Novena Church exorcism suit begins
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Singapore
Valli laughed off priests' prayer attempts, says doc Khushwant Singh 31 July 2008
Straits Times English
(c) 2008 Singapore Press Holdings Limited
GP testifies that plaintiff found early part of alleged incident amusing
AFTER nine months, 31 witnesses and 40 days of courtroom drama, Singapore's sensational 'exorcism' hearing came to a close yesterday, but not before a doctor offered more insight into the woman at the centre of the case.
Dr Kartika Hanafi told the High Court that Madam Amutha Valli Krishnan, who claims that she was traumatised by a church 'exorcism' in 2004, was amused by the incident.
Two days after the alleged incident in which church-goers and priests had tried to drive an evil spirit out of her, Madam Valli said that the priests were silly and that she enjoyed the stupidity of the occasion, Dr Kartika testified.
Later, upon cross-examination by Madam Valli's lawyer R.S. Bajwa, Dr Kartika agreed that the woman was referring only to the early part of the incident, when she found herself surrounded by five praying church-goers after fainting in the Novena Church on Aug 10, 2004.
Madam Valli is claiming that two priests and six church-goers pinned her down and began chanting over her to 'exorcise' a spirit, an ordeal that left her with post-traumatic stress disorder. The defendants deny the allegations and say she is faking her symptoms.
Dr Kartika, a general practitioner at the Flame Tree Medical Centre, also said that Madam Valli later became depressed because of flashbacks and nightmares of the incident at the church. She also complained of being lethargic and unable to sleep.
Meanwhile, lawyers for the defendants told Dr Kartika that Madam Valli had also visited other doctors. Earlier in the hearing, they suggested that she was shopping for doctors to sign off on her claims of depression.
Mr Darrell Low, who is acting for three church-goers, produced a compilation of Madam Valli's visits to Dr Kartika's clinic and another clinic between October and Nov 1, 2004. She obtained 74 sleeping pills from the two clinics while being treated at Tan Tock Seng Hospital for psychiatric problems.
Dr Kartika said she would not have prescribed the pills to Madam Valli had she known that the woman had been given medication by another doctor.
The doctor also said that Madam Valli had asked for a medical report that did not mention her alcoholism, family problems and depression. Dr Kartika refused the request.
About this case
YESTERDAY marked the final day of testimony in a civil hearing in which Madam Amutha Valli Krishnan claims she was traumatised by a forced exorcism at the Novena Church on Aug 10, 2004.
The 52-year-old part-time tutor is suing the Redemptorist Order that runs the church, two priests and six church-goers.
The last witness was Dr Kartika Hanafi, who saw Madam Valli two days after the alleged exorcism.
Dr Kartika said that Madam Valli was initially amused by the experience, calling the priests and church-goers who chanted over her silly.
Both sides are to submit their final arguments by Sept 29.
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If she was possessed and in a real trance, what is there for her to be amused by? And worse, to remember she felt amused. I salute the Defense team for uncovering her fake medical history. She lied when she went to the Novena Church and she has been consistently lying all these years with her song-and-dance with the doctors.
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Read about case in America, girl 17-at-the-time was held down over two days, she was shouting and all that to be released but the youth pastor and his gang were convinced she had been possesed by Devil!
Anyway, so went to court... and High Court in Texas decided: We can't help you, because this is a case of disputed church doctrine and so protected under freedom of religion! Like, wacko.
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America is a good white protestant country. If the claims was filed against the Catholic Church, the judge may have made a different call. It is also a disgustingly litigation mad country. If you try to help someone, you could be sued for interference. If you stop a criminal, he is capable of turning around to sue you. So bah to the USA and their legal system!
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Doctor of alleged exorcism victim refers to her medical notes in court and says:
She wanted me to lie about her medical history
By Arul John
August 01, 2008
SHE told her doctor in 2004 that she did not mind having her previous medical history and family problems revealed.
At that time, she was adamant about taking those allegedly behind her exorcism to court.
However, about a year later, Madam Amutha Valli Krishnan wanted those details covered up when she asked the same doctor for a medical report.
The last witness of the Novena Church exorcism trial, Dr Kartika Hanafi, revealed this in court yesterday, the last day of the trial.
