Similarities between Buddhism and Christianity
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folk buddhism lor.Originally posted by An Eternal Now:All sects are founded based upon particular teachings and practises of the Buddha. The Buddha taught 84000 dharma doors to enlightenment - chanting is one of them, meditation is one of them and within the 'meditation' catergory there are dozens of different types of meditation... there is also koan inquiry, visualisation, etc etc really a lot.
Praying is not one of them because you cannot attain enlightenment by praying.
registered as buddhism. -
There is no such thing as Folk Buddhism - only folks' practices.Originally posted by Ito_^:folk buddhism lor.
registered as buddhism.
Just like if some of those folks practitioners start to pray to Jesus or Mary, and in fact they do pray to some Islamic figures in a nearby island I remember, it doesnt make them 'Folk Christianity' or 'Folk Islam'.
They are completely different things altogether.
What's more, a person can only be considered a Buddhist and a disciple of Buddha after he has taken refuge in the Three Treasures: Buddha, Dharma, and Sangha, as instructed by the Buddha. -
So in actual fact Prayer is a difference and not a similarity, according to you. So if you want to talk to S G Buddha himself, what do you do? Or you never talk to S G Buddha himself?
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No we don talk to buddhaOriginally posted by casino_king:So in actual fact Prayer is a difference and not a similarity, according to you. So if you want to talk to S G Buddha himself, what do you do? Or you never talk to S G Buddha himself?
Respecting NOT Worshipping
http://www.sgforums.com/?action=thread_display&thread_id=188976
We do not pray to the image , but bow in honour of what the image represents,the Noble Qualities of the Buddha, as do the Catholics to the Crucifix. -
So Buddhists do not ask Buddha for blessings? Then again I was at the vesak celebration at Suntec fountain and it was something like pray for peace.... by Buddhist Light or Buddha Light organisation orginating from Taiwan? Folk again? Then again I saw foreign nuns so even foreign nuns are caught up in folk practices?Originally posted by neutral_onliner:No we don talk to buddha -
the diff between buddhism and God-based religion is tat we believe only we can save ourselvesOriginally posted by casino_king:So Buddhists do not ask Buddha for blessings?
"No one saves us but ourselves,
No one can and no one may.
We ourselves must walk the path,
But Buddhas clearly show the way". -- Dp 165 -
No..no .no the blessing in buddhism and the prayer u observe from other religions is veery different.Originally posted by casino_king:So Buddhists do not ask Buddha for blessings? Then again I was at the vesak celebration at Suntec fountain and it was something like pray for peace.... by Buddhist Light or Buddha Light organisation orginating from Taiwan? Folk again? Then again I saw foreign nuns so even foreign nuns are caught up in folk practices?
There are many kinds of prayers. Some are to direct and inspire our mind towards a certain quality or aim, thus creating the cause for us to attain this. An example is praying to be more tolerant and compassionate towards others. Other prayers are for specific people or situations, as in praying for a certain personÂ’s illness to be cured. To have either type of prayer fulfilled depends on more than just praying: the appropriate cause must also be created. It is not just a matter of saying, "Please, Buddha, make this and that happen, but IÂ’m going to relax and have tea while you do the work!"
For example, if we pray to be more loving and compassionate and yet make no effort to control our anger, we are not creating the cause for that prayer to be fulfilled. The transformation of our mind comes from our own effort, and we pray for the BuddhasÂ’ inspiration to do so. "Receiving the blessings of the Buddhas" does not mean that something tangible comes from the Buddhas and goes into us. It means that our mind is transformed through the combined effort of the teachings and guidance of the Buddhas and bodhisattvas and our own practice. Thus, we cannot pray to be born in a pure land and expect the Buddhas and Bodhisattvas to do all the work! We must also make effort to actualize the teachings: we gradually develop detachment from worldly pleasures, we practice compassion as much as we can, and we generate wisdom. Then, praying has an exceptionally profound effect on our mind. However, if we do nothing to correct our bad habits of body, speech and mind, and if our mind is distracted while praying, then there is minimal effect.
