Why meditate?
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Hi Thusness,
Happy New Year JonLS!
Happy New Year to you too.
Told u it will only lead to confusion.
So, confusion is arising in the present moment.
Can you just watch the confusion?
Does it really matter what is in the present moment?When you can see that all experiences are equal expressions of the One...
and that feeling bound is just as much the One as feeling free, only then does the inner division,
better known as ego, fall away.
Adyashanti -
Originally posted by JonLS:
Yes JonLS, no one state is purer than the other and thus, a purest state does not exist. Discrimination creates the non-existence 'Self' and insight dissolves it.
When you can see that all experiences are equal expressions of the One...
and that feeling bound is just as much the One as feeling free, only then does the inner division,
better known as ego, fall away.
Adyashanti -
Is that why christians are not allowed to question and are told to just have faith?
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Do you think that it is better to resolve the confusion or remain in confusion?
Accept the present moment (including the confusion) as if you had chosen it yourself.
This transformation of consciousness is about letting go of thoughts, of beliefs.
How can it NOT lead to confusion, to "not knowing".
Having confusion and not knowing in the present moment is actually a sign of progress.
"So embrace the "not knowing"." (Eckhart Tolle) -
I am not posting in this thread and you are not posting in this thread
That is correct.
There is the appearance of a "someone" posting and a "someone" reading these posts, but this is just appearance based on a false belief, on thought.then who is posting in this thread?
No one.
That is where insight, realization comes in, you need to "see" this.
How badly do you want it???The thread does not exist then what are we reading?
The thread does exist, in appearance only. All meaning attached to what is being perceived is based on belief, on thought, on conditioning. -
What about physical pain and future lives?
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Physical pain is just part of the manifestation, part of the dream, it is a very powerful dream, so don't go asking me to step out in front of a bus again.
Future lives are just a thought in your mind, nothing more.
All that really exists is the present moment.
The absolute truth is that there is only pure consciousness, only being, only enlightenment.
This thread is appearance only.
Any meaning attached to the words in this thread is conditioning, is belief, is thought.
Any meaning is a product of ego/mind.
Which is just appearance within the vastness known as "Being", as Pure consciousness. -
My experiences:
Hi.
Something happened again today as it has so many times before.
When this first started two years ago, I interpreted it as the "holy spirit" had descended on me. At that time the effect was tiny, it happened within my body and shook me to my roots. It felt like sweet ambrosia, at the time I said "my cup runneth over" because it was so powerful and wonderful.
Later on, when I first started posting on the msn boards, I called it a "break in reality", as if the immediate reality I was experiencing somehow broke down and was reassembled in a slightly different way.
Later I started calling it the opening of the inner dimension. All of these events were powerful and painful and stressful on the body and psyche, but it was always met with a big "YES" because it felt so wonderful, so right.
Today this phenomenon still continues, but it doesn't feel as localized as it did before. The "presence" that emerges during this event is so wonderful and all encompassing that even though it has me on my knees and crying and completely "out of it", it also has me yelling "YES" at the top of my mental lungs. I simply cannot get enough of It, even though it feels like it's killing the little egoic me.
When the phenomenon subsides, there is a powerful, almost palpable feeling of peace.
The mind truly has no idea what is going on here.
But the events are truly a humbling experience to the mind, showing it that it has no idea about what reality truly is.
The absolute poverty of mind and it's conceptualizations is very clear. -
Since this thread is about meditation, I'd like to say something about it.
At a time when I still identified with the concept of meditation, a question arose from within.
The question was " when does meditation begin and when does it end".
I knew the answer was "never", but did not understand how or why, I was totally confused.
Eckhart Tolle, in his talk called " What is meditation", says that the true meditation is to be aligned with the present moment, to fully accept the present moment as it is, as if you had chosen it yourself.
This is about total surrender.
And as you can see, there is no time when this will start and no time when it will end.
It is your true nature.
It is timeless.
It is eternal. -
Is it the "only feasible" thing to do? Is it enough? What must be in place even before you start "meditation?"Originally posted by Eric Cartman:Probably the only feasible thing to do next is meditate. -
It is the only feasible thing for "'me' who wants to be 'enlightened' and calm" to do.Originally posted by casino_king:Is it the "only feasible" thing to do? Is it enough? -
What does accepting the present moment do for you? Will it solve your need for food, for example? Is solving the need for food all there is to human life? If it will not solve your need for food, why is it important to "accept the present moment?" What does accepting the present moment do for you?Originally posted by JonLS:Since this thread is about meditation, I'd like to say something about it.
At a time when I still identified with the concept of meditation, a question arose from within.
