SAF teaches troopers what form of Unarmed Combat?
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police no more training TKD ah?
aiyo....thanks for the update....
haiz generation has change liao..... -
maybe NS can be further shortened after phasing out such half-hearted training. since it's not very practical in real combatOriginally posted by IntegraType-R:tats good enuf lor.....wat to expect from those wif no martial arts background?
even the warm-up is siong for them liao......
im a assistant uci....whenever i see those who phia mia to split already close 1 eye liao....as long as they learn wat movement n wat to do is good day liao
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actually its not half hearted training lah.....its sort of close quarter attack/defence lah.....since riflemen oso fight in FIBUA...its good oso to equipt one wif such training.....those who dun put in effort is their lost.....or more tekan for them lor.....jus like everything u do in the army, if u put in effort things will be much more easiler for everyone....as the saying goes gimme 1 good 1 and chop chop good day
btw thats a good pic of a turning kick to the head -
Originally posted by IntegraType-R:actually its not half hearted training lah.....its sort of close quarter attack/defence lah.....since riflemen oso fight in FIBUA...its good oso to equipt one wif such training.....those who dun put in effort is their lost.....or more tekan for them lor.....jus like everything u do in the army, if u put in effort things will be much more easiler for everyone....as the saying goes gimme 1 good 1 and chop chop good day
btw thats a good pic of a turning kick to the head
ya. i agree. glad you like it too 
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Like what i have sae, close combat is still very important in modern warfare. This is so when enemies are overunning yr defenses and charging toward you. What will you do if yr rifle happens to be jammed or out of ammunition at that time?We all know that the answer will be hitting him back with your rifle.This is what you learned in basic combat combat known as rifle techniques.If u had watch war films like saving private ryan or band of brothers before, you will still able to c some form of unarmed combat or bayonet fighting in the movies. Teaching the men close combat is also trying to help them build up their confident so that they know what they will have to do or how to fight without their rifles. Always remember that in wartime, supplies are shortage.You will need all means to save your ammunition to complete your main objective.
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Dude...pls dun make the system taught by SAF seem so deadly here.
I went through UC and part of ICCT before i had to leave the army.
UC = Bullshit.
You should not be encouraging high kicks. High kicks are dangerous moves that makes you susceptible to being taken down. Also, with SBO on, it is worse. We should train to kick Just enough so you can kick up to Rib level. Any time spent trg to kick higher than that is time wasted in a CQC program.
One-step sparring = waste of time. To train timing and sense of distance,m you should make us do sparring with Gloves.
Kicks dun have to look nice, but correct. Kicking the pads shoud not be a test of how loud you can shout, but how hard you can kick.
And you can cut out the no contact sparring in UC1. Wasting time. It degenerates into a shout and slap fest.
Oh and Cut the kata. It teaches you to dance.
Also, LOTS more emphasis should be put into making sure ppl keep their guard up. This is not tae kwan do. Ppl punch your face if your hands are down.
UC1 Grading test = Bullshit. Frens that kick with "chichken wings" thereby demonstrating inflexibility and a lack of power still pass! Yet you see ppl who can kick well but dun shout loud enough fail. Absolute bullshit.
ICCT = since i only went thorugh part of the course, i cant comment much.
BUT please, cut out all the bullshit wrist locks and wrist lock based "throws". When you are fighting and filled with adrenaline, you lose fine motor skills, how can you expect to grab a sweaty wrist and execute your wrist lock w/o kepping punched repeatedly in the face?. Judo and wresting takedown WORK much better. The double-leg takedown should be standard and it works!!!!.
Wrist-lock based hold down = useless for the above reasons. Should be teaching judo based arm + shoulder lock.
Just my 2 cents. SAF Unarmed Combat needs to be changed. -
great analysis i must say. so what would you recommend SAF teach to our soldiers instead?Originally posted by lwflee:Dude...pls dun make the system taught by SAF seem so deadly here.
I went through UC and part of ICCT before i had to leave the army.
UC = Bullshit.
You should not be encouraging high kicks. High kicks are dangerous moves that makes you susceptible to being taken down. Also, with SBO on, it is worse. We should train to kick Just enough so you can kick up to Rib level. Any time spent trg to kick higher than that is time wasted in a CQC program.
One-step sparring = waste of time. To train timing and sense of distance,m you should make us do sparring with Gloves.
Kicks dun have to look nice, but correct. Kicking the pads shoud not be a test of how loud you can shout, but how hard you can kick.
