Looking forward to the launch of 256 and 258. They are perfect for joy-rides/lepak, when I have nothing better to do and I have the concession pass for unlimited bus rides. I can take from my house bus stop, and alight at the bus stop opposite. :)
(this is a loop-hole, but, shh.... don't tell anyone, except the people whom you want to lepak with.)
a bit like the feeder bus routes at Yishun and Woodlands, except the bus does not rest for a while at the bus interchange where it loops.
Only 241 ply Jurong West Street 92 when 99 was extended to Joo Koon Bus Interchange
Originally posted by Path Light:Only 241 ply Jurong West Street 92 when 99 was extended to Joo Koon Bus Interchange
The new pair of bus stops at NTUC Health Nursing Home (#27501) and before Yunnan Crescent (#27509) is a good replacement for the skipped bus stop at Jurong West Street 92 (#27159). Other than that, the bus stops along Jurong West Street 91 are within walking distance from the skipped bus stop.
There are twenty eight days to go before 258 is introduced and 99 extended. If there is nothing else to discuss, I rather we not write anything here and simply let it expire after a while of no activity.
Twenty eight days is a lot of time. Imagine how much we can do in twenty eight days, when it takes only twenty seven days to change a habit, by repeatedly doing the new habit. Let's not waste time here.
Anyway, for the last time, let me comment about the new bus route 258.
It seems that this new 258 is very well-received by the people staying at Jurong West Street 64, 75, 82, 81, 71 and 61, as many people are talking about it. Apart from the connection to Pioneer MRT which we all know, the other benefit is that this new 258 can complement 243G and 181 during peak hours. It will be easier to board the bus during peak hours at Jurong West Street 64 and 75. :)
Whereas for the loading on 258, frankly speaking, I think single-decker (standard) buses are good enough, even during peak hours. There will still be people taking 179 to/fro Pioneer MRT and 181 to/fro Boon Lay Interchange, although some would change to take 258. 258's role is to complement, not substitute.
Nonetheless, if the EZ-Link card reader data proves otherwise, that there is consistent high loadings on 258 at certain periods of the day, I would appreciate that they deploy high-capacity buses on 258 during those periods of the day.
I hope the frequency is good. It should be comparable to the frequencies of 179 and 181, since 258 is a trunk service and these are the trunk services it would complement. In other words, 258 should operate at a frequency of around eight minutes throughout the day.
Originally posted by jurongresident:Looking forward to the launch of 256 and 258. They are perfect for joy-rides/lepak, when I have nothing better to do and I have the concession pass for unlimited bus rides. I can take from my house bus stop, and alight at the bus stop opposite. :)
(this is a loop-hole, but, shh.... don't tell anyone, except the people whom you want to lepak with.)
a bit like the feeder bus routes at Yishun and Woodlands, except the bus does not rest for a while at the bus interchange where it loops.
Doesn't matter... except for joyriders no one else would do that.
Originally posted by jurongresident:The new pair of bus stops at NTUC Health Nursing Home (#27501) and before Yunnan Crescent (#27509) is a good replacement for the skipped bus stop at Jurong West Street 92 (#27159). Other than that, the bus stops along Jurong West Street 91 are within walking distance from the skipped bus stop.
Actually if you really see the actual position of the NTUC Health Nursing Home stop and before Yunnan Crescent stop, it is quite far away from the skipped street 92 bus stop.
The new bus stop #27149 is located at Juying Primary School, instead of opposite the existing bus stop #27141 at opposite Juying Secondary School. The purpose is likely to compensate for the skipped bus stop #27159 at Jurong West Street 93, along with the other two new bus stops at Yunnan Crescent and NTUC Health Nursing Home.Originally posted by chickenlittle2:Actually if you really see the actual position of the NTUC Health Nursing Home stop and before Yunnan Crescent stop, it is quite far away from the skipped street 92 bus stop.
