Anti Aircraft Drill
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Was wondering about this drill I learnt in BMT. What exactly does a 5.56 bullet do to an aircraft flying at 350 miles an hour, IF it actually hits?
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hopefully one or two would hit the pilot i guess.Originally posted by Shotgun:Was wondering about this drill I learnt in BMT. What exactly does a 5.56 bullet do to an aircraft flying at 350 miles an hour, IF it actually hits?
if not, getting a hit on the fuel tank seems good enough. -
Hoping that the firing sounds can scare the pilot away maybe?
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Unlikely, the plane is flying at 350 miles n hour, the motion alone would diffuse any penetrating kinetic energy carried by the bullet.
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It will bounce back and hit the idiot who fired the shot.Originally posted by Shotgun:Was wondering about this drill I learnt in BMT. What exactly does a 5.56 bullet do to an aircraft flying at 350 miles an hour, IF it actually hits? -
BTW, Small arms fire is actually quite a major threat to low flying aircraft. Irregardless of the nonsensical responses posted here.
The bullet will penetrate the thin metal of the plane (unless you are armoured like the Apache or a Warthog)... depending on how it hits.
If it hits head on, the energy of the impact will computed via the velocity of plane + horziontal motion of the bullet.
If it's a tail chase hit, the energy will be the instead deducted.
No, stuff that the motion of the plane will diffuse the bullets is nonsense... go tell that to the hundreds of american aviators downed over vietnam via small arms fire. -
Very true since the plane is made up of mostly aluminum which i can tell you is very thin.Heck it's about as thin as the body of car.....and we know how easily a bullet goes through that.But usually AA guns use .50 cal or bigger.The ammo is bigger then your standard rifle.Though a standard rifle is still deadly apart from a short range of around 800mOriginally posted by SingaporeTyrannosaur:BTW, Small arms fire is actually quite a major threat to low flying aircraft. Irregardless of the nonsensical responses posted here.
The bullet will penetrate the thin metal of the plane (unless you are armoured like the Apache or a Warthog)... depending on how it hits.
If it hits head on, the energy of the impact will computed via the velocity of plane + horziontal motion of the bullet.
If it's a tail chase hit, the energy will be the instead deducted.
No, stuff that the motion of the plane will diffuse the bullets is nonsense... go tell that to the hundreds of american aviators downed over vietnam via small arms fire. -
Very much depends on the flying height of the aircraft, when encountering ground fire from small arms weapons - hand guns and semi-automatic rifles.
During the Vietnam War, a few pilots that flew their Phantom jets and HUEY Helicopters too low, were shot by the Vietcongs firing automatic from AK-47 and single shot WW2 rifles.
Some managed to fly wounded but safely back to base, while others crashed into the jungles. -
I think the drill for infantry to fire their rifles at attacking a/c is to distract the pilot and to increase the morale of the ground troops.
When you are firing back, you feel like you are in control of your own destiny instead of doing nothing and waiting for the naplam or cluster bomb. -
My BMT instructor said the drill is not meant for Fighter Jets armed with tonnes of bomb with ALT more than 1000km.
BMT is basic...dun worry you'll learn more in your unit.....
BTW is this suppose to be RESTRICTED?
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Low flying fighter planes had been known to be shotdown by small arms fire before, like in vietnam and the balkan civil wars.Originally posted by Shotgun:Was wondering about this drill I learnt in BMT. What exactly does a 5.56 bullet do to an aircraft flying at 350 miles an hour, IF it actually hits? -
Example an F-16 tasked with CAS. Can a platoon of infantrymen armed with various weapons, from LAWs, M203s, and 5.56 weapons harm the F-16? Okay, no doubt the LAW will do damage, and the M203.
But the 5.56 bullet? Effective range is what, less than 300m. Give a ballistic trajectory... okay maybe x4, 1200m.
Generally, clusterbombs (Choice of weapon against infantry) or other incendiary rounds are dropped between 3000ft to 5000ft. which puts it in the 1000m range.
Honestly, I'd rather freeze, then run like hell. -
The aircraft drill is mostly to be used against helicopters. It is very unlikely for a fast mover to spot infantrymen on the ground. Based on the experience in Iraq, small arms fire is quite deadly to helicopters, since they are easy to hit and have lots of fragile bits. I would not discount the aircraft drill. Of course, it won't save you from an airstrike (the bombs will be coming from way outside your range anyway), but you might get lucky against helos that cross your path.
Note that aircraft do not carry cluster bombs around all the time. If they do they are either on CAS (which means that they will be flying low so as not to accidentally hit their own troops whom you are probably fighting at the same time), or performing an interdiction airstrike (in which case they know you are there and you are finished). I would be more concerned about their cannon, which they always have and will gladly use to strafe you before radioing your position for an airstrike or artillery attack. And their cannon still have longer range than you. Sigh.
