Truth of the Middle Way
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Can someone explain to me what's the Truth of the Middle Way?
Cheers -
haha , u are vampire ?
are u Vampire King in << I have a meeting with Vampire>> -
Avoiding Extremes
The Buddha taught what he referred to as 'the Middle Way, a path that led to enlightenment by avoiding the extremes of sensory self-indulgence and self-mortification. Quite a humorous sutta tells of how two ascetics approach the Buddha and ask what their destiny will be in their next life. One of the ascetics spends his time acting like a dog, the other like an ox. Thus the ascetic who acts like a dog 'eats his food when it is thrown on the ground', whereas the ascetic who acts like an ox does ox-like things (the sutta doesn't explain what these might be!). By acting in this way, the two ascetics expect that they will be reborn in a higher realm, as gods perhaps, but the Buddha quickly disillusions them. The ascetic who acts like a dog will be reborn in the company of dogs or else hell; the ascetic who acts like an ox will be reborn in the company of oxen or else hell too!
http://buddhism.about.com/cs/theravada/a/MiddleWay.htm -
Originally posted by syncopation_music:haha , u are vampire ?
are u Vampire King in << I have a meeting with Vampire>>
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Originally posted by bohiruci:Avoiding Extremes
The Buddha taught what he referred to as 'the Middle Way, a path that led to enlightenment by avoiding the extremes of sensory self-indulgence and self-mortification. Quite a humorous sutta tells of how two ascetics approach the Buddha and ask what their destiny will be in their next life. One of the ascetics spends his time acting like a dog, the other like an ox. Thus the ascetic who acts like a dog 'eats his food when it is thrown on the ground', whereas the ascetic who acts like an ox does ox-like things (the sutta doesn't explain what these might be!). By acting in this way, the two ascetics expect that they will be reborn in a higher realm, as gods perhaps, but the Buddha quickly disillusions them. The ascetic who acts like a dog will be reborn in the company of dogs or else hell; the ascetic who acts like an ox will be reborn in the company of oxen or else hell too!
http://buddhism.about.com/cs/theravada/a/MiddleWay.htm Thanks bohiruci. That was fast.
So how does the Truth of Middle Way links to the other two Truth in the Three Truths?
Do enlighten me.
Cheers -
Middle way has a few meanings and one of them is as what Bohiruci mentioned... 'Middle Way' suggests not so much of 'a balance between the extremes', but rather, going beyond attachment and illusions to extremes or clinging to polaristic opposites and thinking they are truly existent, satisfying, permanent, etc.
Other than the extremes of asceticism and indulgence in sensory pleasures, to enter more deeply, middle way means the emptiness of the extreme views of sentient beings, such as Eternalism and Nihilism. We often cling to the notion of the self and the world and objects as having true, inherent existence... however we do not see that they are all dependently originated, arising out of conditions, always impermanent, fleeting, changing every moment. We do not see its Emptiness... and so we cling to an eternalistic idea of a permanent, separate Self or the world.
There are also some others who cling to the notion of 'things' that 'does not exist' or 'no longer exist', or 'nihilistic' concept, as opposed to Emptiness - which is empty of all extreme erroneous conceptual views of sentient beings: Existence, Non-existence, Both existence and non existence, Neither existence nor non-existence. Non-existence is merely a false conceptually fabricated concept, and has only relative meaning with Existence... both are attachment.. and they cause suffering.. such as suffering for the non-existence (i.e death) of my relative, or desiring but never getting the existence of $$. We cannot see emptiness.
There are many extreme views but some of the more common ones I listed above... which are the fundamental ones of not seeing the ultimate nature of Emptiness (thus causing all other subsequent ignorance)
Edit: P.S. I also answered your questions about the 'Three Truths' (I assume you mean Three Dharma Seals, or are you refering to something else?), because they are No-Self, Impermanence, Suffering. -
http://www.buddhapadipa.org/pages/buddhism_buddhismforbeginners.html
Unit 1 - Middle way
Before the Buddhist period, there were two widely held beliefs; one was that all things were permanent, this described the transferring of the soul to a new body, after death and was called eternalism. The other was nihilism, which believed in the extinction of the being after death. In fact, they believed that everything was annihilated on death, as everyone was born of four elements and when the four elements dissolved, the being was also annihilated.
The Buddha did not preach either eternalism or nihilism. Instead, he taught the truth or the reality of conditioned existence. This was expressed in three characteristics:
1) Anicca The characteristic of impermanence; i.e. that all conditioned things are impermanent, and of the nature to arise and pass away. No conditioned thing has any permanent nature.
2) Dukkha The characteristic of unsatisfactoriness; i.e. that all conditioned things are unsatisfactory. This is because they are impermanent and do not last, put simply, conditioned things are imperfect.
3) Anatta The characteristic of non-self; i.e. that all conditioned things are without any permanent, independently existing self or entity.
