Venture Era - a defending point of view.
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Originally posted by Tequilera:
To : Heyy mugger
How on earth do you shrink a water molucule?!?! Remove electrons? Then destabilise it where it breaks into hydrogen ions and hydroxide ions? Any O level chemistry student would know that you CANNOT SHRINK a water molecule!
If someone from VE can give me a reasonable answer to my questions, I'll definitely join VE.
well... it doesn't breaks down the molecule structure. It breaks down the molecule structure CLUSTER .
H2O definately cannot be seperated.
so .. example..
Tap water molecule structure cluster is 12-13 H2O
The products breaks it to 3-4 H2O
Uh-huh. You have scientific proofs that breaking up these clusters have any beneficial medical effects? Oh lemme guess.... supposedly 'better absorption' of the water molecules through the cell membranes, right?
I know that water molecules form strong hydrogen bonds with each other, and some molecules may come together and form H-bonds such that they become 'clusters'. But due to the random motion of the water molecules, these clusters are ever-changing in size and structure. Any one 'cluster' exists for only a short amount of time (close to picoseconds) before forming other clusters of differing molecular sizes.
The reason why no one really cares about these clusters is.... there's nothing really interesting about them.
Please give proper scientific proof that water exists solely as clusters of '12 to 13' molecules, and that breaking these clusters is beneficial for the body.
(Dang..... this oughta be fun.
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lol you want like that argue. forever no end one~
hahas. i can't please everyone so if you can't accept the answer then never mind lo~
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like what argue? u mean argue with facts?
luckily we have someone who knows his chemistry or else you people will be fooling everyone
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Originally posted by Tequilera:
lol you want like that argue. forever no end one~
hahas. i can't please everyone so if you can't accept the answer then never mind lo~
LOL...This is all you can do when challenged to raise scientific proof for the products you are selling or planning to sell?
It is a chargeable offence to sell products based on false information hor.If you are not convinced, there's always an ex-MOE JC Chem and Bio teacher, UltimaOnline, to ask.
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Originally posted by Tequilera:
lol you want like that argue. forever no end one~
hahas. i can't please everyone so if you can't accept the answer then never mind lo~
Yes, I argue 'like that'. With cold, hard and objective scientific facts.
And yes, I cannot accept your answer, because it is at odds with what the mainstream scientific community knows.
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Originally posted by Tequilera:
lol you want like that argue. forever no end one~
hahas. i can't please everyone so if you can't accept the answer then never mind lo~
The VE's starter kit dun have facts?
U phail as mlmer. If customer ask u this how r u going to answer?
"Lang kiang jiu ho, mai kay kiang"
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If anything sounds too good to be true, it probably is. My friend and I thought it was a 'normal retail assistant' job =_=, selling normal products like clothes. There was no mention of the company name on Classifieds Ads, so we couldn't do prior research.
DAY 1: Went in like gundus. Got wowed by the magic tricks. But we were also surprised that 70% of the presentation was alotted to explaining the corporate structure, their record sales and the steps to success (ie. money & cars). Considering that this it's 'revolutionary technology', shouldn't they delve more into specific facts? But I guess it didn't matter because we were there for the "retail assistant" job and not "researcher". We then met a lady of a higher ranking, who told us not to break the news to our parents until we went through the training (to ensure thorough brainwashing) the next day. We came out of the entire process pretty hyped up about the money and getting a job at last. I was already dreaming of my Audi convertible.
When I went home, the skeptical side of me decided to look them up online to double-check their credibility. So this thread and a few others came up. LOL it got me recalling all my sec 3&4 Chem&Physics theory and reading up a lot of articles. It got me HIGHLY weirded out because of all the positive statements made by them about their product earlier during the day.
DAY 2: So then we decided to go 'undercover' during training. I asked our PIC for an R&D file (3 times) (&I'm not talking about the files used for product introduction); I was actually earnestly curious about the 'science behind it all' and wanted to x-ref to check for reliability, no harm right? 2hrs+2videos later, I still didn't get that "stack of all the science" a presenter from the first day mentioned they had and which my manager had promised me to help get. This unfortunately, led me to conclude that they either:
a) don't have it (I hope not) or
b) don't have it easily available because it doesn't make sense or
c) are very unorganised as it should've been an important file to assure the promoters that VE's products are backed up with proven research
I came away with ONE flyer about their magnetic mattress. When I asked the name of the manufacturer "in Japan" (phrase used in abundance, I think, to prop up the high tech origin of their products) manufactured the products, and she wasn't sure (means: donno). She did give me some Japanese guy's name, which upon googling does not come up with any matches related to magnetic therapy.
