Land Transport Review
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SMRT's train mileage in 2002 was higher than now though it's opp picture for ridership
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Just a comment. The new fare system is distance-based, not displacement-based. As such, I would think if you start from A, then go to B, and come back to A again, you'll be charged the fare equivalent to the distance of A->B->A, i.e. 2x the distance between A and B, not nil fare as what was suggested.
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unless the system adopts a rule that it is not considered a transfer if consecutive trips are made using the same bus service.Originally posted by stituss:Just a comment. The new fare system is distance-based, not displacement-based. As such, I would think if you start from A, then go to B, and come back to A again, you'll be charged the fare equivalent to the distance of A->B->A, i.e. 2x the distance between A and B, not nil fare as what was suggested. -
sv190 route is a nice moneytree service..Originally posted by sbs&tibs:I like the idea of route bidding, London style. But I prefer HK style, where 2 companies run the same service, which I call it direct competition, but there aren't many cross territory routes, that's the sian thing. If S190 receives such as treatment from both SBST and SMRT, shiok. Lolx.
SBS1710D (Best MKII award winner)
ppl use it for work and play and go sch -
Mdm Saw would likely be disappointed on lucrative rts
LTA would like bundle all the profitable and lost making routes together for every bid to prevent ppl from benefitting cherry picking
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Individual offices if they have operations?Originally posted by simnatic:I know that. Im not asking who will own the interchange. I'm merely asking how will the operations be like in the future when there would be many operators everywhere.
Anyway the system is likely based on number of fare stages travelled within a certain time frame and transfer timing (2hr/45mins). If you tap in and tap out 8 stages later, and board another bus and tap out another 4 stages, you'll be charged 12 stages worth of fare. -
Why the ministry did not want to consider in merging SMRT buses & SBST together instead of opening up new players ????
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merge = no competition = boring...Originally posted by azharjj:Why the ministry did not want to consider in merging SMRT buses & SBST together instead of opening up new players ???? -
Merging does not solved the problem as long as the management of SMRT are still involved. I hope LTA will have a good look at the MRT incident yesterday and do something about it. The fact that it didn't handle the whole situation well has said it all. Lots and tons of complains about how insincere they were.
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Maybe TransitLink could be reorganised such that they take over all the public transport resources then farm them out.Originally posted by SBS8043A:merge = no competition = boring...
In future:
All trains operate under TL livery, but come under SMRT Corp.
All buses operate under TL livery, but are split between SBS and Tibs depending on sector. -
fair means u pay nothing. nothing in life i free. but apparently with the displacement fare system, that may happen.Originally posted by XiaoTaro:I dont see a reason why a passenger can be charged 0.00. and definitely that contradicts with ur point of fairness. How can it be fair when a passenger utilizes the public transport system without paying a cent? Instead, he will be either charged the minimum fare, or the system will be smart enough to distinguish that he is traveling to and fro once between his home and the place to buy stuff and in this case, 2 times the minimum fare.
I believe LTA is modeling the system to work such that a passenger do not get penalized for making multiple transfers between his origin and destination (and between bus / MRT), and this is the only target audience which will really see the benefit in this system. aka distance based fares.
no i have clarfied, by reading the news u would have seen that they are talking dispalcement based fares, not distance based. read the SMu to sin ming example again
the example clrealy states that if the user goes one big round and not ake direct bus , he pays same fare. so by gg two distances one which is longer, he will be charged a standard dispalcement fare.
ZYX -
i dun think is displacement fares. the fare indicated ($1.19 in 2009) is just a guide. fares won't be like that in 2009. and ST is prone to make assumptions like this, even though sometimes it's simply for illustrations purposes.
so, in all respect, it shld be what the LTA mentioned, distance-based fare. -
another media mmisleading the public case?
okie for me i take displacemnt based fare altho the through fare idea i support. displaceemnt fare u see gives me the joys of 0.00 rides as some have mentioned
haha
YX -
absurd...transitlink cant take ovr all companies...it shd b used as a medium 2 organise activities n plans from da companies...
i dun agree wif tl livery...vv boring...yawn...i lyke da current situation called competition...i tink itz beta...only ting i dun lyke is da way smrt is managing tibs...tts a shake head session...i'd rather smrt nt interfere wif da buses...
Originally posted by iveco:Maybe TransitLink could be reorganised such that they take over all the public transport resources then farm them out.
In future:
All trains operate under TL livery, but come under SMRT Corp.
All buses operate under TL livery, but are split between SBS and Tibs depending on sector. -
09 SMRT Buses will merge with SBS Transit,Another 1 or 2 player will be the renowned private operator conditioned they must adapt to th EZ link systems.I really hope ComfortDelgro bus,Westpoint or Woodlands Tpt join the party with SBST holds the majority routes
SMRT they can jollywell concentrate on rail 
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sad to see smrtbuses go like that. suggest restrcutre smrt bbuses co. pop out the trans island bus services. and then sbs will kope this company and everything will be fine and dandy
smrt cna run all trains.
then hor when sbs and trans island merge , the trans island name stay on buses so that in essence trans island become under comfort delgro
\XD
ZYX -
No point letting ComfortDelgro bus enter the market, its still an enlarged monopoly of ComfortDelgroOriginally posted by carbikebus:09 SMRT Buses will merge with SBS Transit,Another 1 or 2 player will be the renowned private operator conditioned they must adapt to th EZ link systems.I really hope ComfortDelgro bus,Westpoint or Woodlands Tpt join the party with SBST holds the majority routes SMRT they can jollywell concentrate on rail 
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I think they're doing well on Chartered SvsOriginally posted by Scania:No point letting ComfortDelgro bus enter the market, its still an enlarged monopoly of ComfortDelgro. -
i think its more appropriate to refer to the official gov't press release instead of the news paper.
