SMRT to get DDs soon
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Originally posted by SMB128B:
Explain the existence of its DDs.
Citaro doesn't take that long as it does not have as much pax.
And how often do you visit Bedok?
Citaro with full house pax also take long time to unload what. Plus I didn't compare it with DD.
I've been there a lot of times, I don't see much long queue that is caused by 222. I don't think by changing ur fleet on 222 will affect much. Don't forget most svc there have slightly longer freq(on average) than 222.
Even if there's 1/2 times where long queues are created because of 222, I don't think there's a need to change to bendy.
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Originally posted by TIB429E:
Citaro with full house pax also take long time to unload what. Plus I didn't compare it with DD.
I've been there a lot of times, I don't see much long queue that is caused by 222. I don't think by changing ur fleet on 222 will affect much. Don't forget most svc there have slightly longer freq(on average) than 222.
Even if there's 1/2 times where long queues are created because of 222, I don't think there's a need to change to bendy.
I agree.
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Originally posted by TIB429E:
Citaro with full house pax also take long time to unload what. Plus I didn't compare it with DD.
I've been there a lot of times, I don't see much long queue that is caused by 222. I don't think by changing ur fleet on 222 will affect much. Don't forget most svc there have slightly longer freq(on average) than 222.
Even if there's 1/2 times where long queues are created because of 222, I don't think there's a need to change to bendy.
Yeah, what I said before, change made does not justify fleet overhaul for SBST.
So we've reached a consensus here uh?
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Unless you follow NB4L all validators can board/alight but SGreans KS mentality will mske it worse...
Saw pple let peeps alite b4 boarding for london 148,390
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Originally posted by SMB128B:
Yeah, what I said before, change made does not justify fleet overhaul for SBST.
So we've reached a consensus here uh?
Paiseh for the Citaro line.
But then if u wanna intro bendy to SBST, u can try putting on 225 as the route distance is short.
I also seen 225 DD pack to the door, which I believe the upper deck is rather empty.
And yeah, 222 is rather like Wdl 913E, slightly longer distance but all alighting at 1 place. Unlike 912 where passengers can choose their direction and which only last 10mins.
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Originally posted by TIB429E:
Paiseh for the Citaro line.
But then if u wanna intro bendy to SBST, u can try putting on 225 as the route distance is short.
I also seen 225 DD pack to the door, which I believe the upper deck is rather empty.
And yeah, 222 is rather like Wdl 913E, slightly longer distance but all alighting at 1 place. Unlike 912 where passengers can choose their direction and which only last 10mins.
Only difference is, 913 is SMRT (should use bendies) while 222 is SBST (needless for the hassle to switch to bendies).
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Originally posted by SMB128B:
Only difference is, 913 is SMRT (should use bendies) while 222 is SBST (needless for the hassle to switch to bendies).
913E liao, crossover to 960 ones only. Can give a try also
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I am confused.
What exactly is the Double Decker bus model that SMRT is procuring?
Is it just the 103 units of Alexander Dennis Enviro500 (mentioned in a Facebook post) or does it also include around 100 units of MAN Lion's City DD?
Because according to http://publictransportsg.wordpress.com/2014/03/21/smrts-new-double-deck-buses/ - a rather credible source that has "predicted" many new bus routes - it seems that SMRT is procuring Double Decker buses from two brands (MAN and Alexander Dennis), instead of just that one brand (Alexander Dennis) which we have (more) sources to confirm it.
If it is true that SMRT is procuring two models of Double Decker bus, then this may explain why the dates vary in some sources; Previously, someone shared with me a picture of a SMRT tender document showing that the Double Decker buses will be introduced in August 2014. This week, SMRT say that the Double Decker buses will be introduced in June 2014.
At first, I thought that SMRT is accelerating the procurement process, thus they can introduce the Double Decker buses in June 2014. Now that I have read this article from http://publictransportsg.wordpress.com/2014/03/21/smrts-new-double-deck-buses/ , I think I know why there are two different dates: SMRT is procuring two models of Double Decker bus.
Therefore, instead of around 100 units, SMRT is actually introducing around 203 units of Double Decker bus - by the end of this year.
Currently, according to Wikipedia, including the one with 'SMB' prefix, SMRT has 324 units of Articulated bus.
On the assumption that part of the around 203 units of Double Decker bus will replace some units of Articulated bus, say 75% of them (since BSEP is primarily about enhancing existing bus services, then secondarily about adding new bus services), around 152 units of Articulated bus will be replaced with around 152 units of Double Decker bus by the end of this year.
But then again, I thought SMRT said that "while the double-deckers will be useful for adding capacity on services into the city, they are not as suitable for heavily-used feeder routes" (http://ride.asiaone.com/news/general/story/smrt-get-double-deckers) - which implies that it may continue to have Articulated buses in its fleet?