As well as eternalism and nihilism, there were another two extreme beliefs; self-indulgence and self-mortification. Those who believed in self indulgence would utterly indulge the body in sense pleasures, paying no attention to the mind. They just served their bodies by eating, drinking, having sex etc. whenever they felt like it. The other group, the self-mortification practitioners did not agree with indulgence and so aspired to the opposite practice of completely mortifying themselves, through various austerities. They believed that if they sacrificed their happiness completely, and tortured themselves, they would achieve great benefit in the next life. These were two very extreme belief systems.
The Buddha himself was born a prince, and so had been showered with luxury since childhood, however, he soon realised that true happiness was not to be found in luxury and so went to practise or experiment with the practices of self-mortification, as a forest dwelling ascetic. However, during his six years as an ascetic, he found those practices, too, to be empty of true happiness. While he practised these, he knew that both of these approaches were too extreme. He realised that self-indulgence was utter materialism and self-mortification was utter spiritualism, so then he balanced these two extremes into the middle way, giving importance to both mind and matter, because when they work together, interdependently it is very powerful. He called this path of balance between the two extremes, the Middle Way. All things depend on the truth of cause and effect as is explained in the BuddhaÂ’s second noble truth; everything arises because of a cause. Since there is a cause, there is an effect which is related to its cause. According to Paticasamuppada (the law of cause and effect), the Buddha taught that all phenomena arise interdependently as the causes always give rise to effects. All things are inter-related, they cannot arise independently. This is called the Middle way in the Buddhist sense.
In another sense, the middle way is a balance which means that the practitioner has to learn and practise the teachings in balance, step by step. The Buddha taught the dhamma or teachings of five faculties; 1) confidence, 2) effort, 3) mindfulness, 4) concentration, and 5) wisdom which must be kept in balance. Confidence must be balanced by wisdom, if there is too much confidence, it gives rise to blind faith, in which people believe anything that has been taught to them, if on the other hand, there is not enough confidence, people end up doubting everything they hear and refusing to believe everything, without any consideration. Effort must also be balanced by concentration, if there is more effort than concentration, it will give rise to a nervous personality. On the contrary, if there is less concentration, it gives rise to sloth and torpor. There is only one quality for which we can say, the more the better, and that is mindfulness. One can never have too much mindfulness.
The middle way also has the meaning of practising or living with moderation. This can be things such as moderation in eating, which does not give rise to any disadvantage for the body. This is the middle way in practice. In general, the Buddhist practice is the middle way, not too loose or too tight. So the first characteristic of Buddhism is that it follows the Middle way. -
Do Come and meet me up for discussion if you interested in BuddhismOriginally posted by Yunhaier: Can someone explain to me what's the Truth of the Middle Way?
Cheers
we are all beginner in Buddhadharma
so you can learn more and learn from us .We also hope to learn from you
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like that sianz cha bo oso canOriginally posted by bohiruci:Do Come and meet me up for discussion if you interested in Buddhism
we are all beginner in Buddhadharma
so you can learn more and learn from us .We also hope to learn from you 
PS : Yun try not to meet another forumite alone, we got a few examples of what happen b4. -
pls keep such irrelevant comment to bar or chit chat. thank you.Originally posted by Kenashi:like that sianz cha bo oso can 
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hahaOriginally posted by Kenashi:like that sianz cha bo oso can
PS : Yun try not to meet another forumite alone, we got a few examples of what happen b4.
we are a group meeting not individual
and the choice is your
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yap, but the whole group is who u know, yun don't even know one of themOriginally posted by bohiruci:haha
we are a group meeting not individual
and the choice is your
i rather u just talk about it here in the forum instead of meeting with another gal forumite.
things happen, bad things do happen no matter how noble someone may be acting
i don't want the whole forum to get drag into another total flaming war! -
what make yr comment relevant in the first place???Originally posted by LinYu:pls keep such irrelevant comment to bar or chit chat. thank you.
i just making a relevant point if u don't like it too bad!
my problem??? -
*Stroll in with popcorns*
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*Find a nice spot*
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*Sit down and watch free show*
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Dear Kenashi ,thank you for your concern to othersOriginally posted by Kenashi:yap, but the whole group is who u know, yun don't even know one of them
i rather u just talk about it here in the forum instead of meeting with another gal forumite.
things happen, bad things do happen no matter how noble someone may be acting
i don't want the whole forum to get drag into another total flaming war!
I am not angry
Well, this is Buddhism forum ,its up to you who you want to flame ,cos eventually we wont reply to you
We are not noble , we are lousier than you in all aspect
There wasnt a you or me in the first place ,and where did your anger arise ?
If anger is part of you ,why will it disappear ?