As for our prayers for a sickness to be cured or the family finances to improve or for a deceased relative to have a good rebirth, these, too, depend on the person involved having created the necessary causes. If he/she has, our prayers provide the condition for the seed of a virtuous action he/she did in the past to ripen and bring its result. However, if that person has not created the causal seed through his/her own positive past actions, then it is difficult for our prayers to be fulfilled. We can put fertilizers and water on the ground, but if the farmer has not planted the seed, nothing will grow.
While describing how cause and effect works in our mental continuum, the Buddha said that killing causes shortage of life. Both abandoning killing and saving othersÂ’ lives cause us to have a long life, free from illness. If we neglect to follow this basic advice and yet pray to have a long and healthy life, we are missing the point! On the other hand, if in the past the person concerned has abandoned killing and has saved lives, then prayers for him/her could be fulfilled.
In the same way, the Buddha said generosity is the cause of wealth. If we have been generous in a past life and now pray for our wealth to increase, then our finances could improve. Yet, if we are very miserly now, we are creating the cause for poverty, nor wealth, in the future. Being generous, helping those in need and sharing what we have, will bring their desirable results sometime in the future. On the other hand, when we experience some difficulties in our life, it is good to ask ourselves, "What kind of action could I have done that created the cause for this result?" This we can learn from the BuddhaÂ’s teachings. Then we can change our behavior to avoid leaving more seeds to experience that undesirable result. -
So you are saying that Buddhists do pray? Yes or No?
If Yes, pray to who? Who is listening? -
direct and inspire our mind towards a certain quality or aim, thus creating the cause for us to attain this NOT having conversation wf himOriginally posted by casino_king:So you are saying that Buddhists do pray? Yes or No?
If Yes, pray to who? Who is listening?
when u lok at the buddha statue you r loking at yourself
http://www.sgforums.com/?action=thread_display&thread_id=184786 -
Originally posted by neutral_onliner:
You are saying that you when you look at Buddha satue, you are looking at a future ideal self or you are looking at self?
direct and inspire our mind towards a certain quality or aim, thus creating the cause for us to attain this NOT having conversation wf him
when u lok at the buddha statue [b]you r loking at yourself
http://www.sgforums.com/?action=thread_display&thread_id=184786[/b]
When Buddhist pray, they are talking to thmeslves? -
actually praying, chanting , focusing the mental energy etc does have a "psychological effect" on people be it self or others.
check out:
http://noosphere.princeton.edu/Global Correlations in Random Data
OR
The Global Consciousness Project, also called the EGG Project, is an international and multidisciplinary collaboration of scientists, engineers, artists and others. This website introduces methods and technology and empirical results in one section, and presents interpretations and applications in another.
We have been collecting data from a global network of random event generators since August, 1998. The network has grown to about 65 host sites around the world running custom software that reads the output of physical random number generators and records a 200-bit trial sum once every second, continuously over months and years. The data are transmitted over the internet to a server in Princeton, NJ, USA, where they are archived for later analysis. Individual data create a tapestry of color. The dot below shows coherence.
The purpose of this project is to examine subtle correlations that appear to reflect the presence and activity of consciousness in the world. The scientific work is careful, but it is at the margins of our understanding. We believe our view may be enriched by a creative and poetic perspective. Here we present various aspects of the project, including some insight into its scientific and philosophical implications.
check out the example of :
Hundredth Monkey phenomenon.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hundredth_Monkey
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In 1985, Elaine Myers re-examined the original published research in "The Hundredth Monkey Revisited" in the journal In Context. In her review she found that the original research reports by the Japan Monkey Center in vol. 2, 5 and 6 of the journal Primates differ from Watson's story in significant ways. In short, it contains no evidence that the 'Hundredth Monkey' phenomenon exists; the published articles only describe how the sweet potato washing behavior gradually spread through the monkey troop and became part of the set of learned behaviors of young monkeys. There is no evidence at all of a critical number at which the idea suddenly spread to other islands, and none of the original researchers ever made such a claim.
