New urban warriors
-
if the thing too easy how u wayang the paperwork ? must impress then can get A for the annually accessment or something. they rather spend thousands to get something dat works and is high-tech than a simple thing dat works and can be easily replaced....illogical ? how often have u seen it then....dis is how it goes lor....Originally posted by palmerised:No shit? Stylo mylo so what? If it doesn't work then what's the point. If it's stupid but it works, it's not stupid. Hell you don't even need a fibre-optic to look around corners.. Mirrors would do the job nicely.
just like doctors will not tell u dat cottage cheese+flaxseed diet will cure most cancers, cos if they do nobody go for chemo/radio how they earn $.... -
They might not be rescuing hostages but to avoid any civilian casualities.Originally posted by lwflee:I doubt these guys are supposed to do Hostage rescue. As such i think equipment like the ball camera is a pretty good idea.
Iraq has exposed the shortcomings of normal FIBUA tactics. Grenades do not always work against an intelligent and determined enemy. This is esp so where the buildings have multiple rooms. Thus, as seen in the BBC documentary of the Marines in Iraq, you see the Marines basically leveling enemy held buildings.
I can therefore see the utility of the Ball-camera; Soldier believes that he has seen enemies in building, he lobs a ball through the window to confirm, and then calls in heavy firepower. The ball clearly has some advantages over a mirror or a fibre-optics camera in that the ball can be deployed over a greater range.
The use of the remote control car is a little far-fetched, but then there should be no comlpiants about having it as an option, ya?
But I doubt the ball camera will work as the enemy might just pump some lead into it when they realised that it is not a grenade.
What happens when the camera is damaged or destroyed? Carry the viewer along to the next room or bring spare cameras?
-
Time taken to check out the data from the ball cam is at least 5-15 seconds,which by then you might have lost the element of surprise.Originally posted by lwflee:I doubt these guys are supposed to do Hostage rescue. As such i think equipment like the ball camera is a pretty good idea.
Iraq has exposed the shortcomings of normal FIBUA tactics. Grenades do not always work against an intelligent and determined enemy. This is esp so where the buildings have multiple rooms. Thus, as seen in the BBC documentary of the Marines in Iraq, you see the Marines basically leveling enemy held buildings.
I can therefore see the utility of the Ball-camera; Soldier believes that he has seen enemies in building, he lobs a ball through the window to confirm, and then calls in heavy firepower. The ball clearly has some advantages over a mirror or a fibre-optics camera in that the ball can be deployed over a greater range.
The use of the remote control car is a little far-fetched, but then there should be no comlpiants about having it as an option, ya? -
no no, it worked, it will work, it should work, it must work !...cos i got promoted for it !Originally posted by LazerLordz:Time taken to check out the data from the ball cam is at least 5-15 seconds,which by then you might have lost the element of surprise.
-
I dun think the element of surprise is that important in some circumstances. After all, i dun really care if they die surprised or not and i do not really want to go in SWAT style. These are soldiers, not policemen. I see them, they arm themselves and go "Allahu Akhba", i bombard the building with m203s and frags, and ask for arty/tank supportOriginally posted by LazerLordz:Time taken to check out the data from the ball cam is at least 5-15 seconds,which by then you might have lost the element of surprise.
Further, i think the enemy will take more than 5 seconds to react to the ball.
Eg. Soldiers think that enemies are present in a 2 room house. They approach, they mirror the entrance. Room empty, but there is a doorway at the end of the room. Now they shouldn't just enter that room because enemies might be beyond the doorway with a grenade ready. That is where i think the ball-camera comes in. You throw it into the corridor, enemy will very likely think its a grenade, so their first reaction will likely be to take cover. Enemy will then have to recognize that the ball is no grenade, afterwhich they will have to either move into another room, or destroy the ball. All these will take, imo about 10 seconds. That is more than enough time to provide good intelligence. Even if the enemies moves into another room, what you now have is a cleared corridor/room. That kinda narrows down the location of the enemies. Better yet they may be flushed outta the room to be cut down by the soldiers providing security.
