What's the diff?

• cck_190

  2 May 04, 20:42

  Can anyone tell me what's the difference between ZF & Voith gearboxes.
  
  and...
  
  Please clarify to me what are the gearboxes are really used for?
  
  Thanks
• Scania

  2 May 04, 20:54

  ZF gearboxes are the gearboxes which makes a howl (something like yyyyyyyyyaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaoooooooooo). The howl is not obvious on some of the ZF habits and ZF Volgern Bendies and Lance C245. When it decleerates, it makes some soft air-letting sound.
  Voith is the gearbox which makes the accleration sound (something like hhhhhoooooorrrrr). This sound is obvious in The Voithed Tridents, Volgern bendies, Voithed 12XX habits (heard from another bus-entusiaist that 1207Y is a ZF). It is not as obvious on the 10XX Voithed habits. Then when it deceleerates it makes a whine (somthing like Wheeeeeeeeee) that can be heard on all Voithed buses.
  Gearboxes help Vehicles accelerate.
• cck_190

  2 May 04, 21:52

  Originally posted by Scania:

  ZF gearboxes are the gearboxes which makes a howl (something like yyyyyyyyyaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaoooooooooo). The howl is not obvious on some of the ZF habits and ZF Volgern Bendies and Lance C245. When it decleerates, it makes some soft air-letting sound.
  Voith is the gearbox which makes the accleration sound (something like hhhhhoooooorrrrr). This sound is obvious in The Voithed Tridents, Volgern bendies, Voithed 12XX habits (heard from another bus-entusiaist that 1207Y is a ZF). It is not as obvious on the 10XX Voithed habits. Then when it deceleerates it makes a whine (somthing like Wheeeeeeeeee) that can be heard on all Voithed buses.
  Gearboxes help Vehicles accelerate.

  What gearbox do Tibs MB0405 use?
• The_Bus_Guide

  2 May 04, 22:03

  Originally posted by cck_190:

  Can anyone tell me what's the difference between ZF & Voith gearboxes.
  
  and...
  
  Please clarify to me what are the gearboxes are really used for?
  
  Thanks

  ZFs shift at about 1500rpm while Voiths hold them a bit higher at around 1800rpm. Acceleration wise ZF come out top. On the other hand, Voiths excel in top end speed as they have an overdrive which kicks in at about 70 km/h. All automatic gearboxes have torque converters, ZF'z are more audible than Voiths. Torque converters prevent the engine from stalling when the vehicle is stationary. It also provides a bit of extra power during acceleration. The whistling noise under braking is made by the integrated retarder. The retarder creates a magnetic field around the engine, slowing down its revolution and helps the vehicle to stop.
  
  All engines have an optimal working range. Gearboxes are essential so that the engine is always operating within this range. For example, let's say an engine works best at around 1500 rpm. When moving off, you'll need to select a gear that will provide enough torque to move the vehicle at 1500rpm. Of course, more torque equals less speed. Hence, you'll need to select another gear which will make the vehicle go faster at 1500rpm. In this way, the engine will not be under or over utilised, prolonging its life.
• SBS9818A

  2 May 04, 22:04

  Originally posted by cck_190:

  What gearbox do Tibs MB0405 use?

  ZF 4HP500. One can hear the distinct ZF howl during acceleration and gear change from first to second.
• The_Bus_Guide

  3 May 04, 07:38

  Originally posted by SBS9818A:

  ZF 4HP500. One can hear the distinct ZF howl during acceleration and gear change from first to second.

  Don't get the gearchange and torque converter sounds mixed up. If you do, you'll end up getting 5-speed instead of 4. At a certain rpm, the torque converter will kick in and you'll hear a rise in pitch. After that you'll hear the pitch drop; that is when the bus engages second gear.
• SBS9816E

  3 May 04, 13:32

  Hmm, seems that i could post something under this thread...
  
  How could you identify the engine sound between a Volvo Olympian 3 Axle under the 9200-9400, and 9401 to 9670?
• SBS9816E

  3 May 04, 13:44

  Regarding to the difference of ZF and Voith,here's something that I could share with you guys:
  
  1. Mercedes O.405G Habit
  The Habit with ZF gearbox, will have a distinct 'cat yell' produced. In some cases, you can't actually get hear it, as the engine sound might covered it up. The ZFs are 4-speed gearbox, therefore you could hear 4 distinctive change of gearbox. However one has to beware about the slip gear change, ie the high pitch yell in the beginning, to the lower yell of the next gear change.
  
  The Habit with Voith gearbox, do have distinct whistle, that is produced when decelerating. Most of the O.405G Habit with Voith gearbox are of 3-speed gearbox. However, the newer Habits, like TIB 1244 - TIB 1247, might have a 4 speed Voith, but no whistle produced during the deceleration of the vehicle. However, one can notice the Voiths by hearing the rather 'dry' engine sound.
  
  2. Volvo Super Olympians & Tridents
  Both of these double deckers from SBST do hold up the first gear very long. This is because they are equipped with Voith gearbox. In the Tridents, you can hear the whistle when they are decelerating. In the Super Olympian, you would get to hear the gears retarding, when they are at a pretty high speed.
  
  NB: The Super Olympian Demo, ie SBS 9888 Y, is a ZF.
  
  3. Volvo Olympian 3 Axle, Leyland Olympian 3 Axle, Volvo B10Ms, TIBS Mercedes Benz O.405, Hino HS3KRKA, Scania L113CRB, Nissan Diesel (UD)
  
  These buses are using ZF4HP500 gearbox. They have very distinctive ZF 'yell'.
  