Despite the lack of supporting evidence for the story as told by Watson and Keyes it is still popular among New Age authors and personal growth gurus and has become an urban legend and part of New Age mythology. As a result, the story has also become a favorite target of the Committee for the Scientific Investigation of Claims of the Paranormal and was used as the title essay in The Hundredth Monkey: And Other Paradigms of the Paranormal published by them in 1991.
Are you saying that for you, praying is simply talking to oneself? I am going to say "for you" instead of saying "for Buddhists" since there are folk practices that people who call themselves Buddhists do. -
Buddha is considered a super natural being (non human) Jesus is considered a super natural being (after his resurrection)
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Originally posted by casino_king:
actually they both like all human died. superman also can die. Buddha taught impermanance, so He must also 'display' dying or we called it parinirvana.
Buddha is considered a super natural being (non human) Jesus is considered a super natural being (after his resurrection)[/b]
when Buddha was asked:
Are you God?
- No.
- Are you an Angel?
- No.
- Are you a Human Being?
- No.
- Then what are You?
- I am "Awake."
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O
To add to this: it does not mean Buddha is a supernatural being, and not a human being.
- Are you a Human Being?
- No.
[/b]
Awakening/enlightenment is not supernatural at all - as we have discussed long time ago already.
So why did Buddha say he is not a human being? Because he is detached from the concept of himself being a human being. A human being is still attached to a 'Self' and sees self as his own body, his mind, etc.
A Buddha has awakened from these attachments to 'self' - and his essence cannot be defined in terms of identification with 'human being'. If he is still attached to the identification of 'I AM SOMETHING' then he is not yet enlightened. -
But you believe that the enlightened person possesed supernatural powers?Originally posted by An Eternal Now:To add to this: it does not mean Buddha is a supernatural being, and not a human being.
Awakening/enlightenment is not supernatural at all - as we have discussed long time ago already.
So why did Buddha say he is not a human being? Because he is detached from the concept of himself being a human being. A human being is still attached to a 'Self' and sees self as his own body, his mind, etc.
A Buddha has awakened from these attachments to 'self' - and his essence cannot be defined in terms of identification with 'human being'. If he is still attached to the identification of 'I AM SOMETHING' then he is not yet enlightened. -
Actually all sentient beings possed such powers, including you and me. We will all discover such powers once reached a certain level of Enligthenment, supernatural powers is part of us, just that we have not beef it up and locate it. But this is not the focus of Buddhism.
HOWEVER, Supernatural powers cannot solve problems and demons/devils know how to use such powers. If supernatural powers can do wonders, the world would not be in such a pathetic state now. It is quite obvious to me that Karma dictates lives, not supernatural powers.
There is a very insteresting story. It happened in both Buddha's and Jesus's time. A story whereby a mother, brought the dead body of her son, approached (both Buddha and Jesus) praying to bring her son back to life.
And they have a very different ending ...
Guess what happened in the stories?Originally posted by casino_king:But you believe that the enlightened person possesed supernatural powers? -
Enlightened person may or may not possess supernatural powers. Many non-enlightened people can also develope such powers, so no point in asking this, there are many people outside Buddhism who has exercised such powers. Supernatural powers was never a pre-requisite of enlightenment, and buddha never taught that awakening and supernatural powers are linked. Supernatural powers is also not a goal in practising meditation, it should never be. Siddhis are merely by-products of samadhi and Buddhists always do not emphasize on such aspects.Originally posted by casino_king:But you believe that the enlightened person possesed supernatural powers?
There are a few kinds of arhants. Some has powers due to his different path of practise, but the other type of arhant is dry-insight, that is he does not focus so much on samadhi and only attains the insight of direct seeing into the 4 noble truths and attaining enlightenment. Not to mention, arhant is the highest level for the self-liberating path. Prior to that there are 3 other levels of awakening.