point: They couldn't convince me to be confident enough of the product to promote it = HOW TO SELL?? And if it's not sufficiently proven, why would I want to sell/promote it? That's like selling magic beansThen we met up with the same lady from DAY 1. We got straight to the point about the pay. MLM/NM = no basic pay (already thinking: don't want already but need to interrupt her to say) okay. But then she tried to convince us that being in NM is good in the long run (residual income, 'reduced backstabbing', look good in resume). We won't become like our aunties/uncles who slog in tradtional corporate companies, amount to nothing much and at the ages 40-50 only earn $4-5k/mthly; having "no choice". Doing the work was easy as well, only "nod-nod" during manager's presentation can get money already.
point: Does that mean I can simply cash in as an SA and don't move up? I really don't want to be the one selling their products because I don't believe in them =_= $450-800 a week isn't bad for a part-timerSome thread repliers mentioned a contact list they apparently encourage recruits to make but my friend and I couldn't even bear to reach that stage. So we told them we were still considering whether or not to stay cuz we're really only looking for a short-term job and was iffy about the whole thing anyway. I think the lady was getting irritated cuz kept wanting more assurance about having a confirm pay and there was another candidate at the table who didn't seem to have any qualms lol. At least we didn't completely blew her off as pre-planned. She was actually quite pleasant and patient. She's apparently quite successful in the company so, kudos! to her I guess.
I'm not here to criticise NM or MLM since this is my only (&brief) experience with such corporate structures. But I believe that I can say that Venture Era neither project themselves nor their trainees as professional nor transparent when it got down to the nitty gritty and our 2nd day's prodding confirmed our worries. Since it took nothing to qualify for the job other than my age, I don't think I'm unfit to say that.
Even if science eventually proves the marvellous qualities of their products and the company's yearly turnover is phenomenal, I can safely say I won't regret not being part of their co. Not my type of people anyway. They presented themselves as extremely money-minded .__. as though there're no other benefits to a job besides the amount you reap in at the end of the day. &that's not a good thing to encourage.
LOOL okay super long post. If you have the patience to read that kudos! to you too : D I'm just sharing an experience.
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i got a qn here... why do all VE agents get pwned here?
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getting interested n curious abt all dis kinda chemistry thing. will anyone like to explain abt nano technology? thanks...
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Originally posted by elementalangel:
i got a qn here... why do all VE agents get pwned here?
Trying to act hero, defend their company .. Get pwned .. Go back office to clarify their doubts and got fucked.
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Originally posted by Midlusionz:
Trying to act hero, defend their company .. Get pwned .. Go back office to clarify their doubts and got fucked.
then realised they have been tricked... regrets... wahahahaa
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Originally posted by elementalangel:
then realised they have been tricked... regrets... wahahahaa
will they really realise it?
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Originally posted by elementalangel:
then realised they have been tricked... regrets... wahahahaa
Nope, they will go, "oh noes, i must listen to my upline! Those on SGforums are liars!" -
Originally posted by eagle:
will they really realise it?
yes they will... that is where they stop postign and start hiding themselves
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i just find it funny. how u work so hard in bringing the company down without letting readers like me know what really happened to you
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it doesnt matter, doesnt it?
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Originally posted by hubbabubbaskateboard:
i just find it funny. how u work so hard in bringing the company down without letting readers like me know what really happened to you
i havnt worked there before... just felt scammed when they told me to sell over priced products to my family... and claimed that it is cheap..
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Originally posted by eagle:
LOL...This is all you can do when challenged to raise scientific proof for the products you are selling or planning to sell?
It is a chargeable offence to sell products based on false information hor.If you are not convinced, there's always an ex-MOE JC Chem and Bio teacher, UltimaOnline, to ask.
Damn, you are good in marketing.
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Hi everyone. I'm a neutral and i have some points to share.
Those that are against Venture Era have several points to argue, mainly:
- Recruiting of teenagers.
- Motivation via greed.
- Promoting the idea of quitting school.
- Doubts about the authencity of the products.
- Possible health hazards involved.
- Moral values of Venture Era such as ruthlessness and greed.
- Tying down people with cars.
While those that are with Venture Era have several points to argue as well, such as:
- It is a proper and successful marketing strategy.
- Rewarding business.
- No start up costs involved.
- Genuine quality of products.
- Beneficial to health.
- Promotes hard work.
I do agree with both sides. Venture Era definitely has a successful business model. By targetting teenagers and their weaknesses such as money and cars, they can motivate them into doing the jobs. No one can argue that they are not doing a proper business and are scamming others. Because as long as the consumers are willing to pay the price that is being asked of them, it is totally legitimate. Business as it is is all about buying low and selling high, which will then bring about profits. The price of goods will definitely have to cover the cost of production, in this case, the extravagent wages and rewards of these distributors. No doubt that the goods have been over priced, but it is perfectly legitimate.