Originally posted by jurongresident:Well, I know I yesterday already say that I will not write anymore comments about 258, but here's something interesting which I just found out/realise:
In terms of characteristics, 258 is similar to 60 at Bedok area.
60
- 15.4km
- starts at Eunos (secondary),
- loops around Bedok (primary)
- 32 bus stops
258
- 13.9km (estimated)
- starts at Joo Koon (secondary),
- loops around Boon Lay (primary)
- 37 bus stops
Like 258, one of 60's roles is to provide bus connection to the MRT.
The frequency of 60 is as follows:
Morning peak: 6-10 mins
Day non-peak: 5-10 mins
Evening peak: 5-12 mins
Night non-peak: 5-17mins
Since 258 is similar to 60, I guess the frequency may be something like this:
Morning peak: around 8 mins
Day non-peak: around 7.5 mins
Evening peak: around 8.5 mins
Night non-peak: around 11 mins
If so, I guess the bus deployment on 258 would also be similar to 60. There should be around 13.5 buses deployed on 258.
there is a big difference between 60 and 258.
60 is the main connector for Bedok Reservoir to Bedok and Eunos MRT. 258 is a supplementary service to 243G/243W to Boon Lay MRT... and the pax to Pioneer MRT is quite questionable... as Boon Lay has hordes of amenities and is closer MRT towards city. Pioneer/Joo Koon will be more patronized by those who work around JIS/Tuas areas.
I think the comparison is totally off. 258 is good because it serves as an alternate service to Pioneer and Joo Koon for those who work in JIS/Tuas area. In fact, a lot of people in Tuas/JIS area live in Jurong West/East towns due to proximity. That's why LTA has worked with grassroots organizations to provide maximum direct connectivity to Jurong West town.
I am aware that in the public, there are comments that the new bus service 258 duplicates most of existing bus service 243. I understand there is the concern of wasteful duplication. I have thought about it. This is actually the best network there can be. If we make any change to the route, there will be loss of bus connections and there will be inconvenience caused.
I would like to remind everyone that 258 is never going to replace 243, since both are different types of bus service.
While we keep the route 243 as it is, I would like to suggest that we change the frequency of bus services 243G and 243W.
As of now, the frequency of bus service 243G/243W is as follows,
During peak hours, the frequency can sometimes be as low as around 3mins (1hr twenty trips), probably due to injection of buses from Jurong West Street 71. In total, in one hour, there is a maximum of twenty trips, and a minimum of ten trips.
While we adjust the frequency, we have to ensure that the waiting time for buses to the common destination (eg. Boon Lay Bus Interchange) remains the same. That is, if now the lowest frequency is 3 mins, we should ensure that regardless of 243 or 258, the lowest waiting time for buses remains at 3 mins.
I would like to suggest that we stop injecting buses from Jurong West Street 71 into 243, when 258 is introduced. Instead, we should run 243 based on the scheduled frequency.
The frequency of new bus service 256 and BSEP bus service 258 should be at ten to fifteen minutes throughout the day, according to the standard set for BSEP trunk bus services.
If so, the frequency of 256 and 258 should be as follows,
Based on the frequency of 256 and 258, to ensure that bus waiting time remains the same, we should adjust the frequency of 243W and 243G to the following,
As a result, we reduce the maximum number of trips in one hour on bus services 243G and 243W to fourteen, and the minimum number to six.
Originally posted by jurongresident:I am aware that in the public, there are comments that the new bus service 258 duplicates most of existing bus service 243. I understand there is the concern of wasteful duplication. I have thought about it. This is actually the best network there can be. If we make any change to the route, there will be loss of bus connections and there will be inconvenience caused.
I would like to remind everyone that 258 is never going to replace 243, since both are different types of bus service.
While we keep the route 243 as it is, I would like to suggest that we change the frequency of bus services 243G and 243W.
