Why meditate?
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Originally posted by JonLS:
Yes JonLS, very well said! It is the path for those that have seen the non-dualistic aspect of reality -- the condition for smooth sailing.
Hi Thusness,
Eckhart has said that the new consciousness is emerging directly now.
I would have to agree with him since this seems to be what is happening.
[b]It is difficult as long as you consider yourself to be the ego, when this is seen through, then it is smoother sailing.
It requires constant surrender and tremendous desire for truth.
Happy holidays!!!
[/b] Before that, for those that attempt to take this path, it is hell lots of confusions. 
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Originally posted by JonLS:
It is a misinterpretation of "an expression" into "desire to do something" when 'I' is there.
Rather, the fact that your utmost desire is to know the truth of your being is simply a sign that awareness is ready to awaken to itself.
But of course this is all appearance, because nothing really awakens.
Enlightenment simply is. -
I know, and I think I know the true nature of existence already.Originally posted by JonLS:Hi Eric,
This is the mind talking.
Thoughts are arising.
Can you just watch them Eric.
Instead of identifying with them, believing them? -
Then what did you mean by "having crossed over to the other shore" last time??Originally posted by casino_king:So many activities in Religions, Buddhism or otherwise, miss the point completely.
Meditation can promote health but you do not meditate for health benefits.
Meditation can still your mind but you do not meditate to still your mind.
Meditation can help you contemplate and crystallize your thoughts but you do not meditate to crystallize your thoughts.
Meditation can help you control your 'chi' but you do not meditate to ... -
Hi Eric,
quote:
You can't really know (with the mind) the true nature of existence.
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Originally posted by JonLS:
Hi Eric,
This is the mind talking.
Thoughts are arising.
Can you just watch them Eric.
Instead of identifying with them, believing them?
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I know, and I think I know the true nature of existence already
You can only be the true nature of existence.
By letting go of needing to know. -
Eric,
Do you really exist?
Or are you just an idea in your head? -
Yes, so there is confusion within the present moment.Originally posted by Thusness:Yes JonLS, very well said! It is the path for those that have seen the non-dualistic aspect of reality -- the condition for smooth sailing. Before that, for those that attempt to take this path, it is hell lots of confusions.
And there is sense of self that identifies with this confusion.
Does this, in any way, take away from the perfection of the present moment???
Are you really the confusion?
Are you really the sense of self that is identifying with it?
Or are you beyond both of these???
As Eckhart Tolle would say, the confusion and the sense of self are the "content" of the present moment.
You are not the content.
You are the present moment.
You are the space in which it all happens. -
How about you go bang yourself unto oncoming traffic and tell me whether it's painful?Originally posted by JonLS:Eric,
Do you really exist?
Or are you just an idea in your head? -
Originally posted by JonLS:
From my understanding, when the mind understands the true nature of existence, the mind will auto release the need of knowing. The need of knowing is a form of craving. Correct me if im wrong.
Hi Eric,
You can't really know (with the mind) the true nature of existence.
You can only [b]be the true nature of existence.
By letting go of needing to know.[/b]
i do know that "self " is an illusion. So how do i experience the true nature of existence? At this moment, am i trying to conceptualise this " true nature of existence and related it to a "how do i" ?
so just simply be and surrending the self in the process? mmmmm..
No thought and desire arising when you experience 'true nature of existence' ???
or am i asking too many questions and not looking hard enough
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Originally posted by JonLS:
From my understanding, when the mind understands the true nature of existence, the mind will auto release the urge of knowing. The urge of knowing is like a form of craving?
Hi Eric,
You can't really know (with the mind) the true nature of existence.
You can only [b]be the true nature of existence.
By letting go of needing to know.[/b]
i do know that "self " is an illusion. So how do i experience this true nature of existence? At this moment, am i trying to conceptualise " true nature of existence and related it to a "how do i" ? so does it explain why i can't experience this true nature of existence
so can i just simply be and surrending the self in the process?
No thought and desire arising when you experience 'true nature of existence' ???
or am i asking too much questions and not looking hard enough -
I was using the Buddhist parable of the Raft... using Dharma as a raft to cross over to the other side. There are many lakes to cross over and the people over the other side can look back and see others trying to come over and why they are stuck in the middle of the lake.Originally posted by Eric Cartman:Then what did you mean by "having crossed over to the other shore" last time?? -
Originally posted by JonLS:
No JonLS,
Yes, so there is confusion within the present moment.
And there is sense of self that identifies with this confusion.
Does this, in any way, take away from the perfection of the present moment???
Are you really the confusion?
Are you really the sense of self that is identifying with it?
Or are you beyond both of these???
There is no 'Self' that is identified with the 'confusion' at the present moment.
The 'Self' is the entire whole of identification. The process of identification to particularize is the confusion itself. There is no beyond, there is only 'insight' that clears the illusion and all merely 'what is'.
The 'space' is another story. This ‘Space’ is the problem of all problems. The subtest stories told. The cognitive thrist creates that 'Space'. Things taking place requires no background, without it nothing is taking place. There is only One, not two. Nothing within or without, just it! In direct path there is no compromise. There is no room for a 'space'.
As Eckhart Tolle would say, the confusion and the sense of self are the "content" of the present moment.
