S'pore's soldiers aren't getting enough respects......
-
wow wow wow someone is talking another string of shit again.If you want to talk about respect
Learn what the hell is respect first.
Respect= an attitude of admiration
Respecting someone does not means that you think yourself or your own effort is lesser than the other person.If you want to respect someone,it is because you appreaciate what the other person has done.It can co exist together with knowing you have respect for yourself and know what you are doing is worthly of respect too.
And what the hell where you arguing about the whole lot time in this thread that respecting someone means you are lower than him or he is like a god or what?Get that right,the person is just talking about simple respect not Worshipping.........what the hell bowing to the person,where did anyone said that?
It all came from you you and you that you take it to mean when someone think they should be getting more respect means they think what they are doing is worth much more than what you are doing.You think that just because some poster here think he should get some respect= to means he is saying other's effort is worth nothing.
Who the hell were you to assume that in the first place and then start to go on and on to belittle the efforts of NS people while there were no one in this entire thread who even mention anything to belittle what girls had to offer to our society.
Even your latest reply,what is new? Only know how to carry on that what girls and non NS people's effort is great too.Whoever said they were not? All the while it was only you and you alone who said that.
So get your fact right first b4 you even want to post anything again.This topic is about RESPECT and not the WORSHIPPING you think the threadstarter is requesting. -
You ever seen those skinny NSF types wearing smart 4? Their arms are so skinny that there is a lot of space in the smart 4 sleeve,its kinda comical.Like that how to make people respect them?
-
wat's wrong with that? some are born skinny wat. like me. freaking skinny, but still can chiong swah, route march and clear soc/ippt.Originally posted by Marco_Simone:You ever seen those skinny NSF types wearing smart 4? Their arms are so skinny that there is a lot of space in the smart 4 sleeve,its kinda comical.Like that how to make people respect them? -
If my post earlier had been mis-interpreted or that I did not make my post clear, I apologize. But yes, the civilian sector is important, and yes though death in labour is real, living is also a sad thing if you choose to look at things that way.Originally posted by mistyblue:To me, I sleep in my bed cause I know we are rich enough to buy expensive defense equipment, missles, weapons and spend it on training men to make sure we do not look like we are easy targets. I sleep well because I know we forge strong ties with US, Isreal and other strong nations by having their investments in Singapore so that the neighbouring countries will think twice about striking us without strong counterstrike from these other countries. I sleep well because through our economic success and abilities to make this region boom, we give our neighbours less reasons to strike us and more reason to cooperate with us. Remember, we will never have enough men to fight any war like China. We rely on other strategies and we rely on the power of money to buy the best equipment and best training environment for our men.
You sleep well at the expense of those who are there to defend you while you type away, down-playing their efforts. Tell me this, when Timor Leste was seeking seperation, there are many NSFs who volunteered, in Operation Flying Eagle in relief efforts there are also NSFs. I'm not saying that the the contributions of those made in the economic sector and so on are any less important, I am thankful for them to let us live in a society which is what it is today. But I'm making specific reference to the Military and Law Enforcement communities as the fact here is that you constantly downplay and slam their efforts even if its a wayang show, at least they bother wayang.While you type away in the relative comfort and security of your home, I hope you know that although the wayang show goes on, the threat we face in this day and age is real. The men and women standing at the frontlines fear that a day comes when they have to pull the trigger, not because they don't have the guts nor the training which you seem as wayanging to put them through, but because they know that the very action they are carrying out bears the responsibility of life and death. You can make millions and lose millions in the stock market overnight, but you do not have to die, at the frontline with a faceless enemy, one wrong decision, one decision too late and you may have to end up hosing what ever is left of the victims off the streets.
As a whole, I believe none of the NSFs nor Regulars here are demanding respect from the civilians or anything, but just pleading them to be left to do their work of safe-guarding the nation from any threats foreign and domestic. -
Well yup,i do agree that we should not just respect soldiers just for the hell of respecting.Respect i do agree have to be fully earned.
But even if soldiers are not respected,at least have the heart to just simply appreciate them for the sacrifice they made in the 2- 2 1/2 years they served the country just cause they had to in order to give better protection to this land we all call home.If you cannot even do that,then dun speak about your own effort in regards to contributing to the society cos in the first place,you do not appreciate other people's effort -
I know you are a body builder but what the hell is wrong with arms being thin so meaning it to be auto that they can never be accorded respect?Originally posted by Marco_Simone:You ever seen those skinny NSF types wearing smart 4? Their arms are so skinny that there is a lot of space in the smart 4 sleeve,its kinda comical.Like that how to make people respect them?