As of now, the frequency of bus service 243G/243W is as follows,
- Morning peak: around 6mins
- Day non-peak: around 4.75mins (1 hour thirteen trips)
- Evening peak: around 4mins
- Night non-peak: around 6.25mins (1 hour ten trips)
During peak hours, the frequency can sometimes be as low as around 3mins (1hr twenty trips), probably due to injection of buses from Jurong West Street 71. In total, in one hour, there is a maximum of twenty trips, and a minimum of ten trips.
While we adjust the frequency, we have to ensure that the waiting time for buses to the common destination (eg. Boon Lay Bus Interchange) remains the same. That is, if now the lowest frequency is 3 mins, we should ensure that regardless of 243 or 258, the lowest waiting time for buses remains at 3 mins.
I would like to suggest that we stop injecting buses from Jurong West Street 71 into 243, when 258 is introduced. Instead, we should run 243 based on the scheduled frequency.
The frequency of new bus service 256 and BSEP bus service 258 should be at ten to fifteen minutes throughout the day, according to the standard set for BSEP trunk bus services.
If so, the frequency of 256 and 258 should be as follows,
- Morning/Evening Peak: 10mins (1hr six trips)
- Day/Night Non-peak: 15mins (1 hr four trips)
Based on the frequency of 256 and 258, to ensure that bus waiting time remains the same, we should adjust the frequency of 243W and 243G to the following,
- Morning peak: 4mins (1hr fourteen trips)
- Day non-peak: 6mins (1hr nine trips)
- Evening peak: 4mins (1hr fourteen trips)
- Night non-peak: 10mins (1hr six trips)
As a result, we reduce the maximum number of trips in one hour on bus services 243G and 243W to fourteen, and the minimum number to six.
Makes sense otherwise you will see lots of bunching...and plenty of empty buses... in the end just hogging the road space and way to the interchane
Like it is happening with 222/291/293 these days.
1-2 Joo Koon service ought to terminate at Boon Lay to free up space at Joo Koon,8 service for a small ITH..Imagine during peak hours
Originally posted by jurongresident:I am aware that in the public, there are comments that the new bus service 258 duplicates most of existing bus service 243. I understand there is the concern of wasteful duplication. I have thought about it. This is actually the best network there can be. If we make any change to the route, there will be loss of bus connections and there will be inconvenience caused.
I would like to remind everyone that 258 is never going to replace 243, since both are different types of bus service.
While we keep the route 243 as it is, I would like to suggest that we change the frequency of bus services 243G and 243W.
As of now, the frequency of bus service 243G/243W is as follows,
- Morning peak: around 6mins
- Day non-peak: around 4.75mins (1 hour thirteen trips)
- Evening peak: around 4mins
- Night non-peak: around 6.25mins (1 hour ten trips)
During peak hours, the frequency can sometimes be as low as around 3mins (1hr twenty trips), probably due to injection of buses from Jurong West Street 71. In total, in one hour, there is a maximum of twenty trips, and a minimum of ten trips.
While we adjust the frequency, we have to ensure that the waiting time for buses to the common destination (eg. Boon Lay Bus Interchange) remains the same. That is, if now the lowest frequency is 3 mins, we should ensure that regardless of 243 or 258, the lowest waiting time for buses remains at 3 mins.
I would like to suggest that we stop injecting buses from Jurong West Street 71 into 243, when 258 is introduced. Instead, we should run 243 based on the scheduled frequency.
The frequency of new bus service 256 and BSEP bus service 258 should be at ten to fifteen minutes throughout the day, according to the standard set for BSEP trunk bus services.
If so, the frequency of 256 and 258 should be as follows,
- Morning/Evening Peak: 10mins (1hr six trips)
- Day/Night Non-peak: 15mins (1 hr four trips)
Based on the frequency of 256 and 258, to ensure that bus waiting time remains the same, we should adjust the frequency of 243W and 243G to the following,
- Morning peak: 4mins (1hr fourteen trips)
- Day non-peak: 6mins (1hr nine trips)
- Evening peak: 4mins (1hr fourteen trips)
- Night non-peak: 10mins (1hr six trips)
As a result, we reduce the maximum number of trips in one hour on bus services 243G and 243W to fourteen, and the minimum number to six.