So, I guess SMRT wants to just reduce the composition of Articulated buses in its fleet, and not totally replace them with Double Decker buses.
Could this be SMRT's only procurement of Double Decker buses at this juncture, and there will be procurement of new Articulated buses next year to replace the units of Articulated bus that would remain next year?
Please correct me if I am wrong.
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Originally posted by Pervertedboy:
A Double Decker bus has one exit door.
An Articulated bus has two exit doors.
Technically, because it has two times the number of exit doors, the unloading of passengers is two times faster for Articulated bus.
Assuming Ceteris Paribus, this means that the amount of time an Articulated bus spends at a bus bay is half the time a Double Decker bus spends at the bus bay.
As less time is spent at the bus bay, an Articulated bus would take a shorter time to operate a route, as compared to a Double Decker bus operating the same route. This would therefore enable commuters to get to their destination faster.
When commuters can get to their destination in a shorter time, they will be happy, be more satisfied with the bus services, etcetera.
More exit doors, Better ride.
Another abuse of the term "ceteris paribus".....
What is there to assume in "all things held constant"?
Even if all things were held constant, but then both buses have different pax distribution to start with (the shorter rear trailer for the bendy means that the rear exit door serves less people in fact), the assumption that the bendy would unload pax in HALF the time is fallacious.
And yes.
Like what some have mentioned here, bendies are a pain in the ass if you are in the bus behind: Most stops only allow 1 bendy a time.
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Originally posted by Pervertedboy:
I am confused.
What exactly is the Double Decker bus model that SMRT is procuring?
Is it just the 103 units of Alexander Dennis Enviro500 (mentioned in a Facebook post) or does it also include around 100 units of MAN Lion's City DD?
Because according to http://publictransportsg.wordpress.com/2014/03/21/smrts-new-double-deck-buses/ - a rather credible source that has "predicted" many new bus routes - it seems that SMRT is procuring Double Decker buses from two brands (MAN and Alexander Dennis), instead of just that one brand (Alexander Dennis) which we have (more) sources to confirm it.
If it is true that SMRT is procuring two models of Double Decker bus, then this may explain why the dates vary in some sources; Previously, someone shared with me a picture of a SMRT tender document showing that the Double Decker buses will be introduced in August 2014. This week, SMRT say that the Double Decker buses will be introduced in June 2014.
At first, I thought that SMRT is accelerating the procurement process, thus they can introduce the Double Decker buses in June 2014. Now that I have read this article from http://publictransportsg.wordpress.com/2014/03/21/smrts-new-double-deck-buses/ , I think I know why there are two different dates: SMRT is procuring two models of Double Decker bus.
Therefore, instead of around 100 units, SMRT is actually introducing around 203 units of Double Decker bus - by the end of this year.
Currently, according to Wikipedia, including the one with 'SMB' prefix, SMRT has 324 units of Articulated bus.
On the assumption that part of the around 203 units of Double Decker bus will replace some units of Articulated bus, say 75% of them (since BSEP is primarily about enhancing existing bus services, then secondarily about adding new bus services), around 152 units of Articulated bus will be replaced with around 152 units of Double Decker bus by the end of this year.
But then again, I thought SMRT said that "while the double-deckers will be useful for adding capacity on services into the city, they are not as suitable for heavily-used feeder routes" (http://ride.asiaone.com/news/general/story/smrt-get-double-deckers) - which implies that it may continue to have Articulated buses in its fleet?
So, I guess SMRT wants to just reduce the composition of Articulated buses in its fleet, and not totally replace them with Double Decker buses.
Could this be SMRT's only procurement of Double Decker buses at this juncture, and there will be procurement of new Articulated buses next year to replace the units of Articulated bus that would remain next year?
Please correct me if I am wrong.
There is nothing to correct or speculate.
Just take the buses as they come la.
The sources are credible?
I wonder.
I wouldn't read too much in people's attempts to wiggle information where it should not be.
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Don't forget there are some new HDB towns coming up soon at the north west area and north east area. not all bus service might be run by sbs. So SMRT might increase the buses to service those new hdb town.
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Originally posted by Pervertedboy:
I am confused.
What exactly is the Double Decker bus model that SMRT is procuring?
Is it just the 103 units of Alexander Dennis Enviro500 (mentioned in a Facebook post) or does it also include around 100 units of MAN Lion's City DD?
Because according to http://publictransportsg.wordpress.com/2014/03/21/smrts-new-double-deck-buses/ - a rather credible source that has "predicted" many new bus routes - it seems that SMRT is procuring Double Decker buses from two brands (MAN and Alexander Dennis), instead of just that one brand (Alexander Dennis) which we have (more) sources to confirm it.
