Singapore unit size..
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Unit size and discussion abt SAF strength is considered classified.Originally posted by tvdog:Sorry, what just got deleted?
What is classified that shouldn't be discussed?
Just curious. -
Are u sure so serious one meh?
If that's the case then let's tell the mods to lock this thread and call police. -
MSD= Military Security DepartmentOriginally posted by tvdog:Sorry, what just got deleted?
What is classified that shouldn't be discussed?
Just curious.
What is MSD?
works the same as ISD -
yah and well done.Originally posted by NeonTetra:CLASSIFIED INFO
please do not discuss and reveal such info here. I will not hesitate to info MSD concerning this if it gets out of hand.
To me it consider treason. shoot him. Stup|d fool.
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ya. from wat u posted, i roughly have an idea wat u mean.....
so basically u itching to tell everyone how garang ur unit is rite?
storeman in SOF does indeed is more 'garang' than others, storemen.Originally posted by Joshua1975:Maybe you can read on my other post than you know, I say what I mean.
Hmm... that is all under command of higher HQ, but my have GAZ-UAZ 69 and URAL 375 -
Originally posted by foga:ya. from wat u posted, i roughly have an idea wat u mean.....
so basically u itching to tell everyone how garang ur unit is rite?
storeman in SOF does indeed is more 'garang' than others, storemen.
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national security should not, and must not be compromised in any way. revealing of singapore armed forces divisional/regimental/battalion down to company orbat would have compromised, in one way or another, the strategic information that foreign armed forces would find useful.
with these infor, they ( foreign forces) gain would enable them to make a fair and , more than often, a fairly accurate judgement of SAF and the way the troops would be deployed. important infor such as systems in use, weaponaries, codes, callsigns, operational readiness, modus operandi of our forces would be the 'main course' that they would be most interested in knowing. but wat is revealed in the open, places like on-line forums, fills in the gaps in great details.
eg.
coy size would indicate how, or rather each individual coy/ platoon would/could be deployed in a scenario encapsulated by the enemy.
Bn size/ and weaponaries would give the our enemies a guage whereby wat type of equipment they would be encountering and how individual weapons would be deployed within the BN/Coy/Platoon.
serious or not. i dun know.
how abt this example. there's cases of break-ins in ur estate. i'm sure u wouldn't wanna go around telling everyone what brand ur TV/DVD/Fridge is,where u keep ur gold bars, code for ur safe, where to find ur limited edition of Coke collection, wat period of the day the house is empty, where u keep ur spare keys, wat time ur son/daughter/bro/sis/father/mother goes to work each day.
i know i wouldn't. but remember the word 'integrity'. from the day u were enlisted in the army, u have sworn under the state flag to always remain loyal to the country and people of the Republic of Singapore. keep it in view. cause u and me have a part in the security and defence of our nation. wat u can't protect, does not belongs to you.Originally posted by tvdog:Are u sure so serious one meh?
If that's the case then let's tell the mods to lock this thread and call police. -
x2Originally posted by foga:national security should not, and must not be compromised in any way. revealing of singapore armed forces divisional/regimental/battalion down to company orbat would have compromised, in one way or another, the strategic information that foreign armed forces would find useful.
with these infor, they ( foreign forces) gain would enable them to make a fair and , more than often, a fairly accurate judgement of SAF and the way the troops would be deployed. important infor such as systems in use, weaponaries, codes, callsigns, operational readiness, modus operandi of our forces would be the 'main course' that they would be most interested in knowing. but wat is revealed in the open, places like on-line forums, fills in the gaps in details.
eg.
coy size would indicate how, or rather each individual coy/ platoon would/could be deployed in a scenario encapsulated by the enemy.
Bn size/ and weaponaries would give the our enemies a guage whereby wat type of equipment they would be encountering and how individual weapons would be deployed within the BN/Coy/Platoon.
serious or not. i dun know.
how abt this example. there's cases of break-ins in ur estate. i'm sure u wouldn't wanna go around telling everyone what brand ur TV/DVD/Fridge is,where u keep ur gold bars, code for ur safe, where to find ur limited edition of Coke collection, wat period of the day the house is empty, where u keep ur spare keys, wat time ur son/daughter/bro/sis/father/mother goes to work each day.
i know i wouldn't. but remember the word 'integrity'. from the day u were enlisted in the army, u have sworn under the state flag to always be loyal to the country and people of the Republic of Singapore. keep it in view. caus eu and me have a part in the security of our nation. wat u can't protect, does not belongs to you. -
obviously is atec rite...Originally posted by Joshua1975:no no no, my PL 33 men, 1 section 9 man and 1 Coy has 144.
My coy have CZ-99 9X19mm, M77B1 7.62mmX51, M77B(LMG) 7,62mmX51, M60 rifle grenades, M84(GPMG) 7.62mmX54, NSV 12.7mm(HMG), M70 60mm mortar, M69A 82mm mortar, RPG-22 80mm, RPG-16 58.3mm, SPG-9 73mm.
My company had taken on all unit in the SAF.
Know what unit is that? Does it look like yours?
Btw, I dun think any one will tell you how many men in a SAF unit. -
Agreed.Security comes first.
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While I agree that national security MUST NOT be compromised, I feel that there is no need to over-react.
I think we have under-estimated our foreign military intelligence counterparts if they still need common soldiers like us to "fill in the gaps".
I'm sure the rough ORBAT or SAFTOE is available in existing military literature like Jane or even Huxley's books. And come on lah, it should be quite common knowledge OCS accepts foreign cadets, even from not-so-friendly countries like Malaysia.