If a war happen,this thin person is just another soldier alongside others who maybe bigger size and is just as capable to doing something that will make him/her a hero/heroine.
It is not only big size people with big biceps who can do stuff worthy of respect.
You attitude is like example American GI laughing at Viet Congs who were much smaller in size compared to them during the Vietnam war,but in the end who were at the losing end? -
\Originally posted by Aveme:I know you are a body builder but what the hell is wrong with arms being thin so meaning it to be auto that they can never be accorded respect?
If a war happen,this thin person is just another soldier alongside others who maybe bigger size and is just as capable to doing something that will make him/her a hero/heroine.
It is not only big size people with big biceps who can do stuff worthy of respect.
You attitude is like example American GI laughing at Viet Congs who were much smaller in size compared to them during the Vietnam war,but in the end who were at the losing end?
Firstly,I am not a bodybuilder.
Actually i am trying to say,should do away with the 4 finger thingy for RECs...coz this stipulation will expose 80% of the skinny upper arm.
I think let them fold until the uniform touching the elbow area like MSG will make them look more presentable. -
ah ok cos you are a mod for pumping iron and posted quite a bit,so i had mistaken you to be one.Originally posted by Marco_Simone:\
Firstly,I am not a bodybuilder.
Actually i am trying to say,should do away with the 4 finger thingy for RECs...coz this stipulation will expose 80% of the skinny upper arm.
I think let them fold until the uniform touching the elbow area like MSG will make them look more presentable.
Well it is just a uniform standard,for each skinny fellow i ever saw in that uniformed state,i have seen some guy with decent enough arm size to fill in the gap very nicely and make them look very gilat.So it may just be how someone look at it.
And anyway the new standard of uniform now will require soldiers to sew on their unit or something else badge on the sleeve portion so very likely now cos of that,they have to fold their smart 4 much lower already as compared to last time. -
Well, that's for the uninitiated. If you've ever seen a 45 kg section machine gunner lug more than his body weight in gear over 120 km of hilly country, you might just take a different perspective and realise that serious men don't have to all look like Arnie.Originally posted by Marco_Simone:You ever seen those skinny NSF types wearing smart 4? Their arms are so skinny that there is a lot of space in the smart 4 sleeve,its kinda comical.Like that how to make people respect them? -
there is a thing call coverup.....Originally posted by mistyblue:You mean women don't die from child birth? Death of any human being is a sad thing - no deny. So deaths as a result of duty is bad. Death from child birth is OK?
The chance of death in SAF is lower than death travelling on the road.
Accidents do happen. So people tell us not to blame govt for our situation.
-
Your posts thus far, are the epitome of ignorance and a shocking lack of a centrist pov, because you deem all guys unable to empathise with you.Originally posted by mistyblue:all BOYS are the same.
Narrow minded and will tell people to Shut Up when they think another person did not experience it, then is considered Stupid.
Its the same, NONE of the BOYS will ever experience menses or pregnancy but all DISMISS it as EASY, No PAIN, RUSSBISH compared to all the "tough" stuff in NS. At least lots of women expeience real pregnancy than Boys who play in War games.
However, do note that you are comparing apples with oranges, and no one will take your posts seriously if you continue to be such a selfish individual.
In addition, I speak from my experience of seeing what our geopolitical reality is like, and the SAF's edge is being eroded as we speak, so please don't think you know a helluva lot about what our military strategy and posture is.
We do not hanker for glory, just silent, tacit acknowledgement that our job has not been in vain. Do you seek glory for being pregnant?I hardly expect you would demand a Congressional Medal of Honor for bearing a child do you?
Get a damned life. -
I think,..... Misty should google up the Russo-Finnish war of 1939-1940. It is a classical example of how a small country can stop an invasion from a regional power and it also proves a bunch of well trained Conscript army soldiers can defeat an enemy on-slaughter.
Just for some hisotrical infomations, Finland broke free from Russia during the early 20th century, after a coup led by the whites. Thus when the Red Soviets managed to build a large and better equipped armed forces, Stalin gave orders to recapture this "renegade province". He took advantage of the fact that the major allied powers were anxiously dealing with Hilter's expansion and America was an isolationist country. Britain was eager to cherry up with the Soviets as they were facing a common enemy, Germany.
Thus no single country dared to commit troops and vast amount of war materials to help the Finns. Sweden a close neighbour, only commit a small squadron of fighters named as "volunteers". Many countries felt that Finland was doomed, and is destined to be subjected under harsh rule once captured, just like Estonia, Latvia......