If it is true that SMRT is procuring two models of Double Decker bus, then this may explain why the dates vary in some sources; Previously, someone shared with me a picture of a SMRT tender document showing that the Double Decker buses will be introduced in August 2014. This week, SMRT say that the Double Decker buses will be introduced in June 2014.
At first, I thought that SMRT is accelerating the procurement process, thus they can introduce the Double Decker buses in June 2014. Now that I have read this article from http://publictransportsg.wordpress.com/2014/03/21/smrts-new-double-deck-buses/ , I think I know why there are two different dates: SMRT is procuring two models of Double Decker bus.
Therefore, instead of around 100 units, SMRT is actually introducing around 203 units of Double Decker bus - by the end of this year.
Currently, according to Wikipedia, including the one with 'SMB' prefix, SMRT has 324 units of Articulated bus.
On the assumption that part of the around 203 units of Double Decker bus will replace some units of Articulated bus, say 75% of them (since BSEP is primarily about enhancing existing bus services, then secondarily about adding new bus services), around 152 units of Articulated bus will be replaced with around 152 units of Double Decker bus by the end of this year.
But then again, I thought SMRT said that "while the double-deckers will be useful for adding capacity on services into the city, they are not as suitable for heavily-used feeder routes" (http://ride.asiaone.com/news/general/story/smrt-get-double-deckers) - which implies that it may continue to have Articulated buses in its fleet?
So, I guess SMRT wants to just reduce the composition of Articulated buses in its fleet, and not totally replace them with Double Decker buses.
Could this be SMRT's only procurement of Double Decker buses at this juncture, and there will be procurement of new Articulated buses next year to replace the units of Articulated bus that would remain next year?
Please correct me if I am wrong.
I have never heard of Gemilang or MAN mentioning the new MAN DD for SMRT...neither from SMRT side.
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Originally posted by carbikebus:
Hopefully..cant wait to see them.I will definately leave my car and motorbike at home for a week to board it!For a start i think 106,167,171,190,700,972 will get it first
171 & 700 can't use DD because of low trees near SCGS. If anything, 61 should get them first. In fact, 61 needs 99% DD fleet. -
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61 67 190 965 969 will get...
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Originally posted by TIB1096A:
61 67 190 965 969 will get...
How can 67 get please explain? Why should 61 and 965 get when the loading does not justify... and SMRT does not have many DDs to spare like SBST to put on any service. -
Originally posted by iveco:
171 & 700 can't use DD because of low trees near SCGS. If anything, 61 should get them first. In fact, 61 needs 99% DD fleet.
171 does not need DDs. 700 should have 4 DDs and can get. There is no problem. The problem of trees is more towards Newton - Little India stretch. 61 should max get 2 DDs in AM direction of BBT to Eunos and PM peak otherwise. Even if it does not get DDs it is okay. The loading does not justify. The loading for DD is only from Ngee Ann during those school timings. Why do you think SMRT not given bendies to 61 anymore? Has had only 1 bendy.Maybe you live along the route of 61 and want it for your personal reason, but there are more needy services that need DDs to start with. When SMRT procures a 400 DDs or so, then they can start experimenting on routes like 61, 965.
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Actually 67 can hve a justification for DDs. If you hve seen it during peak hours, It does get crowded at various parts of its route like cck 2 dunearn/little india, geylang/bedok. I hve always felt if it stayed sbs, it wld be a dd user by now along the lines of 14, 147. Agreed when dtl starts, some of the bukit timah crowd will poof, it will still be a feeder for cck way to dtl.
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I think svc61 should just get Bendy(Or even WAB Bendy when SMRT buys them), that should be enough.
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Originally posted by Pervertedboy:
I am confused.
What exactly is the Double Decker bus model that SMRT is procuring?
Is it just the 103 units of Alexander Dennis Enviro500 (mentioned in a Facebook post) or does it also include around 100 units of MAN Lion's City DD?
Because according to http://publictransportsg.wordpress.com/2014/03/21/smrts-new-double-deck-buses/ - a rather credible source that has "predicted" many new bus routes - it seems that SMRT is procuring Double Decker buses from two brands (MAN and Alexander Dennis), instead of just that one brand (Alexander Dennis) which we have (more) sources to confirm it.
If it is true that SMRT is procuring two models of Double Decker bus, then this may explain why the dates vary in some sources; Previously, someone shared with me a picture of a SMRT tender document showing that the Double Decker buses will be introduced in August 2014. This week, SMRT say that the Double Decker buses will be introduced in June 2014.