Furthermore, I do not see that developing such powers as side-products of samadhi makes you anymore 'superhuman'. We do not identify people with such powers as God or immortal or something. A person who possesses such powers continue to remain fully human. -
What I am trying to say is that Buddhism believes in the super natural. This is where it parts with science and joins the religions?
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Buddhism does not embrace super natural powers. If super natural powers can really solve the world's problem, all Buddhas would be happy to use it.
Science is just a guide to support the teachings of the Dharma.
Originally posted by casino_king:What I am trying to say is that Buddhism believes in the super natural. This is where it parts with science and joins the religions? -
If you use the word superpower than it means that it is supernatural. Surely you cannot insist that something that is "super" is still in the realm of natural?Originally posted by An Eternal Now:A person who possesses such powers continue to remain fully human.. -
It is still natural, just that it has gone from the fields of classical physics to the fields of quantum physicsOriginally posted by casino_king:If you use the word superpower than it means that it is supernatural. Surely you cannot insist that something that is "super" is still in the realm of natural?
In time, science will have a better understanding and therefore there is no longer a need to call it 'super'. In Buddhism we dont see it as super, but merely a side effect of samadhi practises. In Buddhism it is not a big deal and doesnt make anyone a superman, and the powers of karma ultimately cannot be suppressed by the powers through samadhi.
By the way I have bought the book 'The Holographic Universe'. -
You are speculating here. You keep on saying that Buddhism is scientific and then you go ahead and make unscietific statements. I do not know why you are so unsure of Buddhism. I need to find out much more.Originally posted by An Eternal Now:It is still natural, just that it has gone from the fields of classical physics to the fields of quantum physics In time, science will have a better understanding and therefore there is no longer a need to call it 'super'. In Buddhism we dont see it as super, but merely a side effect of samadhi practises. In Buddhism it is not a big deal and doesnt make anyone a superman, and the powers of karma ultimately cannot be suppressed by the powers through samadhi. -
I'll make myself very clear.Originally posted by casino_king:You are speculating here. You keep on saying that Buddhism is scientific and then you go ahead and make unscietific statements. I do not know why you are so unsure of Buddhism. I need to find out much more.
Supernatural implies that it is # Of or relating to existence outside the natural world.
In Buddhism, siddhis are known to be existing as part of the 'natural world' - in fact there is nothing in the world that is unnatural, it only depends on whether the person can comprehend it as natural or not.
In the past people think the Sun rising and moon rising is supernatural, and therefore out of this ignorance they start worshipping the sun and the moon. In Buddhism, we also recognise that such powers yet we do not emphasize it in a way that makes people overly excited or start worshipping people who have such powers.
As for science, as far as science progress on fields of quantum physics even though there is not a lot of understandings yet, it may no longer be needed to call such occurance supernatural, but of course in terms of classical physics we still call it supernatural because it is difficult to comprehend such occurences in terms of classical physics, because wrong mode. It's like trying to use art to do mathematics. -
You are speculating. Until science shows that it is indeed natural, science says that it is unnatural or super natural. You cannot say that you are scientific and then throw scientific principles out the window. Which brings us to a very interesting observation and that is, you seem unsure of Buddhism's ability to stand on its own and need supporting evidence? Please do not take this as I am attacking Buddhism, I am merely "attacking" your logic and convictions.Originally posted by An Eternal Now:I'll make myself very clear.
Supernatural implies that it is # Of or relating to existence outside the natural world.
In Buddhism, siddhis are known to be existing as part of the 'natural world' - in fact there is nothing in the world that is unnatural, it only depends on whether the person can comprehend it as natural or not.
In the past people think the Sun rising and moon rising is supernatural, and therefore out of this ignorance they start worshipping the sun and the moon. In Buddhism, we also recognise that such powers yet we do not emphasize it in a way that makes people overly excited or start worshipping people who have such powers.
As for science, as far as science progress on fields of quantum physics even though there is not a lot of understandings yet, it may no longer be needed to call such occurance supernatural, but of course in terms of classical physics we still call it supernatural because it is difficult to comprehend such occurences in terms of classical physics.