And you can cut out the no contact sparring in UC1. Wasting time. It degenerates into a shout and slap fest.
Oh and Cut the kata. It teaches you to dance.
Also, LOTS more emphasis should be put into making sure ppl keep their guard up. This is not tae kwan do. Ppl punch your face if your hands are down.
UC1 Grading test = Bullshit. Frens that kick with "chichken wings" thereby demonstrating inflexibility and a lack of power still pass! Yet you see ppl who can kick well but dun shout loud enough fail. Absolute bullshit.
ICCT = since i only went thorugh part of the course, i cant comment much.
BUT please, cut out all the bullshit wrist locks and wrist lock based "throws". When you are fighting and filled with adrenaline, you lose fine motor skills, how can you expect to grab a sweaty wrist and execute your wrist lock w/o kepping punched repeatedly in the face?. Judo and wresting takedown WORK much better. The double-leg takedown should be standard and it works!!!!.
Wrist-lock based hold down = useless for the above reasons. Should be teaching judo based arm + shoulder lock.
Just my 2 cents. SAF Unarmed Combat needs to be changed. -
a cocktail of Krav Maga, Sambo, Tukong Moosul and San Shou. never kick when you can punch. take-downs are good for 1 to 1 combat. but when engaged with a group of aggressors, we also need joint-dislocation techniques and long kicking. shoulders should be main targets for dislocation. for kicking, we should optimize the length advantage of our legs and kick at or slightly above groin level. we need to know both stabbing and swinging kicks. a fencer stabs and a parang-wielder swings. stabbing kicks are harder to block but easier to side-step, swinging kicks are the other way round. that's for un-armed combat. also need to learn bayonet strikes.Originally posted by wuming78:great analysis i must say. so what would you recommend SAF teach to our soldiers instead?
San Shou Defeats Full Contact Karate
A victory for Chinese San Shou. In a pioneer team challenge match between Japanese Full-contact Karate & Chinese San Shou Kungfu at the Langfang City Stadium of Hebei province. The San Shou fighters have scored a convincing 3 to 1 victory over the Karateka.
After this victory over Full-contact Karate comes the challenge from Korean Taekwondo fighters. They are all known to be young, below 20 years, but very talented. The San Shou Team however, feels confident of another victory for these Taekwondo fighters are mostly trained in accurately scoring points through various kicks, & may not have enough KO power in their blows. If Korea is sending WTF athletes, then I must agree with the analysis of the Sanda side.
Following that will be what everyone is waiting for - the Showdown between San Shou & Muay Thai. 2 challenges will be held in China & 1 in Thailand. The popularity of these 3 challenge matches is predicted to greatly surpass that of Karate & Taekwondo. Afterall, Muay Thai claims it is the best striking art in existence & the ultimate Ring Sport. Now the organisers have stated that they will not impose any rule restrictions on either side. meaning it will be a truly free style match up. -
Imo,
Boxing/Kickboxing (or Krav Maga which is based off those strikinga rts anyway. The thing is Elbows, Knees and low kicks should be the order of the day) and wrestling/judo/sambo for takedowns and ground defence.
In stand up fighting, isn't distancing, timing and movement the most important elements? These are taught best by distancing drills and full contact sparring with gloves, mouth guard and headgear for safety. Punching Bag and Pads should be used to develop speed, power and endurance.
Takedowns does not neccessarily mean going to the grnd. It can consist of bringing the guy down thus giving stomping opportunities. I feel that the double leg takedown is a high percentage move that should be taught to all soldiers. Similarly, basic Judo throws like O-Goshi is relatively simple and effective.
Ground Defence does not neccessarily mean going to guard. It can consist of how to get up safely from the ground, how to prevent being taken down etc.
Yes, Joint breaks should be taught but again, what should be taught should be relatively high percentage moves. The problem is that in ICCT, wrist locks throws are taught. I feel these "throws" are very low percentage moves against a fully resisting opponent. They also teach hold-downs that utilise wrist locks. The Reverse Arm-bar taught on control and Restraint is much much more useful hold-downs and is a hold down that dun really rely on fine motor skills.
I understand that agression is a very important element of military cqc programs. But no-contact/semi-contact- Compettition Tae Kwon Do-no punching to the face type sparring breed bad habits. Ppl are not keeping their hands up. Agression can be tested by letting the trainee go wild on a punch bag for 3 min. only Ppl who can keep up the pressure and can give powerful strikes for 3 full minutes deserves to pass.