I know i would want this equipment if i have to hunt for insurgents in iraq.
In response to what happens when the ball is destryoed, i would have thought the the camera is generic. IE the camera can be set to any freq and thus you can program which ball you want to receive signals form. They should therefore be carrying plenty of ball-cameras. -
the whole idea is stupid, lets face it.Originally posted by lwflee:I dun think the element of surprise is that important in some circumstances. After all, i dun really care if they die surprised or not and i do not really want to go in SWAT style. These are soldiers, not policemen. I see them, they arm themselves and go "Allahu Akhba", i bombard the building with m203s and frags, and ask for arty/tank support
Further, i think the enemy will take more than 5 seconds to react to the ball.
Eg. Soldiers think that enemies are present in a 2 room house. They approach, they mirror the entrance. Room empty, but there is a doorway at the end of the room. Now they shouldn't just enter that room because enemies might be beyond the doorway with a grenade ready. That is where i think the ball-camera comes in. You throw it into the corridor, enemy will very likely think its a grenade, so their first reaction will likely be to take cover. Enemy will then have to recognize that the ball is no grenade, afterwhich they will have to either move into another room, or destroy the ball. All these will take, imo about 10 seconds. That is more than enough time to provide good intelligence. Even if the enemies moves into another room, what you now have is a cleared corridor/room. That kinda narrows down the location of the enemies. Better yet they may be flushed outta the room to be cut down by the soldiers providing security.
I know i would want this equipment if i have to hunt for insurgents in iraq.
In response to what happens when the ball is destryoed, i would have thought the the camera is generic. IE the camera can be set to any freq and thus you can program which ball you want to receive signals form. They should therefore be carrying plenty of ball-cameras. -
Why?Originally posted by chunyong:the whole idea is stupid, lets face it.
Watching some videos on Iraq, i can certainly see situations where the soldiers would be glad to have the ball-camera. Eg. Soldiers had climbed onto the roof of a building. They dropped two frags into the room below, waited for the explosion, then proceeded to enter the building via the stairs. However, the soldiers were very very cautious because previous frags had not cleared the room at all. Apparently, the enemy was taking cover. Sure enough the soldiers realised that the enemy weren't dead at all and they had to beat a hasty retreat back onto the roof. Now, if they had the ball-camera, they could have cleared that room before proceeding down the stairs. The ball-camera would also have allowed them to plan their assault on the house more effectively. IE Living room is clear, soldiers on the ground floor should attack other rooms through windows/etc. A mirror would not have worked as well here. -
Good point you have there.My reaction was based on a situation where there are terrorists with hostages inside and we are in a war zone, not an area where you call in STAR or SWAT.Originally posted by lwflee:I dun think the element of surprise is that important in some circumstances. After all, i dun really care if they die surprised or not and i do not really want to go in SWAT style. These are soldiers, not policemen. I see them, they arm themselves and go "Allahu Akhba", i bombard the building with m203s and frags, and ask for arty/tank support
Further, i think the enemy will take more than 5 seconds to react to the ball.
Eg. Soldiers think that enemies are present in a 2 room house. They approach, they mirror the entrance. Room empty, but there is a doorway at the end of the room. Now they shouldn't just enter that room because enemies might be beyond the doorway with a grenade ready. That is where i think the ball-camera comes in. You throw it into the corridor, enemy will very likely think its a grenade, so their first reaction will likely be to take cover. Enemy will then have to recognize that the ball is no grenade, afterwhich they will have to either move into another room, or destroy the ball. All these will take, imo about 10 seconds. That is more than enough time to provide good intelligence. Even if the enemies moves into another room, what you now have is a cleared corridor/room. That kinda narrows down the location of the enemies. Better yet they may be flushed outta the room to be cut down by the soldiers providing security.
I know i would want this equipment if i have to hunt for insurgents in iraq.
In response to what happens when the ball is destryoed, i would have thought the the camera is generic. IE the camera can be set to any freq and thus you can program which ball you want to receive signals form. They should therefore be carrying plenty of ball-cameras. -
Ya, i do agree that its utility is limited to missions where the objective is simply to kill all enemies in a hostile area. It certainly cannot be used in missions that require a more delicate touch. We need the SOF for that.
