Malaysian opinions on Defending the Lion City
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Firstly, Singaporean Main Battle Tanks travelling along our highways? Which Main Battle Tanks? Singapore has none. Unless you consider their 120 1960s Centurion tanks
all i can say is 120 centurion tanks and 350 AMX-13 Light tank are still better then someone who only have 26 scorpion light tanks
or their 350 AMX 13 light tanks a challenge for Malaysia's Polish MBTs.
Malaysian polish MBT??? where har? OH..... in POLAND!! wait... are they sure they are really getting those tanks? how come so long liow.. no hear when delivery date is har? not even an estimation!! ahahhahaahaha.....until then... i think they have to rely on their 26 scorpion
MBTs obviously would not travel along highways due to their weight which would no be supported and the speed restrictions of track bound vehicles, unless of course you load them on tank transporters, of which again Singapore has a meagre number of.
hahahahahaaha...... this is rich joke MBT would not travel along highways due to thier weight which would not be supported??? hahahahahahahahahahaahhahaaa.... but then the same road can support the weight of a MBT ontop of a tank transporter??? either this guy must be a failure in physics and maths OR their tank transporter got anti-gravity power!!
speed restriction of track bound vehicles?? what he talking har? wheel vehicle got no speed restriction?
Huxley can throw in the Primus and the Bionix for all he cares, but i doubt these will make a decisive change in the outcome of a land battle fought in the oil palm estates of Labis.
waaa.... hahahahahahaa........ i didnt know that malaysian OIL PALM estate is so power that they can negate the firepower of our PRIMUS and BIONIX by a mere stroke of a pen!
A torrent of armoured vehicles? The US's 6,000 MBTs are a torrent. Russia's 40,000 MBT's are a torrent. Heck, even Israel's 1,ooo plus can be considered more than a fart. The Singaporean torrent? Of what? M113's?
no lah.... i prefer the torrents of LSV and SPIDER armed with SPIKE, SAM, AGL40, 0.5calHMG and dozens of other deadly stuffs.
Striking the KL Tower and the Petronas Twin Tower you say? Obviously Mr. Huxley has forgotten that KL lies over 400 Km away from the nearest Singaporean military installation,
400km not very far at all.... a mere 10 hour trip on a vehicle at 40km/hr or 5 hour trip on a vehicle at 80km/hr.
singaporeans driving along the NS highway has been known to drive at nearly twice that speed, reaching KL in under 3 hours!! and now, how fast does an F-16 falcon travel?
even at subsonic speed... an F-16 speed is 1080km/hr... a distance of 400km would take only 22 minutes! at supersonic... of mach 2 it will take only 10 minutes for an F-16 with FAE to reach KL! while it takes more then 20 minutes for all people to evacuate the petronas tower!! 
whereas Singapore itself, which is ever denser than KL and not to mention other Malaysian towns is easily within reach of Malaysian artillery and MLRS Astros. You bomb the towers or the tower and we turn your cities into a sea of red kiasu blood.
sorry chap... but we got more artillery then malaysia... and we got ICM aka metal rain.... our arty outrange yours... and your astros wont even survive our airstrike!
Taking out the national power grid. I'd love to understand how Singapore's 56 F-16s and soon to be mothballed A4s (of which Malaysia chose to dump 88 of many years ago) can wreak havoc all over Malaysia.
Airstrike...... enuff said....
I am also interested to know how Mr. Huxley would like to explain the Singaporeans annihilating the 3rd Division in Johor. Perhaps they have employed some of Tom Clancy and Dale Hardy's wonderful wondrous weapons that were featured in "The bear and the dragon" and their other fantasy adventures of American military might.
I got an idea..... since malaysia has been so kind to place alot of the major military camp in JOHOR.... we could FAE all those camps within afew minutes flight from singapore.
Next, our FA/18s in Butterworth, over 800kms away from the nearest Singaporean airbase will somehow be lined up at dawn on the runways,
waiting for Singaporean bombs to fall on them and turn them into twisting burning hulks hulks of burnt metal.
distance is never a protection in present days, and even if you could launch those hornets before our falcons can reach butterworth, those hornets with sparrows are mere flying coffins when pit against our falcons with AMRAAM.
Sure, our radar operators would be asleep by then, all over the country and those pesky Singaporeans have no doubt been able to turn their F-16s into stealth platforms, perhaps stealing some of those nice coatings from their Lafayette class ships.
no lah stupid.... the F-16 can use NOE since malaysia got no AWAC and what is so great about a mere 8 hornet?? only 8 leh... you think 800 har?
Ditto too for our MIG-29s in Kuantan, all lined up and waiting for Mr. Kiasu to bomb the living day lights out of them at 6 in the morning.
Kuantan not very far... i think an F-16 on mach 2 should be able to reach kuantan in 7.3 minutes... and if the falcon goes on NOE for the first 100km... heheheehehee.... bye bye fulcrum.....
What of our anti aircraft forces? Those blokes manning the Jenas, IGLAs, Starbursts etc. Sleeping perhaps,
no lah.... they very alert.. but those missiles are SHORADS and VSHORADs... they also suffer from altitude limitation as well as range limitations.... against our falcons... they wont even have a chance to shoot....
after all Mr. Huxley is of the impression that 120,000 Malaysian men in the military spend their days and nights sleeping away and limbo rocking at the nearest dangdut hangouts.
