Does God Exist??
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Originally posted by dumbdumb!:
well, regretfully, it's only best if serious answer seekers find a church to seek their answers. it's definitely more productive
ever occured to you that some people don't exactly feel comfortable stepping into one (for various reasons)?
besides, what's wrong with getting 'answers' from random christians?
i've gone to a christian conference before and i got oh so much more from it than any church. and i did not speak to a single pastor at the conference. just lots of christians who were eager to share their faith.
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Originally posted by dumbdumb!:
poor chap i agree
tried to engage the christians and got lambasted for playing ard
which proves what i said earlier
is bs answer the only excuse to avoid stuff?
u noe, like my boss told everyone, try to be a bit more creative
maybe question his intelligence like miracles & prophecies did
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Originally posted by udontknowme:
ever occured to you that some people don't exactly feel comfortable stepping into one (for various reasons)?
besides, what's wrong with getting 'answers' from random christians?
i've gone to a christian conference before and i got oh so much more from it than any church. and i did not speak to a single pastor at the conference. just lots of christians who were eager to share their faith.
plutonians different from singaporeans
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Originally posted by udontknowme:
ever occured to you that some people don't exactly feel comfortable stepping into one (for various reasons)?
besides, what's wrong with getting 'answers' from random christians?
i've gone to a christian conference before and i got oh so much more from it than any church. and i did not speak to a single pastor at the conference. just lots of christians who were eager to share their faith.
it's nothing wrong, really. continue to go to christian conferences. i'm glad you're benefiting there =)
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does it matter?
since no one can prove it....
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Originally posted by dumbdumb!:
it's nothing wrong, really. continue to go to christian conferences. i'm glad you're benefiting there =)
expensive. can't afford. i forked out the $300 for a very 'special' reason.what most other people did was ask for 'donations'. i can't remember the word they used for this.
there was even a 'christian' explanation on why this is acceptable (which i cannot remember...). But i'm not comfortable with it at all, and therefore cannot go around asking people to give me money to sponsor me for such things... -
Originally posted by udontknowme:
expensive. can't afford. i forked out the $300 for a very 'special' reason.what most other people did was ask for 'donations'. i can't remember the word they used for this.
there was even a 'christian' explanation on why this is acceptable (which i cannot remember...). But i'm not comfortable with it at all, and therefore cannot go around asking people to give me money to sponsor me for such things...which conference did you attend?
from my knowledge. most (if not all) christian conferences are free. yes, there are love offerings, but you're not required to give.
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Originally posted by laurence82:
poor chap i agree
tried to engage the christians and got lambasted for playing ard
which proves what i said earlier
is bs answer the only excuse to avoid stuff?
u noe, like my boss told everyone, try to be a bit more creative
maybe question his intelligence like miracles & prophecies did
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Originally posted by dumbdumb!:
which conference did you attend?
from my knowledge. most (if not all) christian conferences are free. yes, there are love offerings, but you're not required to give.
ever heard of campus for christ...?they used to go by a different name some years ago...which i also cannot remember. haha.
(ok. i googled. i think it used to be called campus crusade. i'm not sure if it's only in North America or if it's international...)
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Originally posted by dumbdumb!:
typical
sigh
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Originally posted by udontknowme:
ever heard of campus for christ...?they used to go by a different name some years ago...which i also cannot remember. haha.
(ok. i googled. i think it used to be called campus crusade. i'm not sure if it's only in North America or if it's international...)
it's international. and u don't have to give or pay anything. everything is provided for by the members themselves. they paid for the food, and drinks out of their own pockets. it's a sacrifice, but we believe it's a sacrifice worth giving if someone sincere can hear the message.
you don't have to give any money, and i'm sure they made it very clear that if you are a guest or a non believer, you are not expected to participate in the love offering.
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Originally posted by dumbdumb!:
it's international. and u don't have to give or pay anything. everything is provided for by the members themselves. they paid for the food, and drinks out of their own pockets. it's a sacrifice, but we believe it's a sacrifice worth giving if someone sincere can hear the message.
you don't have to give any money, and i'm sure they made it very clear that if you are a guest or a non believer, you are not expected to participate in the love offering.
http://www.campusforchrist.org/eastwc2008/what-to-expect/and meals are not provided...