I wonder why we do not deploy more MANPAD systems. That would be a lot better, though I do not relish carrying even more weight. There seems to be a direction toward dual-use missile systems, which can attack both ground and air targets, like Starstreak. However, these systems are still too large for individual infantrymen. Maybe in some years time, we will have guided LAWs that double as MANPADs. That would really put some bite into the PBIs (poor bloody infantry). -
Ermh... MANPADs are too heavy to be carried around...Originally posted by dkhoo:The aircraft drill is mostly to be used against helicopters. It is very unlikely for a fast mover to spot infantrymen on the ground. Based on the experience in Iraq, small arms fire is quite deadly to helicopters, since they are easy to hit and have lots of fragile bits. I would not discount the aircraft drill. Of course, it won't save you from an airstrike (the bombs will be coming from way outside your range anyway), but you might get lucky against helos that cross your path.
Note that aircraft do not carry cluster bombs around all the time. If they do they are either on CAS (which means that they will be flying low so as not to accidentally hit their own troops whom you are probably fighting at the same time), or performing an interdiction airstrike (in which case they know you are there and you are finished). I would be more concerned about their cannon, which they always have and will gladly use to strafe you before radioing your position for an airstrike or artillery attack. And their cannon still have longer range than you. Sigh.
I wonder why we do not deploy more MANPAD systems. That would be a lot better, though I do not relish carrying even more weight. There seems to be a direction toward dual-use missile systems, which can attack both ground and air targets, like Starstreak. However, these systems are still too large for individual infantrymen. Maybe in some years time, we will have guided LAWs that double as MANPADs. That would really put some bite into the PBIs (poor bloody infantry).
and anyway if spotted, i think you better find a place to take cover or start to run b'cos ARTY is most likely to come soon.
den about making holes in the aircraft, mmmm... i think the fuel tanks are no longer that vulnerable. i think is the avonics that are most vulnerable...
about bring down an aircraft, it highly possible...
guess what a small bird can do to a plane liao....
maybe we should bring pigeons along... (can be weapon and food)
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hey don't you guys watch macross at all?
the plane can transform into a robot, crash onto the ground at high speedx, tumble around on rocks and knock all the trees off the ground, and still not dent a wing. -
Cannon?? Easy... teach one play dead drill.... the moment the first 20mm impact, all lie down n play dead.
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Actually the drill is simply to create a wall of flying copper coated lead for the aircraft to not coincidently fly into. You try to directly shoot the aircraft is way too chancy.
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BTW is this suppose to be RESTRICTED?
Nah, it's common knowledge in War survival books which are public domain. -
You never watch Star Trek, which explains all this. They have the structural intergrity field and interial dampeners, which is a set of forcefields which renforce the entire ship, allowing it to wistand stresses which would turn all of them to the consistenty of strawberry jam. Afterall, accelerating to 0.5 impulse (1/2 c) in 15 seconds is an acceleration of over 2 million Gees.Originally posted by nismoS132:hey don't you guys watch macross at all?
the plane can transform into a robot, crash onto the ground at high speedx, tumble around on rocks and knock all the trees off the ground, and still not dent a wing. -
actually the macross theory is that they have some kinda nuclear turbine engine that activates and hardens the thin plating to be stronger than even a tank's armor.
but then they still blow up when they get shot at by guns, how the hell is a bullet stronger than crashing into hard granite at high speeds?
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btw, i am a trekkie
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if it really hits, can rapture the aircraft engine/rotor/turbine....etc causing it to tear when they're flying.Originally posted by Shotgun:Was wondering about this drill I learnt in BMT. What exactly does a 5.56 bullet do to an aircraft flying at 350 miles an hour, IF it actually hits? -
Perhaps its really just meant to shoot combat helicopters or helos. Cos it would definitely not kill a fighter, they move too fast, and can't be bothered with infantry anyway. Also, dedicated CAS aircraft tend to be well armored enough to resist such "wall of lead" tactics.
*shrugs*
Play dead still sounds better to me. -
The bullet is destroyed by the impact, but the sheer kenetic energy of the impact also damages the granite...Originally posted by nismoS132:actually the macross theory is that they have some kinda nuclear turbine engine that activates and hardens the thin plating to be stronger than even a tank's armor.
but then they still blow up when they get shot at by guns, how the hell is a bullet stronger than crashing into hard granite at high speeds?
The macross idea sounds like Enterprise's Hull Polarization, before the humans discovered gravitometric shielding, where a powerful EM charge is passed through a special metal alloy to polarize it, increasing it's mechnical strength greatly via the field currents, and allowing it to absorb and redirect energy, lessening the damage done to it by assualts.
Hmm cool... -
As for shooting at CAS planes, it's usually a bad idea unless they already know you are there and are coming after you... besides that, hide!
Anyway now with FLIR, it's impossible to hide. Saw that clip of the American AC-130 using 105mm shells on individual man targets in Afganistan? Reminds you that air superiority makes all the difference here. If we achieve air superiority, we dun have to worry about that and can use our airpower to swat the soldiers of Country M where they hide.