120,000?? then east malaysia and north peninsula malaysia plus the thoudsands of miles of coast will be left undefended lor....hahahaha
i cut out the stupid joke....
Huxley's believe that Singapore's conscripted reservists, many of whom have no battle experience and Singapore's virtually zero history of warfare experience will somehow rise to the occasion and conquer the southern portion of a country that is 6 times it size in population count is a joke.
sorry.... the entire peninsula malaysia population is not even 5 times the population of singapore... so how could the southern portion of peninsula malaysia have 6 times more population then singapore? cant count har?
Truly, a kiasu sick whiteman, who wants nothing but to sell some tree bark down south.
well... at least someone also bought the tree bark up north... -
Actually TUDM's F-18 can't reponse fast, almost 700km to get to Singapore... Got problems... Furthermore, their plane to our plane is 42: 145
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As above.Originally posted by tripwire:Your post is too long lah. -
while i am confident of our defence capability i read this with a little interest and do not dismiss it outright.We should never over estimate ourselves.
Though we do have certain stuff that is so secret that it aint even leaked out -
Only thing is to upgrade our capability.Originally posted by |-|05|:while i am confident of our defence capability i read this with a little interest and do not dismiss it outright.We should never over estimate ourselves.
Though we do have certain stuff that is so secret that it aint even leaked out -
that we are doing....that we most certainly are doing.Besides like some 1 said before....our Centrurions are all retired liao....Originally posted by sbst275:Only thing is to upgrade our capability. -
Really???Originally posted by |-|05|:that we are doing....that we most certainly are doing.Besides like some 1 said before....our Centrurions are all retired liao.... -
well last time there was abit of discussion about that.And 1 guy blurted that out.Since then some of us have learnt things.sadly we will most likely never heard offcial word or a leaked word for a long time to come.Maybe in 10 years something might get out....maybe...Originally posted by sbst275:Really???
oh and mods....me saying this is ok right? -
But MBT are not suitable if a war w Malaysia breaks as they are mountainousOriginally posted by |-|05|:well last time there was abit of discussion about that.And 1 guy blurted that out.Since then some of us have learnt things.sadly we will most likely never heard offcial word or a leaked word for a long time to come.Maybe in 10 years something might get out....maybe... -
maybe......maybe not.....Originally posted by sbst275:But MBT are not suitable if a war w Malaysia breaks as they are mountainous -
Huxley should write about the malaysian armed forces then.
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Later he kena whack for being biasOriginally posted by RussianPower:Huxley should write about the malaysian armed forces then. -
why should be afraid? he's an academician, not a singaporean politician.
you've never been whacked by an examiner on your thesis before? huxley should be no stranger to that.Originally posted by sbst275:Later he kena whack for being bias -
Lol, tripwire sure has a way of arguing.
Its never good to be underestimating the opposition, even if you're confident of your own capabilities.
Not that I'm proud of what that book was about but if Mr Huxley felt that there's substance to write about something he'd have done that by now. -
omg , wonder what he will write on the MAF..
the only thing..he can say is prolly
"You call that a Armed Forces??"
Our few hundred + A4-SU , which we have junked..is the same as AE86..
once modified with turbo engine and super radar might also work well
Guess those m'sia dudes don't watch singapore national day and see how powerful the bomb burst formation is..
Taking into account 3 F-16 in proportion to 5 A4-SU...
Aniwae , MIG-29 may be good , but leh , Singapore Armed Forces is trained to fight Enemies from all sides, we singaporeans do take WAR seriously , cause we wanna fight for our lives and our families..
And what do u all fight for?
Tell you what, We SG are small and we have been eying your land for a long time ^^
Guess we gonna take over some m'sia land...to hold as a buffer zone..
(With our economic power , as a financial hub , i think we got alot of power to make m'sia slip into a financial crisis by selling away the riggit reserves
and manipulating with economics)
So , in any way , don't play around...
Hinting to you all ..we got MUCH MORE F-16s , then all your MIGS,SU-30 and F/A-18 combined..
SAF is built to withstand damage and from 2 sides , both sides should exercise restraint though , I still don't see why Singapore , which is trained by a country which survived so many wars and holocaust ,and intergrating the war elements, with cutting and leading edge technology can't beat a country with a much larger population
And btw, our F-16 C/D aren't the F-16 C/D you see, it has Elbrit and IAI modifications and help , also with the aid of ST AeroSpace...
Its similar with the same analogy as malaysia buys a proton perdana v6
singapore uses a mitsubishi evolution which we bought , only thing different is we add a ferrari engine inside. -
If we really fight a war, there will be no winners. Both will be losers.
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Hence the importance of diplomacy in our defence context but some people just cannot accept this fact.Originally posted by paperchicken:If we really fight a war, there will be no winners. Both will be losers. -
To be honest, nothing interesting to write about unless he want to write some sarcasm!Originally posted by RussianPower:Huxley should write about the malaysian armed forces then.