Anotehr thing i dun understand is the apparently lack of emphasis on fighting with the rifle. I understand that these techniques are done in ACCT. However, if it is taught like when i was in BMT, then it is not really effective training. The majority of trg should consist of hitting pads/bags instead of looking good hitting the air. Looking good shoukd be secondary to generating power w/o losing balance.
I am just quite peeved because when i was doing UC, the instructor actually said things like "Punch a little to your left so your friend can block properly" WTF!!!
Also, SAF combat soldiers are relatively fit and have relatively high endurance. Surely the results could be so much better. -
3 very useful components in San Shou complete training are it's simplified multi-adversary versions of Chin Na, Pushing-Hands and Sticky-Hands.
Chin Na is a grappling system, based on rapid joint locking. Grappling refers to the manipulation of another's body to reduce the ability of the other to move in a way that typically would be destructive to you. In other words, it is highly efficient grabbing. The name, "Chin Na," shows this because it means seize and lock in Chinese. Chin Na is about exerting absolute control over one's opponents, at the mental level and the physical.
Chin Na are the joint locking/grappling systems from Chinese martial art styles. two classic reasons for applying Chin Na are as follows:
1. Chin Na allows for the option of controlling and disabling opponents without causing serious harm.
2. Chin Na can be used effectively against large groups of people using a wide variety attacks, armed and unarmed.
Reason number one comes from the development of Chin Na by Shaolin Buddhist Monks. Buddhism is built around a general mandate toward compassion and extreme non-violence. The Shaolin sect of Buddhism differed from other sects of Buddhism by promoting the mastery of the physical self through the martial arts. The Shaolin, however, are still Buddhists, and still followed the Buddhist mandates. Time was invested by the Shaolin into the research of Chin Na, because it allowed for the neutralizing of an attacker using a combination of simple restraint, joint dislocation, and/or intense pain. This was very important to the Shaolin, because such aggression from the attacker indicated that the attacker was spiritually undeveloped, in other words, a child. Choosing to merely neutralize the attacker, rather than cripple or kill him/her, gave the attacker an opportunity to physically recover, and then spiritually grow. Since, by religious training, the Shaolin believe our only reason on this world is for spiritual progress, a more spiritually advanced person extending the opportunity to grow to a foolish child was only logical.
Chin Na was developed by more than the Shaolin, although they were the primary developers. Chin Na exists in some form in all Chinese martial arts. For example, it is a major portion of the Tai Chi fighting set. Chin Na, therefore, covers a range of techniques as broad as the Chinese arts, ranging from gentle response to to combat application. Shaolin Chin Na teaches the mild forms as well the combat forms. Often times the same technique or principle can first be used as as an escort, then as a non-painful restraint, then shifted to a simple pain control, then to a joint dislocation, then be used as a joint tear, then as a set up to a truly brutal and quick response--to the radical extent of tearing off parts of an attacker's body.
Shaolin Chin Na teaches the gentle controls and not only the brutal controls. Besides being more complete, statistically this is a more useful approach. The vast majority of physical encounters do not legally justify high levels of force, and are the result of someone behaving in a stupid fashion.
Tai Chi push hands is an exercise primarily designed to enhance a player’s ability to remain balanced while in contact with an opponent. Push hands training improves one’s ability to disrupt the balance of an opponent by “feeling” where his or her center of gravity is and exploiting it. To protect one’s own balance, a player attempts to diffuse incoming forces by sensing them and redirecting them. Typically, players begin facing each other with contact between hands and elbows and a simple pattern of circular movement. At some mutually expected point early into the movement, players begin to search for a way to disrupt the opponent’s balance while maintaining their own balance through adjustments of position, stance, balance and hand position. When either of the players is “uprooted” or loses balance, the action stops and the players begin again with mutual contact and cooperative movement to start the cycle again. Emphasis is placed on using proper “technique” as opposed to “brute force” to accomplish this task.
Wing Chun sticky hands is an exercise primarily designed to enhance a players’ ability to attack an opponent with, and protect one’s self from open handed strikes, punches, elbows, knees, kicks, grabs, locks, etc.. Sticky hands training begins with players facing each other with arms in contact and a simple “rolling” pattern of movement. At some expected time early on in the “rolling” players begin to exploit each other’s position and movement with sharp, explosive attacks. Pulls, pushes, strikes and grabs are all part of the exercise. When one player manages to create a situation where he has “trapped” the other’s arms and can land clean strikes of his own, play pauses momentarily to reset and begin “rolling” again.
