National service and war is pointless.
-
This may not be the first time most of you hear someone whining about enlisting in the military for 2 years but just hear me out because i have some points to make and i hope some of you can counter them and enlighten me instead of giving me a generic response such as asking me to skip it and get a jail sentence or imigrate overseas ( it is not that easy ladies.)
You would most likely been told since young that singapore is weak and that any country would be capable of taking it. So lets think about it , why would another country want singapore in the first place? Sure it has value as a trading post for other countries but if it was taken over , would other nation want to come and trade in it when there are other ports available that are cheaper and hasn't been invaded?
Attacking a small nation like ours would only anger other huge Nation such as USA and the UK and it may escalate into another war which won't be much of a benefit.War only brings proft the weapon manufacturers. Today companies that creates mass supplies of weapons have no competition and they could charge them as high as they could if a war is to start. This is another reason to avoid a war and invading a country like Singapore.
With the discovery of the nucleur bomb , what is the use of sending out men to do the fighting when an atomic detenator is enough to wipe out this entire city much less a battlelion of troopers.Even if all of the men that enlist in NS were to go to war , we are still probably fucking vulnerable just by looking the world map. We are fucking surrounded and if we lost all of our defense post , the battle is as good as over.There isn't a second chance to retake the land.
Defending this country for pride and honor is propaganda created by the government to brainwashed us into thinking fighting for the country for glory is what a singaporean is all about. Why risk our life , dreams ,family for some petty dispute a few politicians can't come to an agreement upon?They send the common folk , poor or rich to defend their ego and all it does is destroy the economy , jobs and lives.In this day and age would anyone living in a 1st world country want to repeat mistakes of the past?
War may be for a good cause , if there is injustice , tyranny and facism it could be worth fighting for but with today history and cultural education plus the invention of the internet , many are coming to see the down side of war and let not the colour of our skins or beliefs seperate us. If we know that war is less profitable and only bring unhappiness , what is the point of all this bullshit with serving your country and dying for it?
War is just young men killing all the other young men that were brainwash into thinking they are fighting for a honorable cause.If that what you want to do it is fine by me , go defend this country without knowing you are being use by the people that run this country i absolutely disagree with how the government force us to enlist in the military or lock us up in a cell should we refuse to join the rest of the herd. It is absolute babaric.
_________________________________________________
I posted this topic recently and it has been moved ,edited and locked by a moderator so that no one can discuss the topic like rational people nor was i able to reedited it. I was upset and i would like to have an explanation of why you are doing this.
It seem that what i heard of how singapore censored other that have disagreement with it policys and are full of imbecile unable to reason with each other without resorting to such junvenille behaviour is true.
-
In every country there is a need of armed forces for security.
It may not be practical, however on the paper, the numbers look good for the investors. It also makes it sound safe to put the money in this place.
When there is a need for men in a disaster, there are forces for mobilization.
The question is the distribution of the men. Regulars versus part-timer. Honestly, how many fat soldiers we can utilize in the times of real need.
Real survival needs versus virtual needs. Securing our own rice bowl against for foreign infestation.
-
Why NS?
NS was introduced in 1967, just 2 years after Singapore’s independence to ensure the peace and stability of our nation.
We are a 'little red dot'.With a population of 4.4 million and a land of 699 square km, Singapore is amongst the 20 smallest countries in the world. Singapore is too small to change the world. Instead, we must adapt as the world changes around us.
Importance of NS
We must be able to defend Singapore ourselves. No one else is responsible for our security and we cannot depend on others to come to our defence.
Our defence is predicated on deterrence. That is why we invest heavily and consistently in building up a strong defence force to provide that deterrence.
At the same time, we seek to be friends with as many countries as possible in the region and beyond. By having friends who can help us in our times of need, we enhance our security.
Need for NS
NS is our only viable option to building up a credible defence force to ensure our survival. A conscription force by law which obliges all eligible people to enlist would create a sizeable standing force ready to guarantee our security.
The SAF maintains itself in a high state of operational readiness at all times so that it is able to react swiftly to any threat.
To meet the defence challenges in the 21st century, the SAF is upgrading and transforming itself into a highly sophisticated, well-integrated fighting force.