It can be found here: http://app.sprinter.gov.sg/data/pr/20080118996.htm
It is highly unlikely there will be any merger on the bus system as LTA strives towards more competition and efficiency and keeping cost competitive. This is clearly stated in point 51 as it is mentioned regarding limited economy of scales for operators above a fleet size of 500 buses. Merging the current two bus companies will make this worse as it calls for a monopoly instead of competition.
On the other hand, TransitLink is unlikely to provide the distribution of transport services. It is a company owned by both SMRT and SBST on a 50:50 basis, and to provide integrated service information and fare distribution between the 2 companies. -
In terms of market basics, i wun support a merger. monopolies tend to be very single minded to profits and dun care bout the consumers . although controlled by LTA, a one bus company with over 95 percent routes in Singapore will simply outbid the little small bus companies for bus routes and everything will be dictaorship-ish
however having said the above, if LTA has much more power than i think they do, they can churn out a success story with just one bus operator. One has to see the exmaple of Sydney's STA. the first customer contact point is their super cool bus website with all bbus information u need. evven searching Sydney buses tickets will bbring u to hat website for all ur bus travelling needs.
however can the small island support competition? we have seen in the past that competition led to much chaos. As a result mergers were made. this i refer to the 1970s and then again in 1973 when SBS was formed out of the many mergers. if LTA can control the competition and yet no cause duplication in services, maybe we have success.
but again current state is two big bus co. can a new start up challenge these two and apply for suitable routes to induce a competitive environment? i thinking the past history really says competition might not work. Unless u reduce SBS into smaller pieces and make some 6 or 7 operators...and have LTA fully control the companys.
one thing good though, bus company under government have shown many success stories. hope we head for that model. be it competitive or just one company.
ZYX -
Then explain why OTC allowed Tibs to be formed in 1982.Originally posted by ZYX2005:In terms of market basics, i wun support a merger. monopolies tend to be very single minded to profits and dun care bout the consumers . although controlled by LTA, a one bus company with over 95 percent routes in Singapore will simply outbid the little small bus companies for bus routes and everything will be dictaorship-ish
however having said the above, if LTA has much more power than i think they do, they can churn out a success story with just one bus operator. One has to see the exmaple of Sydney's STA. the first customer contact point is their super cool bus website with all bbus information u need. evven searching Sydney buses tickets will bbring u to hat website for all ur bus travelling needs.
however can the small island support competition? we have seen in the past that competition led to much chaos. As a result mergers were made. this i refer to the 1970s and then again in 1973 when SBS was formed out of the many mergers. if LTA can control the competition and yet no cause duplication in services, maybe we have success.
but again current state is two big bus co. can a new start up challenge these two and apply for suitable routes to induce a competitive environment? i thinking the past history really says competition might not work. Unless u reduce SBS into smaller pieces and make some 6 or 7 operators...and have LTA fully control the companys.
one thing good though, bus company under government have shown many success stories. hope we head for that model. be it competitive or just one company.
ZYX
Not forgetting SBS(T)'s NEL was a further development of his subway concept. -
I won't trust a transport operator's website which asks me to walk over Sydney habour out of no where without any bridge, or one that brings me onto a loop when I want to go somewhere nearby.Originally posted by ZYX2005:however having said the above, if LTA has much more power than i think they do, they can churn out a success story with just one bus operator. One has to see the exmaple of Sydney's STA. the first customer contact point is their super cool bus website with all bbus information u need. evven searching Sydney buses tickets will bbring u to hat website for all ur bus travelling needs.
ZYX -
well haha
yes apparently i din relaise the STA journey planner assumes humans can fly.
haha
however, having said that, the idea is there and we should improve on it.
ZYX -
alright the train n taxi parts of the LTA review are out.
for the conveinince of bus forumers the speech is here
http://app-pac.mica.gov.sg/data/vddp/embargo/6260896.htm
we thank darryl for letting me know the URl
ZYX -
Well, I don't trust LTA planning all the bus routes. Do they actually know what the passengers want or not?
Firstly, what would they do with existing bus routes? Will they be radically be rationalised? Will direct links between places be further axed? Do we have to make more transfers from bus to bus, bus to train etc? Especially with the recent MRT fiasco and the many times train trips have been interrupted? How exactly reliable can the hub and spoke system be? We ain't doing a Singapore Airlines at Changi Airport.
I am happy that the same fares will be charged by distance though. If this doesn't translate into higher fares.
And I think the tender is crap. Bus operators will definitely wanna cherry pick more profitable and viable routes and shun unprofitable ones away. Unless the routes come in a package. The bus operator has to operate a mixture of routes that have high and low passenger loads.
And a third, fourth bus company? I hope that will materialise? But I doubt it will happen. New companies need a substantial fleet of buses to enter the market. Existing companies might need to re-fit their current buses to meet the current standards? Which company will wanna invest in a business that does not bring high business yields? There's no First or Business class in bus services. And you need a fleet of a few hundred of buses and it has to be Euro 4 and WAB. All these needs $$$.
Competition between buses? Unless buses ply the exact same route, otherwise there is no direct competition. Crap.
Actually the best solution is this.
1) Merge all the transport companies under one roof or the second one is preferred...
2) Management shakeup at the SMRT and keep the existing status of both companies status quo but integrate the frequencies a bit here and there...but given the irregular frequency of SMRT ... i don't know it this would work.