There are many similarities between these two activities. They are both initiated from contact with the opponent. They are both started with a “cooperative” and predictable pattern of cyclical movement. They are both concerned with disrupting the opponent’s balance by attacking his or her center of gravity. They are both learned in stages, moving from predetermined, cooperative patterns of movement at first, to freestyle competitive play at the advanced stages. Both exercises emphasis the use of “sensitivity” and technique over brute force. These training methods are quite similar in many respects. The prior placing of hands between tournament opponents is only to facilitate refereeing or grading. In their combat-oriented versions such as San-Shou, practisioners are taught to block and counter enemy blows and take-down attempts without prior contact with adversaries.
The differences between push hands and sticky hands have to do with intent. The intent of push hands training is to teach a Tai chi player to “stick” to the opponent’s limbs and body. While sticking to the opponent, the Tai Chi player attempts to push, trip or throw. Striking is not the main emphasis in push hands training. The intent of Wing Chun sticky hands training is to strike the opponent while not being struck back. The Tai Chi player will tend to stick to the limbs of an opponent wherever they go, while the Wing Chun player will “chase the body, not the hands” The Tai Chi player will move in circular, flowing patterns while the Wing Chun player will use straight, jolting choppy movements. The differences between these activities are many.
The philosophical underpinnings of each style dictate the training methods used to develop martial skills. Wing Chun is primarily a striking art. ItÂ’s methods deal with cultivating devastating striking ability and defense against strikes. Tai Chi is an art mainly concerned with throws, pushing, pulling and locking. Striking is a major aspect of Tai Chi fighting theory, but not as a part of push hands training. Also, Wing Chun is aimed at striking many times in a short time frame. Tai Chi seems to favor more committed, single attacks of various types. -
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Originally posted by lwflee:............
Takedowns does not neccessarily mean going to the grnd. It can consist of bringing the guy down thus giving stomping opportunities. I feel that the double leg takedown is a high percentage move that should be taught to all soldiers. Similarly, basic Judo throws like O-Goshi is relatively simple and effective.
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i agree take-down followed by stomp is indeed efficient and energy-saving. but when facing a group of enemies, it may be hard to take-down one of them and hold him down for a well-placed stomp, before his friends attack me from behind. in the unfortunate event that the enemy is skilled in martial arts or very limber and nimble, he may be able to resist or even recover from a takedown by reversal maneuvers. take-downs are extremely effective against high-commitment, high-impact moves such as full-swing punches. but against conservative fighters, it may not be the best option to rely on -
Basically, i follow Straight Blast Gym's Phillosophy:
http://www.jkd-kbh.dk/sbg2.wmv
clip on alive vs dead training.
Applicable to all aspects of military trg. Hope some head honchos from the SAF sees this clip. -
Well, close combat is still changing.It is slowly changing to adopt krav maga into the techniques. One good example is the knife threat in Acct(new) which was adopted from krav maga.Krav maga is more suitable for the military as it is battle tested and simple.
As mentioned, Krav Maga ("Contact Combat" in Hebrew) is the official self defense and fighting system used by the Israeli Defense Forces (I.D.F.), Israeli Police and Security Services, and numerous U.S. law enforcement agencies. It is also taught in institutions associated with the Israeli Ministry of Education, and since 1964, Krav Maga has been taught to civilians all over the world as well.
Developed and refined during years of conflict, Krav Maga emphasizes easy-to-learn techniques that have been battle-tested in real, life threatening confrontations. There is nothing flashy about this system.
Krav Maga is comprised of two main parts: self defense and hand to hand combat.
Self defense is the foundation of Krav Maga. Students learn to defend themselves against hostile actions, to avoid injury, and to quickly overcome their assailant. Krav Maga defenses address a wide variety of aggressive acts, such as punches, kicks, chokes, bearhugs, headlocks, grabs, as well as defenses against multiple assailants and assailants armed with a firearm, edged weapon, or blunt object. Students apply the relevant Krav Maga principles and techniques in a multitude of situations, even in unfamiliar or adverse circumstances, such as dark surroundings; from a sitting or lying position; with limited freedom or movement; or under extreme stress and/or fatigue.