The Third Generation SAF will be a network-centric organisation. Our forces will be interconnected, equipped with electronic information systems, and be able to fight cooperatively, and in an integrated manner, on land, in the air and on the sea.
Within the nation itself, the SPF upholds the law and maintains order, keeping the streets safe for family and friends.
And in case of any crisis or emergency, such as a major accident or a terrorist attack, the SCDF will be there to rescue and save the lives of fellow citizens.
All together, the SAF, SPF and SCDF play a key role in Singapore’s Total Defence—Military Defence, Civil Defence, Economic Defence, Social Defence and Psychological Defence.
-
Total Defence (or TD) is the name of Singapore's comprehensive defence strategy, adapted from countries like Denmark, Sweden, Switzerland and Austria.
It is based on the understanding that besides military action, aggressors can also defeat the country by wrecking its economic systems, tearing its social fabric apart, targeting Singaporeans' beliefs and commitment to defence, and its ability to recover from disasters, both natural and man-made.
The Total Defence concept encompasses five key aspects – military, civil, economic, social and psychological defence – and focuses on the need for each Singaporean to play his or her part to defend the nation. These five aspects are very similar to the "4 Defences" of the Austrian "Comprehensive National Defense" (Umfassende Landesverteidigung) strategy of 1975.
The Five Aspects
"Military Defence" consists of the Singapore Armed Forces (SAF), including its citizen soldiers.[1] Their mission is to "enhance Singapore's peace and security through deterrence and diplomacy, and should these fail, to secure a swift and decisive victory over the aggressor". As part of the mission, the SAF strives to maintain a high state of operational readiness 24/7.
"Civil Defence" is about ensuring Singaporeans know what to do in times of an emergency. The Singapore Civil Defence Force (SCDF) supports this aspect of Total Defence. However, if Singapore encounters a nation-wide emergency (e.g.: terrorism act or war), the SCDF will not be able to cope with the demands of the situation. Hence, it is crucial to rope in Singaporeans to help their fellow Singaporeans. To facilitate this, the SCDF recruits and trains civil defence volunteers in first aid, rescue and evacuation procedures, and shelter management.
"Economic Defence" is defined as maintaining the economy of the country and its ability to compete in the world, as well as environmental protection.[1] It also involves helping Singapore (and Singaporeans) stay relevant in the global economy and putting in place economic systems to ensure that the Singapore economy does not collapse in times of crisis.
"Social Defence" is about keeping the social fabric strong and ensuring that Singaporeans live in harmony regardless of race or religion.[1] This is especially important because Singapore is a multi-racial and multi-religious society.
"Psychological Defence" is about loyalty, commitment to Singapore, and having the will power and resilience to overcome challenges.[1] This is the component that would determine if Singaporeans will stay to fight or abandon the country when it is in trouble.
Protecting our way of life
Introduced in 1984, the concept of Total Defence (TD) was adapted from the experiences of countries like Switzerland and Sweden. As a young nation with a small population and a conscript armed forces, we needed to draw on the different strengths and abilities of our community to augment our defence capability.
Conflicts between countries are no longer just military in nature. Potential aggressors and threats can appear in less obvious and non-conventional ways (e.g., destroying social cohesion by exploiting differences in race, language, religion, culture, social or economic class; weakening national resilience by using psychological warfare to play on the people’s fears and apprehensions; or waging economic warfare through economic boycotts, trade sanctions or acts of sabotage to bring down the economy). Total Defence provides the framework for a comprehensive and integrated response to deal with all kinds of threats and challenges. Whether it is a security threat such as global terrorism, or a national crisis like SARS, Total Defence brings together all relevant government agencies, private sector organisations and all Singaporeans in a coordinated effort to deal effectively with these threats and challenges. When Singaporeans take personal responsibility for and get involved in the defence of Singapore, they are playing their part to help keep Singapore safe and secure.
Total Defence has five aspects - Military Defence, Civil Defence, Economic Defence, Social Defence and Psychological Defence. These five aspects represent the key sectors of society. They also help Singaporeans understand how they can be involved. When we take National Service seriously, volunteer in civil defence exercises, help build a strong economy, strengthen community ties with one another regardless of race and religion, and stay committed to defend the country, we are doing something in every sector of our society to strengthen Singapore's resilience as a nation.
