Warnings to Buddhist about unorthodox sect in Singapore
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it says its their first "zhu", probably refering to ancestor or priest or monk of their temple and placed it alongside buddha, either refering it has gain buddhahood or on the same status.Originally posted by maggot:Nice picture
if u can see, there are animals feeding on a corpse on the bottom left and right side of the picture. and human heads satay on top left. the left sides are all weapons, and the right side are all arms of various beings.
and a big fat dick in the middle.. but lets juz ignore it for now. -
The truth is always ugly so it is the real truth
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I wonder too.Originally posted by sinweiy:yeah, i normally don't do deframing and would respect ppl, but i wonder how come they (Singapore Gelugpa Buddhist Society ) have this privilege to have the Buddha's relics and Buddha's disciples' relics for the exhibition in Spore Expo come end of the year.
http://www.gelugpa.com/images/Gelugpa/Forms/Relic.pdf
http://www.gelugpa.com
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Anyway today I went to MPH to buy some books and found out that many many Buddhist books in the Buddhist corner were from Geshe Kelsang Gyatso
Haiz... hope ppl will not be misleaded. -
Wah lau be more respectful can... (your last sentence)Originally posted by Ito_^:it says its their first "zhu", probably refering to ancestor or priest or monk of their temple and placed it alongside buddha, either refering it has gain buddhahood or on the same status.
if u can see, there are animals feeding on a corpse on the bottom left and right side of the picture. and human heads satay on top left. the left sides are all weapons, and the right side are all arms of various beings.
and a big fat dick in the middle.. but lets juz ignore it for now. -
please refrain from posting wrathful deities or worldly spirit ,Originally posted by Ito_^:
kewl!
it can be a traumatic experience to some people who have weak heart
Under Vajrayana Buddhism ,all images of Wrathful deities have to be explained before publish them on the books , internet and online material
the person who post must have a gd intention in mind
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Shall I remove the picture?Originally posted by bohiruci:please refrain from posting wrathful deities or worldly spirit ,
it can be a traumatic experience to some people who have weak heart
Under Vajrayana Buddhism ,all images of Wrathful deities have to be explained before publish them on the books , internet and online material
the person who post must have a gd intention in mind -
Yes...pls do soOriginally posted by An Eternal Now:Shall I remove the picture?
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kk...
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i found this letter:Originally posted by An Eternal Now:I wonder too.
Anyway today I went to MPH to buy some books and found out that many many Buddhist books in the Buddhist corner were from Geshe Kelsang Gyatso Haiz... hope ppl will not be misleaded.
Geshe Kelsang Gyatso replies to Newsweek
http://www.cesnur.org/testi/fr99/gkg.htmFalse Accusations Against the Innocent
really dunno.
Letter to the editor in response to the article 'Cult Mystery'
that appeared in Newsweek International, the 28th of April 97,
and in Newsweek USA, 5th of May 97
Allow me to introduce myself; my name is Geshe Kelsang Gyatso. Since July of last year NKT people, including myself, have remained peacefully without any further involvement in the Dorje Shugden controversy. We received messages from many people, including some Tibetans in London, thanking us for leaving the controversy in peace and indicating their appreciation. Now we are very surprised by this article in Newsweek, which includes very unpleasant quotations from Robert Thurman and HH the Dalai Lama, and which causes new problems to arise.
We find that most of the information in this article is false. Amongst other things, for example, it says that the First Dalai Lama was Je Tsongkhapa's nephew. We believe that Je Gendundrub became the First Dalai Lama. Are you saying that Je Gendundrub was Je Tsongkhapa's nephew? If so, this is incorrect. ....
HH the Dalai Lama claims: "Nobody would pray to Buddha for better business, but they go to Shugden for such favours - and this is where it has become like spirit worship." This is not true. Many Tibetans pray to other Buddhas such as Tara and make prayers to other Dharma Protectors for success in business and for the removal of obstacles. Why are Shugden practitioners singled out? Particularly, in the Kadampa tradition we do not pray for worldly attainments such as wealth, reputation, success in business, etc., we pray for the welfare of all beings and the attainment of spiritual realizations.
HH the Dalai Lama is also contradicting himself. He previously regarded Dorje Shugden as a Buddha, and composed verses of praise to him that can still be seen today. It is his responsibility to resolve this contradiction.....
(cont in link)
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Tara is enlightened Bodhisattva.
Shugden is a worldly spirit - and when Geshe Kelsang Gyatso say they have left the controversy, it means he continued practising it but backed out from the debate.
