GCM New/Transferred Buses
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Originally posted by SBS3004X:
Rumours are around on facebook that SG5755K - SG5761S will be transferred from TT to GAG.
I thought till SG5764J?No?
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Originally posted by carbikebus:
Its no longer matter which model go to which Operators bro..Beside K230UBs and OC500LEs...Im not suprised if SBST and GA gets MAN too..
I understand LTA let GA trial the BYD K9..Hopefully deploy on svc 36 and let it burn..
yes but the whole point of GCM is to lower costs, and allocating operators alien models or too many type of models is not going to help.
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Originally posted by TIB868X:
yes but the whole point of GCM is to lower costs, and allocating operators alien models or too many type of models is not going to help.
LTA already buy the buses,Whatever buses they allocated the operators just take..
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Originally posted by TIB868X:
yes but the whole point of GCM is to lower costs, and allocating operators alien models or too many type of models is not going to help.
Barely one month in and GCM/BCM is already starting to unravel itself.
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Originally posted by TIB868X:
yes but the whole point of GCM is to lower costs, and allocating operators alien models or too many type of models is not going to help.
The rationale for such a move is straighforward. LTA is getting operators to familiarise with different models and makes so as to prepare them to deal with depot shifts.
We must recognise that operators, under GCM, will change from time to time. This also means that one single operator will also handle different depots as they win and lose different contracts.
We must also recognise that the buses in a depot, being government assets, are not going to move with the operators. So SBST cant bring its entourage of Citaros and Wrights from say HGDEP to Bulim, for example, and expects the SMRT makes there to be kicked out.
Seeing as such, operators must know how to deal with different makes in order to prepare themselves for a depot shift.
There is a reason why LTA is injecting all sorts of bus makes into different depots. This is to further reduce the effort an operator must waste when it handles the fleet from another depot (imagine if GA handles a full fleet of SBST makes at Loyang. If one day it shifts to Woodlands and is faced by a sea of SMRT fleets...) By diversifying the fleet now, operators are spending the effort now to learn how to handle different models, so in the future they do not have to.
But if anything, I hope if they go for a uniform fleet it will not be the Wrights due to its lacklustre interior fitting... Owing to the lousy, blockheaded design principle of SBST.
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Originally posted by SMB128B:
The rationale for such a move is straighforward. LTA is getting operators to familiarise with different models and makes so as to prepare them to deal with depot shifts.
We must recognise that operators, under GCM, will change from time to time. This also means that one single operator will also handle different depots as they win and lose different contracts.
We must also recognise that the buses in a depot, being government assets, are not going to move with the operators. So SBST cant bring its entourage of Citaros and Wrights from say HGDEP to Bulim, for example, and expects the SMRT makes there to be kicked out.
Seeing as such, operators must know how to deal with different makes in order to prepare themselves for a depot shift.
There is a reason why LTA is injecting all sorts of bus makes into different depots. This is to further reduce the effort an operator must waste when it handles the fleet from another depot (imagine if GA handles a full fleet of SBST makes at Loyang. If one day it shifts to Woodlands and is faced by a sea of SMRT fleets...) By diversifying the fleet now, operators are spending the effort now to learn how to handle different models, so in the future they do not have to.
But if anything, I hope if they go for a uniform fleet it will not be the Wrights due to its lacklustre interior fitting... Owing to the lousy, blockheaded design principle of SBST.
I do not think wholesale depot shifts are specified in GCM contracts. That is a very unlikely scenario, unless LTA is expecting at least one operator to go bust in the next few years.
Contract areas (and consequently, depots) changing hands (e.g. Bulim going to SBS Transit) is still at least 5 years away. There is no guarantee the mechanic taking on a new model now is going to stay on for the next five years. Even so, operators are given at least 6 months in advance to make such preparations.
For every extra model the operator receives, the operator has to buy and store its own spare parts. That adds extra costs. If the parts are out of stock, do not expect to ask rival operators for help. They do not and will not. LTA might be able to ask nicely (the same way they ask for drivers from SBS Transit during SMRT drivers strike), but they cannot compel another operator in such a scenario.