Hand to hand combat constitutes a more advanced and sophisticated phase of Krav Maga which teaches how to neutralize an opponent quickly and effectively. It embodies elements related to the actual performance of the fight: tactics, feints, powerful combinations of different attacks, the psychological dimensions of the fight, and learning how to use the environment to your advantage.
In addition, Krav Maga incorporates specialized training methods to not only challenge students physically, but to also install into the student a special mental discipline meant to strengthen the spirit and to develop the ability to deal with violent confrontations under high stress. These training methods have been used in IsraelÂ’s most elite units and have proven themselves in real fighting.
Krav Maga is not merely another school of martial arts based on traditional approaches. It is a modern method characterized by a coherent and logical way of thinking which builds up easy, natural, and practical techniques featuring simple movements of the human body.
The lethal nature of the Krav Maga system simulates real life situations. It teaches people how to save lives and to cope with common street violence. To be effective in the streets, Krav Maga cannot include rules and limitations. Therefore, there are no sport competitions for Krav Maga because it is designed to remain a realistic fighting system.
Indeed there are some similarities between Krav Maga and other martial arts. However, Krav Maga was developed in an environment where the Israeli military could not devote many hours to prolonged hand to hand combat training for their personnel. Therefore, the Krav Maga system was created with great importance placed on bringing students to a high level of skill in a relatively short period of time. There are no katas (forms) or rules in the system. Anything goes when you are fighting for your life!
Krav Maga is much more a survival system dealing with personal safety issues in the context of defending against both armed and unarmed attackers. It is considered to be a modern, highly refined, street fighting system, designed to be utilized against muggings, street attacks, and sexual assaults.
Here are some videos on krav maga.
http://www.kravmagaco.com/videos.php -
Krav Maga looks pretty good but then how you train is more important. Looking at the video clips, one can see that it is training W/O resistance. I hope we are not training like that.
Anyway, Tango12 - you are a UCI right? I hope you look at the clip (http://www.jkd-kbh.dk/sbg2.wmv) i posted above and maybe show it to all UCIs. And i really hope all senior appointment holders in the SAF sees the video clip. It is a summary of all i think is wrong with SAF training. Note that the person who made the video is Matt Thornton who is a Civilian. If Civilians can train in that way...
Glad to hear the SAF is still evolving its CQC system though.
P.S. Have you any idea who the SAF consults for its CQC system? I don't think its secret or anything coz when you go to some martial arts website, they will brag about having helped train SAF soldiers. If not then nvm then.
From the pictures and the techniques i have seen in ICCT, i think they consulted with some HapkiDo guys? Though there are some aikido wrist locks there i do not think Aikido Instructors were really consulted because some of the way things are done is not very Aikido-like.
EDIT: OMG i just heard you incorporated Knife Defenses into the system. I hope you guys dun train like in the video because clearly the "attacker" was not reacting to anything the defender did. I read that in some schools, they use marker pens to test their knife defences. So maybe that is a thought. -
At first, CCT was based on ju jitsu.Thats why u are able to find alot of techniques similar to it.However, after krav maga was introduced,we find that it is more suitable for the military and begin to adopt it.
Well, one must understand now that SAF is very very concern on the safety of the soldiers.The officers or instructors are to write a report if any injuries happened.Also, even for doing throws, the trainees are required to wear headgears now.Any changes or new techniques implement must be approved by the CO or chief of army.That is why u dun get to see dangerous moves in CCT anymore.Remember that the pioneer batch of commandos who learnt the UC used real bayonets for their training on knife defence.Then why is it no more now?Your idea on using pen kife is a gd idea but i dun tink it will be adopted by the army.Also, not all the soldiers are as karang as u tink.Many of them just wanted to serve n fxxx off.They do not even like to serve ns and yet u expect they to be siao on on this.If u ask them to use pen knives in the training, many will either calling the SAF hotline or dare not carry on training.On the next training, you will get to see many on att C.If you are an instructor who faces thousand of diff soldiers everday, u will get wat i mean.
