What spiritual techniques do you use in controlling lust?
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What are the methods you would employ to eliminate lust? What was your experience and how did it felt? How did you gave up lust?
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My technique when I see a hot babe is to imagine her without the long hair and feminine body, and treat her as a guy.
It may sound offensive, but it works great for me. I view lust as an insatiable err of human nature, and must be purged from the heart and mind.
I ain't Buddhist though, but I'm an atheist who believes in the good of all religion. -
i think of all the ugly people, then i stop lusting altogether to make it fair
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What kind of lust?Originally posted by Fire Star:What are the methods you would employ to eliminate lust? What was your experience and how did it felt? How did you gave up lust?
Anyway through dharma practise we will gain samadhi strength (one pointedness/unwavering mind) and wisdom, and will be able to see the illusoriness of what you are lusting. Meditation also helps, thats my experience.
A classical way of transcending sexual lust in Buddhism is to contemplate death and decay, and also is to see into the very nature of the object we lust, and realise the very nature of Suffering, Impermanence, and No-Self. That is Wisdom. That is the 3 dharma seals, and the reality of all phenomena (dharmas). Suffering means when the mind tries to grasp, seek or avert whatever phenomena, that will cause sufferings.. and nothing is satisfactory. Impermanence means nothing is lasting, everything is in a constant flux.
No-Self means the notion of 'self' is an illusion, as one contemplate deeper one will come to realise that what we think of 'self' is in reality just a process that is made up of the 5 Skhandas. The Body is also not self, it is certainly not self... you can live when parts of your bodies are removed, so to speak. The 'self' can't be found upon inquiry. -
Here is a Thai monk's meditative journey towards his attainment of Arhantship (attainment of Liberation and Nirvana), in which he also discussed the issue of transcending sexual lust.
Forest Dhamma Books
(From Part 1) The practice of wisdom begins with the human body, the grossest and most visible component of our personal identity. The object is to penetrate the reality of its true nature. Is our body what we’ve always assumed it to be—an integral and desirable part of who we really are? To test this assumption we must thoroughly investigate the body by mentally deconstructing it into its constituent parts, section by section, piece by piece. We must research the truth about the body with which we are so familiar by viewing it from different angles. Begin with the hair on the head, the hair on the body, the nails, the teeth and the skin, and move on to the flesh, blood, sinews and bones. Then dissect the inner organs, one by one, until the whole body is completely dismembered. Analyze this conglomeration of disparate parts to clearly understand its true nature.
If you find it difficult to investigate your own body in this way, begin by mentally dissecting someone else’s body. Choose a body external to yourself; for instance, a body of the opposite sex. Visualize each part, each organ of that body as best you can, and ask yourself: Which piece is truly attractive? Which part is actually seductive? Place the hair in one pile, the nails and teeth in another; do the same with the skin, the flesh, the sinews and the bones. Which pile deserves to be an object of your desire? Examine them closely and answer with total honesty. Strip off the skin and pile it in front of you. Where is the beauty in this mass of tissue, this thin veneer that covers up the meat and entrails? Do those various parts add up to a person? Once the skin is removed, what can we find to admire in the human body? Men and women—they are all the same. Not a shred of beauty can be found in the body of a human being. It is just a bag of flesh and blood and bones that manages to deceive everyone in the world into lusting after it.
It is wisdomÂ’s duty to expose that deception. Examine the skin carefully. Skin is the great deceiver. Because it wraps up the entire human body, itÂ’s the part we always see. But what does it wrap up? It wraps up the animal flesh, the muscles, the fluids and the fat. It wraps up the skeleton with the tendons and the sinews. It wraps up the liver, the kidneys, the stomach, the intestines, and all the internal organs. No one has ever suggested that the bodyÂ’s innards are desirable things of beauty, worthy of being admired with passion and yearning. Probing deeply, without fear or hesitation, wisdom exposes the plain truth about the body. DonÂ’t be fooled by a thin veil of scaly tissue. Peel it off and see what lies underneath. This is the practice of wisdom.
