Hitting targets as far as KL or Ipoh from singapore....
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the question is.... is SAF able to hit those places from the comfort of singapore without the need move into malaysia....
rephrasing it... does SAF have missiles or rockets that have a range in excess of 500km?
personally...i ponder... if it might be possible to integrate LONGSHOT with LALEE....
LONGSHOT can be attached to LALEE.... that will boost LALEE range by 110km.... after which... LONGSHOT can be set for autodetached..... then LALEE engine switch on... and continue the trip....
OR use LALEE to carry multiple ASM or bombs or watever munitions with longshot attachment...
either way.... think we can achieved 500km range or more?
lastly.... i have seen UAVs with rocket boosters to enable them to take off from the back of truck... can LALEE be modified to do the same.?? if yes..... then perhaps LALEE with LONGSHOT bombs could travel with the army and provide CAS as and when needed... without straining the RSAF...
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What's the range of our howitzers?
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Buy a scud missle .. after all , those things are on the market.
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500km or more? not unless u believe in that rumour posted some months ago about Sg showing "interest" in some Russian hardware years ago which happened to be picked up by Aussie intelligence...
still, if u develop Lalee and Firefly properly (proper inertia or GPS guidance systems), i don't think u need Longshot... a bit extra lah... unless u're concerned that SAF won't get access to GPS satellites to use for its guidance systems... if GPS access is not an issue, Longshot will just be excess baggage. i'll rather carry more payload.
besides, not exactly a necessity if u consider that command of the skies will allow u to do almost everything imaginable to them on the ground...
btw, SG FH2000's official range is about 30 km... rocket assisted rounds will give it about 10 km more i think... -
Its official range is 40km .
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hhahha...i almost laugh off my seat when u said 500km.
SAF dont hve any deep strike capability from land....MAF have...ASTROS II..already 90km..plus AV/MT-300----300km
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Hmmm did malaysia have the 90 km version of astro II missiles?Originally posted by Innocent_Malaysian:hhahha...i almost laugh off my seat when u said 500km.
SAF dont hve any deep strike capability from land....MAF have...ASTROS II..already 90km..plus AV/MT-300----300km 
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i wont be surprised if they do have the 90 km range rockets... afterall.. they already have the other stuffs... why stop short??
however... its a fact that eversince malaysia purchased the FH77 VSEL... with 30km range... the entire singapore is already expose to arty fire...
it begs the question... why purchase a 90 km rocket system that fires very expensive rockets (compare to arty shells) to achieve the same effect....
i know that some might claim that the push for the longer range is out of fear of the counter battery power of FH2000 which have a range of 40km... that would... probably nullified MAF's FH77 arty over time... but i wonder... how many more arty could MAF purchase if those money meant for ASTRO2 are all used to purchase th G-5....which have a range better then FH2000...
furthermore... the purchase of A2... would only lead to SAF looking out for weapons that could either counter A2 or surpase A2 in terms of range and firepower...
Since SAF got the money... they wont be short of offers... in fact.. i wont be surprise if the maker of A2 might be one of those lineing outside Bt. Gombak....
ultimately... given time... weapons on both side would advance to a stage where (i believe) it will nullify the benefit of geographical size or strategic depth... as weapons would reach further and further....
weapons would also becomes more and more destructive.. and thus nullifies the advantage of a larger population...
as technology advances...even further... they ultimately narrows the gap between big nations and small nations in millitary capability....
now back to topic.....
IF SAF general tomolo wants to hit KL without sending ships, planes or troops... wat options are available to them??
a LALEE carrying a warhead.... or wat?
Oh... the above are for mere academic disccussion...
forget the stupid notion that A2 will mess SAF up... it aint that simple...like i always say... one weapon dont decide the outcome of a war... if malaysia A2 singapore... we will simply FAE all their major city... see who more mad.... -
i am not at a liberty to discuss this
but trust in the SAF
we have more then u think we have -
Our current known stand off capability is the Longshot , which give us a pretty good range of 110km. With technology to build Firefly , Lalee and Blue Horizon UAV ,it not wise to rule out that we dun design and manufacture Cruisemissile when the SAF have been crazing for force multipliers for decades.Originally posted by whiteillum:i am not at a liberty to discuss this
but trust in the SAF
we have more then u think we have
When the Janes Team interviewed the Israeli counterparts on the Firefly design , they asked very good questions such as wat are the roles of the UAV in SAF. The Israeli Engineers replied that they are for long range , high alttitude recons (?) , other than that , they are not allow to say.
