Airborne Training / School
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Originally posted by scabstermooch:I dun think Guards specialise in Raids - perhaps some ex-guardsmen can pipe in.
I am also not sure what the NDU really does - probably recce in general and beach recce? The british equivalent however is not the Royal Marine Commandos - the RM is elite infantry under the Navy with a commando role. They also specialise/keep themselves updated on Arctic warfare.
Edit: RSN website says:
"NDU is responsible for all diving operations, which include general and combat diving operations, explosive ordnance disposal and mine disposal for the SAF. It comprises the Diving School, Clearance Diving Group, Underwater Demolition Group, and Combat DIving Group..." -
Let's not forget NDU's SWG = SBS in Britain
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There was a company of pathfinders in the Guards reserve unit in fact they were the original first batch and perhaps the best.Guardsmen,ex-Cdos,Rangers and some misfits also.I wonder what happened to them.Pvt me if you were one of them.Originally posted by Joshua1975:we conduct local as in LZs and DZs AO recon. A coy of Pathfinders (numbers withhold) to do recon on LZ for 3+1 LS isn't any easy jobs and to add on a DZ for resup. Hell it will
Pathfinder land blind, hours later follow by Sniper, LRRP and BRC than battalions scout. Day or days later than the landing force,
Hell the top knows what they are doing... ??????? maybe the top CDOs knows.
First In, Last Out. -
Originally posted by chanjyj:
No, you're just about right there, chanjyj.
Nono.. I think I was misunderstood
I know there are some who get those badges (American Wings etc), but the whole group of commandos i.e. 1st CDO Btn is not a special forces group right? It's just highly trained infantry, comparable to maybe the American Rangers.
I'm also a bit confused why most CDOs don't go for ranger sch in the US, when the US Rangers themselves are considered only "[b]special-ops capable" and not special forces.
So can we say that our Singapore commandos are just highly trained infantry/airborne troops who are special-ops capable but aren't special forces themselves, and our only "true" Special forces group will be the SOF (In peace and war)? No offence to any Commando/NDU/Guards. I have friends in there.
Forgive my terrible "lawyers writing". I'm been typing my proposals the past few hours and can't seem to get that "official" tone of voice out of my system.
Ponders/Gedanken wish to tell this noob here more? (I do surf this forum, only I don't post anything)[/b]
The role of 1 CDO is about the same as that of the US Rangers, mainly LRRP and small-scale raids. Effectively they are light infantry with airborne capability. Another equivalent unit would be the British Paras. I'll avoid a comparison with the US 82nd Airborne because that unit's huge.
For special forces in the vein of the SAS or Green Berets, Singapore's got the SOF and SWG. That said, SOF is not all that large a unit, forming the rough equivalent of one of the SAS' squadrons. -
Your description of 1st CDO is honest and true.The Singapore Ranger course is or should I say was not a learning course unlike the US Rangers but those who went through the sleep deprivation ,mental and physical stress deserve a certain degree of respect.If possible SAF should send soldiers for the US Ranger instead of conducting their own course which is a lot cheaper but the quality of soldiering skill is a lot different also.Were all thick skinned and can go through all kinds of tekan but what we want is good knowledge also.Originally posted by Gedanken:No, you're just about right there, chanjyj.
The role of 1 CDO is about the same as that of the US Rangers, mainly LRRP and small-scale raids. Effectively they are light infantry with airborne capability. Another equivalent unit would be the British Paras. I'll avoid a comparison with the US 82nd Airborne because that unit's huge.
For special forces in the vein of the SAS or Green Berets, Singapore's got the SOF and SWG. That said, SOF is not all that large a unit, forming the rough equivalent of one of the SAS' squadrons. -
what is sniper doing for scout ahead? what role are they in now? scouting or niping?Originally posted by chanjyj:Originally posted by Joshua1975:
Correct me if I'm wrong. Sniper and LRRP are division assets, but I don't think they will be deployed together. I think they act seperately, in different capacities and functions.
Sniper is primarily a front-line unit, aka, they stay ahead of friendly forces to "scout ahead", but remain infront of the enemy's front. However, LRRP will be inserted behind the enemy's front, and may not be involved directly in the emminent attack. They may be monitering the enemy's reaction to the attack and how they redeploy forces, checking if enemy reinforcements/new troops coming in, etc.