Dalai Lama used to praise Dorje Shugden - that was a long time ago. He also did some practises of Dorje Shugden.. but left after he realised the harmfulness of the practise. -
there's a saying in Hua Yen Sutra: "xian yi yu kou qian, hou ling lu fo zhi. First hook them up with desire, then slowly lead them into the wisdom of Buddha."
http://sg.search.yahoo.com/search?p=%E5%85%88%E4%BB%A5%E6%AC%B2%E5%8B%BE%E7%89%BD%2C%E5%BE%8C%E4%BB%A4%E5%85%A5%E4%BD%9B%E6%99%BA&y=All+the+Web&ei=UTF-8&fr=FP-tab-web-t&x=wrt
i remember i come across a sutra of "Buddha speak of the 12 Name of great Fortunate goddess". it also got to do with wealth and is also mi zhong sutra.
http://www.suttaworld.org/gbk/sutra/kgin/kgin21/index.htm
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Yes - even Tibetan practises of Dzambala.Originally posted by sinweiy:there's a saying in Hua Yen Sutra: "xian yi yu kou qian, hou ling lu fo zhi. First hook them up with desire, then slowly lead them into the wisdom of Buddha."
http://sg.search.yahoo.com/search?p=%E5%85%88%E4%BB%A5%E6%AC%B2%E5%8B%BE%E7%89%BD%2C%E5%BE%8C%E4%BB%A4%E5%85%A5%E4%BD%9B%E6%99%BA&y=All+the+Web&ei=UTF-8&fr=FP-tab-web-t&x=wrt
i remember i come across a sutra of "Buddha speak of the 12 Name of great Fortunate goddess". it also got to do with wealth and is also mi zhong sutra.
http://www.suttaworld.org/gbk/sutra/kgin/kgin21/index.htm
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But these are all manifestations of Avalokitesvara Bodhisattva out of skillful means - they are NOT worldly spirits that can potentially cause ppl to deviate from dharma, and sectarianism. -
yes, itÂ’s the universal door of Guan Yin Bodhisattva.
CHAPTER TWENTY-FIVE
THE UNIVERSAL DOOR OF GUANSHI YIN BODHISATTVA
(THE BODHISATTVA WHO CONTEMPLATES THE SOUNDS OF THE WORLD)
http://www.buddhistdoor.com/resources/sutras/lotus/sources/lotus25.htm"If they must be saved by someone in the body of a heavenly dragon, yaksha, gandharva, asura, garuda, kinnara, mahoraga, human, or nonhuman, and so forth, he will manifest in such a body and speak Dharma for them.
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"If they must be saved by someone in the body of a Vajra-wielding spirit, he will manifest in the body of a Vajra-wielding spirit and speak Dharma for them.
"Inexhaustible Intention! Guanshiyin Bodhisattva has accomplished merit and virtue such as this and, in all manner of forms, roams throughout the land, saving and liberating living beings. -
Yup - as long as it is being taught in the sutras, the tantras, it's ok. All Tibetan deities - taras, dzambalas, etc etc, are manifestations of Mahabodhisattvas that are at least 8th Bhumi. But when it comes to wordly spirits (i.e Dorje Shugden), better be careful.
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Just wondering whether the Singapore Gelupa Society is recognised by the Buddhist comunity in Singapore (eg Fo Jiao Zhong Hui) ?
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regardless. actually i don't really want to look down on any spirits. i think it depend. they are not totally unconvertable. for MCK, even worldly spirit of Tai Sui had become His dharma protector.
Or even we see some of BuddhaÂ’s disciple, we know how great was Buddha then. After every Sutra we read at the end, those Qian Da Po, Qin Na Lo, Lo He Mo Lo, are all Maras. All take oathed to help Buddha, protect the Dharma. If in the Future buddhists who recite the sutras and are bother by anyone, they oathed to destory them. if not their heads will break/crack into 7 pieces. Maras are very afraid of swearing. But now they swear to Buddha. Look at how great is Buddha. So maras are not unchangable. When we change them, they no longer become mara.
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Yes it's possible. Padmasambhava, the founder of Tibetan Buddhism, has converted a lot of spirits and evil spirits in the past. But as for Dorje Shugden, he has become defiant and committed autrocities - you can read up the histories.Originally posted by sinweiy:regardless. actually i don't really want to look down on any spirits. i think it depend. they are not totally unconvertable. for MCK, even worldly spirit of Tai Sui had become His dharma protector.
Or even we see some of BuddhaÂ’s disciple, we know how great was Buddha then. After every Sutra we read at the end, those Qian Da Po, Qin Na Lo, Lo He Mo Lo, are all Maras. All take oathed to help Buddha, protect the Dharma. If in the Future buddhists who recite the sutras and are bother by anyone, they oathed to destory them. if not their heads will break/crack into 7 pieces. Maras are very afraid of swearing. But now they swear to Buddha. Look at how great is Buddha. So maras are not unchangable. When we change them, they no longer become mara.