Do you think that Singapore being the richer and more advance party will sit down and say '' Oh , the Malaysian had their Astros2 , we are farked! ''...........? I think everyone shld know the answer........
We must not over armed ourselves , it will create a arm races and in the future lead to something like the overgrowth Soviet Army. We must not create an arm race as being the smaller country , any arm race will first make singapore in a disadvantage position. We must armed ourselve and maybe armed alittle more that our neighbours, if our neighbours will to introduce a new toy in the region , then we will step in to again , armed alittle bit more than them . Slowly by slowly , we build our force not to threaten our neighbours but with some open/closed technology to deter them.
Dun push a lion too much , no where to go , it will fight back hard....... This logic work both ways........ Since Malaysia introduce new forms of weopanary into the region , which directly threatening us , its our turn to show off wat we plan to get and wat we had......when? Let the govt decide. -
more like we have more then every1 thinks we have ahah.Originally posted by whiteillum:i am not at a liberty to discuss this
but trust in the SAF
we have more then u think we have
Anyway i trust the SAF so yea....... -
Originally posted by foxtrout8:
agreeed
Our current known stand off capability is the Longshot , which give us a pretty good range of 110km. With technology to build Firefly , Lalee and Blue Horizon UAV ,it not wise to rule out that we dun design and manufacture Cruisemissile when the SAF have been crazing for force multipliers for decades.
When the Janes Team interviewed the Israeli counterparts on the Firefly design , they asked very good questions such as wat are the roles of the UAV in SAF. The Israeli Engineers replied that they are for long range , high alttitude recons (?) , other than that , [b]they are not allow to say.
Do you think that Singapore being the richer and more advance party will sit down and say '' Oh , the Malaysian had their Astros2 , we are farked! ''...........? I think everyone shld know the answer........
We must not over armed ourselves , it will create a arm races and in the future lead to something like the overgrowth Soviet Army. We must not create an arm race as being the smaller country , any arm race will first make singapore in a disadvantage position. We must armed ourselve and maybe armed alittle more that our neighbours, if our neighbours will to introduce a new toy in the region , then we will step in to again , armed alittle bit more than them . Slowly by slowly , we build our force not to threaten our neighbours but with some open/closed technology to deter them.
Dun push a lion too much , no where to go , it will fight back hard....... This logic work both ways........ Since Malaysia introduce new forms of weopanary into the region , which directly threatening us , its our turn to show off wat we plan to get and wat we had......when? Let the govt decide.[/b] -
Originally posted by foxtrout8:
Yes we should do what the British did to the germans in the years before ww1!
Our current known stand off capability is the Longshot , which give us a pretty good range of 110km. With technology to build Firefly , Lalee and Blue Horizon UAV ,it not wise to rule out that we dun design and manufacture Cruisemissile when the SAF have been crazing for force multipliers for decades.
When the Janes Team interviewed the Israeli counterparts on the Firefly design , they asked very good questions such as wat are the roles of the UAV in SAF. The Israeli Engineers replied that they are for long range , high alttitude recons (?) , other than that , [b]they are not allow to say.
Do you think that Singapore being the richer and more advance party will sit down and say '' Oh , the Malaysian had their Astros2 , we are farked! ''...........? I think everyone shld know the answer........
We must not over armed ourselves , it will create a arm races and in the future lead to something like the overgrowth Soviet Army. We must not create an arm race as being the smaller country , any arm race will first make singapore in a disadvantage position. We must armed ourselve and maybe armed alittle more that our neighbours, if our neighbours will to introduce a new toy in the region , then we will step in to again , armed alittle bit more than them . Slowly by slowly , we build our force not to threaten our neighbours but with some open/closed technology to deter them.
Dun push a lion too much , no where to go , it will fight back hard....... This logic work both ways........ Since Malaysia introduce new forms of weopanary into the region , which directly threatening us , its our turn to show off wat we plan to get and wat we had......when? Let the govt decide.[/b] -
ha ha... bankrupt them with a naval arms race... not likely to work since we don't have THAT big an edge over them in all aspects...Originally posted by |-|05|:Yes we should do what the British did to the germans in the years before ww1!
but if they try to match us plane for plane, i'll laugh my balls off that'll do it... -
What's LALEE & ASM ? What is this Longshot & Firefly?Originally posted by tripwire:the question is.... is SAF able to hit those places from the comfort of singapore without the need move into malaysia....
rephrasing it... does SAF have missiles or rockets that have a range in excess of 500km?
personally...i ponder... if it might be possible to integrate LONGSHOT with LALEE....
