How much has the army change?
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From last time till now? Is the training slacker? Is the rules now flexible? Handling of weapons, machines etc.???
Comparing older and younger generation here.
Thanks for your info!
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regimetal slack alot
especially in bmtc, trg not like trg
we are trg a bunch of soldiers not CCs -
comparison between the 2G, 2.5G and 3G army.
http://www.sgforums.com/?action=thread_display&thread_id=183111 -
Maybe its better in some ways... perhaps to foster a more "thinking army".
I do however, feel that there must always have a strong emphasis on discipline and regimentation.
Compared to what the previous generations have gone through, I'm sure many will agree that army life has become less "painful". -
now got more n more welfare due to the negative publicity in the recents 1-2yrs...
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I do not think that training is more relaxed. Perhaps it is definitely alot more welfare and regimentation is not so strict.
But I do question the SAF's obssession with parades. I think other countries also don't have such priority on parade. I guess if you don't have real conflicts to deal with, senior commanders have to rely on parades to pass the time.
Also, in terms of regulars in the army, to a certain extent WOSE's quality is expected to increase. Now I've seen recruitment to be more stringent and many WOSE's getting laid off if they don't perform. I guess budget getting tighter. My ex-CSM, now 2WO complaining to me that there are indications that they will not be renewing his contact when it expires next year. Alot of other older staff also same thing.
Last time anyhow slack, don't get promoted still got couple Gs a month. Now no such thing. -
definitely alot slacker. more welfare. losing its feel of army/militarism. camaradrie also sorely lacking in combat units. thinking soldier think only about himself. there's no sense of "killer instinct" in the eye of a soldier. when i was in south korea and chance upon any army uniformed personal, they certainly have the "army air" around them. sadly, the case here is not like that.
on a good note, the army has greatly improved on its productivity and safety practices. many redundant stuff were phased out. but then again, some of the ridiculous chores, punishment or excercises does create stronger bonding among older batches of soldiers. when you know your platoon mates and yourself went thru nonsensical crap together, it sort of build up the rapport in the group.
eg. change parade. -
to name a few
1) cookhouse food - from servicemen cook to caterers
2) range - butt party to electronic target (zeroing also electronically)
3) accomodation - 2" foam mattress to 6" thick pocketed spring mattress
4) transport to camp - now got private bus operators -
for me i think this way....
during my time (wah!!!! 18 yrs ago!!!!) when you enlisted, theres no such things as complain, hotline, fair and etc.... and therefor, instructor can do alot of wonders! and during that time, alot of us was less educated, we dare not voice out! and most of the time, we will just FOLLOW the instruction or order! this ended up, we have more siong training and more tekan session! however, the best part is, from there, the whole batch of us was more unite! and we really learned to take care of our own mate. i still remember what my CO ever said to us, IF ONE OF YOU GOT INTO A FIGHT! AND THE OTHER DIVER WAS THERE WITHOUT HELPING HIM! I WILL CHARGE THAT FCUKER WHEN HE GET BACK TO CAMP!
guess what the Co will get if he dare to say this in todays SAF
after so many yrs.... the SAF ve change... i cant say that it change to be more slack or something like that, i did ask this question when im still in the forces, and one of my officer actually say this to us..... during world war one, solider ve to fight a war within 100m, and during world war two, solider have to fight a war with 10km, and nows day.... we have to fight a war before we can physically SEE OUR ENERMY!!! and therefor, we have to accept the norm! we have to transform the whole SAF! alot of things which we use to train and learn, its slowly being replace by system and PC. therefor, the engage of physical human ve getting lesser! (to a certain extend). like it anot... theres the way a war have to fight nows day ..... after hearing all this.... i really feel sad about it.... but... come to think of it... its TRUE AND ITS FACT! -
no more stand by bed at the parade square, cannot sleep on the bed during office hours, running around with rifle over head shouting like a madman that's for sure.
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Also now got such thing as "illegal punishment"
Examples are:-
1.) Push up cannot do more than 20 (yeah right.... )
2.) No change parade punishment (yeah right.... )
3.) Ah Gord mentioned: No More Stand by bed in parade square.
4.) Any 3SG caught shouting KNNBCCB infront of recruits can get screwed by OC.
... (Please add on ) -
Also now got such thing as "illegal punishment"
Examples are:-
1.) Push up cannot do more than 20 (yeah right.... )
2.) No change parade punishment (yeah right.... )
3.) Ah Gord mentioned: No More Stand by bed in parade square.
4.) Any 3SG caught shouting KNNBCCB infront of recruits can get screwed by OC.