The five arrows in the logo represent the five aspects of Total Defence: Military, Civil, Economic, Social and Psychological Defence.
The arrows point in the same upward direction. This signifies concerted effort towards a common objective of safeguarding the progress and future of Singapore.
The logo's outline is significant because:
It is, firstly, the outline of a hand, symbolising action and representing unity and completeness. Total Defence is deficient if any of the five "fingers" is missing.
Secondly, the logo is in the shape of a house, and symbolises Singapore as our homeland. With Total Defence, the security of our homeland is therefore safeguarded.
The tagline "It's personal. Play your part." in its handwritten format emphasises the personal nature of and involvement in Total Defence, reminding Singaporeans that they have a part to play in the defence of Singapore. The rounder edges of the logo give it a softer feel, reflecting the personal stake in Total Defence and encouraging Singaporeans to embrace Total Defence in their daily lives.
The crescent and five stars, and the colours of red and white, are elements from the National Flag. They represent nationhood. Total Defence brings Singaporeans together as one people.
Taken as a whole, the logo symbolises all Singaporeans doing what they can in Total Defence to ensure peace and security for the future.
-
Young Man!!..........
Don't think so much.........just Serve And Forget..........
When you are at my age now, you will feel how nice to be 18 again..........
I still prefer Temasek Green last time..............
-
You don't have a proper army, other countries will take you for granted, start to make trouble etc.
And bluntly speaking, Singapore is a chinese majority country but south east asia is not the original homeland of chinese. We live in a region when other people see chinese as aliens that eat up local businesses, so due to envy and other factors, pogroms and massacres of chinese occur from time to time.
So we can't take security for granted.
13 May incident
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/13_May_incident
1740 Batavia massacre
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1740_Batavia_massacre
Sook Ching massacre
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sook_Ching_massacre
May 1998 riots of Indonesia
-
Originally posted by eac:
Total Defence (or TD) is the name of Singapore's comprehensive defence strategy, adapted from countries like Denmark, Sweden, Switzerland and Austria.
It is based on the understanding that besides military action, aggressors can also defeat the country by wrecking its economic systems, tearing its social fabric apart, targeting Singaporeans' beliefs and commitment to defence, and its ability to recover from disasters, both natural and man-made.
The Total Defence concept encompasses five key aspects – military, civil, economic, social and psychological defence – and focuses on the need for each Singaporean to play his or her part to defend the nation. These five aspects are very similar to the "4 Defences" of the Austrian "Comprehensive National Defense" (Umfassende Landesverteidigung) strategy of 1975.
The Five Aspects
"Military Defence" consists of the Singapore Armed Forces (SAF), including its citizen soldiers.[1] Their mission is to "enhance Singapore's peace and security through deterrence and diplomacy, and should these fail, to secure a swift and decisive victory over the aggressor". As part of the mission, the SAF strives to maintain a high state of operational readiness 24/7.
"Civil Defence" is about ensuring Singaporeans know what to do in times of an emergency. The Singapore Civil Defence Force (SCDF) supports this aspect of Total Defence. However, if Singapore encounters a nation-wide emergency (e.g.: terrorism act or war), the SCDF will not be able to cope with the demands of the situation. Hence, it is crucial to rope in Singaporeans to help their fellow Singaporeans. To facilitate this, the SCDF recruits and trains civil defence volunteers in first aid, rescue and evacuation procedures, and shelter management.
"Economic Defence" is defined as maintaining the economy of the country and its ability to compete in the world, as well as environmental protection.[1] It also involves helping Singapore (and Singaporeans) stay relevant in the global economy and putting in place economic systems to ensure that the Singapore economy does not collapse in times of crisis.
"Social Defence" is about keeping the social fabric strong and ensuring that Singaporeans live in harmony regardless of race or religion.[1] This is especially important because Singapore is a multi-racial and multi-religious society.
"Psychological Defence" is about loyalty, commitment to Singapore, and having the will power and resilience to overcome challenges.[1] This is the component that would determine if Singaporeans will stay to fight or abandon the country when it is in trouble.