LONGSHOT can be attached to LALEE.... that will boost LALEE range by 110km.... after which... LONGSHOT can be set for autodetached..... then LALEE engine switch on... and continue the trip....
OR use LALEE to carry multiple ASM or bombs or watever munitions with longshot attachment...
either way.... think we can achieved 500km range or more?
lastly.... i have seen UAVs with rocket boosters to enable them to take off from the back of truck... can LALEE be modified to do the same.?? if yes..... then perhaps LALEE with LONGSHOT bombs could travel with the army and provide CAS as and when needed... without straining the RSAF...
can anyone enlighten me?
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I've notice Innocent Malaysian always pips up some funky point, which get's immediately crushed by the bare facts... then he goes back to his burrow and sulks until his short term memory forgets the loss and he goes back to bash his head on the wall again...
Just my two cents worth. -
LALEE is a Unmanned Aerial Vehicle that supposed to be used in naval applications.Originally posted by Paladin:What's LALEE & ASM ? What is this Longshot & Firefly?
can anyone enlighten me?
ASM is Anti-ship missile
Longshot is this package u fit to a bomb to give it some range.
Firefly is another UAV for observation -
LALEE is supposed to comeback.. . its a UAV.. . not a cruise missile, though when it gets old and starts dropping out of the sky u can use it as such. Otherwise, it makes more sense to design a dedicated type of cruise missile for use.Originally posted by tripwire:the question is.... is SAF able to hit those places from the comfort of singapore without the need move into malaysia....
rephrasing it... does SAF have missiles or rockets that have a range in excess of 500km?
personally...i ponder... if it might be possible to integrate LONGSHOT with LALEE....
LONGSHOT can be attached to LALEE.... that will boost LALEE range by 110km.... after which... LONGSHOT can be set for autodetached..... then LALEE engine switch on... and continue the trip....
OR use LALEE to carry multiple ASM or bombs or watever munitions with longshot attachment...
either way.... think we can achieved 500km range or more?
lastly.... i have seen UAVs with rocket boosters to enable them to take off from the back of truck... can LALEE be modified to do the same.?? if yes..... then perhaps LALEE with LONGSHOT bombs could travel with the army and provide CAS as and when needed... without straining the RSAF...
Those UAV that can take off from the back of a truck are the very small type used for simple observation duties only, or maybe they can lase a target to guide a LGB in, but thats abt it, i doubt lalee can be launched from back of truck. . .
but this one is pure speculation on my part, I might be wrong. . most likely am -
Not bankrupt them lah we just extend the so called "danger zone" to infinety.The danger zone is the period of time when the weapons that would take the capability of the enemy to a point that the enemy is currently at.Meaning if they get say a top of the line tank that would take them 5 years to field and that would take them to equal and alittle better then us.The 5 years is the danger zone.During that period of time new weapons would develop that would make their weapons old though not outdated.Then we get new 1's.They cannot hope to get a new system every 5 years just to match us!Originally posted by CX:ha ha... bankrupt them with a naval arms race... not likely to work since we don't have THAT big an edge over them in all aspects...
but if they try to match us plane for plane, i'll laugh my balls off that'll do it... -
but i dont think we can afford to change a particular platform once every 5 years as well... it will strain our economy if not teeter it to the brink of collapse...
furthermore... everytime the maharaja's army purchase any " Top of the line stuffs" its always more hype then truth.... and never in the right number...
singapore SAF is a professional force.. we dont purchase out of piq nor out of carelessness... it will be foolish to buy 2 to 3 dozen apache just to counter MAF's pathetic 26 scorpion tanks... suffice to say.. SAF's buildup is not merely based on a single threat, single scenario... SAF is more matured....
unlike the childish MAF... only wanna take in the comfort of their self delusion in its ability to beat SAF because singapore is so much smaller... while turning completely blind and deaf to other bigger power in the region like TNI, thailand, china and india... because they knew and have admitted their incompetance, inability and ineptness in dealing with these powers... they probably will sooner drop their sarongs and bend over whenever these nations come knocking on their doors......
in fact ... most of their equipment purchase... are crap load of joke.... furthermore.. they always buy in so pathetic a small number... it makes one ponder if they really have a monkey as a CDF or wat...
take their hornets for example... its just barely enough in number to form a small aerobatic team (think the US navy aerobatic team got more hornets ) ... and they call that a combat force... *ouch* they must be in dream land.....
furthermore... anyone taking a good look at their ORBAT will be shocked to see a circus or a museum with many types of weapons but never in the right amount... it begs to wonder.... wat the hell is wrong with their CPUs...
