Guard Duty system
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with the recent dave teo's incident, the spotlight has centered on guard duties. no doubt all camps in SAF now are tightening the way guard duties are conducted.
therefore i will like to give my take on how guard duty is conducted in my camp, how some of the things i felt needs improvement. do share with us your experiences as well.
to get things started, my camp is not a combat camp, there are no combat units inside (actually there is a combat unit but they are classified so lets not go there). there are 2 training schools which takes turns providing guards for guard duties.
so everyday we have trainees as guards. most of them are fresh PTEs out of BMT, some are CPLs fresh from BSLC, some are men from other units attached to my camp for course, once in a while we have cadets as well.
The guard com is always a sergeant from the main training school of the camp, the 2IC is usually a sergeant from the other training school, the 3IC is a CPL/PTE from the other training school who is a perm staff of the unit.
there are many units inside the camp, each with their own different designed camp passes.
ok so with all these basic info listed out, here are some of the problems i usually face with them.
[*] because the guards are trainees, they do not know how the camp works and are not familiar with the different passes. many times, whenever someone flashes a pass at them, they will just let them in, even if the passes are from other camp or a visitor pass. one is not supposed to book out of camp with a visitor pass.
[*] because the guardcom and his guards are from different units, the guardcom will find it hard commanding them.
[*] sometimes the guards are from other mono-intake units attached here for course. they never use a M16 before as they are trained to handle SAR21 since their mono-intake BMT.
selecting soldiers who are not even M16 trained for guard duties really makes me wonder whoever select the guards did he even make an effort to check whether all of them are M16 trained or not?
there's are many more i'll like to bring up but this post is getting too long so i'll leave to the rest of you to share with us your experiences. -
SUMMARISE....PLS...
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read liao very enriching . thankyew. although i dont go tekong tekong
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u probably wouldn't understand since i believe u haven't serve NS right?Originally posted by Aaron8209:SUMMARISE....PLS...
these are serious concerns, i could have written more but didn't want to make it too long.
please read through it if u intersted, else click on "Newest Topics" on your left and find another topic to take part in. -
actually, those that are nt m16 trained, sometimes are allowed to hold truncheon and baton, but the other mus be m16 trained la.
but its true la, the ppl doing guard are nt experienced, always change, sometimes is cos they tio extra kena guard duty, suay suay, no heart to do their job.....
cant really blame them, its hw the system works. it calls for inexperienced men but slightly more experienced commander, ie: nt very experienced and effective overall guards...... -
My buddy whom was recently on duty at Sungei Gedong Camp, had a total of 6 turnouts in a single night of duty due to the recent incident.
And Gordonator, I'm surprised that SAR21 trained guards are not M16 Trained. Because I've seen guards armed with SAR21 or M16 when i go back to HQ NCC for trg. So are SAR21 guards armed with M16 when on duty? -
i think that depends on which unit they are frm. cos nt every unit is equipped with sar21, eg: navy n air force still use ar15. but maybe some army units still use ar15 too...
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these guards might be lao jiao already and have been trained in M16 as well during some point in their NS life.Originally posted by SpecOps87:And Gordonator, I'm surprised that SAR21 trained guards are not M16 Trained. Because I've seen guards armed with SAR21 or M16 when i go back to HQ NCC for trg. So are SAR21 guards armed with M16 when on duty?
for my case, i personally have seen quite a few times guards feed-backing that they are not M16 trained which leads me to conclude that probably they are still fresh, M16 handling is not part of their mono-intake BMT. -
ya, in tekong bmt, will learn m16 first, then if u get posted to sar21 unit u get to learn sar21 too. mono intake might nt get the chance to learn both.
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Well, my camp was next to Gordy's. We never had problems with our guards, they were mostly specialists and even if there were trainees or newly-posted in personnel, we always tried to keep a 3SG together with a greenhorn PTE/LCP so that the former can guide the new bird.
And yes, we used AR-15s. However, we had no mono-intake personnel as it was a majority Specialist camp, so there wasn't a problem with new birds not knowing how to use one of those things.
However, as I usually walked over to his camp for lunch, I always felt that his camp sentries were quite on the ball when it came to ensuring that people only enter after they've been processed, or gotten the required pass.
I'll post more another time. Just to share how different camps can have vastly different styles.
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guard duty is always done by those tio extra. why not get those RP to do night guard duty too?
then all will be professional enuff to secure the camp. -
my old camp guards oso quite siao on wan... they will conduct chks bags of those leaving the camps, but if anyone wanna hide anything on their body den ll lah... but i been to other camps n dint really c such on-ness
when i did my guard, it was bcos is rostered... but cos we always do as 1 whole grp so not too bad, got gd company...
but i tink e guard com n DO shld b more on to prevent any lapses, during my time, some DO nvr mount guard, nvr turn out guard, but some DO will diligently turn out guard n do drills... @ dat time will feel damn sian n shack but now noe its 2 heighten our readiness -
Now most of the camp is on the balls....but i think it will only last about 4 - 5 mths then after that it will be back to normal. Seriously, nobody would find peforming guard duty is fun therefore they will do a substandard performance.