In order to really see the truth of this matter for yourself, in a clear and precise way that leaves no room for doubt, you must be very persistent and very diligent. Merely doing this meditation practice once or twice, or from time to time, will not be enough to bring conclusive results. You must approach the practice as if it’s your life’s work—as though nothing else in the world matters except the analysis you are working on at that moment. Time is not a factor; place is not a factor; ease and comfort are not factors. Regardless of how long it takes or how difficult the work proves to be, you must relentlessly stick with body contemplation until all doubt and uncertainty are eliminated.
Body contemplation should occupy every breath, every thought, every movement until the mind becomes thoroughly saturated with it. Nothing short of total commitment will bring genuine and direct insight into the truth. When body contemplation is practiced with single-minded intensity, each successive body part becomes a kind of fuel feeding the fires of mindfulness and wisdom. Mindfulness and wisdom then become a conflagration consuming the human body section by section, part by part, as they examine and investigate the truth with a burning intensity. This is what is meant by tapadhamma.
Focus intently on those body parts that really capture your attention, the ones whose truth feels most obvious to you. Use them as whetstones to sharpen your wisdom. Expose them and tear them apart until their inherently disgusting and repulsive nature becomes apparent. Asubha meditation is insight into the repulsiveness of the human body. This is the body’s natural condition; by nature, it is filthy and disgusting. Essentially, the whole body is a living, stinking corpse—a breathing cesspool full of fetid waste. Only a paper thin covering of skin makes the whole mess look presentable. We are all being deceived by the outer wrapping, which conceals the fundamental repulsiveness from view. Merely removing the skin reveals the body’s true nature.
By comparison to the flesh and internal organs, the skin appears attractive. But examine it more closely. Skin is scaly, creased, and wrinkled; it exudes sweat and grease and offensive odors. We must scrub it daily just to keep it clean. How attractive is that? And the skin is firmly wedded to the underlying flesh, and thus inextricably linked to the loathsome interior. The more deeply wisdom probes, the more repulsive the body appears. From the skin on through to the bones, nothing is the least bit pleasing.
PROPERLY DONE, BODY CONTEMPLATION is intense and the mental effort is unrelenting; so, eventually, the mind begins to tire. It is then appropriate to stop and take a rest. When meditators who are engaged in full-scale body contemplation take a break, they return to the samadhi practice they have developed and maintained so assiduously. Reentering the still peace and concentration of samadhi, they abide in total calm where no thoughts or visualizations arise to disturb the citta. The burden of thinking and probing with wisdom is temporarily set aside so that the mind can completely relax, suspended in tranquility. Once the mind is satiated with samadhi, it withdraws on its own, feeling reinvigorated and refreshed and ready to tackle the rigors of body contemplation again. In this way, samadhi supports the work of wisdom, making it more adept and incisive.
Upon withdrawal from samadhi, the investigation of the body immediately begins anew. Each time you investigate with mindfulness and wisdom, the investigation should be carried out in the present moment. To be fully effective, each new investigation must be fresh and spontaneous. Don’t allow them to become carbon copies of previous ones. An immediacy, of being exclusively in the present moment, must be maintained at all times. Forget whatever you may have learned; forget what happened the last time you delved into the body’s domain—just focus your attention squarely in the present moment and investigate only from that vantage point. Ultimately, this is what it means to be mindful. Mindfulness fixes the mind in the present, allowing wisdom to focus sharply. Learned experience is stored as memory, and as such should be put aside; otherwise memory will masquerade as wisdom. This is the present imitating the past. If memory is permitted to replace the immediacy of the present moment, then genuine wisdom will not arise. So guard against this tendency in your practice.