At first, I thought that SMRT is accelerating the procurement process, thus they can introduce the Double Decker buses in June 2014. Now that I have read this article from http://publictransportsg.wordpress.com/2014/03/21/smrts-new-double-deck-buses/ , I think I know why there are two different dates: SMRT is procuring two models of Double Decker bus.
Therefore, instead of around 100 units, SMRT is actually introducing around 203 units of Double Decker bus - by the end of this year.
Currently, according to Wikipedia, including the one with 'SMB' prefix, SMRT has 324 units of Articulated bus.
On the assumption that part of the around 203 units of Double Decker bus will replace some units of Articulated bus, say 75% of them (since BSEP is primarily about enhancing existing bus services, then secondarily about adding new bus services), around 152 units of Articulated bus will be replaced with around 152 units of Double Decker bus by the end of this year.
But then again, I thought SMRT said that "while the double-deckers will be useful for adding capacity on services into the city, they are not as suitable for heavily-used feeder routes" (http://ride.asiaone.com/news/general/story/smrt-get-double-deckers) - which implies that it may continue to have Articulated buses in its fleet?
So, I guess SMRT wants to just reduce the composition of Articulated buses in its fleet, and not totally replace them with Double Decker buses.
Could this be SMRT's only procurement of Double Decker buses at this juncture, and there will be procurement of new Articulated buses next year to replace the units of Articulated bus that would remain next year?
Please correct me if I am wrong.
"Credible source" is insider information....some people never change -
Originally posted by Pervertedboy:
SBS Transit should learn from SMRT - on how they allocate the various bus types to its routes based on traffic conditions, and with consideration for its commuters - and also introduce (re-introduce) Articulated buses into its fleet.
Similarly, SBS Transit can consider having Articulated buses for its feeder services that need high capacity buses. This would benefit commuters on short routes, and also people who are unable (or have difficulty) climbing stairs.
Meanwhile, the Double Decker buses can be re-allocated to trunk routes, where some of them are in need of higher frequencies.
I believe SBST ever thought buying some bendies hence SBS998 &999 demonstrator buses existed then. but looking at the congested bus interchanges and bus depots; worse still-the new interchanges seem to get even smaller. how to accomodate bendies? 1 solution is to build more new bus hubs to spread the load of existing busy bus interchanges. -
Originally posted by SBS3688Y:
I believe SBST ever thought buying some bendies hence SBS998 &999 demonstrator buses existed then. but looking at the congested bus interchanges and bus depots; worse still-the new interchanges seem to get even smaller. how to accomodate bendies? 1 solution is to build more new bus hubs to spread the load of existing busy bus interchanges.Can't solve the issue of congested interchanges if your no. of services there is high. Even if u don't use bendy, I don't think there would be much difference.
The best solution is just expand your bus hubs. Nowadays, people talk about convenient.
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Originally posted by Vicknaa:
Actually 67 can hve a justification for DDs. If you hve seen it during peak hours, It does get crowded at various parts of its route like cck 2 dunearn/little india, geylang/bedok. I hve always felt if it stayed sbs, it wld be a dd user by now along the lines of 14, 147. Agreed when dtl starts, some of the bukit timah crowd will poof, it will still be a feeder for cck way to dtl.
I am not questioning whether 67 deserves DDs. It definitely does, but the route cannot accommodate DDs because of low trees between Newton and Little India. Same reason why 48, 66 do not have DDs.67 is actually a very long route. LTA should really consider splitting it into two. No one takes it for such long distance.
67 --> Tampines Interchange loop @ Rochor Canal (ply DDs)
767 --> CCK Interchange <--> Lor 1 Geylang Terminal
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Originally posted by TIB429E:
I think svc61 should just get Bendy(Or even WAB Bendy when SMRT buys them), that should be enough.
Again, let me re-iterate. There are other services like 857/985 that deserve high capacity buses more than 61 today. The loading on sv 61 has dropped quite a lot (part of it could be people have opted for other services). Problem with 61 is also its long winding route all the way to Eunos.The route of 61 should be shortened to improve on-time arrivals. I suggest even if it does Bukit Batok to Harbourfront Interchange, it caters to most of the load. From there on you have other services.
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Originally posted by SBS3688Y:
I believe SBST ever thought buying some bendies hence SBS998 &999 demonstrator buses existed then. but looking at the congested bus interchanges and bus depots; worse still-the new interchanges seem to get even smaller. how to accomodate bendies? 1 solution is to build more new bus hubs to spread the load of existing busy bus interchanges.
LTA has to build more bus interchanges and terminals. Else how is it going to accommodate 80 new services. Most interchanges are bursting already. Moreover, if it does not merge/rationalize services, you are not even going to get relief from existing services. Hence, no option but to build new terminals / interchange. I hope they have thought about it.