Stop bashing MiG fighters please...
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Mig fighter have a very poor combat record because their usually third world countries's pilots are poorly-trained as compare to their western counterparts. Never assumed Soviet fighters are a piece of joke, when manned by well-trained pilots it can be as dangerous as the technically best fighter field by the west. This senario can be the same as with RMAF. Finally we have yet to see Soviet MiG-29 Versus American F-18 yet.
Look at this MIG-21 figther
shot down this F-14 Tomcat
during the Iranian War in 1983, just see one of the best fighter jet of the Western airforce manned by a lousy pilot can get shot down by a decade old fighters. In my opinion, great pilots realy matters
I once read that in a exercise between Malaysian Air force and Australian Air Force, a RMAF MiG-29 successfully engaged and "shot down" the RAAF F-18(If i'm not wrong, or maybe a F-15) this should be a worry for RSAF. -
that one is bullshit one lah.... all the RMAF MIG-29 did was SIMULATING AMRAAMSKI firing and shouted FOX-3 first only mah..... like that also count as kill meh?Originally posted by Caesar95:I once read that in a exercise between Malaysian Air force and Australian Air Force, a RMAF MiG-29 successfully engaged and "shot down" the RAAF F-18(If i'm not wrong, or maybe a F-15) this should be a worry for RSAF.
nothing was fired at all except empty air!.... they dont even have AMRAAMSKI in their inventory!......
ask them go fly kite lah..... -
Haha..caesar..
IRAQIs CLAIM their MIG-21 shot down a F-14 Tomcat.
Do you not get it?
That means it was not officially proven.
dumb -
Mig fighter have a very poor combat record because their usually third world countries's pilots are poorly-trained as compare to their western counterparts. Never assumed Soviet fighters are a piece of joke, when manned by well-trained pilots it can be as dangerous as the technically best fighter field by the west. This senario can be the same as with RMAF. Finally we have yet to see Soviet MiG-29 Versus American F-18 yet.
Can you quote someone credible here whom say that soviet fighters are a piece of joke?I once read that in a exercise between Malaysian Air force and Australian Air Force, a RMAF MiG-29 successfully engaged and "shot down" the RAAF F-18(If i'm not wrong, or maybe a F-15) this should be a worry for RSAF.
The RAAF vs RMAF is by hearsay without solid evidence in the public domain to support it, however in the public-government domain, the British had released information that their Harrier|| manage to trash the MiG-29 in BVR combat.
So is it fair for me to say that our F-16D with the APG-68v9 (better than the Blue Vixen) have advantage over the MiGs? So it is not about under estimating our opponent but you shouldnt be paranoid about it. -
Nobody is bashing the MIG. It has prove itself in Vietnam War! That is Mig-21,now is Mig-29.I think it has no problem to handle US F-18 and F-16 as what other say it all depends on the pilot and the system! A 50/50 chance.
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i believe in close dogfight MiG will win F-16 & F-18.
but F-16 F18 is base on the whole fighting system.they will prevent not to dogfight with MiG..they will use their super long range missile to hit MiG from damn far away. -
Why in close dogfight the MiGs will win against the F-16 and F-18?Originally posted by paperduck:i believe in close dogfight MiG will win F-16 & F-18. -
F-16 and F-18 r specially design to engage in dogfight too! F-16 is regarded as the best dogfight presently.By the way,it is mismatched to compare F-16/F-18 against Mig 21. The Mig-21 is 3 decades behind the F-16 and F-18!Originally posted by paperduck:i believe in close dogfight MiG will win F-16 & F-18.
but F-16 F18 is base on the whole fighting system.they will prevent not to dogfight with MiG..they will use their super long range missile to hit MiG from damn far away. -
looks like pple created f-16.net for nothing!
should have created mig-29.net
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Well hahaha believed it or not if u read carefully i was saying the MiG-21 SHOT DOWN the F-18 in a dogfight in the Iranian war! I use this to prove that quality of pilots really mattersOriginally posted by zenden9:F-16 and F-18 r specially design to engage in dogfight too! F-16 is regarded as the best dogfight presently.By the way,it is mismatched to compare F-16/F-18 against Mig 21. The Mig-21 is 3 decades behind the F-16 and F-18! -
Yes it is officially proven, Iraqi MiG-21 shot down F-18 manned by the Islamic Repblic of Iranian air forceOriginally posted by SibeiSuayKia:Haha..caesar..
IRAQIs CLAIM their MIG-21 shot down a F-14 Tomcat.
Do you not get it?
That means it was not officially proven.
dumb
"As for the F-14s, only a small number were ever airworthy at any given time (generally 10 to 20) and these were typically kept out of combat. They were most often used as airborne early warning platforms owing to the design's powerful radar, and were therefore deemed too valuable to risk in air-to-air combat. In this role, the planes were sometimes defended by F-4E and F-5E fighters. At least some F-14s were lost in action, but the claims of the two sides are in poor agreement, as is always the case in warfare. Iraq claims some 11 kills:
21 November 1982: F-14 shot down by a Mirage F1EQ
March 1983: F-14 shot down by a MiG-21
11 September 1983: 2 F-14s shot down while attempting to intercept Iraqi aircraft
4 October 1983: F-14 shot down in a dogfight
21 November 1983: F-14 lost during air battle over Bahragan
24 February 1984: F-14 lost
1 July 1984: F-14 lost
11 August 1984: 3 F-14s shot down
Meanwhile, Iran claims that the F-14 accounted for 35 to 45 kills against the Iraqi Air Force for only one shot down. Iran has admitted to up to 12 further losses, but claims they all resulted from engine stall during dogfights rather than enemy fire. Though the claims of neither side have been verified, F-14s are known to have accounted for 3 air-to-air kills against Iraqi aircraft, including two Mirage F1s and a MiG-21. Western estimates for the true kill-loss ratio attained by the F-14 during the conflict credit 4 kills against 4 or 5 losses. " -
I understand many of u feel skeptical of it, just like me when i first read this article...unbelievable kill!
