever USA has been doing.
Again, I never called it unreasonable demands. Your words not mine. One very clear example of this pushing around is how the US would try to force countries which US servicemen and even have committed crimes in to evade trial, more than once citing a presumption that their citizens would not get a "free and fair" trial. Remember the rape of 12-year-old schoolgirl in Okinawa by Marines, the road accident in S Korea when 2 S Korean schoolgirls were killed, and closer to home how the US interfered in our trial of the American punk who vandalised cars, citing caning as "cruel and unusual" punishment? Whats that if not infringing other countries sovereignity and pushing other countries around?
No bad effects now, sure. But the potential is there. -
hmm..i think u better read up ur facts 1st before coming into US defence..seem luike ur trying to enforce ur own view into others...just like USA...Iraq invade Kuwait wif a greenlight frm US..n when Us saw a international repercussion..he turn the table against Iraq..US supported Iraq against Iran..after many years of mayhem..US turn against them..wat a joke...Originally posted by gasband:To be frank, when i said go ahead, it is not that i am indifferent to the situation. But it is a fact that if India insists on using USA as an excuse and go ahead and attack Pakistan, can we really stop them? But as I said, just like Iraq invade Kuwait for pure selfish reasons and got sanctioned, India will have to bear any consequences it any arise.
USA have a history of making unreasonable demands? I dun remember, maybe you can tell me. And even so, what major wrongs came out from that? I wun vouch for the future but so far, i seen no bad aftereffects of whatever USA has been doing.
or shall we tok abt Vietnam? or post 911 Afghanistan? Korean war?
yea..we cant stop India frm attacking pakistan..but if US dun attack Iraq in the 1st place..will India have any excuse to attack Pakistan?
u seen no bad after effects of watever USA have done? i think ur blind...cant u c Iraqi civilian being bomb n killed? to u its onli something far away..to them the Iraqi its so real..u noe wat come out of all tis? HATE!! ur blind to c tat the Arabic pple os condamning tis attack? u noe wat will come out of it? more terrorist!!! open ur eyes dude..wat u reap is wat u sow...live a life not kill it -
And so you believe it hook line and sinker unquestioningly? Ahhh...the innocence of youthOriginally posted by laser51088:some times, going along with what u are fed is rite. . . though there are always loopholes and mistakes in there too, but there must be something useful in it that people often overlook. . .
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So guess you'll prefer to leave Saddam and his team to gas, murder, torture and let the Iraqis live in fear all their lifes......Originally posted by NathanG5:u seen no bad after effects of watever USA have done? i think ur blind...cant u c Iraqi civilian being bomb n killed? to u its onli something far away..to them the Iraqi its so real..u noe wat come out of all tis? HATE!! ur blind to c tat the Arabic pple os condamning tis attack? u noe wat will come out of it? more terrorist!!! open ur eyes dude..wat u reap is wat u sow...live a life not kill it
I believe you can see that a majority of the Iraqis live in fear and terror during Saddam's time. -
blah... if saddam has any bio warfare, u tink USA will wait until one bomb drop in their country and the desease spread like sars like that, u tink they will wait until its too late? use yr brains.
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How the civillians the US have killed up to now and are going to kill will never reach anywhere near the sum Saddam totalled in the egomanicaial hell of his regime. And at least the allies are trying their best NOT to harm civvies, Saddam goes OUT OF HIS WAY to harm them during his reign just to make his backside a little more comfortable in his throne.
If the Arab nations were really concerned for the Iraqis and their brothers and wanted to do something intelligent about it, they should have disposed Saddam themselves rather then wait for some americans to do it. -
I agree. What Saddam & his team did by placing arms, weapons amongst the people was not considerate towards his people at all. Love for iraqis
To hell with him 
Encourage suicide bombers Why not he take the lead by example That would be great -
yea as if u reali saw wats happening in Iraq?Originally posted by Ding:So guess you'll prefer to leave Saddam and his team to gas, murder, torture and let the Iraqis live in fear all their lifes......
I believe you can see that a majority of the Iraqis live in fear and terror during Saddam's time.
so ur there when the gassing start?
y US did not do anything back den? it was more den 2 decade ago when that happen..so y now? so ur tellin me tat Saddam gas his pple onli yesterday eh...n open ur eyes Mr Ding..my eyes is open enuff...y wait till now to overthrow the regime? y not 2 decade ago? -
SO now u confuses me Mr Nathan. R you for or against the war
I'm not there in Iraq and so aren't you. So why raise this point
Justice is served. Better late than not