Well, if we want some of the loading on 179 and 241 to come over to 258, the waiting time for 258 should be comparable to 179 and 241; around six to eight minutes. Otherwise, there is no incentive of doing so, unless people are willing to wait ten to fifteen minutes for a bus to/fro Pioneer MRT Station.
In the evening, people may be willing to wait around ten to fifteen minutes for the bus, as most of them have nothing on after work. However, in the morning, people have to rush to work.
I would like to suggest a short-working trip of 258 that connects to Pioneer MRT Station. It operates only during peak hours, at least in the morning.
Suggestion: 258M
The length of the route is 3.7km, and it takes around ten to fifteen minutes to complete one loop.
If we set the frequency at 10-15 minutes, we only need one bus. If we use two buses for this short-working trip, we can increase the frequency to 5-7.5 minutes. :)
Originally posted by carbikebus:1-2 Joo Koon service ought to terminate at Boon Lay to free up space at Joo Koon,8 service for a small ITH..Imagine during peak hours
Actually, it should be we terminate at Joo Koon instead, to free up space at Boon Lay, so that we can have more bus services there in future. :)
Anyway, no worries about the drive way being small. It is still more spacious than the end-on drive way at Boon Lay. :)
Originally posted by BusAnalayzer:there is a big difference between 60 and 258.
60 is the main connector for Bedok Reservoir to Bedok and Eunos MRT. 258 is a supplementary service to 243G/243W to Boon Lay MRT... and the pax to Pioneer MRT is quite questionable... as Boon Lay has hordes of amenities and is closer MRT towards city. Pioneer/Joo Koon will be more patronized by those who work around JIS/Tuas areas.
I think the comparison is totally off. 258 is good because it serves as an alternate service to Pioneer and Joo Koon for those who work in JIS/Tuas area. In fact, a lot of people in Tuas/JIS area live in Jurong West/East towns due to proximity. That's why LTA has worked with grassroots organizations to provide maximum direct connectivity to Jurong West town.
I'm confident that 258 will get more or at least equal pax to Pioneer MRT compared to Boon Lay, at least during AM peak. Because walking from the alighting berths in Boon Lay Int to Boon Lay MRT is farther than walking from bus stops outside Pioneer MRT to Pioneer MRT itself. And people may prefer Pioneer MRT as there's a higher chance to get seats (there are already people 'U-turn'ing at Joo Koon just for seats). It may even end up like another 860 situation, especially for those closer to Pioneer MRT.
Originally posted by jurongresident:Well, I know I yesterday already say that I will not write anymore comments about 258, but here's something interesting which I just found out/realise:
In terms of characteristics, 258 is similar to 60 at Bedok area.
60
- 15.4km
- starts at Eunos (secondary),
- loops around Bedok (primary)
- 32 bus stops
258
- 13.9km (estimated)
- starts at Joo Koon (secondary),
- loops around Boon Lay (primary)
- 37 bus stops
Like 258, one of 60's roles is to provide bus connection to the MRT.
The frequency of 60 is as follows:
Morning peak: 6-10 mins
Day non-peak: 5-10 mins
Evening peak: 5-12 mins
Night non-peak: 5-17mins
Since 258 is similar to 60, I guess the frequency may be something like this:
Morning peak: around 8 mins
Day non-peak: around 7.5 mins
Evening peak: around 8.5 mins
Night non-peak: around 11 mins
If so, I guess the bus deployment on 258 would also be similar to 60. There should be around 13.5 buses deployed on 258.
Eunos should be primary for 60 instead of Bedok. 60's loading at Eunos is more than Bedok especially for those going to MRT.
Svc 256 and Svc 258 more or less is like Svc 79 lorhx. Looping at Boon Lay Interchange. But also, Boon Lay interchange is already congested enough with Svc 179 & 179A...