Madam Amutha, 52, claims she was the victim of a forced exorcism at the church on 10 Aug 2004.
She is seeking compensation and is suing the Redemptorist Order that runs the church, two priests and six churchgoers.
Cross-examined by defence lawyer Anthony Lee, Dr Kartika said Madam Amutha had been a patient at Flame Tree Medical Centre (FTMC) since 15 Oct 2003.
COMPLAINTS
She said she frequently complained of insomnia and stress caused by problems with her work and family, and also told Dr Kartika of her alcohol dependency to help her sleep.
Dr Kartika said that on 11 Aug, the day after the alleged exorcism, Madam Amutha visited the clinic and told the doctor examining her, Dr Doreen Ang, what had happened to her.
She visited FTMC again the next day and told Dr Kartika the same account. Referring to her medical case notes, the doctor said Madam Amutha told her on 9 Aug she had gone with her family to the Novena church to pray.
Madam Amutha said she fainted in the church and woke up in a room there and saw people around her.
Reading from her case notes, she said: 'The patient (Madam Amutha) asked who they were and someone said, 'I am Jesus'. She became angry and said, 'Then I am Lucifer'.
'There were four men holding her down and a lady read a Bible and sprinkled holy water. A 'pastor' asked her to identify the cross and eat the holy wafer. The patient all along felt they were all 'silly' and she was enjoying the stupidity of the situation.'
On 18 and 24 Aug, Dr Kartika said, Madam Amutha visited FTMC and told the doctor examining her that she could not help thinking of the events of 10 Aug, and wanted to take the priests involved to court.
She said Madam Amutha visited her at the clinic on 30 Aug 2004, and told her she was adamant in pursuing the case in court.
She said: 'Madam Amutha told me her son had called the PM's office and TV to publicise the case. I advised her to see a psychiatrist.'
Dr Kartika said Madam Amutha told her she was not worried that her psychiatric history, alcoholism or family problems would be known.
'Madam Amutha said, 'This (the medical history) is irrelevant to the case! I want justice'.'
But on 21 Oct 2005, Madam Amutha changed her tune.
Dr Kartika said: 'She came to see me after an absence of one year. She said she was advised to get a medical report from her doctors, past and present, to ascertain her mental state prior to the incident on 10 Aug 2004.
'She wanted me to write a medical report but wanted no mention of her family problems, alcoholism and depression.
'I told her it would not be legal or right because it would be a great omission of the truth. She insisted on the medical report but in the end, I informed her that I could not write it.'
Both sides' lawyers are supposed to hand in their written submissions by 29 Sep, said defence lawyer Tito Isaac.
He said oral replies would be made in the week starting 13 Oct, followed by Justice Lee Seiu Kin's judgment.
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so, is this case over for the time being until the solicitors hand in their written submissions?
i wonder if Singtel is going to sue SW?
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I don't know why I could be shocked that she could ask the doctor to lie for her! So much for being too traumatic to think clearly. And so much for her family's denials about not knowing about her doctor shopping.
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I am very interested to see what happens after the verdict.
If SW loses the case, will she and her family commit mass suicide? If she doesn't kill herself, how is she going to pay the huge legal fees? -
Originally posted by Honeybunz:
I am very interested to see what happens after the verdict.
If SW loses the case, will she and her family commit mass suicide? If she doesn't kill herself, how is she going to pay the huge legal fees?
I suppose, the Redemptorist Order could subsidize some of the legal costs. Of course that will surely cause plenty of uproar. -
I would like to read Justice Lee's judgement, and see what points of law were argued for and taken into account in the decision.
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Originally posted by SingaporeMacross:
I suppose, the Redemptorist Order could subsidize some of the legal costs. Of course that will surely cause plenty of uproar.
Huh? Are you saying the Redemptorist Order could subsidise some of the lying cheating plaintiff's legal costs? Why should they do that? It is a different story if this was a genuine case needing financial assistance! But this is a deliberate attempt to swindle money.Did you read the papers that before the case came to trial, as soon as the plaintiffs had a lawyer stupid enough to take the case, it was her son who contacted several journalists as they wanted the case to be publicised. No wonder before the trial began and in the early days of the trial, the reporters sounded so sympathetic to that SM and her family of con artists.