The Finlands were poorly equipped with mainly WW1 gears and donations from friendly nations before the war. Wad more, their main forces are made up of conscripts and reservists, which are usually down-played as less efficient and skilled. But in the end, they won. From wad i noe, initially the Finns faced many failures due to lack of exposure to in real combat, but in the end, they manage to put their acts together and defeat the Reds. Contrary to popular believes, the Reds no doubt better equipped, were badly demoralised dat even the political Comissars in the units can't rally the men to fight effectively. In fact, many of their resupply lines were ambushed and many gears fell into the hands of the Finns during hasty retreats.
It may surprise u that Finland democratic republic some wad like the Swiss and their govt during the war was made up of a a coalition govt. This is contrary to some old politcal bigwigs who claim that a small country with a huge involvement of oppositions will be a corrupted, impoverish one that will be marked by social unrest, thus an authorian govt is the best solution.
U must noe, no doubt other countries have a full time force, but it is not as if all their troops have seen or experience some form of combat. Even countries that boast that they have gone to war and won, those troops that fought are most probably old or dead, thus so much of being "bloodied". -
Age old tactics, Lordz - can't win by logic, get on the rags and win by hissy fit.Originally posted by LazerLordz:Your posts thus far, are the epitome of ignorance and a shocking lack of a centrist pov, because you deem all guys unable to empathise with you.
-
Win?Originally posted by Gedanken:Age old tactics, Lordz - can't win by logic, get on the rags and win by hissy fit. -
Well, take a stab at winning then.
-
Interesting thread. Seems it has deviated from the original topic to become a full-fledged gender war!
I'm not so sure about the respect bit, but i dare say most of our fellow singaporeans who have not or NEED NOT serve DO take our "BOYS" for granted. When i'm on the train, in uniform or not, i never expect people to give up their seats for me, cause i'm not old, pregnant or bleeding. (Should i give up my seat to a young woman having a period? i'm not entirely sure.) In fact i give up my seat if i have one, every single time to someone more needy, not because i'm a soldier but because of human decency.
Misty, granted, everyone of us, military or not does have a part to play in total defence. No one here is undermining you, so why do you undermine our "boys" in green? And your argument about bleeding is quite frankly, rubbish. My buddy's elder sister signed on with the army, not as some DXO, artillery/engineer/signal/logistics officer, but as a damn tooth-and-nail INFANTRY SERGEANT. She never once played the "oh i'm a girl" card, cus she knows that to do something like that will only cause her to LOSE RESPECT. She got OOCed in SISPEC when she injured her leg crossing the Jacob's Ladder (do you know what is that in the first place?) and is now going through a re-course. Oh yeah, i'm sure she bleeds monthly too.
To ME, ladies like her are the ones that deserve respect, and not like some others, who's idea of make-up is the latest line from Shisheido or Shu Uemura, and not Hunter's Choice Woodland Green Camouflage Cream, and YET TALK as if they've been through everything and act like know-it-alls.
Bottom line, you think you're a bloody Godsend to singaporeans, well good for you. But listen, even our soldiers, enlisted men like me are disposable when the shit hits the fan, what more you? At least i know, if and when the time comes i'll be going out in a bang fighting at the front, what more can a soldier ask for?
THREE CHEERS FOR THOSE WHO HAVE SERVED, ARE SERVING, AND WILL SERVE IN TIME TO COME. -
You have summed up what's just wrong, when ego grows too large, be it for either gender.Originally posted by Hellraiza:Interesting thread. Seems it has deviated from the original topic to become a full-fledged gender war!
I'm not so sure about the respect bit, but i dare say most of our fellow singaporeans who have not or NEED NOT serve DO take our "BOYS" for granted. When i'm on the train, in uniform or not, i never expect people to give up their seats for me, cause i'm not old, pregnant or bleeding. (Should i give up my seat to a young woman having a period? i'm not entirely sure.) In fact i give up my seat if i have one, every single time to someone more needy, not because i'm a soldier but because of human decency.
Misty, granted, everyone of us, military or not does have a part to play in total defence. No one here is undermining you, so why do you undermine our "boys" in green? And your argument about bleeding is quite frankly, rubbish. My buddy's elder sister signed on with the army, not as some DXO, artillery/engineer/signal/logistics officer, but as a damn tooth-and-nail INFANTRY SERGEANT. She never once played the "oh i'm a girl" card, cus she knows that to do something like that will only cause her to LOSE RESPECT. She got OOCed in SISPEC when she injured her leg crossing the Jacob's Ladder (do you know what is that in the first place?) and is now going through a re-course. Oh yeah, i'm sure she bleeds monthly too.