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So it is F-18 or F-14? U one time say F-14 then later F-14...., very confusing one leh...Originally posted by Caesar95:Well hahaha believed it or not if u read carefully i was saying the MiG-21 SHOT DOWN the F-18 in a dogfight in the Iranian war! I use this to prove that quality of pilots really matters -
F-14 is the Iranian one, F-18 is the Aussie plane, yeah
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Caesar95 sounds like lying! By the way,Iranian F-14 r really badly maintain at that time! After the Islamic revolution,the US ban all comtacts with Iran.Iran has no spare part for their F-14.I will not be surprised if their F-14 is shot down by Mig-21!Originally posted by foxtrout8:So it is F-18 or F-14? U one time say F-14 then later F-14...., very confusing one leh...
A better example to judge shall be the Libya 1982 aerial war. The Mig-23 were shot down by the F-14 without any loss! F-14 is far more superior than Mig-23. -
Since he is just saying his opinion, he is not lying. It is just that he is confused by his own words.Originally posted by zenden9:Caesar95 sounds like lying! -
how many times must i say..
it's like impossible for MIG-21 to shoot down a f-14/f-18 jet..
unless the pilot purposely wanna be shot down -
I think MIGs are really impressive jets, the do give western fighter a run for their money. However, in air-fighting, there is a lot of other factors, not just looking at the jet performance and compare which is better and which is worst.Originally posted by SibeiSuayKia:how many times must i say..
it's like impossible for MIG-21 to shoot down a f-14/f-18 jet..
unless the pilot purposely wanna be shot down
Also in war, there is no absolute, even a MIG-21 if able to get a F-14/F-18 to get into a dog-fight and tight turn, within combat enevelop that bring out the best of the Mig-21 and disadvantage of F-14/F-18. Also who knows, a mistake may be make and why not a combination of factors may still see Mig-21 win.
How could refurbished Russian MiG-21 jets even be a threat to American fighters? "When you stuff them full of Israeli electronics, multi-function [air-to-air] radar, and a helmet-mounted sight for cueing its Python-3 missiles," said a Defense Tech pal in the USAF.
AND MORE: Air power's dirty little secret is that the airframe pretty much doesn't matter these days," says Defense Tech reader JA. What it does is "provide mounting points for weapons, sensors and engine(s). The MiG-21's airframe is quite sufficient for acting as a placeholder for state of the art toys. To my way of thinking the USAF's Fighter Mafia has never made the case for the need for either the (A)/F-22 or A/(F)-35. Rumsfeld's failing has been in not bringing these overeducated idiots to heel."
A soldier must remember, anyone with a gun is dangerous, he can have a lousy gun, and does not know how to shot well, but he just have to be lucky. -
i honestly thing the SU's are better
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A soldier can have a lousy gun ..does not shoot well..Originally posted by storywolf:I think MIGs are really impressive jets, the do give western fighter a run for their money. However, in air-fighting, there is a lot of other factors, not just looking at the jet performance and compare which is better and which is worst.
Also in war, there is no absolute, even a MIG-21 if able to get a F-14/F-18 to get into a dog-fight and tight turn, within combat enevelop that bring out the best of the Mig-21 and disadvantage of F-14/F-18. Also who knows, a mistake may be make and why not a combination of factors may still see Mig-21 win.
How could refurbished Russian MiG-21 jets even be a threat to American fighters? "When you stuff them full of Israeli electronics, multi-function [air-to-air] radar, and a helmet-mounted sight for cueing its Python-3 missiles," said a Defense Tech pal in the USAF.
AND MORE: Air power's dirty little secret is that the airframe pretty much doesn't matter these days," says Defense Tech reader JA. What it does is "provide mounting points for weapons, sensors and engine(s). The MiG-21's airframe is quite sufficient for acting as a placeholder for state of the art toys. To my way of thinking the USAF's Fighter Mafia has never made the case for the need for either the (A)/F-22 or A/(F)-35. Rumsfeld's failing has been in not bringing these overeducated idiots to heel."
A soldier must remember, anyone with a gun is dangerous, he can have a lousy gun, and does not know how to shot well, but he just have to be lucky.
how can he match up against robocop who seems to be better 99% of the time? -
SBSK, like you say it seem to be better 99% . But what if robocop is so unluck that that 1% happen !!! Strike 4D !Originally posted by SibeiSuayKia:A soldier can have a lousy gun ..does not shoot well..
how can he match up against robocop who seems to be better 99% of the time? -
As mentioned before, the pilot's experience & training is just as vital as the quality of the fighter jet. To say that MIG-29 will surely lose to F-16, is just as inaccurate as saying that F-16 will surely lose to MIG-29 in close quarters.
We buy what we feel is most suitable for us, end of story. Surely we are not gonna ape M'sia & buy whatever they buy just 'cos we fear that their stuff is better are we?
And besides, there is no sure way of declaring which fighter is better. Yes, the F-15 has had great success, but it would be inaccurate to label it the best fighter jet in the world. Similarly, the MIG-21 (nicknamed the flying coffin) has had the dubious honour of crashing tons of times (just asking the Indian air force), but that doesn't necessarily mean its the lousiest fighter jet.
So what if M'sia MIG 29 supposedly "shot down" a RAAF F-18 in an exercise? Does that immediately prove that S'pore is in deep shit 'cos our F-16s are no match for MIG 29s? I think not!! -
actually right.. i think the best aeroplane can be found in primary school classrooms.. u know u use a4 paper and fold one.. den put toothpick as the nose of the plane?
damn power one