I do not really want an infantry section from 3 SIR to rescue me... They will go "GRENADE!" + "BANG BANG BANG" and i will go "FuuuuucK!" -
well i think it might have it's use.
attach it to a launcher (like ww2 style where they put the nade at the end of the garand) and shoot it into a window. then see the insideto verify if it's all tangos, and if it is, 203 that room, but only that room.
i say they must develop this ball cheaply cause if it gets destroyed then you have to carry alot of "eye-balls" (heh i like that term). -
oh and i have another question... if you have a suggestion, who do you approach?
-
Very good example of technology overkill!Originally posted by chunyong:less than a min to make the ladder, why dun just use the standard ladder dat has been used since 2-3 decades ago....just stack and climb....less than 2 seconds.
got a story to summarise all this...
The USA spend alot of $ on research to develope a pen dat can allow the astronauts to write in space irregardless of position and finally they invented it....but wat did the Russians do ? they use pencil.....simple, gets the job done and millions saved.
the suvellience ball is useless, the 1st thing u toss into a room must be something to disorientate those inside so u can move in....a ball like dis will definitely get the hostages killed or they people inside will shoot at the door and the fool outside surely beehive liao...
no doubt the person who brought up the idea or invented it will get promoted but....i dunno if the UOC is 'going' in the right direction or not....seems to me dat their main aim is to flaunt technology niah.....
-
And they will next go "Brother! Paiseh paiseh!"Originally posted by lwflee:Ya, i do agree that its utility is limited to missions where the objective is simply to kill all enemies in a hostile area. It certainly cannot be used in missions that require a more delicate touch. We need the SOF for that.
I do not really want an infantry section from 3 SIR to rescue me... They will go "GRENADE!" + "BANG BANG BANG" and i will go "FuuuuucK!" -
the only way i see it applicable is to prevent ambush or going down stairs but if u follow the rules on how to move up/down stairways, it shouldn't be dat much of a problem.Originally posted by lwflee:Why?
Watching some videos on Iraq, i can certainly see situations where the soldiers would be glad to have the ball-camera. Eg. Soldiers had climbed onto the roof of a building. They dropped two frags into the room below, waited for the explosion, then proceeded to enter the building via the stairs. However, the soldiers were very very cautious because previous frags had not cleared the room at all. Apparently, the enemy was taking cover. Sure enough the soldiers realised that the enemy weren't dead at all and they had to beat a hasty retreat back onto the roof. Now, if they had the ball-camera, they could have cleared that room before proceeding down the stairs. The ball-camera would also have allowed them to plan their assault on the house more effectively. IE Living room is clear, soldiers on the ground floor should attack other rooms through windows/etc. A mirror would not have worked as well here. -
please la people.... they are still figuring it out leh... its still a trial and error thingy ... but please dun go flaming people la...name calling is an extremly bad habit that borders on the line of stupidity and.... something bad i guess....
Marco_Simone please hor? u dun even know LTA Mohammed Sofian... i know most of them by sight and some of them by name okie... some more senior member..... haiz......
anyhow... 3 SIR has got alot of training to do la... next week they still have to go brunei to do their usual jungle training that all SIR units go thru leh... they some more got duo role to play...
beri tuff on them la -
I'm not sure how a fibre Optics work, is it integrate with a weapon? It seems that it will be good for a "look see look see" kind of situation, then plan and attack. However the rifle with the 90deg scope seems useful enough to survey and allow us the shoot at the enemies without exposing much of our body. my 2cents worth.Originally posted by deathscythe99:Fibre Optics cable is a must.
In fact, I posted that question to their CPT on duty there
He was dumbfounded.
Even the rifle with the 90deg scope also...I asked why not use fibre optics cable instead? More efficient, and enemy cant detect so easily. (imagine u see a barrel of an assault rifle sticking out )
The answer? Cos we needed to come out with something creative and cheap