On a positive note, Svc 182/182M, Svc 254, Svc 255 & Svc 257 will start from Joo Koon will empty some parking lots. I wish Svc 79 will be able to shift its berth to the sawtooth berth together with Svc 251.
Originally posted by jurongresident:As mentioned in a reply I wrote earlier, as of now, bus services 243G and 243W each operate around twenty trips during peak hours, thirteen trips during day non-peak and ten trips during night non-peak.
Even if we reduce the frequency of bus services 243G and 243W, it still must meet the minimum frequency for feeders. To minimise adjustments in future, I suggest we straight-away follow the standards set for the Government Contracting Model.
In this case, it is maximum eight minutes. If want, maybe six minutes is good enough during peak hours, since there would now be 258 complementing it.
Hence, I recommend that the new frequency of bus services 243G and 243W to be as follows,
243G / 243W
Peak: 6 mins (10 trips)
Non-peak: 8 mins (7 trips)
To minimise inconvenience, the total number of trips made to common destinations (eg. Boon Lay Bus Interchange) should remain the same.
Therefore, I would like to suggest that we set the frequency of bus services 258 and 256 to provide for the number of trips that would make up for the same total number of trips, after we reduce the number of trips made on bus services 243G and 243W.
I feel that bus services 258 and 256 should follow the same frequency. While route 258 duplicates route 243G's initial section, it does not duplicate route 243W's initial section. If we adjust the frequency of bus services 243G and 243W for service 258, service 256 should follow the same frequency as service 258, otherwise the initial section of service 243W would be affected.
As such, I recommend that we set the frequency of bus services 258 and 256 to the following,
258 / 256
Peak: 6 mins (10 trips)
Day non-peak: 10 mins (6 trips)
Night non-peak: 20 mins (3 trips)
If we use my recommendations above, we would save a total of 20 trips during peak hours, 12 trips during day non-peak, and 6 trips during night non-peak.
These trips can be transferred to other feeder bus services, to make them equal to what is currently enjoyed by only people staying along bus routes 243G and 243W. :)
Currently, this is the frequency of the other feeder bus services at Boon Lay:
242
Morning peak: around 5 mins (12 trips)
Day non-peak: around 7 mins (8.6 trips)
Evening peak: around 5.5 mins (10.9 trips)
Night non-peak: around 8 mins (7.5 trips)
241
Morning peak: around 6 mins (10 trips)
Day non-peak: around 6 mins (10 trips)
Evening peak: around 3.5 mins (17 trips)
Night non-peak: around 5.5 mins (10 trips)
240
Morning peak: around 7 mins (8.6 trips)
Day non-peak: around 6.5 mins (9 trips)
Evening peak: around 8 mins (7.5 trips)
Night non-peak: around 9.5 mins (6.3 trips)
Feeder bus service 242 can receive 8 more trips during morning peak, 5 more trips during day non-peak, 10 more trips during evening peak, and 3 more trips during night non-peak! :)
Feeder bus service 241 can receive 10 more trips during morning peak, 3 more trips during day non-peak and 3 more trips during evening peak! :)
After that, we still have an excess of 2 trips during morning peak, 4 trips during day non-peak, 7 trips during evening peak and a trips during night non-peak. We can give them all to feeder bus service 240! :)
Although feeder bus service 240 would still have less number of trips (except during day non-peak) than feeder bus services 241 and 242, that service actually has trunk bus services 30 and 154 to complement it.
Meanwhile, imagine what we could do with the number of trips we would save after we shorten some of the bus routes to Joo Koon Bus Interchange. :)
Originally posted by jurongresident:
If we use my recommendations above, we would save a total of 20 trips during peak hours, 12 trips during day non-peak, and 6 trips during night non-peak.