The battalion level scouts are a diff matter altogether, they deploy shortly ahead of the battalion only, help to determine method of attack, enemy positions, and do not act idependently of the parent unit.
what is behind enemy front. LRRP to check enemy reinforcement? how far in is LRRP deploy in the 1st place, do you know? reinforcement to where? the new toy, UAV for what? and what are the scout for? what the hack the battalion setting block force? ENEMY REINFORCEMENT???
LRRP have more importance info or i should say role to do than this.
talking about LZ in-ops, your "don't think they will be deployed together" does not apply. just correcting you. -
??? ??? ???Originally posted by Short Ninja:There was a company of pathfinders in the Guards reserve unit in fact they were the original first batch and perhaps the best.Guardsmen,ex-Cdos,Rangers and some misfits also.I wonder what happened to them.Pvt me if you were one of them.
Pvt me??? big shot??? read below -
You nasty fella!Originally posted by Joshua1975:??? ??? ???
Pvt me??? big shot??? read below
I think he wanted you to send him a private message if you belong to the afore-mentioned pathfinder platton. -
Originally posted by Joshua1975:what is sniper doing for scout ahead? what role are they in now? scouting or niping?
what is behind enemy front. LRRP to check enemy reinforcement? how far in is LRRP deploy in the 1st place, do you know? reinforcement to where? the new toy, UAV for what? and what are the scout for? what the hack the battalion setting block force? ENEMY REINFORCEMENT???
LRRP have more importance info or i should say role to do than this.
talking about LZ in-ops, your "don't think they will be deployed together" does not apply. just correcting you.what is sniper doing for scout ahead? what role are they in now? scouting or niping?
you so bad mood for what? 
Frankly, I have no idea. My friend in HQ Commando didn't tell me what snipers actually did. but from what he said I think he was implying that sniper still stay infront of the enemy. Joshua1975 if you know better can you elaborate?LRRP to check enemy reinforcement?
I think you misunderstood my meaning. Reinforcement as in general enemy movement in a specific area. Not 1 platoon walking down the road.UAV for what?
I have no idea what level UAV will be used? Maybe batallion level. When I mentioned LRRP I was talking about Division level.and what are the scout for?
If I was correct in saying UAV is btn level, then I think the UAV would be aurmenting the scouts.[/i] -
I agree that the US and Singapore Ranger courses are very different courses. That said, I don't think it's necessary to send large groups of men to the US Ranger course. That would be prohibitively expensive, and besides, the skills could be taught by Singaporean instructors who are themselves properly trained. Under the leadership of then-Captain Ng Heng Chew, my instructors certainly did build in the map-reading, patrolling and other skills that you would find in the US Ranger syllabus.Originally posted by Short Ninja:Your description of 1st CDO is honest and true.The Singapore Ranger course is or should I say was not a learning course unlike the US Rangers but those who went through the sleep deprivation ,mental and physical stress deserve a certain degree of respect.If possible SAF should send soldiers for the US Ranger instead of conducting their own course which is a lot cheaper but the quality of soldiering skill is a lot different also.Were all thick skinned and can go through all kinds of tekan but what we want is good knowledge also. -
Just curious Ged, for those whom have cleared the Ranger course and are awarded the Ranger Tab be it the local or foreign tab, in times of war do they fight as a unit like what the US Army do? Where all the Rangers fight together as a unit?Originally posted by Gedanken:I agree that the US and Singapore Ranger courses are very different courses. That said, I don't think it's necessary to send large groups of men to the US Ranger course. That would be prohibitively expensive, and besides, the skills could be taught by Singaporean instructors who are themselves properly trained. Under the leadership of then-Captain Ng Heng Chew, my instructors certainly did build in the map-reading, patrolling and other skills that you would find in the US Ranger syllabus.
Thanks in adv. -
Hey!
I thinks there a place for you to asked, and that me. I was thinking if we can makes a infantry with becoming a airborne unit? It consider an airborne infantry. Anyone heard of it? Consider a 82SD from the US histories World War 11 Army
Regards Hudax -
yes. this is exactly the same thing that happened to a forum member here. he got his wings during his NSF days.Originally posted by ipcommander:I've heard a case where an OCS graduate, who's not even a regular, but during his NS duration, he was allowed to do Airborne. -
Originally posted by chanjyj:
nothing i can elaborate, you need to read back. primary role and secondary role.
quote:
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what is sniper doing for scout ahead? what role are they in now? scouting or niping?
