1+1+1 = 1 ?
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but how to get to heaven since heaven is the focal pt of creationistic religions??? i dun tink judaism teaches no heaven and hell...at least nt according to wad i noe...i didnt say the unique point makes it the true religion...hinduism, islam, judaism and christianity(we count from the entioch church in the bible)...christianity is the oldest...i would say its the combination of everything we discussed put tgr tat helps one determine if the religion is the only true religion...i dun tink hinduism professes to bve the one true religion...so tat leaves christianity, islam and judaism...
remember earlier on, i said tat the nature of creators(even humans) is tat we wun create wad we dun desire? Allah does nt desire a r/s wif his followers...judaism according to wad u said is juz believing in God but r/s is nt impt...christianity, the God is very relational to the pt tat salvation is thru a r/s wif him...
wadever i have shared are my own ways of determining the religion for myself...of cuz i muz confess tat i started off creationistic cos i always believed in a creator even though i come from a free-thinking family...so from there i eliminate and was left wif christianity...this method may nt work for everyone but it worked for me...
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Originally posted by Tcmc:
despondent,
Throughout my discussion with you, you pointed out a few points that you think help prove your God. --
1. Scriptures
2. Personal experiences
3. Unique point of salvation through grace
But I have shown you that ALL other religions prove their respective Gods with the same points too.
So I am a bit confused.
Since you have left christianity, do you think it is ok to let them be? It is the choice of the christians to believe in Christianity.
Knowing that christianity cannot provide answers, we have the freedom to seek else where.
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and i have to emphasize again tat in christianity, r/s are a result of creation and nt sth tat juz happen lidat...
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Just be happy....there are more than one choice for food....same for religions....
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Originally posted by Demon Bane:
Just be happy....there are more than one choice for food....same for religions....
Yes, man, precisely my sentiments. That is why I am seeking else where.
I don't deny christians don't like to see christians leave their faith and come out with something .. . . .. . .. . . I want to stress not every christian is forever a christian. Humans are allowed to choose their own belief. In Singapore, we are fortunate to be given religious freedom.
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Originally posted by winsomeea:
Yes, man, precisely my sentiments. That is why I am seeking else where.
I don't deny christians don't like to see christians leave their faith and come out with something .. . . .. . .. . . I want to stress not every christian is forever a christian. Humans are allowed to choose their own belief. In Singapore, we are fortunate to be given religious freedom.
Yeap....to each its own....French will say french food best and Chinese will say theirs the best....etc. Choose the food that will fill you....and be happy about it...
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Originally posted by despondent:
cos buddhism is seldom slammed by ppl compared to christianity??? ppl find no-creator religion more acceptable?
creationism is simple, naive and absurd to say the least. its just doesnt made any sense. anyway creationism was the thought created 2 millennium ago, where science, knowledge and technology were at best rudimentary unlike now. we have the benefit of the doubt.
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Originally posted by Susanteo2011:
no such thing as religions.............
all things, living or non-living..................are no-things............
since physical reality already proven to be an illusion.................
no use telling this to a christian. this is alien to them, as it is impossible not to have a creator. dun waste your breath.
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Originally posted by despondent:
but how to get to heaven since heaven is the focal pt of creationistic religions??? i dun tink judaism teaches no heaven and hell...at least nt according to wad i noe...i didnt say the unique point makes it the true religion...hinduism, islam, judaism and christianity(we count from the entioch church in the bible)...christianity is the oldest...i would say its the combination of everything we discussed put tgr tat helps one determine if the religion is the only true religion...i dun tink hinduism professes to bve the one true religion...so tat leaves christianity, islam and judaism...
remember earlier on, i said tat the nature of creators(even humans) is tat we wun create wad we dun desire? Allah does nt desire a r/s wif his followers...judaism according to wad u said is juz believing in God but r/s is nt impt...christianity, the God is very relational to the pt tat salvation is thru a r/s wif him...
wadever i have shared are my own ways of determining the religion for myself...of cuz i muz confess tat i started off creationistic cos i always believed in a creator even though i come from a free-thinking family...so from there i eliminate and was left wif christianity...this method may nt work for everyone but it worked for me...
depsondent
1. Ask most jews today, they will tell you the word "sheol" in the Torah does not refer to hell but to death. Most jews do not believe in a literal hell.
So what you know is misinformed.
2. Like I already told you. OLDEST religion is NOT equals to the MOST TRUE. You said christianity is older than buddhism which I dont see how it can be. Jesus started christianity 500 years later than Prince Gautama Buddha. So if your logic says older means more true, than Buddhism is more true than Christianity? Don't tell me Christianity is also in the old testament, because the old testament is about Judaism and not Christianity.
3. You keep saying that your unique point of "relationship with Jesus" makes your religion more true.
I already told you. Every religion has its unique point. Yes your religion has a UNIQUE point. But so does every other religion. But your problem is you dont bother to study other religions in depth!