If a cadet from Royal Malaysian Army can get commissioned, and we can participate in bilateral exercises with them, I don't think they still us to tell them the section/platoon/company size and the weapon/equipment we use. -
[quote]Originally posted by Icemoon:
While I agree that national security MUST NOT be compromised, I feel that there is no need to over-react.
like i said, security should and must not be compromised.
and u understand that very well too. which is good.
but one should never take chances with national security issues.
that's problem with majority of us singaporean guys. we serve NS, we get in touch with operational equipment, participate in operational exercises, handle operational informations. to us, they r like duties and part and parcel of NS life. but to those who had never served in the force, the details can be overwhelming.
over-react? would wanna play it on ur hand when things get , well, out of hand?
I think we have under-estimated our foreign military intelligence counterparts if they still need common soldiers like us to "fill in the gaps".
to u the infor u leak might seem unsubstantial. but to them, depending on the type of infor they are looking at( it could be strategic infor like weapon type, actual capabilities,equipment performances, pros and cons of our equipment....) they could could form the important missing pieces which would enable them to make a better judgement on us. so why take the risk? being complacent is not sin, neither is it a crime. it's an option and it's a choice.
I'm sure the rough ORBAT or SAFTOE is available in existing military literature like Jane or even Huxley's books. And come on lah, it should be quite common knowledge OCS accepts foreign cadets, even from not-so-friendly countries like Malaysia.
first and foremost, i would like to add that malaysia is our very close neighbour. and i believe i didn't generalised the identity of our presummed enemy to be malaysia.
but we should never under-estimate the potential of our friendly neighbours and at the same time expose ourselves to our potential enemies by our own people,.
like i said, thanks to us, they would would come around and gather infor to number 1, counter gauge their infor from overt sources, number 2, to fill in the details which they misses out on. and security isn't a computer game in which if failed in a mission, u could always go back the last saved position/mode. national security concerns u and me and everyone else tat something to us. would u wanna take the chance in helping the enemies?
If a cadet from Royal Malaysian Army can get commissioned, and we can participate in bilateral exercises with them, I don't think they still us to tell them the section/platoon/company size and the weapon/equipment we use.
OCS is training school for christ sake.
infor pertaining to the operational units are very different from OCS or SISPEC for that matter. and if i'm not wrong, it's been quite a number of years since we last had any joint ex with malaysia. however under the FPDA framework, tat i'm not too sure.
for example when country A purchase a new ATGM, wat is available on the overt sources pertaining to the total acquistion , how they would be deployed, which units the weapon would be deployed , is very limited. however thanks to a batch of 'kind souls' , we are able to seek a more, wider perspective on the relevant details. accurate or, at least we would have something substaintial to work on in the acquistion of more important infor . -
Regiments are not battalions. Here, all infantry battalions are part of the Singapore Infantry Regiment family. The formal name during ceremonial parades, for example, is 544th Battalion, Singapore Infantry Regiment. There is only one Singapore Infantry Regiment, consisting of many infantry battalions.Originally posted by tvdog:SAF regiments are actually battalions.
Let's say you are in 544th Singapore Infantry Regiment but it is actually only a battalion. And the HQ is called battalion HQ and the CO is the Battalion Commander.
Confusing, right?
Actually does anyone know the difference between a battalion and a regiment? or is it just semantics - different word same meaning.
The regiment can be a family of battalions, based on history, function, formation, training, etc, etc.
In Singapore, its just a grouping of the infantry formation, for training, doctrine, etc.
Battalions from the regiment are distributed across brigades and divisions for operational purposes.
Other examples - the Royal Malay Regiment in Malaysia, consists of only Malay soldiers. The regiment contains battalions of infantry, mechanised infantry and airborne infantry. For ceremonial purposes - they use their own unique number 1 uniform during parades. Also, for operational purposes, the various battalions of the Royal Malay Regiment are distributed across brigades and divisions.
The Royal Ranger Regiment in Malaysia, also consists of infantry, mechanised infantry and airborne infantry battalions. The regiment takes its name from some historical unit during the British times. If I'm not mistaken - the Royal Ranger Regiment accepts non-Malays within its ranks. Again, for operational purposes, the various battalions are distributed across brigades and divisions.
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/india/rgt.htm Regiments and battalions in the Indian Army explained.
In any case, Singapore's military consists of mostly conscripts and focus is mostly on vocation/skills training only. All the ceremonial formalities and military organisation is often ignored, and nobody bothers anyway. -
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Sorry..didn't know discussing such things are considered classified. Forget about this thread then..
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Originally posted by TVaddict:obviously is atec rite...
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They are not classified but on a need to know basis. Some of them were just over reacting on this issue, however lets bear in mind that national security is always important.Originally posted by Jazzswing:Sorry..didn't know discussing such things are considered classified. Forget about this thread then..
Jazzswing, i will recommend that you ask any of your peers whom had served the army, it will be more convenient for anyone to tell you such information in private then in the public domain. -
Bah!keep typing nothing seem to appear. Ignore this post...
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I think I understand...Originally posted by bcoy:Regiments are not battalions. Here, all infantry battalions are part of the Singapore Infantry Regiment family. The formal name during ceremonial parades, for example, is 544th Battalion, Singapore Infantry Regiment. There is only one Singapore Infantry Regiment, consisting of many infantry battalions.
The regiment can be a family of battalions, based on history, function, formation, training, etc, etc.
In Singapore, its just a grouping of the infantry formation, for training, doctrine, etc.
Battalions from the regiment are distributed across brigades and divisions for operational purposes. -
Was reading on attrition rates on divisions/battalions during sustained combat and it just hit me. Argh, nvm.Originally posted by foxtrout8:They are not classified but on a need to know basis. Some of them were just over reacting on this issue, however lets bear in mind that national security is always important.
Jazzswing, i will recommend that you ask any of your peers whom had served the army, it will be more convenient for anyone to tell you such information in private then in the public domain.