You are not the content.
You are the present moment.
You are the space in which it all happens.[/b] -
Yah... space is another illusion. It is the conventional mind that cognate the 'space'.Originally posted by Thusness:The 'space' is another story. This ‘Space’ is the problem of all problems. The subtest stories told. The cognitive thrist creates that 'Space'. Things taking place requires no background, without it nothing is taking place. There is only One, not two. Nothing within or without, just it! In direct path there is no compromise. There is no room for a 'space'. -
If there is no space, then why bother to meditate? Yes, since there is no 'you' or 'self', then there is nothing there.
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Yes...dissolving, dissolving and still dissolving...Originally posted by longchen:Yah... space is another illusion. It is the conventional mind that cognate the 'space'. -
Hi Herzog,
If there is no space, then why bother to meditate?
Exactly, there is really no need to meditate.
Only the false sense of self feels the need to do something.
Can you drop the seeking?
Can you let go of the seeker?
Of course not, these are just ideas. -
Hi Thusness,
The 'space' is another story. This ‘Space’ is the problem of all problems. The subtest stories told. The cognitive thrist creates that 'Space'. Things taking place requires no background, without it nothing is taking place. There is only One, not two. Nothing within or without, just it! In direct path there is no compromise. There is no room for a 'space'.
Very well said.
I totally agree.
Thank you. -
Hi Thusness,
No JonLS,
Yes, very well said.
There is no 'Self' that is identified with the 'confusion' at the present moment.
The 'Self' is the entire whole of identification. The process of identification to particularize is the confusion itself. There is no beyond, there is only 'insight' that clears the illusion and all merely 'what is'.
Thank you for clearing that up for me. -
quote:
I wouldn't do that because I respect the idea.
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Originally posted by JonLS:
Eric,
Do you really exist?
Or are you just an idea in your head?
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How about you go bang yourself unto oncoming traffic and tell me whether it's painful?
I respect the dream. -
Hi Isis,
From my understanding, when the mind understands the true nature of existence, the mind will auto release the need of knowing. The need of knowing is a form of craving. Correct me if im wrong.
What I have experienced is that the mind becomes aware of the poverty of it's own conceptualizations and then is quite prepared to remain silent.i do know that "self " is an illusion. So how do i experience the true nature of existence? At this moment, am i trying to conceptualise this " true nature of existence and related it to a "how do i" ?
The very fact that you are trying to do something should suggest to you that this is efforting by the ego/mind.
The fact is you already are fully what you are.
You are perfection right now.
You are the present moment.
You are God.
There's nothing you need to do to achieve this.
Just be!so just simply be and surrending the self in the process? mmmmm..
This does not happen like this.
No thought and desire arising when you experience 'true nature of existence' ???
It requires insight into your true nature.or am i asking too many questions and not looking hard enough
There will continue to be the appearance of a "someone" asking questions and looking hard until you fully realize that there is no one and nothing to do.
Perfection is here right now.
And within this perfection is a dream of imperfection.
Until you wake up.
As Ramana Maharshi would say, you have to do whatever you can to get rid of the idea that you are not realized. -
In other words, know that everything is fine and nothing matters ultimately no matter what is done? Just like how christians know that God will take care of all things, just rest and glorify God, and dont bother finding out what God is because he is unknowable because he is God? (I'm not being angry at this)
Now that I know this, I want some supernatural powers to play with. -
You also said that the angels and heavenly beings all rejoiced at your attainment.Originally posted by casino_king:I was using the Buddhist parable of the Raft... using Dharma as a raft to cross over to the other side. There are many lakes to cross over and the people over the other side can look back and see others trying to come over and why they are stuck in the middle of the lake. -
Why are you suddenly so interested in me?Originally posted by Eric Cartman:You also said that the angels and heavenly beings all rejoiced at your attainment. -
cos you claimed to have some spiritual attainment.Originally posted by casino_king:Why are you suddenly so interested in me? -
There is no such thing as True or Fake Buddhism at the summit or the epic center of Buddhism. You will recognise it when you have reached it. Those that have gone before can only guide you as you make the journey.Originally posted by Eric Cartman:cos you claimed to have some spiritual attainment.
It is your own journey. It is your own effort. Nobody can take credit when you have reached the destination.
If it were possible for an external source to bring you into the epic center, many more would be there. Fortunately or unfortunately, depending on the perspective of whether you are looking from the outside or you are looking in, the journey is your own.
The good thing about this then is that, unlike dogmatic religions, you can actually reach the destination through guidance from an internet forum. You see, it is your own effort and not somebody's teaching. (There is a duality here. It is 100% effort and 0% effort. That is not important. For now you have to take it as 100% effort.)
Since it is your own effort, what would be the problem if you received "bad" guidance? Whatever "guidance" you received has to pass through you. It is your effort, it is your journey. You have to work it out for yourself what is "good" and what is "bad" anyway.
You have to test it. You have to taste it. The "bad" teaching can open your eyes to what is bad and that is as important as knowing what good is; if you are to reach the epic center.
It then follows that there is no "fake" Buddhism at all. That which is fake will teach you what "fake is" and that which is "true" you cannot accept anyway unless you yourself know it to be true after you have tested it and tasted it.