The question was " when does meditation begin and when does it end".
I knew the answer was "never", but did not understand how or why, I was totally confused.
Eckhart Tolle, in his talk called " What is meditation", says that the true meditation is to be aligned with the present moment, to fully accept the present moment as it is, as if you had chosen it yourself.
This is about total surrender.
And as you can see, there is no time when this will start and no time when it will end.
It is your true nature.
It is timeless.
It is eternal. -
How did you come to the conclusion that all you need is to "meditate" in order to become enlightened?Originally posted by Eric Cartman:It is the only feasible thing for "'me' who wants to be 'enlightened' and calm" to do. -
Not ALL that is needed. Just lets me concentrate much better, so I can identify those previously unconscious things in my mind.Originally posted by casino_king:How did you come to the conclusion that all you need is to "meditate" in order to become enlightened? -
The basic question of what will enlightenment do for me is flawed because there is no me that can gain anything from enlightenment.Originally posted by casino_king:What does accepting the present moment do for you? Will it solve your need for food, for example? Is solving the need for food all there is to human life? If it will not solve your need for food, why is it important to "accept the present moment?" What does accepting the present moment do for you?
Enlightenment is the seeing that there is no separate self.
Hunger arises in the present moment, and is followed by eating in the present moment. This is all appearance and is not interpreted as a problem that needs to be solved. Because it is all the One.
Life is a complete mystery and is accepted as such.
I am in a permanent state of "not knowing" and totally comfortable with it. -
This has just been posted on another forum and I thought it may be helpful here:
Quote:
Joel said: Meditation seems to be no more than the alert but still mind, completely focused upon now, Self. Like an orchestra trained on the conductor.
I don't wish to come off as being a nit-pick but there is a basic misunderstanding here - mind is movement of consciousness as form, and being a form it cannot focus on the now. This is a subtle but important point. Mind, being movement, cannot also be still. It is not mind which focuses on Self/now, but rather, it is Self/now in which mind arises. If this isn't understood then one can get caught up in trying to get the mind to "do something" to wake up.
The alertness you mention is the stillness of consciousness itself. When the mind is no more that alertness/stillness is left standing on its own with nothing getting in the way of it - this is the natural state of awareness, what you are. That consciousness /stillness/alertness is here right now, even in the midst of mental activity - it can be felt/realized no matter what the circumstances are.
This is why formal meditation for the sake of awakening can get in the way. If one practices formal meditation to awaken the most important point in meditation is when the technique drops away along with the ego/mind and there is no more grasping/efforting at "meditating". But what often happens is that the ego hangs on to the technique with determination in order to "meditate". This is what I did for nearly 30 years. Once I saw this I could see how "I" delayed consciously waking up.
Now if I sit for formal meditation it seems ridiculously irrelevant because I can see myself efforting to get something I already am. -
The last time I meditated, which was over a year ago, I came to the realization at the end of the meditation that I was just an idea.
I could no longer meditate after that.
I was completely lost.
It was a very difficult time. -
I totally agree with that. You meditated for 30 years??Originally posted by JonLS: -
Not ALL, then what else is needed? How does "meditating" and "concentrating" help you identify "previously unconscious" things in your mind?Originally posted by Eric Cartman:Not ALL that is needed. Just lets me concentrate much better, so I can identify those previously unconscious things in my mind. -
It's all about habits, isn't it?Originally posted by casino_king:Not ALL, then what else is needed? How does "meditating" and "concentrating" help you identify "previously unconscious" things in your mind? -
Originally posted by JonLS:
Do you equate "accepting the present moment" as "enlightenment?" Why did you tell us that "The basic question of what will enlightenment do for me is flawed"?
The basic question of what will enlightenment do for me is flawed because there is no [b]me that can gain anything from enlightenment.
Enlightenment is the seeing that there is no separate self.
Hunger arises in the present moment, and is followed by eating in the present moment. This is all appearance and is not interpreted as a problem that needs to be solved. Because it is all the One.
Life is a complete mystery and is accepted as such.
I am in a permanent state of "not knowing" and totally comfortable with it.
[/b]
What are you going to do about the present "you" that is here and now posting in this forum? -
Habits as in "doing" or "thinking"?Originally posted by Eric Cartman:It's all about habits, isn't it? -
both and beyondOriginally posted by casino_king:Habits as in "doing" or "thinking"? -
Can one do without thinking? Is it "without thinking" or something else?Originally posted by Eric Cartman:both and beyond -
dont think about the future, just live in the presentOriginally posted by casino_king:Can one do without thinking? Is it "without thinking" or something else?