The risk for operating a small variant fleet is that they can remain out of service for months while waiting for the spare parts to be shipped in. We have seen that with many of the demonstrator buses.
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TT got Citaros,B9TLs,E500s and A22s and possibly A95s
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Originally posted by sgbuses:
I do not think wholesale depot shifts are specified in GCM contracts. That is a very unlikely scenario, unless LTA is expecting at least one operator to go bust in the next few years.
Contract areas (and consequently, depots) changing hands (e.g. Bulim going to SBS Transit) is still at least 5 years away. There is no guarantee the mechanic taking on a new model now is going to stay on for the next five years. Even so, operators are given at least 6 months in advance to make such preparations.
For every extra model the operator receives, the operator has to buy and store its own spare parts. That adds extra costs. If the parts are out of stock, do not expect to ask rival operators for help. They do not and will not. LTA might be able to ask nicely (the same way they ask for drivers from SBS Transit during SMRT drivers strike), but they cannot compel another operator in such a scenario.
The risk for operating a small variant fleet is that they can remain out of service for months while waiting for the spare parts to be shipped in. We have seen that with many of the demonstrator buses.
Exactly seeing that GCM will inevitably see the chances of a switch in operator (and hence, a shift in depots for operators and subsequently the fleets) that LTA is prompting operators to equip themselves with parts NOW than later, when they will be frantically hunting for the parts. This is done by mixing up the fleets for different depots beforehand, before GCM kicks in full force.
Tl;dr, SBST and GA will inevitably have MAN and perhaps ADL in their fleets. They ought to, too.
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I feel its better to have at least 3 different brands for all operators.
SBST:Volvo B9TLs/MAN A95/MAN A95s/ADL E500 12.8m/Scania K230UBs/MB Citaros
SMRT:MAN A95s/Volvo B9TLs/ADL E500s/ADL E500 12.8m/MB OC500LE/MAN A22/MB Citaros
Tower Transit:Volvo B9TLs/ADL E500s/MAN A95s/MAN A95s 12.8m/MAN A22/MB Citaros
Go Ahead:Volvo B9TLs/MAN A95s/MAN A95s 12.8m/MAN A22s/MB Citaros
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Originally posted by sgbuses:
I do not think wholesale depot shifts are specified in GCM contracts. That is a very unlikely scenario, unless LTA is expecting at least one operator to go bust in the next few years.
Contract areas (and consequently, depots) changing hands (e.g. Bulim going to SBS Transit) is still at least 5 years away. There is no guarantee the mechanic taking on a new model now is going to stay on for the next five years. Even so, operators are given at least 6 months in advance to make such preparations.
For every extra model the operator receives, the operator has to buy and store its own spare parts. That adds extra costs. If the parts are out of stock, do not expect to ask rival operators for help. They do not and will not. LTA might be able to ask nicely (the same way they ask for drivers from SBS Transit during SMRT drivers strike), but they cannot compel another operator in such a scenario.
The risk for operating a small variant fleet is that they can remain out of service for months while waiting for the spare parts to be shipped in. We have seen that with many of the demonstrator buses.
What you are saying applies to the entire country as well. Are you suggesting that all buses in Singapore be standardised? I understand where you are coming from on that. But the current situation is that we do have multiple models (Citaro vs A22, B9TL vs E500 vs A95). Given that situation, it's better to have all operators at least familiar with all the types.
The problem arises mainly with the DD fleet, where there is a more obvious imbalance. A22s are arguably not a very small minority, but the E500s and A95s each are.
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Anyway, updates on the BYD K9 - it is confirmed to be under Go-Ahead. Pictures were posted on "Wheels Singapore" and "(buses[in]gapore)" Facebook pages, depicting the bus parked in some warehouse (believed to be HDT, the bus dealer) with a white front and a side wrap, which is partially covered in tarp.
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Originally posted by CB2883J:Anyway, updates on the BYD K9 - it is confirmed to be under Go-Ahead. Pictures were posted on "Wheels Singapore" and "(buses[in]gapore)" Facebook pages, depicting the bus parked in some warehouse (believed to be HDT, the bus dealer) with a white front and a side wrap, which is partially covered in tarp.