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you obviously have closed your mind and are unable to see that the ST reports says that Simon Tan had accepted that he went beyond prayer. Since he has admitted what is your problem??????? Were you there??? Those who have attended in the public gallery and who obviously have open minds unlike you including catholics like me appreciate that alot of smoke has been thrown up by the church whilst the real issue is very clear, she was subjected to more than a prayer and Simon agrees. At least, the lady has an excuse of previos mental illness, what excuse has a bigot like you have?????
If you cannot an open mind, then keep your mouth shut!!!!
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Huh???
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hi veryfaircomment
How's the weather at Blk 620 Ang Mo Kio Ave 9?
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Originally posted by Faircomment:
you obviously have closed your mind and are unable to see that the ST reports says that Simon Tan had accepted that he went beyond prayer. Since he has admitted what is your problem??????? Were you there??? Those who have attended in the public gallery and who obviously have open minds unlike you including catholics like me appreciate that alot of smoke has been thrown up by the church whilst the real issue is very clear, she was subjected to more than a prayer and Simon agrees. At least, the lady has an excuse of previos mental illness, what excuse has a bigot like you have?????
If you cannot an open mind, then keep your mouth shut!!!!
So interesting you talk about open mind, then you call me a bigot and ask me to shut my mouth. Practise what you preach then come back to the forum. I attended quite a number of court hearings and the sentiment of the public gallery is far different from what you claim!
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after all that, how goes the case?
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Originally posted by Faircomment:
you obviously have closed your mind and are unable to see that the ST reports says that Simon Tan had accepted that he went beyond prayer. Since he has admitted what is your problem??????? Were you there??? Those who have attended in the public gallery and who obviously have open minds unlike you including catholics like me appreciate that alot of smoke has been thrown up by the church whilst the real issue is very clear, she was subjected to more than a prayer and Simon agrees. At least, the lady has an excuse of previos mental illness, what excuse has a bigot like you have?????
If you cannot an open mind, then keep your mouth shut!!!!
If you think the church is in the wrong and Amutha is the victim, by all means show your sympathy and open-mindedness by giving her $250,000 that she is asking for from the church and help her pay the legal fees. You want to sound like a hero, we respect that.
We are not interested in teaching people how to be smart.
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Originally posted by the Bear:
after all that, how goes the case?
I believe the lawyers from both sides have already submitted the papers to the court (deadline was 30 Sep). Now pending for the verdict. If I'm not wrong, it's in mid Oct.
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There will be a closing submission tomorrow at Supreme Court 4D from 10 am.
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Originally posted by Honeybunz:
There will be a closing submission tomorrow at Supreme Court 4D from 10 am.
are you going to have a look?
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Originally posted by the Bear:
are you going to have a look?
Not sure yet. But if I can't go, I will keep tuning in internet to get updates...hehehe
You going?
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Originally posted by Honeybunz:
Not sure yet. But if I can't go, I will keep tuning in internet to get updates...hehehe
You going?
not a chance.. not because don't want to go but work seems to be accelerating.. that's the word to use.. accelerating...
and we're going to be running to stand still at work until next FY
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Oct 15, 2008
Lawyers to file statements
Court hearing for them to make closing submissions was called off on Wednesday.
By Selina Lum
LAWYERS for both sides in the Novena Church 'exorcism' case returned to court on Wednesday to make closing submissions.
But the hearing, scheduled for two days, was called off. Instead, the lawyers will file written replies to each other's arguments.
The lawyers involved declined to reveal the reason for the change. It was not immediately clear if there will be an open-court hearing before the judge delivers his decision.
The high-profile case was last heard in Aug. Madam Amutha Valli Krishnan, 52, sued two priests and six churchgoers for allegedly forcing an exorcism on her at the Novena church in Aug 2004.
She claimed she was pinned down, sat upon and strangled during the session, which left her so traumatised that she is unable to lead a normal life.
The defendants said they merely prayed over her and had held her down to stop her from hurting herself.
They described Madam Valli as behaving strangely and violently at the church, such as creeping on the floor like a snake. -
i think they don't want to talk about it...
too nonsensical..
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Originally posted by the Bear:
i think they don't want to talk about it...
too nonsensical..
I managed to go there this morning and I prayed hard that I would be able to get a seat.
In the end, the thing was cancelled!
So angry.