New batch of SMRT Mercedes Benz Citaro have arrived!
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Originally posted by S.Solitaire:
Like what this fellow guy said, bendies are known as killer buses in London...
No doubt they do have the highest accident/incident records in London, however, u might be surprised to know that the citaro and the citaro g has exactly the same turning circle by specification.
There's nothing to be said if the drivers arnt trained for the use of the buses, because if keisei bus can use them on roads as narrow as london in chiba, japan, no reason they cant be used in london if adequate training is given. Negotiating a turn with a articulated vehicle is not the same as with a rigid.
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Here is also a petty concise and balanced view on the issue being discussed.
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If bendy buses, or technically speaking, articulated buses, are a failure in the icon of buses, why is there a big number of them being used in german cities?
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Not only German certain parts of Europe too.Maybe their motorists are more gracious?Even in Sardinia theres handful of MAN Articulate.Some parts of Spain use the Capacity as well,Brazil using tri-articulate.S'pore cannot have too many bendies on the road.Probably just 200 units is enough.
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Consider that the city of London is very old, dating back centuries. Most of the roads there were originally build for horse-carts and such; when some of the roads were built, even the simplest motor vehicles seemed like a wild fantasy. The oldest roads probably date back as far back as the 17th century, built after the Great London Fire of 1666. Some roads are probably even older than that.
London's roads were never really built for long vehicles such as a bendy bus. With bendy buses, they sometimes block side roads when stopped at certain bus stops, and the turning radius allowed for some roads and road junctions is just simply too small for such a long vehicle. Many of the roads are probably also very narrow (remember, again - some of these roads were probably built before motor vehicles existed), which can present additional problems for a bendy bus. Cyclists also find it more difficult to overtake a bendy bus because of it's length - I personally have experienced it.
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Originally posted by SBS 1000U:
I thought bendies are already banned by LTA???
Hi. Just to clarify, I have publicly asked LTA during a meeting, in the presence of some SMRT staff, if bendy quota is set. However, LTA says that they are willing to permit more bendies if the demand is there. Therefore it has to be like a proposal sent in by SMRT to LTA then there will be evaluations.
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Originally posted by Shaunso237:
Hi. Just to clarify, I have publicly asked LTA during a meeting, in the presence of some SMRT staff, if bendy quota is set. However, LTA says that they are willing to permit more bendies if the demand is there. Therefore it has to be like a proposal sent in by SMRT to LTA then there will be evaluations.
Seems like when the current bendies start retiring , there is a possibility that Citaro G can appear in SG one day ^^ -
Originally posted by Shaunso237:
Hi. Just to clarify, I have publicly asked LTA during a meeting, in the presence of some SMRT staff, if bendy quota is set. However, LTA says that they are willing to permit more bendies if the demand is there. Therefore it has to be like a proposal sent in by SMRT to LTA then there will be evaluations.
I remember reading somewhere in earlier posts that SMRT top management has rejected proposal to buy new bendies and chose the rigids instead due to extra costs. -
Originally posted by SBS3688Y:
I remember reading somewhere in earlier posts that SMRT top management has rejected proposal to buy new bendies and chose the rigids instead due to extra costs.They are planning in future to convert to full single deck fleets for better frequncies and also lesser space crunch in their depots and interchange operations. Moreover, they also planning for the new deployment demands once the Bukit Timah MRT line is ready in future and thus may need lesser or even axe bendy buses after that.
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Bendies consume more diesel too... Idk for DDs... But the accident rate is high too....
IMO, bendies for feeder/intratown services.... DDs for trunk..
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Saw SMB142J and SMB144D inside C&C only.
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Originally posted by SBS 1000U:
I think will be more for Ang Mo Kio depot, since 853 will be WAB very soon.Should be spliting? Half to 858, half to 853/852? Since it's just only 10 Citaros. Plus, I think KJDEP should give out their OCs to those depot that's in need of WAB buses for their WAB service(s).
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Originally posted by SMB66X:
Should be spliting? Half to 858, half to 853/852? Since it's just only 10 Citaros. Plus, I think KJDEP should give out their OCs to those depot that's in need of WAB buses for their WAB service(s).
Most probably they will end up in AMDEP though giving 167 851 and 854 first with WLDEP getting hands-me down.
Of course some buses needed to be dropped over, Time will tell.
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Originally posted by TIB 781 L:
Most probably they will end up in AMDEP though giving 167 851 and 854 first with WLDEP getting hands-me down.
Of course some buses needed to be dropped over, Time will tell.
For what in giving 167 & 854?
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Originally posted by SMB66X:
For what in giving 167 & 854?
You might find it no point to give it to 167 and 854 but seems like SMRT likes to place lots of first-hand stuff to 167 854, 851 and 853 inclusive. So not sure if 167 will get them given 167 had lots of first hand stuff in the past.
If you think it's illogical up to you.
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Hmm Whatever the deployments will be for the Citaros, let it take effect when the buses are officially deployed.
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About the WAB Bendies issue i feel that the number might be small due to upcoming rail lines...Say 600 rigids to 200 bendies
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I just hope they could at least do a one-to-one replacement for outgoing bendies since our population will never ever go down, and the towns which SMRT serves like Yishun and Woodlands are still expanding, so bendies are still needed to deal with the crowds.