Advice from Jackie Chan...
Translation: China things will explode
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Originally posted by CB2883J:
What you are saying applies to the entire country as well. Are you suggesting that all buses in Singapore be standardised? I understand where you are coming from on that. But the current situation is that we do have multiple models (Citaro vs A22, B9TL vs E500 vs A95). Given that situation, it's better to have all operators at least familiar with all the types.
The problem arises mainly with the DD fleet, where there is a more obvious imbalance. A22s are arguably not a very small minority, but the E500s and A95s each are.
So what should we do with the minority fleet? Isn't that the whole point?
For every new model introduced into an operator, that operator has to spend money to induct drivers, mechanics, recovery crews, operational staff, and others. If they choose not to train all crew, either they have to impose operational restrictions or take a chance.
As far as I know, TT is doing neither. Perhaps that might explain the A95s being mothballed in the depot.
I am seeing things in the GCM/BCM that even Transperth, as bad as it can be sometimes, knows it should not do.
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Originally posted by sgbuses:
So what should we do with the minority fleet? Isn't that the whole point?
For every new model introduced into an operator, that operator has to spend money to induct drivers, mechanics, recovery crews, operational staff, and others. If they choose not to train all crew, either they have to impose operational restrictions or take a chance.
As far as I know, TT is doing neither. Perhaps that might explain the A95s being mothballed in the depot.
I am seeing things in the GCM/BCM that even Transperth, as bad as it can be sometimes, knows it should not do.
I see. But they've got to do something about the A95s in the end. It's clear that they are still being purchased and registered under GCM, but neither TT nor GA is taking them as of now (and according to your logic - which makes sense - they shouldn't). Then who do you say they should go to?
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Anyway, what's up with the BYD?
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Originally posted by CB2883J:
I see. But they've got to do something about the A95s in the end. It's clear that they are still being purchased and registered under GCM, but neither TT nor GA is taking them as of now (and according to your logic - which makes sense - they shouldn't). Then who do you say they should go to?
Give them to SMRT. Take back the BSEP E500 MMCs in return and give them to TT. Any excess B9TLs with TT as a result should then go to GA. Maintain the original arrangement as it was a couple of months back.
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Originally posted by CB2883J:
Anyway, what's up with the BYD?
There is a massive opportunity in the future. TT is adopting runtimes perfect for BYD electric buses. And I don't see how a true-three door SD solution is going to arrive anytime soon. So, why not?
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Like that better sold off those Scania K230UBs,Volvo B9TL CDGEs and MB OC500LEs.
SBST and SMRT use only Mercedes-Benz Citaros,MAN A22s,MAN A95s and Volvo B9TLs while TT and GA use Mercedes Benz Citaros,MAN A22s,ADL E500s and Volvo B9TLs.
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Registered on 25 July 2016
SG5390D
SG5395R -
If E200 got 12m version or E300 got 2 door variant we should standardise all buses from ADL. After all we already have the E500s.
Transperth has been using B8RLE of late. Maybe we can use these instead of Citaroes or A22s. There is already a strong Volvo presence in the form of B9TLs.
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Registered on 26 July 2016
SG5118A
SG5119Y
SG5120S -
The buses above are registered under TT.
85 remaining.
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Originally posted by TIB987K:
The buses above are registered under TT.
85 remaining.
How come you know its under TT?Why they need so many DDs?They got only 26 service and one depot.
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I strongly believe the newly registerred buses being parked at Bulim are just temporarily parked there until the operator is ready to take over the buses just like SMRT B9TLs and GAG A95s (I suspect).
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Originally posted by SMB5007J:
I strongly believe the newly registerred buses being parked at Bulim are just temporarily parked there until the operator is ready to take over the buses just like SMRT B9TLs and GAG A95s (I suspect).
I concour that,Because most of SMRT depots got no more space to park until they scrap their DAFs and Mark II bendy buses first.