Also, u once feedback that the majority of trg should consist of hitting pads/bags instead of looking good hitting the air. Looking good should be secondary to generating power w/o losing balance. One must understand that many of the units do not have enough punching bags or pads. We did try to give them several punching bags to be put up so that when CCT is conducted, the trainees can train on them.However, the unit fears of the bags been stolen, they rather keep them in the store.Also, to control a company or a whole battlion for training is not an easy task.If you can only ask a few of the trainees to come up to train the punching bags while the rest of the company wait.Soon, u will find those waiting behind playing around and much time is wasted. They can only have 14 lessons for CCT and 1 lesson is onli 2 hrs unlike other countries who have UC almost everyday.(South korea elite force the Black Beret takes UC and TKD everyday n up to 4 hrs a day)
Sometimes, much time is wasted when the medic or supervisng officer is not around.This caused the instructors unable to start the lesson and have to wait for they to arrive 1st.When the unit is busy, they will also cancel some the lessons. -
you may suggest to relevant authorities to replace TKD and hapkido with aikido and Gracie jujitsu instead. because the latter 2 have less high kicking and very simple and safe and needing very little energy. definitely will gain popularity among NSF who are less karangOriginally posted by Tango12:At first, CCT was based on ju jitsu.Thats why u are able to find alot of techniques similar to it.However, after krav maga was introduced,we find that it is more suitable for the military and begin to adopt it.
Well, one must understand now that SAF is very very concern on the safety of the soldiers.The officers or instructors are to write a report if any injuries happened.Also, even for doing throws, the trainees are required to wear headgears now.Any changes or new techniques implement must be approved by the CO or chief of army.That is why u dun get to see dangerous moves in CCT anymore.Remember that the pioneer batch of commandos who learnt the UC used real bayonets for their training on knife defence.Then why is it no more now?Your idea on using pen kife is a gd idea but i dun tink it will be adopted by the army.Also, not all the soldiers are as karang as u tink.Many of them just wanted to serve n fxxx off.They do not even like to serve ns and yet u expect they to be siao on on this.If u ask them to use pen knives in the training, many will either calling the SAF hotline or dare not carry on training.On the next training, you will get to see many on att C.If you are an instructor who faces thousand of diff soldiers everday, u will get wat i mean.
Also, u once feedback that the majority of trg should consist of hitting pads/bags instead of looking good hitting the air. Looking good should be secondary to generating power w/o losing balance. One must understand that many of the units do not have enough punching bags or pads. We did try to give them several punching bags to be put up so that when CCT is conducted, the trainees can train on them.However, the unit fears of the bags been stolen, they rather keep them in the store.Also, to control a company or a whole battlion for training is not an easy task.If you can only ask a few of the trainees to come up to train the punching bags while the rest of the company wait.Soon, u will find those waiting behind playing around and much time is wasted. They can only have 14 lessons for CCT and 1 lesson is onli 2 hrs unlike other countries who have UC almost everyday.(South korea elite force the Black Beret takes UC and TKD everyday n up to 4 hrs a day)
Sometimes, much time is wasted when the medic or supervisng officer is not around.This caused the instructors unable to start the lesson and have to wait for they to arrive 1st.When the unit is busy, they will also cancel some the lessons. -
Originally posted by Tango12:
[quote.]
At first, CCT was based on ju jitsu.Thats why u are able to find alot of techniques similar to it.However, after krav maga was introduced,we find that it is more suitable for the military and begin to adopt it.
Well, one must understand now that SAF is very very concern on the safety of the soldiers.The officers or instructors are to write a report if any injuries happened.Also, even for doing throws, the trainees are required to wear headgears now.Any changes or new techniques implement must be approved by the CO or chief of army.That is why u dun get to see dangerous moves in CCT anymore.Remember that the pioneer batch of commandos who learnt the UC used real bayonets for their training on knife defence.Then why is it no more now?Your idea on using pen kife is a gd idea but i dun tink it will be adopted by the army.Also, not all the soldiers are as karang as u tink.Many of them just wanted to serve n fxxx off.They do not even like to serve ns and yet u expect they to be siao on on this.If u ask them to use pen knives in the training, many will either calling the SAF hotline or dare not carry on training.On the next training, you will get to see many on att C.If you are an instructor who faces thousand of diff soldiers everday, u will get wat i mean.[/quote]
I said Marker Pens. Alternateively, i also heard of some schools rubbind lipstick on their training blades.
Yes training safety is a concern. Wearing headgear means we can now train even more realistically. It is a good move. Kudos to SAF for that since they are not cheap. But since we already have headgear, just slap on some gloves (S$30? But i'm think SAF already have) and mouth guard(cheap ones about s$5?) and you are ready to spar or do some realistic training. You can do alot with gloves. Mixed Martial Arts Gyms, boxing and kickboxing gyms have developed training technioques to train safely. It is from them that we should be learning since these are the guys who actually fight full contact against a fully resisting opponent consistently. They know what works.