Keep probing and analyzing the nature of the body over and over again, using as many perspectives as your wisdom can devise, until you become thoroughly skilled in every conceivable aspect of body contemplation. True expertise in this practice produces sharp, clear insights. It penetrates directly to the essence of the body’s natural existence in a way that transforms the meditator’s view of the human body. A level of mastery can be reached, such that peoples’ bodies instantly appear to break apart whenever you look at them. When wisdom attains total mastery of the practice, we see only flesh, sinews and bones where a person once stood. The whole body is revealed as a viscous, red mass of raw tissue. The skin will vanish in a flash, and wisdom will quickly penetrate the body’s inner recesses. Whether it’s a man or a woman, the skin—which is commonly considered so appealing—is simply ignored. Wisdom penetrates immediately inside where a disgusting, repulsive mess of organs and bodily fluids fills every cavity. -
Wisdom is able to penetrate to the truth of the body with utmost clarity. The attractiveness of the body completely disappears. What then is there to be attached to? What is there to lust after? What in the body is worth clinging to? Where in this lump of raw flesh is the person? The kilesas have woven a web of deception concerning the body, fooling us with perceptions of human beauty and exciting us with lustful thoughts. The truth is that the object of that desire is a fake—a complete fraud. For in reality, when seen clearly with wisdom, the body by its very nature repels desire. When this delusion is exposed in the light of wisdom, the human body appears in all its gory detail as an appalling sight. Seen with absolute clarity, the mind shrinks from it instantly.
The keys to success are persistence and perseverance. Always be diligent and alert when applying mindfulness and wisdom to the task. DonÂ’t be satisfied with partial success. Each time you contemplate the body, carry that investigation through to its logical conclusion; then quickly reestablish an image of the body in your mind and begin the process all over again. As you delve deeper and deeper into the bodyÂ’s interior, the various parts will gradually begin to break up, fall apart, and disintegrate right before your eyes. Follow the process of disintegration and decay intently. Mindful of every detail, focus your wisdom on the unstable and impermanent nature of this form that the world views with such infatuation. Let your intuitive wisdom initiate the process of decay and see what happens. This is the next stage in body contemplation.
Follow the natural conditions of decay as the body decomposes and returns to its original elemental state. Decay and destruction is the natural course of all organic life. Eventually, all things are reduced to their constituent elements, and those elements disperse. Let wisdom be the destroyer, imagining for the mindÂ’s eye the process of decay and decomposition. Concentrate on the disintegration of the flesh and other soft tissue, watching as it slowly decomposes until nothing remains but disjointed bones. Then reconstruct the body again and begin the investigation once more. Each time that intuitive wisdom lays waste to the body, mentally restore it to its former condition and start anew.
This practice is an intense form of mental training, requiring a high degree of skill and mental fortitude. The rewards reflect the power and intensity of the effort made. The more proficient wisdom is, the brighter, clearer and more powerful the mind becomes. The mind’s clarity and strength appear to have no bounds—its speed and agility are amazing. At this stage, meditators are motivated by a profound sense of urgency as they begin to realize the harm caused by attachment to the human form. The lurking danger is clearly seen. Where previously they grasped the body as something of supreme value—something to be admired and adored—they now see only a pile of rotting bone; and they are thoroughly repulsed. Through the power of wisdom, a dead, decaying body and the living, breathing body have become one and the same corpse. Not a shred of difference exists between them.
You must investigate repeatedly, training the mind until you become highly proficient at using wisdom. Avoid any form of speculation or conjecture. DonÂ’t allow thoughts of what you should be doing or what the results might mean to encroach upon the investigation. Just concentrate on the truth of what wisdom reveals and let the truth speak for itself. Wisdom will know the correct path to follow and will understand clearly the truths that it uncovers. And when wisdom is fully convinced of the truth of any aspect of the body, it will naturally release its attachment to that aspect. No matter how intently it has pursued that investigation, the mind feels fully satisfied once the truth manifests itself with absolute certainty. When the truth of one facet of body contemplation is realized, there is nothing further to seek in that direction. So, the mind moves on to examine another facet, and then another facet, until finally all doubts are eliminated.
Striving in this way, probing deeper and deeper into the bodyÂ’s inherent nature with an intense focus on the present moment, a heightened state of awareness must be maintained; and the intensity of the effort eventually takes its toll. When fatigue sets in, experienced meditators know instinctively that the time is right to rest the mind in samadhi. So they drop all aspects of the investigation and concentrate solely on one object. Totally unburdening themselves, they enter into the cool, composed, rejuvenating peace of samadhi. In this way, samadhi is a separate practice altogether. No thoughts of any kind infringe upon the cittaÂ’s essential knowing nature while it rests peacefully with single-minded concentration.