  4. Scania N113CRB, Volvo Olympian 2 Axle, Volvo B10M (DM3500)
  These buses are using Voith gearbox. You can hear its whistle during acceleration and deceleration.
  
• SBS9818A

  3 May 04, 20:44

  Originally posted by SBS9816E:

  Regarding to the difference of ZF and Voith,here's something that I could share with you guys:
  
  1. Mercedes O.405G Habit
  The Habit with ZF gearbox, will have a distinct 'cat yell' produced. In some cases, you can't actually get hear it, as the engine sound might covered it up. The ZFs are 4-speed gearbox, therefore you could hear 4 distinctive change of gearbox. However one has to beware about the slip gear change, ie the high pitch yell in the beginning, to the lower yell of the next gear change.
  
  The Habit with Voith gearbox, do have distinct whistle, that is produced when decelerating. Most of the O.405G Habit with Voith gearbox are of 3-speed gearbox. However, the newer Habits, like TIB 1244 - TIB 1247, might have a 4 speed Voith, but no whistle produced during the deceleration of the vehicle. However, one can notice the Voiths by hearing the rather 'dry' engine sound.
  
  2. Volvo Super Olympians & Tridents
  Both of these double deckers from SBST do hold up the first gear very long. This is because they are equipped with Voith gearbox. In the Tridents, you can hear the whistle when they are decelerating. In the Super Olympian, you would get to hear the gears retarding, when they are at a pretty high speed.
  
  NB: The Super Olympian Demo, ie SBS 9888 Y, is a ZF.
  
  3. Volvo Olympian 3 Axle, Leyland Olympian 3 Axle, Volvo B10Ms, TIBS Mercedes Benz O.405, Hino HS3KRKA, Scania L113CRB, Nissan Diesel (UD)
  
  These buses are using ZF4HP500 gearbox. They have very distinctive ZF 'yell'.
  
  4. Scania N113CRB, Volvo Olympian 2 Axle, Volvo B10M (DM3500)
  These buses are using Voith gearbox. You can hear its whistle during acceleration and deceleration.
  

  Not to forget Voith gearbox equipped O405Gs sound very throaty.
• BlessingSatan

  6 May 04, 10:26

  K,How about the Allisons?From the previous one w/o the retarder to the current World series and i understand that Darts using it right my fellow friends?
• SBS9818A

  6 May 04, 18:19

  Originally posted by BlessingSatan:

  K,How about the Allisons?From the previous one w/o the retarder to the current World series and i understand that Darts using it right my fellow friends?

  Darts use Allison AT545 gearboxes. Hydraulically driven, if I'm not wrong.
• BlessingSatan

  6 May 04, 18:26

  Originally posted by SBS9818A:

  Darts use Allison AT545 gearboxes. Hydraulically driven, if I'm not wrong.

  Like the one LO2x use?
• xin1jun2

  6 May 04, 21:05

  Originally posted by SBS9818A:

  Darts use Allison AT545 gearboxes. Hydraulically driven, if I'm not wrong.

  more info: the merc of1417 and b57s also use allison. the hino ht238 also allison. the hino rk176s also allison. seems that allison gearbox very hot in the 80s.
  
  now we have zfs and voiths.
  
  i like zf gearbox for cat yell
  
  while the whistling down of the voith is cool.
  
  zyx
• SBS9818A

  7 May 04, 21:31

  Originally posted by BlessingSatan:

  Like the one LO2x use?

  LO2X uses Allison World Transmissions. Different, if I'm not wrong.
• BluBlur

  7 May 04, 21:45

  Originally posted by cck_190:

  What gearbox do Tibs MB0405 use?

  The entire 0405s use ZF. For 0405Gs it's split up into ZFs and Voiths as follows:
  
  ZF: Hispano 849B-904A, Hispano-Habit / Volgren 1019Z-1023K, 1061A, 1063U-1187X, 1198P-1207Y
  Voith: 1024H-1060C, 1062Y, 1188T-1197S, 1208U-1247G
  
  The DAF SB220 uses Voith too.
  
  Edit: Forgot about the Citaro-alikes for ZF: 973A-1001Z.
• SBS9818A

  7 May 04, 21:52

  Originally posted by BluBlur:

  The entire 0405s use ZF. For 0405Gs it's split up into ZFs and Voiths as follows:
  
  ZF: Hispano 849B-904A, Hispano-Habit / Volgren 1019Z-1023K, 1061A, 1063U-1187X, 1198P-1207Y
  Voith: 1024H-1060C, 1062Y, 1188T-1197S, 1208U-1247G
  
  The DAF SB220 uses Voith too.

  Isn't 1050G the last one with a Voith?
• ^tamago^

  7 May 04, 22:09

  Originally posted by SBS9818A:

  Isn't 1050G the last one with a Voith?

  nopes.
• Windy_hates_B10TLs

  13 May 04, 12:21

  The TIBS (now SMRT Buses) have 5 speed ZFs...a 5HP 500. Because they are governed to 60km/h, as just about all Singaporean heavy and goods vehicles are, they don't ever go into 5th gear. The only gearboxes that go into top gear are the 4 speed Voiths in the O.405Gs, and the Mk III B10Ms with 3 speed Voiths, and O.405s with SBST which have a 3 speed Mercedes Benz W3E.110 gearbox. The B10Ms with 4 speed Voiths only go to 3rd, and the Scania N113s when they had a 4 speed Scania gearbox went into 3rd after governing. It was after the governing thast the problems with the Scania gearbox really became costly, and hence the whole fleet was converted to the Voith gearbox, hence this loud whooosh you get in these buses. With the Scania gearboxes, you could not hear a thing, other than road noise, and the sound from the a/c or forced ventilation in the non-a/c N113CRBs.