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Originally posted by udontknowme:
http://www.campusforchrist.org/eastwc2008/what-to-expect/and meals are not provided...
http://www.campusforchrist.org/
and
are different.
i can only speak for the latter.
as for the costs. they probably only expect christians to attend (we don't mind), it looks like an event only christians would attend anyway.
if the cost bothers you, maybe you can talk to a christian about it (since i think many were interested in sharing their faith with you), and work something out.
u're not local are you?
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technically, i can afford to pay $300. it's other issues regarding the money and how the people paying for it got their money that bothered me. but that's another issue for another day and thread since my issue is not with whether or not God exists. for now,i'm going home, finally! and about that question, i don't hold a singapore passport...
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Originally posted by udontknowme:
technically, i can afford to pay $300. it's other issues regarding the money and how the people paying for it got their money that bothered me. but that's another issue for another day and thread since my issue is not with whether or not God exists. for now,i'm going home, finally! and about that question, i don't hold a singapore passport...
ok
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Originally posted by laurence82:
poor chap i agree
tried to engage the christians and got lambasted for playing ard
which proves what i said earlier
is bs answer the only excuse to avoid stuff?
u noe, like my boss told everyone, try to be a bit more creative
maybe question his intelligence like miracles & prophecies did
Yeh, what I tried to do is only ask questions for christians to answer. They are a group of people with faith and I assume they should be able to clear any doubt I got. Its not playing on my part. Otherwise, why would I bother to ask so many questions when I can just hack care about whether its true or not.
Unfortunately, the answers I read only serves to create more doubt. Right now, after reading the answers given, I got a lot more questions to ask but I guess there's no point asking them since I am supposedly deemed a critic though not obvious by their choice of words.
Even if I do post my new questions, I think I will get similiar answers again.
I got the feeling christians are unsure of their history and thus unable to explain some questions posted or maybe they got no explantion for something and that why chose not to answer.
I am not about to create a flaming war here and I am kind of glad Laurence82 jumped out in my defence because I ask simply to know more. And who knows, one day, u might be like us, questioning faith.
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Why don't you ask God? Oh, wait.
Ok sorry for that. What I want to say is, i guess it doesn't matter if God does exist or not. Because if He doesn't, would you stop being a good person? If you wouldn't, then whether He exists (for you) or not is immaterial. The only important thing is you don't stop ever becoming the best person you can be.
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Originally posted by jgho83:
Yeh, what I tried to do is only ask questions for christians to answer. They are a group of people with faith and I assume they should be able to clear any doubt I got. Its not playing on my part. Otherwise, why would I bother to ask so many questions when I can just hack care about whether its true or not.
Unfortunately, the answers I read only serves to create more doubt. Right now, after reading the answers given, I got a lot more questions to ask but I guess there's no point asking them since I am supposedly deemed a critic though not obvious by their choice of words.
Even if I do post my new questions, I think I will get similiar answers again.
I got the feeling christians are unsure of their history and thus unable to explain some questions posted or maybe they got no explantion for something and that why chose not to answer.
I am not about to create a flaming war here and I am kind of glad Laurence82 jumped out in my defence because I ask simply to know more. And who knows, one day, u might be like us, questioning faith.
oh, i have been here questioning, not their faith, but their lack of integrity when responding to certain issues....thats like since 2004
its easier for them to blame u for playing around, insinuate that u are too unintelligent (compared to them) etc etc..than to say they dont have a clue or anything
my personal belief as to why this forum fell apart that, is that not only there are non believers who genuinely played around, but that's almost insignificant compared to the constant squabbles among denominations here and the lack of integrity when responding to issues..
believe me, i know hoards of forumers who are christians whom i often go outing with and they think the people here are idiots
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Originally posted by jgho83:
Yeh, what I tried to do is only ask questions for christians to answer. They are a group of people with faith and I assume they should be able to clear any doubt I got. Its not playing on my part. Otherwise, why would I bother to ask so many questions when I can just hack care about whether its true or not.
First of all, let's examine your definition - a group of people with faith.... what is "faith" to you? Faith, at best, in an intangible thing. When Christians say that we have faith in God, we are challenged to prove the existence of God. When Christians say that we believe in the Bible, we are challenged to prove the validity of the Bible.
So at the end of the day, if you say that we are a group of people of faith, and we say we believe in God and the Bible, are you going to ask us to prove it? If I cannot prove the existence of God and the validity of the Bible, are you going to call use delusional? or stupid? (mind you, that has been done before).
Originally posted by jgho83:Unfortunately, the answers I read only serves to create more doubt. Right now, after reading the answers given, I got a lot more questions to ask but I guess there's no point asking them since I am supposedly deemed a critic though not obvious by their choice of words.