With the citta absorbed in total stillness, the body and the external world temporarily disappear from awareness. Once the citta is satiated, it withdraws to normal consciousness on its own. Like a person who eats a full meal and takes a good rest, mindfulness and wisdom are refreshed and ready to return to work with renewed energy. Then, with purposeful resolve, the practice of samadhi is put aside and the practice of wisdom is reestablished. In this way, samadhi is an outstanding complement to wisdom.
THE BODY IS VERY IMPORTANT TO CONSIDER. Most of our desires are bound up with it. Looking around us, we can see a world that is in the grips of sexual craving and frantic in its adoration of the human form. As meditators, we must face up to the challenges posed by our own sexuality, which stems from a deep-seated craving for sensual gratification. During meditation, this defilement is the most significant obstacle to our progress. The deeper we dig into body contemplation, the more evident this becomes. No other form of kilesa drags more on the mind, nor exerts greater power over the mind than the defilement of sexual craving. Since this craving is rooted in the human body, exposing its true nature will gradually loosen the mindÂ’s tenacious grasp on the body.
Body contemplation is the best antidote for sexual attraction. Successful body practice is measured by a reduction in the mind’s sexual desires. Step by step, wisdom unmasks the reality of the body, cutting off and destroying deep-rooted attachments in the process. This results in an increasingly free and open mental state. To fully understand their significance, meditators must experience these results for themselves. It would be counter-productive for me to try to describe them—that would only lead to fruitless speculation. These results arise exclusively within a meditator’s mind, and are unique to that person’s character and temperament. Simply focus all your attention on the practical causes and let the results of that effort arise as they will. When they do, you will know them with undeniable clarity. This is a natural principle.
When body contemplation reaches the stage where reason and result become fully integrated with wisdom, one becomes completely absorbed in these investigations both day and night. It’s truly extraordinary. Wisdom moves through the body with such speed and agility, and displays such ingenuity in its contemplative techniques, that it seems to spin relentlessly in and out and around every part, every aspect of the body, delving into each nook and cranny to discover the truth. At this stage of the practice, wisdom begins to surface automatically, becoming truly habitual in manifesting itself. Because it’s so quick and incisive, it can catch up with even the most subtle kilesas, and disable even the most indomitable ones. Wisdom at this level is extremely daring and adventurous. It is like a mountain torrent crashing through a narrow canyon: nothing can deter its course. Wisdom bursts forth to meet every challenge to crave and to cling that is presented by the kilesas. Because its adversary is so tenacious, wisdom’s battle with sexual craving resembles a full-scale war. For this reason, only a bold and uncompromising strategy will succeed. There is only one appropriate course of action—an all out struggle; and the meditator will know this instinctively.
When wisdom begins to master the body, it will constantly modify its investigative techniques so that it will not fall prey to the tricks of the kilesas. Wisdom will try to keep one step ahead of the kilesas, constantly looking for new openings and constantly adjusting its tactics: sometimes shifting emphasis, sometimes pursuing subtle variations in technique. -
As greater and greater proficiency is achieved, there comes a time when all attachment to one’s own body and to that of others appears to have vanished. In truth, a lingering attachment still remains; it has only gone into hiding. It has not been totally eliminated. Take careful note of this. It may feel as though it is eliminated, but actually it is concealed from view by the power of the asubha practice. So don’t be complacent. Keep upgrading your arsenal—mindfulness, wisdom and diligence—to meet the challenge. Mentally place the whole mass of body parts in front of you and focus on it intently. This is your body. What will happen to it? By now wisdom is so swift and decisive that in no time at all it will break up and disintegrate before your eyes. Each time you spread the body out before you—whether it is your body or someone else’s—wisdom will immediately begin to break it apart and destroy it. By now this action has become habitual.
In the end, when wisdom has achieved maximum proficiency at penetrating to the core of the bodyÂ’s repulsive nature, you must place the entire disgusting mess of flesh and blood and bones in front of you and ask yourself: From where does this feeling of revulsion emanate? What is the real source of this repulsiveness? Concentrate on the disgusting sight before you and see what happens. You are now closing in on the truth of the matter. At this crucial stage in asubha contemplation, you must not allow wisdom to break the body apart and destroy it.