Protecting our way of life
Introduced in 1984, the concept of Total Defence (TD) was adapted from the experiences of countries like Switzerland and Sweden. As a young nation with a small population and a conscript armed forces, we needed to draw on the different strengths and abilities of our community to augment our defence capability.
Conflicts between countries are no longer just military in nature. Potential aggressors and threats can appear in less obvious and non-conventional ways (e.g., destroying social cohesion by exploiting differences in race, language, religion, culture, social or economic class; weakening national resilience by using psychological warfare to play on the people’s fears and apprehensions; or waging economic warfare through economic boycotts, trade sanctions or acts of sabotage to bring down the economy). Total Defence provides the framework for a comprehensive and integrated response to deal with all kinds of threats and challenges. Whether it is a security threat such as global terrorism, or a national crisis like SARS, Total Defence brings together all relevant government agencies, private sector organisations and all Singaporeans in a coordinated effort to deal effectively with these threats and challenges. When Singaporeans take personal responsibility for and get involved in the defence of Singapore, they are playing their part to help keep Singapore safe and secure.
Total Defence has five aspects - Military Defence, Civil Defence, Economic Defence, Social Defence and Psychological Defence. These five aspects represent the key sectors of society. They also help Singaporeans understand how they can be involved. When we take National Service seriously, volunteer in civil defence exercises, help build a strong economy, strengthen community ties with one another regardless of race and religion, and stay committed to defend the country, we are doing something in every sector of our society to strengthen Singapore's resilience as a nation.
The five arrows in the logo represent the five aspects of Total Defence: Military, Civil, Economic, Social and Psychological Defence.
The arrows point in the same upward direction. This signifies concerted effort towards a common objective of safeguarding the progress and future of Singapore.
The logo's outline is significant because:
It is, firstly, the outline of a hand, symbolising action and representing unity and completeness. Total Defence is deficient if any of the five "fingers" is missing.
Secondly, the logo is in the shape of a house, and symbolises Singapore as our homeland. With Total Defence, the security of our homeland is therefore safeguarded.
The tagline "It's personal. Play your part." in its handwritten format emphasises the personal nature of and involvement in Total Defence, reminding Singaporeans that they have a part to play in the defence of Singapore. The rounder edges of the logo give it a softer feel, reflecting the personal stake in Total Defence and encouraging Singaporeans to embrace Total Defence in their daily lives.
The crescent and five stars, and the colours of red and white, are elements from the National Flag. They represent nationhood. Total Defence brings Singaporeans together as one people.
Taken as a whole, the logo symbolises all Singaporeans doing what they can in Total Defence to ensure peace and security for the future.why did you edit my post?
-
we need an army bcuz humans are shelfish beings...
Unitl we achieve genuine world peace, it is impossible for any country not to have an army. Still, I agree with you: War is pointless!
National service is needed because we do not have enough population. But two years are too LONG! I know Koreans serve two years too, but there are in a diff circumstances(provocation from the north).
National Service in other countries:
Taiwan = 4 months(2014 onwards), I believe(if not wrong) there are thousands of missiles aimed directly at Taiwan.
Switerland = 5 months
Singapore = 2 years!! WHY?? we are in peace zone, aren't we?
-
Originally posted by Nigho17:
we need an army bcuz humans are shelfish beings...
Unitl we achieve genuine world peace, it is impossible for any country not to have an army. Still, I agree with you: War is pointless!
National service is needed because we do not have enough population. But two years are too LONG! I know Koreans serve two years too, but there are in a diff circumstances(provocation from the north).
National Service in other countries:
Taiwan = 4 months(2014 onwards), I believe(if not wrong) there are thousands of missiles aimed directly at Taiwan.
Switerland = 5 months
Singapore = 2 years!! WHY?? we are in peace zone, aren't we?
Humans are nor selfish beings, they are the most selfless beings by nature. Just that some twats are raised to believe that they have to be selfish in order to 'survive'. Also, our so called army is a defense military, to protect against assholes like terrorists and such. We do not have any way to protect ourselves during a straight out war.
-
are you listening?
-
Originally posted by sgdiehard:
are you listening?
I doubt it. Also, Uraniumfish > salmonfish.
