Today in 1977, The Debut of the First Double-Decker Bus.
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28 years old today, Singapore Bus Service (SBS) launches its first double decker bus, service 86, which goes from Tampines to Shenton Way. The new service is launched by Senior Minister of State Ong Teng Cheong.
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wish they could be more accurate...specifically, the 'Tampines' part. 86 started from 'Tampines Way' to be more exact, which was in the Hougang area. IIRC, Tampines was still a ulu kampong in 1977
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In the past, the name "Tampines" referred to a huge area that included the site of PLAB.Originally posted by supremebull:wish they could be more accurate...specifically, the 'Tampines' part. 86 started from 'Tampines Way' to be more exact, which was in the Hougang area. IIRC, Tampines was still a ulu kampong in 1977
Anyway, the history of DDs in Singapore is quite full of milestones. We have the last batch of vehicles bearing the "Leyland" signature, and these are none other than the LO3Xes, Singapore's first ADDs.
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Oh btw, Hougang didn't seem to exist in some of the old Street Directories I've used (1956 onwards). Instead the area was called "Tampines".
And the first double decker in Singapore was a demo bus from Malaysia. I think it was an AEC. Interestingly, Malaysia doesn't use anymore of the full height DDs. -
Whats IIRC? BTW only after 1980 then got Flats in Tampines.Originally posted by supremebull:wish they could be more accurate...specifically, the 'Tampines' part. 86 started from 'Tampines Way' to be more exact, which was in the Hougang area. IIRC, Tampines was still a ulu kampong in 1977 -
The earliest was along Ave 2Originally posted by Volvo Olympian:Whats IIRC? BTW only after 1980 then got Flats in Tampines.
It actually arrived SG in 1976 for road testing
Happy 28th anniversary! -
Many of Malaysia's overhead bridges and flyovers have about 5m minimum clearance. That is more than enough for DDs. A pity they don't intend to use such buses.Originally posted by Yusry:And the first double decker in Singapore was a demo bus from Malaysia. I think it was an AEC. Interestingly, Malaysia doesn't use anymore of the full height DDs. -
What was the first DD bus ? Leyland right ?
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It was said eunos, geylang, paya lebar, kallang, aljunied area were under "Geylang" before seperated.. presumbly due to the naming of MRT stations.. like CCK north is called Yew Tee etc.
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LA... The earliest was the BACO/ DM body, remembered there was 20 of them...Originally posted by Airbus330Captain:What was the first DD bus ? Leyland right ?
All eventually retired by 1990 as buses back then has only a 12 yrs lifespan on the roads -
The abovementioned areas are still classified under the Geylang New Town boundary.Originally posted by 105090:It was said eunos, geylang, paya lebar, kallang, aljunied area were under "Geylang" before seperated.. presumbly due to the naming of MRT stations.. like CCK north is called Yew Tee etc. -
Bus standing cap was 87...Originally posted by Gordonator:28 years old today, Singapore Bus Service (SBS) launches its first double decker bus, service 86, which goes from Tampines to Shenton Way. The new service is launched by Senior Minister of State Ong Teng Cheong. -
As mentioned earlier, KL had DDs in the 1950s which were similar to the Routemasters. One was sent to Singapore for evaluation but Singapore operators were not interested. If I'm not wrong, Penang also had DDs back then. I think the cost of maintaing DDs is the main problem for Malaysian operators, most of which are private companies. The Malaysian DDs were gone less than 10 years later and it was not until the coming of the Nice 2 did Malaysia have a 2 storey bus once again.Originally posted by iveco:Many of Malaysia's overhead bridges and flyovers have about 5m minimum clearance. That is more than enough for DDs. A pity they don't intend to use such buses.
Although the bridges in Malaysia have enough clearance for DDs, many of the trees, utility poles, street signs, etc. are not. I have rode on an Iveco Turbocity in KL which had its rear exhaust stack swiped off by a hanging tree branch. I also found other buses which had suffered the same fate. -
I won't consider those Nice2 as 2-storey, as the lower floor is of standing height only for small children, not regular adults !
Nice 2 entire fleet i'll say is '1.5' storeys coach, where the overall height is only slightly higher than a high-deck single decker coach.
For true double-decker in more recent times in Malaysia , i'll consider those used with MAN 24.460 chassi with 3-axles. Both floors are of adult standing height here.
I believe why double-deckers didn't catch on in Malaysia was because of the sceptism from some people in Malaysia then that the (likely mostly British) double-deckers had inferior road handling capabilities compared to single deckers, something which i do believe is still the case with modern double-deckers, simply due to their higher c.g. over single deckers. Of course in the double-deckers of today, these have greatly improved active safety margins with the increasing use of electronic air-suspension control, ABS, ASR etc. which i won't expect to find in a Leyland Atlantean !!
So slowly now you see the re-emergence of the double-decker in Malaysia. although so far not yet in citybus operations again. With better buses available today, i won't rule out KL having double-decker citybuses again, with MAN being a probable choice.Originally posted by The_Bus_Guide:As mentioned earlier, KL had DDs in the 1950s which were similar to the Routemasters. One was sent to Singapore for evaluation but Singapore operators were not interested. If I'm not wrong, Penang also had DDs back then. I think the cost of maintaing DDs is the main problem for Malaysian operators, most of which are private companies. The Malaysian DDs were gone less than 10 years later and it was not until the coming of the Nice 2 did Malaysia have a 2 storey bus once again.