These trips can be transferred to other feeder bus services, to make it equal to what is currently enjoyed by only people staying along 243G/243W route! :)
Currently, this is the frequency of the other feeder bus services at Boon Lay:
242
Morning peak: around 5 mins (12 trips)
Day non-peak: around 7 mins (8.6 trips)
Evening peak: around 5.5 mins (10.9 trips)
Night non-peak: around 8 mins (7.5 trips)
241
Morning peak: around 6 mins (10 trips)
Day non-peak: around 6 mins (10 trips)
Evening peak: around 3.5 mins (17 trips)
Night non-peak: around 5.5 mins (10 trips)
240
Morning peak: around 7 mins (8.6 trips)
Day non-peak: around 6.5 mins (9 trips)
Evening peak: around 8 mins (7.5 trips)
Night non-peak: around 9.5 mins (6.3 trips)
Feeder bus service 242 can receive 8 more trips during morning peak, 5 more trips during day non-peak, 10 more trips during evening peak, and 3 more trips during night non-peak! :)
Feeder bus service 241 can receive 10 more trips during morning peak, 3 more trips during day non-peak and 3 more trips during evening peak! :)
After that, we still have an excess of 2 trips during morning peak, 4 trips during day non-peak, 7 trips during evening peak and a trips during night non-peak. We can give them all to feeder bus service 240! :)
Although feeder bus service 240 would still have less number of trips (except during day non-peak) than feeder bus services 241 and 242, that service actually has trunk bus services 30 and 154 to complement it.
Meanwhile, imagine what we could do with the number of trips we would save after we shorten some of the bus routes to Joo Koon Bus Interchange. :)
it is a pity that u did not become the transport minister... can help SG gov to save alot of money....
Originally posted by lemon1974:it is a pity that u did not become the transport minister... can help SG gov to save alot of money....
Really, think about how many jobs would be made redundant when the number of trips is reduced.
There may not be any impact on jobs when we reduce the number of trips on bus services 243G and 243W, as we could re-deploy the affected bus captains to the new bus service 258. Likewise, we could re-deploy the bus captains affected by the relocation of bus route 257 to the new bus service 256.
Whereas for the bus captains who are affected when we relocate bus routes 182, 251, 254 and 255, we could re-deploy some of them to bus services 99 and 194 - While the rest have to be re-deployed to other bus services, or they would be made redundant.
This is why I suggest that we "give" trips (bus captains and buses) to other bus services. We may not have so much of excess resources to "give" at such a scale that I suggested earlier, but at least they could be "given" to a few other bus services to benefit more people. They can be any type of bus service; they do not have to be feeder bus services. :)
This would ensure that all bus captains continue to be deployed. However, we cannot ensure the same for the buses. Because the new bus service 258 will use new buses provided by the BSEP (Bus Service Enhancement Programme), it is inevitable that some buses will become excessive. We could let them be spare buses at the Soon Lee Bus Depot, but I think it is better to deploy them to replace the non-WAB (not Wheelchair Accessible) buses instead; use the excess buses to replace and retire the non-WAB buses. This can help to accelerate the launch of WAB (Wheelchair Accessible) bus services on all public bus routes in Singapore. :)
Anyway, I observe that most buses at the Boon Lay Bus Interchange today are already WAB buses. There may be a small number of buses that are excessive and non-WAB. For such buses, we could retire them directly.
Flyer about the opening of Joo Koon Bus Interchange.
Hi. I am pleased to inform you that the flyer is now available.
I am not sure if the flyers have been placed at Boon Lay Bus Interchange.
I went onto the website of SBS Transit.
At the tab titled "Joo Koon Bus Interchange", there is a hyperlink to the PDF version of the flyer.
For convenience, you may click on the link below to view the flyer straightaway:
There are only 21 days for Joo Koon Bus Interchange to open
According to the flyer (http://www.sbstransit.com.sg/download/jki_flyer.pdf), the allocation of berth is as follows,
B1 - 254 • 255 • 256
B2 - 253 • 257 • 258
B3 - 99 • 182 • 182M