Thus is the beauty of Buddhism that many thousand and million follows the art of living
I suggest you search under google for this text
"Dealing with Anger " by Thubten Chodron
Whatever wrath you have incurred ,May I offer you the White Lotus
The Most Beautiful Lotus in Indian Culture
Till then
Blessed you 65 000 000 000 000 000 000 years
Amituofo -
Hmm... gatherings I think its best to keep among those interested and those we know each other in the forum... I think no need to persuade newbies lah
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Originally posted by An Eternal Now:Middle way has a few meanings and one of them is as what Bohiruci mentioned... 'Middle Way' suggests not so much of 'a balance between the extremes', but rather, going beyond attachment and illusions to extremes or clinging to polaristic opposites and thinking they are truly existent, satisfying, permanent, etc.
Other than the extremes of asceticism and indulgence in sensory pleasures, to enter more deeply, middle way means the emptiness of the extreme views of sentient beings, such as Eternalism and Nihilism. We often cling to the notion of the self and the world and objects as having true, inherent existence... however we do not see that they are all dependently originated, arising out of conditions, always impermanent, fleeting, changing every moment. We do not see its Emptiness... and so we cling to an eternalistic idea of a permanent, separate Self or the world.
There are also some others who cling to the notion of 'things' that 'does not exist' or 'no longer exist', or 'nihilistic' concept, as opposed to Emptiness - which is empty of all extreme erroneous conceptual views of sentient beings: Existence, Non-existence, Both existence and non existence, Neither existence nor non-existence. Non-existence is merely a false conceptually fabricated concept, and has only relative meaning with Existence... both are attachment.. and they cause suffering.. such as suffering for the non-existence (i.e death) of my relative, or desiring but never getting the existence of $$. We cannot see emptiness.
There are many extreme views but some of the more common ones I listed above... which are the fundamental ones of not seeing the ultimate nature of Emptiness (thus causing all other subsequent ignorance)
Edit: P.S. I also answered your questions about the 'Three Truths' (I assume you mean Three Dharma Seals, or are you refering to something else?), because they are No-Self, Impermanence, Suffering. Thanks for being helpful Eternal.
And bohiruci I thank you for the offer too though I am quite satisfied with the answers I receive from this forum. Hey, at least by asking, you may also learn from my question, if applicable, as well.
Mummy passed me a book about Buddhism so there are bound to be questions.
Cheers -
Excellent YunHaierOriginally posted by Yunhaier: Thanks for being helpful Eternal.
And bohiruci I thank you for the offer too though I am quite satisfied with the answers I receive from this forum. Hey, at least by asking, you may also learn from my question, if applicable, as well.
Mummy passed me a book about Buddhism so there are bound to be questions.
Cheers
May You Experience the Bliss of Dharma
I will Pray for your Wisdom
regards
Bohiruci -
seriously, i don't care if u r angry or not.Originally posted by bohiruci:Dear Kenashi ,thank you for your concern to others
I am not angry
Well, this is Buddhism forum ,its up to you who you want to flame ,cos eventually we wont reply to you
We are not noble , we are lousier than you in all aspect
There wasnt a you or me in the first place ,and where did your anger arise ?
If anger is part of you ,why will it disappear ?
Thus is the beauty of Buddhism that many thousand and million follows the art of living
I suggest you search under google for this text
"Dealing with Anger " by Thubten Chodron
Whatever wrath you have incurred ,May I offer you the White Lotus
The Most Beautiful Lotus in Indian Culture
Till then
Blessed you 65 000 000 000 000 000 000 years
Amituofo
humans r born with emotions, those who suppress it n those who will let it out. we have seen what those who suppress it have done based on the USA shooting incident!!!
just becos millions follow it, doesn't make it right.
millions of germans followed Hitler during WWII, is he a god or a devil in disguise.
pick yr pick
i have no need for a book to tell me how to deal with anger, i know how to keep them in check, i am mature n independent enough.
u follow yr way n i make my own way! -
Hi all,
Just try to clarify some misconception here.It not so much about suppressing one emotion.That poor korean chap obviously given to bouts of anger which sadly ended up in such an unfortuate state.
Anger is always a tough one. It can cause so much damage, that one can develop feelings of great shame & failure. The key is to stay with the anger and really get acquanted with it.
Basically, we need to become aware of the state of mind before anger. It is the root of the emotion. And we need to see what internal & external conditions are present when anger arises. Basically we need to see the whole tree of anger, from seed to sprout to fruit-bearing (the actual physical lashing out) tree. Once we become acquanted with the whole process, we can begin to identify the state of mind that is necessary for the anger to germinate. Once we can recognize this state of mind, we can then learn to let go of that mental attitude/energy. Then, though all other conditions may be present, the tree will not grow. All we have to do is find the state of mind that allows anger to arise, and take care of that. At that point we can learn ways to prevent even that state of mind from arising.
Buddha once said
Holding on to anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned
Peace to all -
same here, i just posted the last few posts for fun!!
no harm intended
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Are you serious?Originally posted by syncopation_music:haha , u are vampire ?
are u Vampire King in << I have a meeting with Vampire>>
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How many ppl can do that, I'm not there yet but at least when I close my eyes my mind is empty. But I still have love for my gf, and the rest is meaningless to me. Where to go from here?