Then make them take it out before training. I believe we have identified one of the root of the problems already - Logistical. We do not have enough logistical support. Hmm i always thought that we had enough pads because my unit had enough last time. No matter, i understand the limitations now. All i have to say is the SAF can put in all the dealiest techniques in the syllabus, but w/o proper training, those techniques are useless.
Also, u once feedback that the majority of trg should consist of hitting pads/bags instead of looking good hitting the air. Looking good should be secondary to generating power w/o losing balance. One must understand that many of the units do not have enough punching bags or pads. We did try to give them several punching bags to be put up so that when CCT is conducted, the trainees can train on them.However, the unit fears of the bags been stolen, they rather keep them in the store.
Again logistical problems. Not sure what can be said except i symphatize with the UCIs because they are not goven the proper support to do their job. Some generals need to see this thread. Worse are the discipline problems. Again, hope some generals see this thread.
Also, to control a company or a whole battlion for training is not an easy task.If you can only ask a few of the trainees to come up to train the punching bags while the rest of the company wait.Soon, u will find those waiting behind playing around and much time is wasted. They can only have 14 lessons for CCT and 1 lesson is onli 2 hrs unlike other countries who have UC almost everyday.(South korea elite force the Black Beret takes UC and TKD everyday n up to 4 hrs a day)Sometimes, much time is wasted when the medic or supervisng officer is not around.This caused the instructors unable to start the lesson and have to wait for they to arrive 1st.When the unit is busy, they will also cancel some the lessons.
Again discipline problems, but this time it is worse because it involves OFFICIERS. 'nuff said. Another issue is the commitment of some units. They skip lessons then they should not be able to pass their UC package.
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Overall then it would appear the problems stem from lack of support, logistical or otherwise, for out UCIs. Shame on the leadership is all i can say.
Anyway keep up the good work. Nice to have the perspective of a UCI.
:-) -
Yeah they use very little energy . . .but do you have any idea how long it takes for one to master akido or jujitsu to be effective in combat?Originally posted by boy in blues:you may suggest to relevant authorities to replace TKD and hapkido with aikido and Gracie jujitsu instead. because the latter 2 have less high kicking and very simple and safe and needing very little energy. definitely will gain popularity among NSF who are less karang
It is easy to kick and punch lah, but to train the people to such a stage where you have to go into the enemy's punch and perform some throwing moves on him really takes alot of training and experience. Just look at this, aikido just to move one belt from a white belt you need 12 sessions of 2 hours each minimum. So with 14 sessions of 2 hours, you can barely even cover the basics, not to mention utillising it for actual combat. -
I totally agreed with wat you say... basically, i was previously trained in aikido. After a year of training, i could only confidently say that i understand on how the techniques are performed, but on effective applying it in actual situation is a totally different thing... the instinct of performing a techniques is very important... and it only comes after years of committed training... my sensei once said that one with average talent takes at least 5 years of training for him/her to effectively defend themselves, and in traditional aikido schools, trainees takes at least 7 years in order to attain their 1st dan...Originally posted by CenturionMBT:Yeah they use very little energy . . .but do you have any idea how long it takes for one to master akido or jujitsu to be effective in combat?
It is easy to kick and punch lah, but to train the people to such a stage where you have to go into the enemy's punch and perform some throwing moves on him really takes alot of training and experience. Just look at this, aikido just to move one belt from a white belt you need 12 sessions of 2 hours each minimum. So with 14 sessions of 2 hours, you can barely even cover the basics, not to mention utillising it for actual combat.
so wat i'm trying to say here is that, although aikido may seem to be a effective art by using minimal force to overcome aggressors, but its techniques that involves various spherical movements are difficult to pick up... thus, its is not very suitable for the SAF... as for jujitsu, although there are lesser sphercial movements, effectively picking it up still takes at least 3 years... for NSFs that has only little time to spare, they may not seem to be a good choice...
seriously, in my point of view, striking art like taekwondo and karate may prove to be a better choice, they are easlier to pick up compared to grappling art like aikido, jujitsu or hapkido... at least the soldiers know the correct way of punching and kicking... better than half f*** fists and knee level kicks... I guess this is the problem of conscription.... not enough time to spare...