For example in the early 80's , MY decided to build up a mechanized forces( after more than 10 years since we have our mechannized forces), so they ordered & bought Sibmas 6x6 wheeled & Condor 4x4 wheeled APC for the main mechanized forces and a small amount of Scorpion and Stomer for recon role in the same time frame.
The Scorpion and Stomer are ok but the Sibmas & Condor were bad buys, the reason is that both veh are wheeled which has a very high ground pressure which will be easily mired in our tropical rain forest. In fact, the Condor was so bad that it was reported that it could only operate in limited way by MAF!!!!
Now the next bad buy, the A-4. They bought 88 2nd hand upgraded A-4 from the US surplus stock and delivery started in 1985.
This was heavily critcised by some military analyst as a bad buy becos it was considered to have a limited useful lifespan for the A-4 .
Three years after the deliveries the A-4, TUDM anounced in 1989 that they were going to withdraw from service and replaced by British Aerospace Hawk Mk 298s in late 1994 with less than 9 years of svc.
In fact , some of the upgraded A-4 after delivered were never sent back to MY but stored in US and were later scrapped !!!!
Next bad decision is of course the zoo collection of TUDM, Mig29, 8 F/A-18 & Hawks that were bought at the same time.
This was also heavily critcised by some military analyst becos of the small number of three type of a/c which created such a logistic nightmares for TUDM which in fact most of Mig-29 were grounded due to spares shortage in the first few years of svc.
Even now , the Mig 29 is still have bad availability record becos of the short lifespan of the russian engines.
Now they are adding more a/c type into the force namely SU-30 and the return of F-5, that means they will be operating five type of fighters b4 the end of the decade, the zoo is expanding !!!!
Next is of course the Condor replacement, they bought 110 KIFV from South Korean for UN operation. Then they bought 211 Nurol ACV-300 from Turkey.
Both KIFV & ACV-300 are variant of UDLP(formerly FMC) AIFV, upgraded variant of M113. They look the same but both type are using different powerpack. the ACV-300 uses US powerpack whereas the KIFV uses German powerpack!! Another logistics nightmare!!!!
Next is the MBT selection, two of the shortlisted were the Ukraine T-84 and the Polish PT-91.
Among the two, T-84 is of course a better MBT, T-84 is the upgraded T-80UD of USSR, the PT-91 is upgraded "Monkey" model T-72M1.
( They are called monkey model( export model) becos of poorer armour as compare to the Russia's own T-72 variant)
The T-84 is of better armour protection as well as with the latest K-5 ERA whereas the PT-91 is of poorer armour as well as the older ERAWA-1 ERA.
In fact, MY has actually chosen the T-84 over the PT-91 but eventually called off becos the Ukraine do not accept palm oil as payment!!!!
So if Huxley were to write about the malaysian armed forces, it would be with many sarcastic remarks than praises!!! -
it's all inter twined......Originally posted by Obersturmfuhrer:Hence the importance of diplomacy in our defence context but some people just cannot accept this fact. -
I think Huxley never draw the conclusion that SG will definitely win a war with Malaysia although he did point out that we do hold an edge over them despite our smaller size and population.
We will never know the outcome till the day we actually fight.
For now I think we shd keep the peace and stop this pointless discussion. -
maybe our Infantry?Originally posted by sbst275:But MBT are not suitable if a war w Malaysia breaks as they are mountainous -
If Singapore loses, you will live under Bumi rule.
If Singapore wins, you will be spitted upon every time you encounter a Malaysian. Meanwhile, resistance forces will spill NS man's blood everyday in the kampongs, like in Iraq.
As for me, I will run away to Australia and start life anew...... -
....... and live in Aussie refugee camp.Originally posted by Dr Who:If Singapore loses, you will live under Bumi rule.
If Singapore wins, you will be spitted upon every time you encounter a Malaysian. Meanwhile, resistance forces will spill NS man's blood everyday in the kampongs, like in Iraq.
As for me, I will run away to Australia and start life anew...... -
well, i qoute domingo chavez(created by Tom clancy),Originally posted by Obersturmfuhrer:Hence the importance of diplomacy in our defence context but some people just cannot accept this fact.
diplomacy is a country f**king another.
Well, guess for malaysia and singapore, we have already completed the karmasutra! -
That's right. MY's gunboat diplomacy regarding the oilfield dispute with Brunei just last year, I think.Originally posted by Obersturmfuhrer:
Hence the importance of diplomacy in our defence context but some people just cannot accept this fact. [/quote]
[quote]Originally posted by |-|05|:it's all inter twined......
If you r weak , you will be push around, that's reality.
If you r strong, you will at least deter war from happening.
After our independance, MY thought that they could push us around becos we did not have strong armed forces and becos they could threaten to cut off our water supply.
But in 1969, we paraded our AMX-13 tanks during NDP to show MY in particular that we are no pushover. LKY were even reported to threaten to invade Johore if our water supply is threaten.
One thing, MY know that we will not start a war unless we are threaten, becos SAF is a mainly conscripts army, therefore our economy will be in a total standstill due to all able men will be involved in the war.
Thus having a strong SAF has actually prevent situation above from happening.