-
Originally posted by Uraniumfish:
I doubt it. Also, Uraniumfish > salmonfish.
No
____________________________________
I went off to bed last night so i wasn't able to response early.Anyway some of you made good points on how a small country like ours need a strong military force.
But i am still not satisfied on how this justify the government to instill fear onto us of getting a felony should we choose to skip it. Aye it true we are selfish creatures , i can't bear the thought of wasting 2 years of my on life on this miserable planet to serve in the army because i rather use it to work on something i love.
even though lee kuan yew policy seems more logical it makes my stomach churn that he gets to decide the life for all us of young male adults without giving us a say in it.
i do not have the leadership ,the time nor the intelligence to convince people to start a riot to change the law ,Most of us are already well adjusted to our way of life to risk getting beat down by a mob of police all for the sake of such a petty disagreement.I should probably just suck it up and do my time like the rest.
That being said even though if a war is to happen i would not join the fight all for the sake of killing my fellow humans and risking my life.
-
Originally posted by Ieatsalmonfish:
No
____________________________________
I went off to bed last night so i wasn't able to response early.Anyway some of you made good points on how a small country like ours need a strong military force.
But i am still not satisfied on how this justify the government to instill fear onto us of getting a felony should we choose to skip it. Aye it true we are selfish creatures , i can't bear the thought of wasting 2 years of my on life on this miserable planet to serve in the army because i rather use it to work on something i love.
even though lee kuan yew policy seems more logical it makes my stomach churn that he gets to decide the life for all us of young male adults without giving us a say in it.
i do not have the leadership ,the time nor the intelligence to convince people to start a riot to change the law ,Most of us are already well adjusted to our way of life to risk getting beat down by a mob of police all for the sake of such a petty disagreement.I should probably just suck it up and do my time like the rest.
That being said even though if a war is to happen i would not join the fight all for the sake of killing my fellow humans and risking my life.
Source: www.mindef.gov.sg/imindef/press_room/official_releases.html
Posted: 15 Oct 2012, 1720 hours (GMT +8)Written Reply by Minister for Defence Dr Ng Eng Hen to Parliamentary Question on National Service Defaulters
Mr Muhamad Faisal Abdul Manap: To ask the Minister for Defence (a) in each of the years from 2006 to 2011 what is the number of National Service defaulters; and (b) of these, how many are (i) resident Singaporeans (ii) overseas Singaporeans and (iii) permanent residents.
Dr Ng Eng Hen: Table 1 shows the breakdown of National Service (NS) defaulter cases from 2006 to 2011. NS defaulters are those who failed to register or enlist for NS, or failed to return after their exit permits expired.
-
Yeah, I think it is a form of discrimination. Fear mongering doesnt work, this is not China. When enlist, I tell you my heart and mind will not be with the SAF, I will always be thinking about those who work for/with me.
-
Originally posted by eac:Source: www.mindef.gov.sg/imindef/press_room/official_releases.html
Posted: 15 Oct 2012, 1720 hours (GMT +8)Written Reply by Minister for Defence Dr Ng Eng Hen to Parliamentary Question on National Service Defaulters
Mr Muhamad Faisal Abdul Manap: To ask the Minister for Defence (a) in each of the years from 2006 to 2011 what is the number of National Service defaulters; and (b) of these, how many are (i) resident Singaporeans (ii) overseas Singaporeans and (iii) permanent residents.
Dr Ng Eng Hen: Table 1 shows the breakdown of National Service (NS) defaulter cases from 2006 to 2011. NS defaulters are those who failed to register or enlist for NS, or failed to return after their exit permits expired.
you still have not answer my question, why did you edit my post? -
Ts, do you know who is Aldora Chong? She claims to be a time traveler.
-
The first poster asks very relevant questions which should be asked from time to time. War is pointless. The point is that not everyone shares that view.
Singapore had zero resources in 1941. Yet by 1942, the Japanese had taken over Singapore, chinese residents were massacred on the beaches. In the 60s, communism had taken hold of Malaya. By the 1970s, communism threatened to overrun south east asia from Indochina to Indonesia. In the last decade, the threat had transformed into an extra-national one with shadow organisations such as JI planning attacks in the little red dot.