Fix the repulsive image clearly in your mind and watch closely to detect any movement in the repulsive feeling. You have evoked a feeling of revulsion for it: Where does that feeling originate? From where does it come? Who or what assumes that flesh, blood and bones are disgusting? They are as they are, existing in their own natural state. Who is it that conjures up feelings of revulsion at their sight? Fix your attention on it. Where will the repulsiveness go? Wherever it moves, be prepared to follow its direction.
The decisive phase of body contemplation has been reached. This is the point where the root-cause of sexual craving is uprooted once and for all. As you focus exclusively on the repulsiveness evoked by the asubha contemplation, your revulsion of the image before you will slowly, gradually contract inward until it is fully absorbed by the mind. On its own, without any prompting, it will recede into the mind, returning to its source of origin. This is the decisive moment in the practice of body contemplation, the moment when a final verdict is reached about the relationship between the kilesa of sexual craving and its primary object, the physical body. When the mindÂ’s knowing presence fully absorbs the repulsiveness, internalizing the feeling of revulsion, a profound realization suddenly occurs: The mind itself produces feelings of revulsion, the mind itself produces feelings of attraction; the mind alone creates ugliness and the mind alone creates beauty.
These qualities do not really exist in the external physical world. The mind merely projects these attributes onto the objects it perceives and then deceives itself into believing that they are beautiful or ugly, attractive or repulsive. In truth, the mind paints elaborate pictures all the time—pictures of oneself and pictures of the external world. It then falls for its own mental imagery, believing it to be real.
At this point the meditator understands the truth with absolute certainty: The mind itself generates repulsion and attraction. The previous focus of the investigation—the pile of flesh and blood and bones—has no inherent repulsiveness whatsoever. Intrinsically, the human body is neither disgusting nor pleasing. Instead, it is the mind that conjures up these feelings and then projects them on the images that are in front of us. Once wisdom penetrates this deception with absolute clarity, the mind immediately relinquishes all external perceptions of beauty and ugliness, and turns inward to concentrate on the source of such notions. The mind itself is the perpetrator and the victim of these deceptions; the deceiver and the deceived.
Only the mind, and nothing else, paints pictures of beauty and ugliness. So the asubha images that the meditator has been focusing on as separate and external objects, are absorbed into the mind where they merge with the revulsion created by the mind. Both are, in fact, one and the same thing. When this realization occurs, the mind lets go of external images, lets go of external forms, and in doing so lets go of sexual attraction.
Sexual attraction is rooted in perceptions of the human body. When the real basis of these perceptions is exposed, it completely undermines their validity; and the external, as we know it, collapses and our attachment to it ceases of its own accord. The defiling influence of sexual attraction—which has ridden roughshod over the mind since time immemorial, luring the mind to grasp at birth and so experience death continuously for eons—this insidious craving is now powerless. The mind has now passed beyond its influence: It is now free. -
Lose all your human feelings and you will not feel lust.Originally posted by An Eternal Now:Here is a Thai monk's meditative journey towards his attainment of Arhantship (attainment of Liberation and Nirvana), in which he also discussed the issue of transcending sexual lust. -
What human feelings? Even if you dont love someone you can still lust.Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:Lose all your human feelings and you will not feel lust. -
My way of controlling lust is very simple... When I see a physically attractive/ sexy lady, I would picture her 40 years down the road..... Works for me
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Mmm similar technique to mine.Originally posted by Beyond Religion:My way of controlling lust is very simple... When I see a physically attractive/ sexy lady, I would picture her 40 years down the road..... Works for me -
i dont even get rid of it. -_-"" even with your method, still very hard isnt it?Originally posted by PointBlue:Mmm similar technique to mine. -
Not at all. I came from a boy's school so my technique is a deeply cultured one.Originally posted by tut4nkh4m3n:i dont even get rid of it. -_-"" even with your method, still very hard isnt it? -
Only~ You~~~~~~~~~~
Neng(3) Wei(4) Wo(2) Qu(3) Xi(1) Jing(1)~~~
Only~ You~~~~~~~~~~
Neng(3) Zhan(3) Yao(1) He(2) Chu(2) Mo(2)~~~
Forgot da rest.