To ME, ladies like her are the ones that deserve respect, and not like some others, who's idea of make-up is the latest line from Shisheido or Shu Uemura, and not Hunter's Choice Woodland Green Camouflage Cream, and YET TALK as if they've been through everything and act like know-it-alls.
Bottom line, you think you're a bloody Godsend to singaporeans, well good for you. But listen, even our soldiers, enlisted men like me are disposable when the shit hits the fan, what more you? At least i know, if and when the time comes i'll be going out in a bang fighting at the front, what more can a soldier ask for?
THREE CHEERS FOR THOSE WHO HAVE SERVED, ARE SERVING, AND WILL SERVE IN TIME TO COME.
Humility and realising that we are not ubermensch, nor Clark Kent, will go a long way. But the thing with pride, is that its a tinted lens that will send LTA inspection alarms skyhigh. -
I'm not entirely sure WHAT you're getting at, esp the LTA part, but i'm sure it's something fair.Originally posted by LazerLordz:You have summed up what's just wrong, when ego grows too large, be it for either gender.
Humility and realising that we are not ubermensch, nor Clark Kent, will go a long way. But the thing with pride, is that its a tinted lens that will send LTA inspection alarms skyhigh. Been reading up on Nietzsche i see? 
-
Sorry man, I descend into the pits of analogies sometimes.Originally posted by Hellraiza:I'm not entirely sure WHAT you're getting at, esp the LTA part, but i'm sure it's something fair. Been reading up on Nietzsche i see? 
Nietzsche is very interesting, I would recommend it to anyone in need of a good book. It was a good way to spend guard duty at the desk.. -
Wonder what me and my friends stay up every night 24/7 staring at Radar scopes everynight for.
But we still hunker down and do it. -
You do it because you know if you don't, the alternative is worst. We still acknowledge what every serving soldier is going through today.Originally posted by jianfish9:Wonder what me and my friends stay up every night 24/7 staring at Radar scopes everynight for.
But we still hunker down and do it. -
It actually gets even more interesting when you take what he writes in the context of his following Schopenhauer and Kant.Originally posted by LazerLordz:Nietzsche is very interesting, I would recommend it to anyone in need of a good book. -
Okay, *holds his hands up* , who's Schopenhauer?Originally posted by Gedanken:It actually gets even more interesting when you take what he writes in the context of his following Schopenhauer and Kant. -
Arthur Schopenhauer was a philosopher who preceded Nietzsche. Schopenhauer's writing, especially "The World as Will and Representation ", was a key influence on Nietzsche's works.
Sadly, of course, you do realise that our mate Adolf turned Nietzsche's Uberman concept upside down and came up with the untermenschen? -
Like u said urself,physical pain you can handle.Mental is harder.Originally posted by mistyblue:all BOYS are the same.
Narrow minded and will tell people to Shut Up when they think another person did not experience it, then is considered Stupid.
Its the same, NONE of the BOYS will ever experience menses or pregnancy but all DISMISS it as EASY, No PAIN, RUSSBISH compared to all the "tough" stuff in NS. At least lots of women expeience real pregnancy than Boys who play in War games.
It's mental in there. Carrying on and pushing on even when u are at your physical limit.
Yes none of the boys will never ever experience menses or pregnancy and dismiss it as easy.
But girls and those who do not serve will do like wise for NS.The will dismiss as easy when we do something we do not want to do but have to do.That we put our life and limbs on the line.I've known PERFECTLY fit males who end up with life injuries sustained during NS. Busted knees that will never heal right. A slip disk that prevents them frm carrying heavy loads or even frm playing a game of tennis when they're older.
A lost finger,a disfigured face.....all that from doing something we mostly never wanted to tell me all that is any easier or less painful that you would belittle us like that?
You make it sound as though it's a game.It's not and nowhere is it more easily seen then when we are on our "wargames" We bleed during those "games".Some have even lost their lives.
Is it to much to ask for alittle bit of respect for what we do considering that while we whine about it,we still do it knowning that with the shit that goes on in there our chances of getting a life injury is actually pretty damn high?A little respect of not insulting us or belittlering what we actually do.
Oh and to add....something that you seem not to reliase here....CHOICE.Child birth is CHOICE.The female capt CHOICE(even though i respect that.) Running around in a jungle carrying 40kg of shit...NOT A CHOICE.