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What Prestroz said is right.All those martial arts take alot of time to master.Learning and mastering the techniques take years.It is not just going through the motion.Like what i have said before.If you want the soldiers to be a fighter in just 14 lessons is impossible.Why the SAF choose tkd over other martial arts is because tkd is much more straight forward and easy to catch up. If tkd is really that useless then why did bruce lee learn it?People think that he learnt his kicks from gongfu but he learnt it from tkd.All those who learn wushu will know that the famous sidekick by bruce lee doesnt even exist in wushu.He learnt it from a korean tkd master named Lee Jungu.The main objective of close combat is that our soldiers are able to defend themselves instead of standing like a log without knowing what to do.If you learnt CCT before you will noticed that it is focusing more on defending than attacking.Why is this so?Well, our army is more like a peace keeping force.Especially after 911, our army are to protect vital places like jurong island or airport.They are not supposed to anyhow shoot at any suspects.Their duty is to arrest them.That is why saf changes unarmed combat to close combat.UC is meant to kill while CCT is used for control and restraint.This is the reason why CCT has alot of locks in it.Originally posted by Prestroz:I totally agreed with wat you say... basically, i was previously trained in aikido. After a year of training, i could only confidently say that i understand on how the techniques are performed, but on effective applying it in actual situation is a totally different thing... the instinct of performing a techniques is very important... and it only comes after years of committed training... my sensei once said that one with average talent takes at least 5 years of training for him/her to effectively defend themselves, and in traditional aikido schools, trainees takes at least 7 years in order to attain their 1st dan...
so wat i'm trying to say here is that, although aikido may seem to be a effective art by using minimal force to overcome aggressors, but its techniques that involves various spherical movements are difficult to pick up... thus, its is not very suitable for the SAF... as for jujitsu, although there are lesser sphercial movements, effectively picking it up still takes at least 3 years... for NSFs that has only little time to spare, they may not seem to be a good choice...
seriously, in my point of view, striking art like taekwondo and karate may prove to be a better choice, they are easlier to pick up compared to grappling art like aikido, jujitsu or hapkido... at least the soldiers know the correct way of punching and kicking... better than half f*** fists and knee level kicks... I guess this is the problem of conscription.... not enough time to spare... -
If you say that the fact that SAF is using tkd as it is a easier to pick up form of martial arts,then I did recommend the Israeli Krav Maga.As it is a pure form of fighting,its no holds barred...its effectiveness lies in the fact that a good defense requires a good offence.And that the efficiency of it is that Krav Maga is never ever viewed upon as a competitive sport unlike the others like TKD,Wushus Akidio etc..Krav Maga is fighting for your live.
And the uniqueness of Krava Maga also lies in the fact that it has no rules,the only rule being that you must emerge at the end of the fight,ALIVE.
Just my 2cents worth. -
ask them to try muai thai instead. Highly offensive. If you want a good mix of grappling and attacking , try hapkido, but i am not sure how long it will take to use it effectively.
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Yesh - I agree! Imagine a muay thai round house to the thighs....Now imagine the same kick smashing into your thighs - but with BOOTS!!!
DEAD LEG! wahahaha! -
All this talk about which martial arts is pointless unless the trainees are able to master it completely... The SAF does teach Akido etc but only to units like ADF and commandos simply because they're the only ones who have the standards to be able to execute these manoevers under pressure. As an instructor I have seen trainees unable to even execute the most basic front kick to the GROIN level!! With luntuts like these, talking about chinese martial arts and combo martial arts is pointless...
Tango 12 was right when he said that 9 to 13 lessons is too short to perfect anything.. We are steadily moving towards the Krav maga type of unarmed combat involving knee jab and elbow strike etc... But such changes cannot occur overnight simply because anything that has to be put into practice in the SAF needs to have Lesson plans and training directives etc and these things dont just appear from nowhere.. Someone has to sit down and analyse each technique and come up with a training program.. talk is cheap but to actually put it into practice aint easy.
Boy in blues is right about the high kicks and the problems associated with it. We are as said before moving away from the old UC style syllabus. As long as a soldier can react fast and strike fast with power he can travel around the world with just a clenched fist. So please enough of all this thing about which is the best martial art or which ones to combine. We need to teach the soldier to react fast and strike effectively. So what we need now is something to make the gundus respond to a strike and not stand there and say "HUH?????"
I do hope the new syllabus will terach them to do that. I do however feel sad about the instructor who asked the soldier to punch to the side so the guy can block!! Hence I also agree that some instructors need to be more proffessional in how they conduct lessons!!!
Oh boy... Another long reply!!!haha!