Even if I do post my new questions, I think I will get similiar answers again.
I have always thought that a forum such as this is not the right platform for answers.
1. Members are lay people, many of whom are no different from you. We have our personal understanding and comes in varying levels of spiritual maturity. Some are young and hot-blooded and others are old and jaded. But for some strange reason we are all gauged on the different yardstick from non-believers.... we are not suppose to retaliate when pushed.
2. If you think the answers are the same, does it not also mean that the Christians you are asking are believing the same thing?
Which is why, I'd previously said that you should go to a church to look for better Christian answers, but of course, you had chosen NOT TO.
Originally posted by jgho83:I got the feeling christians are unsure of their history and thus unable to explain some questions posted or maybe they got no explantion for something and that why chose not to answer.
I am not about to create a flaming war here and I am kind of glad Laurence82 jumped out in my defence because I ask simply to know more. And who knows, one day, u might be like us, questioning faith.
Not to worry, I question my faith all the time.
That being said, are you willing to engage me on a personal level? no, not like meeting up, but thru PM?
Many critics are not willing to engage on a private level. If you are, you may PM me any questions you may have. This way, it is unlikely that it will evolved into a flame war.
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to jgho83
tat applies to me as well...u can PM me if u like...but i would advise tat u start a thread or do it thru a thread...but if u wan answers from me, be prepared to read a whole big chunk of things...
disclaimer: wadever so-called evidence i provide u r the evidence tat I MYSELF consider as gd enuff evidence to prove tat God exists...u can call them private proofs...but u must understand tat wad is convincing to me may not be convincing to u...after all, a man's meat is another man's poison...
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Actually, sometimes it's better not to say anything if you are not sure of the answer.
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God is he whose existence is without a Beginning and whose existence is without an End.
God is the Light, the one that Guides.
The One whom with His Guidance His belivers were guided, and with His Guidance the living beings have been guided to what is beneficial for them and protected from what is harmful to them.
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Originally posted by nabil:
God is he whose existence is without a Beginning and whose existence is without an End.
God is the Light, the one that Guides.
The One whom with His Guidance His belivers were guided, and with His Guidance the living beings have been guided to what is beneficial for them and protected from what is harmful to them.
All things must have a beginning and an end else it won't exist. Hence God doesn't and cannot exist. -
Hello people.
I think this question really seeks each individual's experiences in life, and I ask forgiveness from members involved in this thread on my opinions before proceeding, so whatsoever that is spoken of in the aftermath of this apology is well taken care of.
Our lives are bounded unto this earthly world where it seemed a place stranded between the illusionary of the duality of things; the first wonder and glimpse of a formidable creation set forth by the unknown, who, was shrouded behind the holy veil.
The entirety of universe, a unification of all probabilities, a totality of all hierarchical forms of life and object, undoubtedly through aeon, did not less affirm us the presence of a creator; it reassured to us again and again via humanity in the expounding of complex technologies and mysteries of nature that there is an inevitable evidence of a divine being, an intervention of divinity that had touched the hearts of us subconsciously at a point in time of our lives. And such is the presence of divinity in all things that it seemed almost unfeasible in all ways to the relinquishing of it nor of contempting it, and that alone which arouses the spiritual sensitivity in humans stood eminently as the touch of the creator; one that its sanctity could not be forgotten.
Humanity was not superior because of the outspring of constant inventions and technological creations that would theorize the tough willpower of survival in history, nor of the capability in victory over nature; but truely, it is the beauty of virtues and morals bornt in blood of Humanity, and where in its heart lies a special capacity that is dedicated for the union with the divine being. And wherein the lives of all, there is a unity in the seeking of the purpose of Life; the divinity signal and the calling of the divine being, a true calling that has to be answered to even till time of death. It is definitely that through the testimonial of Humanity's existence, illustrates how the divine being surely favoured Humanity with the bestowing of richness in Grace unconditionally.
Science is on the rocky path to the unveiling of holy veil while Religion, a path of illumination, a journey through the holy veils to the divine being under the constant dedication of oneself to the divine calling and the selfless outpouring of Faith.
In Deus nos fides.
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Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:
All things must have a beginning and an end else it won't exist. Hence God doesn't and cannot exist.To christians God is the beginning...but the end hasn't come so how u know God cannot exist?
but maybe i understand how u know...cos u r anti-religion