In my own opinion, if someone drive a car in, the rp will ask to open and check inside. But what if that someone is a major or big shot, you think that rp will do the same thing? And how do they really check? Just open the boot, check here and there then ok liao. One can really easily bing "dangerous" items inside to camp by hiding it tactically. I feel that SAF really need to overhaul the whole security system to the level like the causeway/tuas standard -
My camp very little Cpl and below,hence sometimes very weird guard commd 3sg,2IC 3SG even guards also 3sg LOL,as for DO,usually a SSG and above.Hence we all usually prefer to be guards than guard commd hahaa,guard commd more sai kang to do guards just do the normal duties can liao.
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Hmm tml we will noe wat will happen to Cpl Teo liao...all the best to him
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Same camp lah.Originally posted by KenPlus:My camp very little Cpl and below,hence sometimes very weird guard commd 3sg,2IC 3SG even guards also 3sg LOL,as for DO,usually a SSG and above.Hence we all usually prefer to be guards than guard commd hahaa,guard commd more sai kang to do guards just do the normal duties can liao.
Once, I was Guard Comd, and my Guard 2IC was a 2SG from the other units.
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My side, the higher the rank, sometimes the "tekan-session" happened more often.Originally posted by zorro82:Now most of the camp is on the balls....but i think it will only last about 4 - 5 mths then after that it will be back to normal. Seriously, nobody would find peforming guard duty is fun therefore they will do a substandard performance.
In my own opinion, if someone drive a car in, the rp will ask to open and check inside. But what if that someone is a major or big shot, you think that rp will do the same thing? And how do they really check? Just open the boot, check here and there then ok liao. One can really easily bing "dangerous" items inside to camp by hiding it tactically. I feel that SAF really need to overhaul the whole security system to the level like the causeway/tuas standard
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sometimes i really pity the guards doing weekend duties. the strength is the same as weekdays, 8 but on weekends they have to do 24 hrs shift of 2 hrs work 2 hrs rest.
i understand how it feels, 2 hrs of duty always seems an eternity but 2 hrs rest always go past so fast. hardly enough time to take a nap.
furthermore my camp sentry area is not sheltered like in Maju Camp, the poor lads has to stand under the hot sun.
saturday at least not so bad, sunday go back can rest. those kena sunday one is the worst, monday still need to carry on their lessons. -
For my camp hmm not really weekends duty are even more slack than weekdays as the whole camp empty and we even close the gates LOL,play PS2(if the DO is i know or very gd one hahaa)machiam chalet sia sometime even change into PT kit hahaha but correct lah weekend in camp is sian but not sian when we buy itOriginally posted by Gordonator:sometimes i really pity the guards doing weekend duties. the strength is the same as weekdays, 8 but on weekends they have to do 24 hrs shift of 2 hrs work 2 hrs rest.
i understand how it feels, 2 hrs of duty always seems an eternity but 2 hrs rest always go past so fast. hardly enough time to take a nap.
furthermore my camp sentry area is not sheltered like in Maju Camp, the poor lads has to stand under the hot sun.
saturday at least not so bad, sunday go back can rest. those kena sunday one is the worst, monday still need to carry on their lessons.
haha now quite sensitive lah but what i say is last time,when i am nsf now ord liao soo dunno liao ahhaaaaa -
only one question regards arms for the guards personnel.
I thought u would use your dedicated arms to do guard duty. Unless u r in HQ personnel or service side. and if your rifle is zero why would u use a different arms?
U only got limited rounds in the mag and if you REALLY REALLY have to use it. chances are it has to be 1 for 1.
The other question is how do they clear arms? if the individual is not certified technical handling of the weapon assigned. Than how many crab is going to row? -
that time my place one medic horn the checkpoint cos peak hr n jam mah. he suay suay my co behind him, come out give him pasar malam....
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This practice differs between units or even companies.Originally posted by Arapahoe:only one question regards arms for the guards personnel.
I thought u would use your dedicated arms to do guard duty. Unless u r in HQ personnel or service side. and if your rifle is zero why would u use a different arms?
U only got limited rounds in the mag and if you REALLY REALLY have to use it. chances are it has to be 1 for 1.
The other question is how do they clear arms? if the individual is not certified technical handling of the weapon assigned. Than how many crab is going to row?
Some companies set aside a number of rifles solely for guard duty.
Some units set aside a number of rifles at the guard house.
the standing order is supposed to be that service personnel is only allowed to use arms he has passed technical handling on AND fired at least a live round from it in a range setting.
But another standing order also state guards of a critical or sensitive camps are not allowed to hold truncheon and shield.
This 2 conflicting SOs make the amount of qualified personnel limited to the point i guess they "close" one eye. -
tink they should've a vocation/unit specialise in guardduty... RP no enuff...
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he not talking about tekongOriginally posted by oOprinceOo:read liao very enriching . thankyew. although i dont go tekong tekong -
20 SA Guards use M16Originally posted by SpecOps87:My buddy whom was recently on duty at Sungei Gedong Camp, had a total of 6 turnouts in a single night of duty due to the recent incident.
And Gordonator, I'm surprised that SAR21 trained guards are not M16 Trained. Because I've seen guards armed with SAR21 or M16 when i go back to HQ NCC for trg. So are SAR21 guards armed with M16 when on duty?
2 SIR guards use SAR21