Although the bridges in Malaysia have enough clearance for DDs, many of the trees, utility poles, street signs, etc. are not. I have rode on an Iveco Turbocity in KL which had its rear exhaust stack swiped off by a hanging tree branch. I also found other buses which had suffered the same fate. -
I believe in west & east Malaysia today double-deckers are used again, after an absence of a few decades.
Like those using MAN 24.460 chassi with 3-axles with coach bodies.Originally posted by iveco:Many of Malaysia's overhead bridges and flyovers have about 5m minimum clearance. That is more than enough for DDs. A pity they don't intend to use such buses. -
In Singapore or in the world ??
If in Singapore i believe most likely a British make, maybe Leyland.
If in the world, then likely a German make, a Daimler. Thus, i'll classify it indirectly [since Daimler later re-organised as Daimler-Benz] as a Mercedes-Benz.Originally posted by Airbus330Captain:What was the first DD bus ? Leyland right ? -
Wasn't the Daimler Fleetliner a British bus? Daimler was later absorbed into the Leyland Group along with Guy, Albion, AEC and Bristol.Originally posted by hseochin:In Singapore or in the world ??
If in Singapore i believe most likely a British make, maybe Leyland.
If in the world, then likely a German make, a Daimler. Thus, i'll classify it indirectly [since Daimler later re-organised as Daimler-Benz] as a Mercedes-Benz. -
There's 2 Daimlers as far as i know. I don't think their related to each other.
British Daimler (i believe some link with Jaguar & Leyland) & German Daimler, which of course is associated with Daimler-Benz, the German firm behind Mercedes-Benz. It's known that the world's 1st bus (with IC engine not horse driven !) was created by (German) Daimler, same man who created the world's 1st van & truck with IC engines. [Karl Benz created the 1st car with IC engine].
That Daimler you mentioned is likely a British bus. I don't think there was ever any association between Leyland & Daimler-Benz.Originally posted by iveco:Wasn't the Daimler Fleetliner a British bus? Daimler was later absorbed into the Leyland Group along with Guy, Albion, AEC and Bristol. -
AFAIK, only Konsortium is currently using the MAN 24.460 in West Malaysia. Other operators seems to prefer the Scania K124IB. But I think even the 24.460 is not as high as a regular DD.Originally posted by hseochin:I believe in west & east Malaysia today double-deckers are used again, after an absence of a few decades.
Like those using MAN 24.460 chassi with 3-axles with coach bodies. -
So there's other 3-axle chassi with double-deck body used in Malaysia besides MAN ?
How i judge whether the height is as high or not is observing if an adult can stand upright on both floors. The Konsortium ones i believe can so then i'll consider these as 2-storey 'normal' height DD.Originally posted by The_Bus_Guide:AFAIK, only Konsortium is currently using the MAN 24.460 in West Malaysia. Other operators seems to prefer the Scania K124IB. But I think even the 24.460 is not as high as a regular DD. -
The only other 3-axle chassis is the MAN 24.370 used by the Transnasional Executive Coach. But it's not a DD, though. Other DD coaches are all 2-axle chassii, probably with the same configuration as the Nice 2 coaches. There are Scania, MAN and even a Japanese model.Originally posted by hseochin:So there's other 3-axle chassi with double-deck body used in Malaysia besides MAN ?
How i judge whether the height is as high or not is observing if an adult can stand upright on both floors. The Konsortium ones i believe can so then i'll consider these as 2-storey 'normal' height DD. -
Talking about a Japanese 3-axle chassis, i ever seen 1 in KL but it's from Thailand. From a distance @ night i thought it was a M-B O 404 DD because the coachwork seemed a close copy of the real M-B double-decker coach, down to the O 404's front grill with M-B star logo & 'O 404 DD' side plate & 3-element front headlamp, rear high & low lampsets & Setra-like rear-view mirrors but the giveaway was the wheel-hub design, steering-wheel & dashboard which confirmed to me it's only a Nissan Diesel chassis in 6x2 form.
I've been told that Thailand is full of fake buses/coaches especially M-B so this in hindsight came as no surprise afterall !
I believe this type of Nissan Diesel 3-axle can also be seen in Singapore occasionally, driven from Thailand. For 2-axle i've not seen any Japanese makes with double-deck body.Originally posted by The_Bus_Guide:The only other 3-axle chassis is the MAN 24.370 used by the Transnasional Executive Coach. But it's not a DD, though. Other DD coaches are all 2-axle chassii, probably with the same configuration as the Nice 2 coaches. There are Scania, MAN and even a Japanese model. -
Height is somewhere abt 4.1m, like HK's NWS Hldg's Bus rt 15 that 10.3m TridentOriginally posted by The_Bus_Guide:AFAIK, only Konsortium is currently using the MAN 24.460 in West Malaysia. Other operators seems to prefer the Scania K124IB. But I think even the 24.460 is not as high as a regular DD. -
Hougang only started in 1980's, starting from the Tampines Rd area 1st... Then to Kovan that sideOriginally posted by Yusry:Oh btw, Hougang didn't seem to exist in some of the old Street Directories I've used (1956 onwards). Instead the area was called "Tampines".
And the first double decker in Singapore was a demo bus from Malaysia. I think it was an AEC. Interestingly, Malaysia doesn't use anymore of the full height DDs.