In my opinion, using teenagers as distributors is a masterstroke. With such overwhelming incentives, Venture Era can sell their products through enthusiastic people without having to pay fixed salaries to them, which would be beneficial to their business. And by letting these teenagers do their own business, they have the power to control their salaries without the need of having any capital. Whereas if Venture Era had adopted a policy which involves paying fixed salaries to the teenagers, the disparity in motivation would have been significant. Business is not just about the product itself, but also the staffs' motivation. And this is exactly what Venture Era is banging on.
As for the better counter arguments, they are mainly targetting the business ethics and moral values of Venture Era. Indeed, the mainstream people would deem quitting school as an risky act because of the social stigma that has been established in Singapore. Most would condemn Venture Era's impact on these teenagers, for fear that they might ruin their future by choosing the unconventional career path. There is no right or wrong in this case. If Venture Era is a scam, this argument would have stand. But since there are successful cases, moral values are subjective to opinions. Furthermore, Singapore encourages entrepreneurship and taking risks. Venture Era definitely provides this opportunity.
Whereas some counter arguments include the lost of friends and relatives. In my opinion, I believe that the defenders of Venture Era has done well in their arguments. Indeed, it is up to the individuals to decide their approach to the job. The company does encourage targetting of the distributors' family and friends, and there is nothing wrong with that. In fact, it is a very good business strategy.
However, I do have some slight concerns over the values that Venture Era is indirectly or maybe even directly promoting. Which is greed. Again it is human nature to greed for more spending power and higher status. Just like Singapore's education system, we are all accustomed to perform under constant pressure to achieve our targets, be it getting to the dream college or getting our dream jobs and our dream pay. Venture Era is not entirely wrong about promoting the value of "greed" as long as it's achieved with hard work. And for that matter, Venture Era does promote a meritocracy system to encourage hard work.
As for tying down these teenagers with cars, it is again subjective. The company rewards hard working workers with cars, at the same time ties them down to their jobs. It might sound unethical at first, but viewing from a different viewpoint, it is yet another successful business strategy. Venture Era does not break their promise nor resort to scams to cheat their employees of their hard work. In fact, I would have to agree that Venture Era has really taken good care of their staffs' welfare. It's only fair that the company rewards accordingly to the hard work. The Car Achievers benefit from having their own dream cars. On one hand the employees are motivated to work and are rewarded handsomely, and on the other hand the company has extra assurance of keeping their staffs. It's a win win situation and a two sided affair.
Whereas whether the products are of genuine quality, I have no idea. Perhaps this is the biggest loophole of Venture Era. They do not portray a positive image of their company by instilling trust in their products from the public. No doubt that Network Marketing is a successful business model, but I believe that adequate advertising and promoting of products are also essential to promote the image of the company. Doubts and skeptics would not have been as much if Venture Era has established its reputation. And the fact that most people that are defending Venture Era are most probably teenagers that are more proned to using emotive languages and mediocre examples such as Bill Gates and Thomas Edison ,Venture Era's credibility and professional image is further jeopardised.
On a final note, I wish to advice all interested parties to consider their options thoroughly before making any impulsive decisions. Do consult your parents and seek for any professional help before making decisions. Do adequate researches to find out what you're getting yourself into to avoid any regrets. And I do wish to see Venture Era promoting their products more to build up their credibility.
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omg, a wall of text
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OMFG AoE dmg man!
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Originally posted by Hardcoreblizzard:
Hi everyone. I'm a neutral and i have some points to share.
Those that are against Venture Era have several points to argue, mainly:
- Recruiting of teenagers.
- Motivation via greed.
- Promoting the idea of quitting school.
- Doubts about the authencity of the products.
- Possible health hazards involved.
- Moral values of Venture Era such as ruthlessness and greed.
- Tying down people with cars.
While those that are with Venture Era have several points to argue as well, such as:
- It is a proper and successful marketing strategy.
- Rewarding business.
- No start up costs involved.
- Genuine quality of products.
- Beneficial to health.
- Promotes hard work.
I do agree with both sides. Venture Era definitely has a successful business model. By targetting teenagers and their weaknesses such as money and cars, they can motivate them into doing the jobs. No one can argue that they are not doing a proper business and are scamming others. Because as long as the consumers are willing to pay the price that is being asked of them, it is totally legitimate. Business as it is is all about buying low and selling high, which will then bring about profits. The price of goods will definitely have to cover the cost of production, in this case, the extravagent wages and rewards of these distributors. No doubt that the goods have been over priced, but it is perfectly legitimate.