A unique point does NOT make a religion more true.
Why cant you try to get this into your mind or try to understand facts instead of having bias opinion?
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Originally posted by winsomeea:
Since you have left christianity, do you think it is ok to let them be? It is the choice of the christians to believe in Christianity.
Knowing that christianity cannot provide answers, we have the freedom to seek else where.
winsomeea
Me leaving christianity doesnt mean I cannot ask christians about their religion right? I am learning. Thanks. :)
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i was juz sharing my way of determining the religion for myself...u dun have to follow it...the Antioch church in the bible were the 1st ppl to be called christians...like i said b4, it depends how u define christianity...to u it started from jesus, but to me it didnt...u see wd i mean by apple-orange argument? our platforms are different to begin wif...why am i the one misinformed abt jews? why cun u be the one misinformed? in wd way are the words of a jrew more accurate than a book i read written by a theologian who has studied religions???
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Originally posted by despondent:
i was juz sharing my way of determining the religion for myself...u dun have to follow it...the Antioch church in the bible were the 1st ppl to be called christians...like i said b4, it depends how u define christianity...to u it started from jesus, but to me it didnt...u see wd i mean by apple-orange argument? our platforms are different to begin wif...why am i the one misinformed abt jews? why cun u be the one misinformed? in wd way are the words of a jrew more accurate than a book i read written by a theologian who has studied religions???
1. Well try to go online and ask a few practising jews? They can tell you the torah doesnt mention hell. Or if you have jewish friends. I talked to a jewish friend of mine. He told me. And also a few onlin epracticing jews. So I believe you're misinformed. But if you have talked to jews before, tell me about it? The theologian you read about is a christian and most christians know nothing about jjews, judaism and the torah.
2. Yes our platforms are different. But I am coming from an objective, unbiased platform. I see all religions objectively and find the similarities and differences. Unfortunately, you seem to come from a very "christian" platform which is not very objective? Don't you think so?
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tats cos i have a religion alredi and found my own set of beliefs...its usually those who do not have a set of religious beliefs or are stil searching who can be more ''objective''...u also need to consider the nature of the religion...creationistic religions tend to be very ''biased'' cos they believe in a SINGLE creator...
in case u dunno, theologians dun juz study christianity...they study religions...its a masters' degree in religious studies nt christianity alone...
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despondent
1. I have talked to jews. And they tell me what judaism is about. Yet you only read a theologian's writings who's probably a CHRISTIAN, and you say I am wrong but you are correct????? Is your pride getting in the way? It's ok to be wrong sometimes you know? Why dont you find out from jews instead of christians?
2. Thank you for agreeing with me that you are less objective. Why dont you strive to be more objective and fair?
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despondent,
I am curious. Do you know what Jews think about Jesus?
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there r 2 types of jews..which one u referring to?
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Lol. Then just tell me what these 2 types of jews believe about Jesus.
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messianic jews believe the same as christians...salvation is by grace of God and the man who camne 2000yrs ago was indeed Jesus the Son of God...
the other type of jews believe Jesus is the Son of God but the man who came 2000yrs ago wasnt jesus...so they stil await the 1st coming...there are the jews who believe salvtion is by keeping the commandments of God nt by grace since Jesus hasnt come as a sacrifice yet...
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despondent,
Yes I agree with the messianic jews.
BUT YOUR SECOND kind of jews is hahahahahahah. You are very misinformed my friend!
The 2nd kind jews are jews who practice judaism and read the torah. They wait for a HUMAN king to save them from their troubles. And the 2nd kind of jews see jesus as a "lost" man. They believe jesus had good intentions but was misguided.
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despondent,
The jews who practise judaism dont even care about jesus. They dont even think he was a son of god or that he was a supernatural being! Most jews believe that jesus was a misguided prophet who misinterpreted the torah old testament!
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hmmm i wish brey was here...brey is a messianic jew who became messianic after 1st being original jew...he has disappeared from this forum if nt he would be a gd person to clarify our discussion regarding jews...the old-timers in the forum wil noe him...
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n wasnt this a frendly discussion? why do i see mockery from u???
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1. Sorry for that laugh but really I have never heard of that kind of jews you described.
2. Did you ask brey about the views of orthodox jews regarding jesus? Because I have spoken to a few jews who practised judaism and they tell me that. Unless....you're telling me that you know judaism better than my jewish friends?
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i definitely wun claim tat...juz puzzled abt the different set of info we got...i asked brey b4 but i cun remember all the details...the book i read told me original jews dun believe the man who came 2000yrs ago was truly Jesus the Son of God...tats why to them salvation is thru obeying the torah...
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despondent,
Jews who practised judaism believe that there was this man called Jesus 2000 years ago. But to them, Jesus was not the son of god. To them, Jesus was a misguided jewish prophet.
In Islam however, Jesus has a special status. He is a prophet but human nonetheless, not a God or Son of God.