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hehe
...izzit? worst than mara itself? sound also like Devattata. Guan Yin Bodhisattva also have one form in such brutalness one right? even heard Devattata was a bodhisattva in disguise? to me is fen bie xin(dualistic/discriminating mind).
anywhy am just explaining that this is one of the advance knowledge of Hua Yen Sutra. especially the San Cai visiting 53 gurus. One of which Gan Lu Huo Wang, a king who was a mean and brutal killing machine of beings that are also mean and evil, this is his form of delivering beings. beings are mean, HeÂ’s even meaner per se. indeed a bodhisattva in disguise. again this is all advance knowledge of Hua Yen Sutra, not good for beginners.
tis good to abide by the rule of Respect the Buddha(outside), Praise the Thus Come One (inside).
http://sg.search.yahoo.com/search?p=%E7%A4%BC%E6%95%AC%E8%AF%B8%E4%BD%9B%EF%BC%8C+%E7%A7%B0%E8%B5%9E%E5%A6%82%E6%9D%A5&ei=UTF-8&fr=FP-tab-web-t&x=wrt
ie. we don’t praise the doing outside, just ‘li jing’ and only see the goodness inside will do.
Ban Shi Tong Gen Shen (we are all born from the same root). Xing ban san, Si xiang yuan (Root Nature is the same, only widen by habits).
ps: this thread reminds me of Gospel of Judas.
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But definitely not for Dorje Shugden, a spirit that has caused sectarianism and violence - not for the sake of compassion. Dorje Shugden is also in every way like a worldly spirit, and may demand things and can be offended.
Dorje Shugden is not recognised by the entire Buddhist community. -
Not all maras are converted, although the Mara king is.Originally posted by sinweiy:worst than mara itself? -
i jus wonder if Buddha himself ever do condemnation.
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the answer is noOriginally posted by concerned_man:Just wondering whether the Singapore Gelupa Society is recognised by the Buddhist comunity in Singapore (eg Fo Jiao Zhong Hui) ?
Singapore Buddhist Federation advisory is made up of several resident lama of singapore tibetan buddhist community like
Buddha Sasana(Sakyapa)
Amitabha Buddhist centre(Gelugpa)
and so on
you will never see singapore Gelugpa society in For you information ,that is the sure sign -
Tara or Arya Tara, also known as Jetsun Dolma in Tibetan, is a female Buddha typically associated with Buddhist tantra practice as preserved in Tibetan Buddhism. She is the "mother of liberation", and represents the virtues of success in work and achievements. Tara is a Tantric deity, whose practice is used by practitioners of Vajrayana to develop certain inner qualities and understand outer, inner and secret teachings about compassion, mercy and emptiness.
Tara is actually the generic name for a set of Buddhas or Bodhisattvas of similar aspect. These may more properly be understood as different aspects of the same quality, as Bodhisattvas are often considered metaphoric for Buddhist virtues.
The most widely known Taras are:
Green Tara, known for the activity of compassion
White Tara, also known for compassion, long life, healing and serenity; also known as The Wish-fulfilling Wheel, or Cintachakra
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tara_%28Buddhist%29
the White Tara (Bai2 Du4 Mu3) picture
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just want to say cause and effect isn’t empty. how we treat or judge others, others will also treat and judge us the same next time. even if ‘wrong’, just keep it to oneself, better remain as a good Buddhists and don’t say them, it ain’t wholesome, for personal cultivation sake that is.
now i know how mara destroy the Dharma. they become part of buddhists, saying false teachings, then true ppl contemn. when ppl start to have discriminating mind. and from this very root of dualism, it snowball, leading to contemnation and more contemning and confusion will eventually lead to degeneration of Dharma. itÂ’s like a natural cause. sigh. now i know why Buddha drop His tears.
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Well of course he does, as I was saying in the previous thread/post, Buddha highly condemned many superstitious rituals and things like animal sacrifices.Originally posted by sinweiy:i jus wonder if Buddha himself ever do condemnation.
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Condemn not for the sake of condemning, but condemn to let others know what to avoid.now i know how mara destroy the Dharma. they become part of buddhists, saying false teachings, then true ppl contemn. when ppl start to have discriminating mind. and from this very root of dualism, it snowball, leading to contemnation and more contemning and confusion will eventually lead to degeneration of Dharma. itÂ’s like a natural cause. sigh. now i know why Buddha drop His tears.
I'm sorry, but it will be necessary for 'true people' to condemn when necessary - if not, there will only be more confusion. As for the problem of 'Dualism', this is really that 'true person' personal matter - whether he becomes attached to this situation or not. But it will be silly if he is not attached to the situation, but instead, he is attached to Emptiness. Yin wu shuo zhu er sheng qi xin.
A practitioner can engage in all these without seeing it as a dualism, that is true non-dualism, not just on the surface. In reality it just is.
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UrgyenTashi's reply to Dan Ballance:whether shugden is an evil spirit, a worldly protector - whatever - the most dangerous evil we need to pacify, imho, is the seed of conflict within our own minds, that if allowed to may run on for another 300 years. this is the real damage that is done i believe.
While I agree with the sentiment behind talk like this, I'm sorry but it just doesn't apply in this situation. Those who are speaking out need to, and have been asked to, this is not a personal crusdade they are taking up for the sake of some rigidly held view. There's too much evidence to the contrary to take that stance.
To let this go on is to allow alot of people to be harmed. Feelings will be hurt but this needs to be put out there, this is really huge.