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At the first place why do you want to give it up?Originally posted by Fire Star:What are the methods you would employ to eliminate lust? What was your experience and how did it felt? How did you gave up lust? -
losing the HABIT of lust arising is betterOriginally posted by Herzog_Zwei:Lose all your human feelings and you will not feel lust. -
Lust is the feeling of sexual attraction.Originally posted by An Eternal Now:What human feelings? Even if you dont love someone you can still lust. -
May I enquire when does lust arise? And is it a habit?Originally posted by Cenarious:losing the HABIT of lust arising is better -
i dont know how to describe and i dont wish to think it out for u.Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:May I enquire when does lust arise? And is it a habit?
in the past i thought people had fair skin (like no pimples ect) because they had good genes but later i found out facials and moisturisers can make your skin smoother than anyone else's so there is nothing special about fair skins and that helped me greatly.
i think everything is due to habits (so i try to break all habits, those as subtle as i can find), thats why i felt like i discovered a "theory of everything" when i read eckhart tolle's books
oh ya, you have to look at your own mind and find for yourself why your lust arise. -
Yes breaking 'habit energy' is very important and according to master shen kai that should be the least that all buddhists should accomplish as a buddhist. Good habits are still ok, but lots of habits that human usually has are unwholesome and self-serving.
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i know i am not enlightened but what do i do to become enlightened?!
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you have created at least 2 or 3 topics on that already.Originally posted by Cenarious:i know i am not enlightened but what do i do to become enlightened?! -
Well, good technique about imagining someone getting old down the years, but I would like to hear more techniques people would employ, if possible.
And deadpoet, quite enlightening you ask why would one give up lust in the first place, for I thought it is where conspiracy lies.
Thanks eternalnow for the quote and information. But I would like to know if someone has given up lust competely, and how he/shedoes that. -
Of course if there's such person one can be a supernormal specimen, who is able to go beyond such a big hurdle.
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Originally posted by Fire Star:
At mundane level we get rid of evil lust to avoid bad consequence and also thoughts leading to evil actions. 'Legitimate sexual desires' (i.e occuring within marriage, one's spouse and not just any other people) is still quite ok but is mentally unhealthy to have too much either. As the buddha says, the thought manifests as word, word manifests as deed, the deed developer into habit, and habit gardens into character. Therefore as we think so we become. Furthermore if one has the habit of leacherous thoughts such habits can be brought over to our next life and we may carry out sexual misconducts and eventually end up in the lower realms. At a higher level one cleanse himself of lust because it prevents the experience of the perfect bliss of nirvana, and lust is a fetter that is equivalent to dukkha. There cannot be freedom and liberation if one's mind is preoccupied by them. We will also not be liberated from the world of samsaric rebirth since love and lust (qing, ai, yu) is the recipe for rebirth. Whereas, the scriptures say, the four characteristics of nirvana is eternity, bliss, self and purity. (chang, le, wo, jing). Purifying the mind of sentient thoughts (not evil thoughts only, but all sentient thoughts) is taught in buddhism. Other religions does not seem to teach this. Only do good, avoid evil.
Well, good technique about imagining someone getting old down the years, but I would like to hear more techniques people would employ, if possible.
And deadpoet, quite enlightening you ask why would one give up lust in the first place, for I thought it is where conspiracy lies.
Thanks eternalnow for the quote and information. But I would like to know if someone has [b]given up lust competely, and how he/shedoes that.[/b]
That monk who wrote that was someone who has completely transcended lust (and even at that point he has not attained complete liberation yet). He attained liberation years later. There are many many thousands of others throughout history (even today) who have accomplished this (attaining liberation). So its not exactly a superhuman thing. And in buddhism we believe everyone can become a buddha and all of up aim to attain enlightenment. Do you mean someone from this forum? Not sure whether the more experienced ones would like to share... Hope they do.