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you so bad mood for what? Frankly, I have no idea. My friend in HQ Commando didn't tell me what snipers actually did. but from what he said I think he was implying that sniper still stay infront of the enemy. Joshua1975 if you know better can you elaborate?:
correct, and my question to you know is how far deep are they in? do you know? repeat again, LRRP have more importance role than to recce in SAF context today.
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LRRP to check enemy reinforcement?
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I think you misunderstood my meaning. Reinforcement as in general enemy movement in a specific area. Not 1 platoon walking down the road.:
again, the AO? how big do you really think the AO will be for Div lel? How far in are LRRP into enemy line? LRRP operate at Div lel at Y distance, with UAV what distance will it be? 2 time Y or 3 time Y
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UAV for what?
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I have no idea what level UAV will be used? Maybe batallion level. When I mentioned LRRP I was talking about Division level.:
??? read the above. distance.
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and what are the scout for?
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If I was correct in saying UAV is btn level, then I think the UAV would be aurmenting the scouts.[/i] -
Raids ops was remove from GUARDS doctorine in 93.Originally posted by scabstermooch:I dun think Guards specialise in Raids - perhaps some ex-guardsmen can pipe in. -
there is a difference in being ranger trained and in a ranger regiment in the usOriginally posted by SpecOps87:Just curious Ged, for those whom have cleared the Ranger course and are awarded the Ranger Tab be it the local or foreign tab, in times of war do they fight as a unit like what the US Army do? Where all the Rangers fight together as a unit?
Thanks in adv.
not all ranger train soldiers are in the ranger regiment..
the ranger course is a 9 week long combat leadership course, conducted in three three-week phaseshttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ranger_School
those from the 75th ranger regiment have to go thru Ranger indoctrination programme
The term "Army Ranger" is reserved solely for someone who serves within the 75th Ranger Regiment. A popular phrase within the Ranger Regiment regarding this issue is: "The tab is a school, the scroll is a way of life" (the scroll being the insignia of the 75th Ranger Regiment). Another saying is Tab Wearers and Scroll Bearers. You wear the tab, but it's an honor to bear the scroll. A person who passes Ranger School is considered "Ranger Qualified", but is not a member of the Regiment, and thus not a Ranger.
tab
scrollhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Army_Rangers
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Oh so that is wad pathfinder do.......... hmm........ isn't this like the TAG(terminal air guidance) platoon in the GDS battalion?
Btw, regarding the ranger tab, I heard there is a golden one which is the US one and Red one which is local one. I mean the backing is black, the words are coloured.
Last time I was still NSF, our OC, HQ CSM, S3 are all ranger trained. But according to our OC, all of theirs is US one. He say that the local ranger course is more siong than the US one, in terms of the POW treatment which is part of their course. But never the less, I really respected my OC as he is damn power one. That time Navex in Brunei, he and the coy 2IC tell us to rest on our own while they themselves when to find the check points at night with no NVG!!! Dunno how he did it one. Another one is our BN S3. That time he saw our ppls clearing Lalang using parang. Then he demo his way of clearing vegetation. He literally open up his arms and laid on the lalang, which is a damn efficient method. In fact we cleared the vegetation faster using his method. -
Yeah, what Rockhound said!
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UP!!!Originally posted by equlus84:Oh so that is wad pathfinder do.......... hmm........ isn't this like the TAG(terminal air guidance) platoon in the GDS battalion?
Btw, regarding the ranger tab, I heard there is a golden one which is the US one and Red one which is local one. I mean the backing is black, the words are coloured.
Last time I was still NSF, our OC, HQ CSM, S3 are all ranger trained. But according to our OC, all of theirs is US one. He say that the local ranger course is more siong than the US one, in terms of the POW treatment which is part of their course. But never the less, I really respected my OC as he is damn power one. That time Navex in Brunei, he and the coy 2IC tell us to rest on our own while they themselves when to find the check points at night with no NVG!!! Dunno how he did it one. Another one is our BN S3. That time he saw our ppls clearing Lalang using parang. Then he demo his way of clearing vegetation. He literally open up his arms and laid on the lalang, which is a damn efficient method. In fact we cleared the vegetation faster using his method. -
You totaly misunderstood me.I was just looking for some long lost army friends.Save your belligerent attitude for the right time.Originally posted by Joshua1975:??? ??? ???
Pvt me??? big shot??? read below