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Yeah right...MKI bendies should go early,56 for 50 WAB bendies should be enough for this time being..MAN NG363F is another good option
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Originally posted by ^tamago^:
I just hope they could at least do a one-to-one replacement for outgoing bendies since our population will never ever go down, and the towns which SMRT serves like Yishun and Woodlands are still expanding, so bendies are still needed to deal with the crowds.
that, to me, is effective only if e new citaros have a lot of standee area.SMB136C does not have a lot of this.
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Originally posted by ^tamago^:
I just hope they could at least do a one-to-one replacement for outgoing bendies since our population will never ever go down, and the towns which SMRT serves like Yishun and Woodlands are still expanding, so bendies are still needed to deal with the crowds.
to add on; MM Lee already said in recent newspaper reports that he thinks the current population is still not enough and he plans to get somemore foreigners here to take up citizenship or PR. I think LTA should further open the public transport market wider to allow more competitors to operate to improve service levels. Or else most of us will end up standing throughout the bus journeys and getting unsatisfactory public bus services. -
Originally posted by buses[IN]gapore!:
Seems like when the current bendies start retiring , there is a possibility that Citaro G can appear in SG one day ^^Maybe even a Citaro GL Capacity. ^^
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Originally posted by SBS3688Y:
to add on; MM Lee already said in recent newspaper reports that he thinks the current population is still not enough and he plans to get somemore foreigners here to take up citizenship or PR. I think LTA should further open the public transport market wider to allow more competitors to operate to improve service levels. Or else most of us will end up standing throughout the bus journeys and getting unsatisfactory public bus services.However most Singaporeans are still unhappy with the population increase for the recent years and the influx of foreigners has been decreasing. Thus the rate of increase will be slow and gradual in future. But most likely problem is that the current infrastructures are already unable to cope with the increase.
And don't forget they are also building more rails lines to cope with the demand in future, which is also another disaster waiting to happen if an inflexible system is going to be heavily relied in future.
Originally posted by ^tamago^:I just hope they could at least do a one-to-one replacement for outgoing bendies since our population will never ever go down, and the towns which SMRT serves like Yishun and Woodlands are still expanding, so bendies are still needed to deal with the crowds.
Originally posted by carbikebus:About the WAB Bendies issue i feel that the number might be small due to upcoming rail lines…Say 600 rigids to 200 bendies
Most likely in future, bendy buses are only used for feeder services only. But other than Woodlands, Yishun, and Chua Chu Kang, the other estates like Sembawang, Bukit Panjang, and Bukit Batok do not need many bendy buses. The number will be capped to the most to 200, including spare buses, but the number might be smaller if single deckers are good enough fulfill the frequncies.
Originally posted by SBS 1000U:They are planning in future to convert to full single deck fleets for better frequncies and also lesser space crunch in their depots and interchange operations. Moreover, they also planning for the new deployment demands once the Bukit Timah MRT line is ready in future and thus may need lesser or even axe bendy buses after that.
You have a point here. And if this is true, that will solve a lot of their current problems. But the problem is, do they even bother to improve further?Originally posted by buses[IN]gapore!:
Seems like when the current bendies start retiring , there is a possibility that Citaro G can appear in SG one day ^^Originally posted by dan474:Maybe even a Citaro GL Capacity. ^^
Can forget about all these because the most you can see are the Citaro single deckers. Capacity confirm will be not approved by LTA.
Maybe can see them if you go to Europe.
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Originally posted by vicamour:
However most Singaporeans are still unhappy with the population increase for the recent years and the influx of foreigners has been decreasing. Thus the rate of increase will be slow and gradual in future. But most likely problem is that the current infrastructures are already unable to cope with the increase.
And don't forget they are also building more rails lines to cope with the demand in future, which is also another disaster waiting to happen if an inflexible system is going to be heavily relied in future.
Most likely in future, bendy buses are only used for feeder services only. But other than Woodlands, Yishun, and Chua Chu Kang, the other estates like Sembawang, Bukit Panjang, and Bukit Batok do not need many bendy buses. The number will be capped to the most to 200, including spare buses, but the number might be smaller if single deckers are good enough fulfill the frequncies.
You have a point here. And if this is true, that will solve a lot of their current problems. But the problem is, do they even bother to improve further?Can forget about all these because the most you can see are the Citaro single deckers. Capacity confirm will be not approved by LTA.
Maybe can see them if you go to Europe.
That's because none of the bendies are deregistered yet. If 838H is deregistered alr, you would see at least a demo bendy on the roads.
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Originally posted by dan474:
That's because none of the bendies are deregistered yet. If 838H is deregistered alr, you would see at least a demo bendy on the roads.
LTA will not approve the Capacity due the length, that's for sure.There are many cheaper brands to buy other than Mercedes Benz for bendy buses and SMRT has already spend extra money/budget to get Citaro single deckers. That's why they trial the MAN and Zhongtong, as most likely candidates.
One thing for sure, LTA has limit the number of bendy buses each company can buy. Even if SBST wants to buy them in future, they can also buy in small fleets. So what for spend so much extra money to buy such small fleets in future? They can spend more money instead to buy more single deckers to improve the frequncies instead, else just go for double deckers.