To assume that Singapore has nothing to offer is not reality. Singapore is today an economic juggernaut not because someone said so. Singapore port status and geographical position makes it a strategic location where MNCs set up HQs. It sits at the heart of a trade route where 70% of the world's oil traffic passes. If Singapore chokes off the Malaccan straits, 1 billion chinese go without electricity. Do you think the Chinese government dont see that?
Today, the regional threats are diminished not because Singapore has no army but because it has an effective one. It takes many many years of investment and training to build up an effective army. It can take only a year or less (or simply an act of parliament) to eliminate it. Whether NS can sustain Singapore's security in the future is subject to debate. There may be other options to NS. Only Singaporeans can decide how safe Singapore should be. Sure, maybe a little less investment on defence or less time spent on NS may not compromise security...or it may. The young are willing to take more risk. Older folks, maybe not. It may be a tired old phrase but a wrong choice can = no more Singapore.
-
.
-
Originally posted by Ieatsalmonfish:
.
Leatsalmonfish, just serve your NS military service then you will know the meaning of your service to the country. There is no problem just follow whatever you are ordered to do and you will be ok. Good Luck. -
Originally posted by Nigho17:
we need an army bcuz humans are shelfish beings...
Unitl we achieve genuine world peace, it is impossible for any country not to have an army. Still, I agree with you: War is pointless!
National service is needed because we do not have enough population. But two years are too LONG! I know Koreans serve two years too, but there are in a diff circumstances(provocation from the north).
National Service in other countries:
Taiwan = 4 months(2014 onwards), I believe(if not wrong) there are thousands of missiles aimed directly at Taiwan.
Switerland = 5 months
Singapore = 2 years!! WHY?? we are in peace zone, aren't we?
Taiwan going to be part of china soon, so they wind down their NS from 3 years to 4 months.Switerland got free NATO defence umbrella.
Singapore want to remain free and not kowtow to anyone, so 2 year NS.
-
Originally posted by tripwire:
-
"National Service is a waste of time and torture."
I've heard many people say that, but, so what? It is not a waste of time for I am damn sure some things we learn in NS can be applied to life. And you may think it is a torture, but I don't think it is torturous. Somehow, I feel that the need to face the workforce is MUCH MORE torturous. What's so bad about keeping fit in the Army than to face the attitude of your boss everyday. At the same time lazing in the office and turning fat? (Not everyone is like that I know) Suffering from high blood pressure from the stress.
And by the way, I would consider these boys who stated the above as pampered and have no ability to endure hardship. Would be worse when they face the workforce.
For those who say just serve and zao, really haven't learn anything from the two years of valuable experience. Does it matter how long other countries serve? Malaysia serve 3 months do you want to migrate there? For what I know Singapore is the most fair in racial equalities in the region, but also the place where there are the most pampered kids complaining about National Service. Take a look at Isreal, no one is complaining about their 3 years of service and their strict standards. (such as having to carry their rifle wherever they go even when they 'book out') Why are you complaining now?
Personally, I wouldn't want to change the law, rather I hope the government enforce it more strictly. Hate me for all you like, but I will get this straight, without a country, you have no home. Migrate for all you want, but remember what your ancestors had gone through to keep what Singapore is today.
If one day a second Japanese Occupation occurs because people like you is unwilling to serve, how would YOU be able to cope with the guilt? Your family members and relatives all massacred? Think man THINK.
-
if there is no national service?then the officers regulars all ebd up jobless?then they do wad?sell backside???
-
Originally posted by zulkifli mahmood:
Leatsalmonfish, just serve your NS military service then you will know the meaning of your service to the country. There is no problem just follow whatever you are ordered to do and you will be ok. Good Luck.Actually that offers no help to actual citizens of Singapore. I tell you this, someone who has a real job for 2 years instead of doing NS is helping the country much more, as they are responsible for at least something productive. NS is a service to the government, not the country.
-
Originally posted by Uraniumfish:
Actually that offers no help to actual citizens of Singapore. I tell you this, someone who has a real job for 2 years instead of doing NS is helping the country much more, as they are responsible for at least something productive. NS is a service to the government, not the country.
pick up a book on economics 101 and then serve your NS with pride.