Personally... i feel that malaysia's action in weapon purchase is more of a fanfare event then a security consideration... else why the claim to purchase the MIG-29M, then call it the MIG-29N... but in truth.. they got the MIG-29A (vintage stuff)?? -
i don't know about you but from some other forum(www.airforcesmonthly.com), our friends up north think that the migs are world beater.....some sort of state of the art, top of the line stuff.......frankly speaking, i don't think our alot of our friends up north know that they got a second hand plane from the russians............ probably the 'N' gave them a wrong impression........but anyway, if they want to live in a wonderland, so be it, if our friends up north say that their MBT is the most advanced in the region, let them be, if our dear friends say they 'boleh' so be it, if they laugh at our inability to hit target 500km away let them laugh.........lets not get upset over this upmanship thingy.....one must remember that accolades have to be earned not given by oneself.....by the way, when was the last time some foreign armed forces have praised MAF?
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No lah we no need replace every 5 years cuz they need to use their equpiment for long time also mah all we have to do is stay 1 step ahead of them instead of trying to buy everytime something new comes.Originally posted by tripwire:but i dont think we can afford to change a particular platform once every 5 years as well... it will strain our economy if not teeter it to the brink of collapse...
furthermore... everytime the maharaja's army purchase any " Top of the line stuffs" its always more hype then truth.... and never in the right number...
singapore SAF is a professional force.. we dont purchase out of piq nor out of carelessness... it will be foolish to buy 2 to 3 dozen apache just to counter MAF's pathetic 26 scorpion tanks... suffice to say.. SAF's buildup is not merely based on a single threat, single scenario... SAF is more matured....
unlike the childish MAF... only wanna take in the comfort of their self delusion in its ability to beat SAF because singapore is so much smaller... while turning completely blind and deaf to other bigger power in the region like TNI, thailand, china and india... because they knew and have admitted their incompetance, inability and ineptness in dealing with these powers... they probably will sooner drop their sarongs and bend over whenever these nations come knocking on their doors......
in fact ... most of their equipment purchase... are crap load of joke.... furthermore.. they always buy in so pathetic a small number... it makes one ponder if they really have a monkey as a CDF or wat...
take their hornets for example... its just barely enough in number to form a small aerobatic team (think the US navy aerobatic team got more hornets ) ... and they call that a combat force... *ouch* they must be in dream land.....
furthermore... anyone taking a good look at their ORBAT will be shocked to see a circus or a museum with many types of weapons but never in the right amount... it begs to wonder.... wat the hell is wrong with their CPUs...
Personally... i feel that malaysia's action in weapon purchase is more of a fanfare event then a security consideration... else why the claim to purchase the MIG-29M, then call it the MIG-29N... but in truth.. they got the MIG-29A (vintage stuff)?? -
500km is peanuts... thats what the RSAF is for... true, so surface to surface capabilities, but we're not gonna fight THEIR way ANYWAY... u control the air, u are in a better position to control everything below it...Originally posted by kanzer:i don't know about you but from some other forum(www.airforcesmonthly.com), our friends up north think that the migs are world beater.....some sort of state of the art, top of the line stuff.......frankly speaking, i don't think our alot of our friends up north know that they got a second hand plane from the russians............ probably the 'N' gave them a wrong impression........but anyway, if they want to live in a wonderland, so be it, if our friends up north say that their MBT is the most advanced in the region, let them be, if our dear friends say they 'boleh' so be it, if they laugh at our inability to hit target 500km away let them laugh.........lets not get upset over this upmanship thingy.....one must remember that accolades have to be earned not given by oneself.....by the way, when was the last time some foreign armed forces have praised MAF?
so they wanna get into a pissing contest? compare air forces. no contest. -
I think the malaysian motto should not be "truly asia", but rather:
Ego by ignorance
what u think? -
Hmm , i believe thats their slogan for promoting tourism internationally. I dun really see anything wrong with that , as every country will have their slogan as positive as possible to dig big bucks from the tourism bucket.Originally posted by SingaporeTyrannosaur:I think the malaysian motto should not be "truly asia", but rather:
Ego by ignorance
what u think?
''Truely asia'' , the world will see abt that..........