In my opinion, using teenagers as distributors is a masterstroke. With such overwhelming incentives, Venture Era can sell their products through enthusiastic people without having to pay fixed salaries to them, which would be beneficial to their business. And by letting these teenagers do their own business, they have the power to control their salaries without the need of having any capital. Whereas if Venture Era had adopted a policy which involves paying fixed salaries to the teenagers, the disparity in motivation would have been significant. Business is not just about the product itself, but also the staffs' motivation. And this is exactly what Venture Era is banging on.
As for the better counter arguments, they are mainly targetting the business ethics and moral values of Venture Era. Indeed, the mainstream people would deem quitting school as an risky act because of the social stigma that has been established in Singapore. Most would condemn Venture Era's impact on these teenagers, for fear that they might ruin their future by choosing the unconventional career path. There is no right or wrong in this case. If Venture Era is a scam, this argument would have stand. But since there are successful cases, moral values are subjective to opinions. Furthermore, Singapore encourages entrepreneurship and taking risks. Venture Era definitely provides this opportunity.
Whereas some counter arguments include the lost of friends and relatives. In my opinion, I believe that the defenders of Venture Era has done well in their arguments. Indeed, it is up to the individuals to decide their approach to the job. The company does encourage targetting of the distributors' family and friends, and there is nothing wrong with that. In fact, it is a very good business strategy.
However, I do have some slight concerns over the values that Venture Era is indirectly or maybe even directly promoting. Which is greed. Again it is human nature to greed for more spending power and higher status. Just like Singapore's education system, we are all accustomed to perform under constant pressure to achieve our targets, be it getting to the dream college or getting our dream jobs and our dream pay. Venture Era is not entirely wrong about promoting the value of "greed" as long as it's achieved with hard work. And for that matter, Venture Era does promote a meritocracy system to encourage hard work.
As for tying down these teenagers with cars, it is again subjective. The company rewards hard working workers with cars, at the same time ties them down to their jobs. It might sound unethical at first, but viewing from a different viewpoint, it is yet another successful business strategy. Venture Era does not break their promise nor resort to scams to cheat their employees of their hard work. In fact, I would have to agree that Venture Era has really taken good care of their staffs' welfare. It's only fair that the company rewards accordingly to the hard work. The Car Achievers benefit from having their own dream cars. On one hand the employees are motivated to work and are rewarded handsomely, and on the other hand the company has extra assurance of keeping their staffs. It's a win win situation and a two sided affair.
Whereas whether the products are of genuine quality, I have no idea. Perhaps this is the biggest loophole of Venture Era. They do not portray a positive image of their company by instilling trust in their products from the public. No doubt that Network Marketing is a successful business model, but I believe that adequate advertising and promoting of products are also essential to promote the image of the company. Doubts and skeptics would not have been as much if Venture Era has established its reputation. And the fact that most people that are defending Venture Era are most probably teenagers that are more proned to using emotive languages and mediocre examples such as Bill Gates and Thomas Edison ,Venture Era's credibility and professional image is further jeopardised.
On a final note, I wish to advice all interested parties to consider their options thoroughly before making any impulsive decisions. Do consult your parents and seek for any professional help before making decisions. Do adequate researches to find out what you're getting yourself into to avoid any regrets. And I do wish to see Venture Era promoting their products more to build up their credibility.
u are promoting how good the people at the admin side of VE thinks and not mainly for the sake of the people working there.
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I'm not actually promoting anything. I'm just giving my neutral point of view, weighing the possible pros and cons of being involved in such a business model. However, I do admit that I am impressed with their business brains. Whereas for the sake of the people working there, I believe it's every man for himself. You have to know what's the best for yourself because no one is able to help you make personal decisions like how much you are willing to commit. For this I believe it happens anywhere, not just in Venture Era. Since there are successful cases in this company, why not try listening to it with a open heart, instead of closing your ears even before anything is being said? What's the most that you stand to lose? Time? Because Venture Era doesn't require you to fork out your own money like Sunshine Empire did, which eventually led to the possibility of a scam. And if you have committed 1 month, or even just 2 weeks to give it a try, it is never too late to back out if you've realised that it's not the ideal career path for you. Why miss out on possible success routes because of the social stigma that has been inflicted by the public? To me, that is definitely not a wise thing to do. And if you really do end up as one of the high earners, who else but yourself do you have to thank for opening up your mind and accepting new ideas?
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Time is money, no?
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Being a MLMer in VE is not a rewarding business; it's not even their own business to begin with, yet they claim they are doing their own business. That's one thing I'm against.
Second thing which has been failed to be brought out is that being an MLMer in VE helps you build passive income. Really duh...
In all, your point of view is not neutral enough. I'm still neutral, preferring to look at facts objectively, and have not condemned anything on their products.