5) no more knuckle push-ups
6) no more star jumps
7) no more log PT
no more "can-see-my-teeth" boots, blacken is good enuff.
9) guard room all upgrade to air-con. good life for 3SG guard comd liao.
10) no more suffer from ah beng cook. all commercialised liao.
... (Please add on ) -
no more bayonet fighting drills.
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Change parade......that's fun lol.....Originally posted by madcampus:Also now got such thing as "illegal punishment"
Examples are:-
1.) Push up cannot do more than 20 (yeah right.... )
2.) No change parade punishment (yeah right.... )
3.) Ah Gord mentioned: No More Stand by bed in parade square.
4.) Any 3SG caught shouting KNNBCCB infront of recruits can get screwed by OC.
5) no more knuckle push-ups
6) no more star jumps
7) no more log PT no more "can-see-my-teeth" boots, blacken is good enuff.
9) guard room all upgrade to air-con. good life for 3SG guard comd liao.
10) no more suffer from ah beng cook. all commercialised liao.
... (Please add on )
Star jumps i still got do leh....
Boots now black can liao.
I still got see stand by bed in coy line leh -
Has the Army changed
Previous Chiefs have removed the formation signs, collar insignias and badges on the uniform and now the Chief is putting them back.
We have recruit training in Tekong, then moved out of Tekong, and now back to Tekong.
Some smart guys introduced the waterproof boots, then the boys could not get their feet dry, now its back to the old boots.
The soldiers work on and bring in new good quality equipment, then came the public tender and purchase of Made-in-China equivalents at cheaper prices. Soon, they found that these are not more durable than the old equipment, and revert back again. -
What no more log PT? Thought that was great team work exercise.. Although when actually doing it, I hated every moment.
So no CSM can make you carry your cupboard down to the parade square to stand by cupboard?
Oh, one more to add to the list. Not much eating out of mess tins with every food item (rice, curry chicken, sardine, vegetable and soup) all poured into one mess tin for a watery meal during field training. Now all in cardboard boxes. -
no more fail swimming, fail SBJ/shuttle run/pull-ups need to recourse BMT.
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as long as got attend lessons etc go btp, fieldcamp (at least got 80% attendance), attend ippt can pop from bmt leOriginally posted by Gordonator:no more fail swimming, fail SBJ/shuttle run/pull-ups need to recourse BMT. -
What about SOC?Originally posted by tortoise55:as long as got attend lessons etc go btp, fieldcamp (at least got 80% attendance), attend ippt can pop from bmt le -
SOC is not a requirement to pass bmt.Originally posted by insouciant:What about SOC? -
they are known as the white elephants of BMTC now.Originally posted by insouciant:What about SOC? -
i find this crap...having to pass out from BMT without having to pass SOC..piece of BS ....Originally posted by monoslayer:SOC is not a requirement to pass bmt.
well i enlisted in 2001 ..i can say it was not too xiong nor so relax as i read now. I got bayonet fighting lessons still, tekan sessions ...stand by beds in COY Line, instructors using langauges that i am still rather impressed by their wonderful concoction of vulgarities.
Regimentation is still a must. muster parades, ironed uniforms, polished boots for parades ...standby field packs ...
We are training soldiers and not boy scouts .. -
thought swimming long time ago dun need to pass can pass BMT ler?Originally posted by Gordonator:no more fail swimming, fail SBJ/shuttle run/pull-ups need to recourse BMT.
at least that was so when i enlisted for BMT 10+ years ago. -
this is a pretty impressive post for a person who told another to take out a part of his bolt carrier group to do one shot one c.ock. i wonder wat would your BMT CSM say... oh yeah, "GO AND POLISH YOUR BOOTS!"Originally posted by one-niner:i find this crap...having to pass out from BMT without having to pass SOC..piece of BS ....
well i enlisted in 2001 ..i can say it was not too xiong nor so relax as i read now. I got bayonet fighting lessons still, tekan sessions ...stand by beds in COY Line, instructors using langauges that i am still rather impressed by their wonderful concoction of vulgarities.
Regimentation is still a must. muster parades, ironed uniforms, polished boots for parades ...standby field packs ...
We are training soldiers and not boy scouts ..
much is still the same, dun worry, u r a boy scout too. -
Originally posted by Ristar:
yeah ..a silly comment on my part though.
this is a pretty impressive post for a person who told another to take out a part of his bolt carrier group to do one shot one c.ock. i wonder wat would your BMT CSM say... oh yeah, "[b]GO AND POLISH YOUR BOOTS!"
much is still the same, dun worry, u r a boy scout too.[/b]