Inspiring story of Pureland Patriach Che Wu
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When Che Wu Patriach who receive the chan lineage at his chan master deathbed ,but later announced to the assembly he decide to promote Pureland Buddhism of Amitabha ,He was questioned by his shi xiong
His shixiong ask ,"Since Saha World is like having dream , Western Paradise is also like having dream , why the need to seek rebirth in Western Paradise
Master Che Wu skillfully answered ," Wrong , Saha world is bad dream .Every rebirth ,one retrogress on the path of Bodhi , and cannot remember one practise unless with good Dharma teacher .The more u rebirth , the more stupid u become ."
While Western Paradise is Good dream .One will not retrogress in the place and never bound to suffering of the human realm due to too hot or too cold
Of course AEN have shared his opinion with me abt the need to be a Great Bodhisattva
this is just one of the anecdotes of Pureland Patriach of Chinese Mahayana Buddhism
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No matter where you go, it's always a bad dream unless your heart tells you it's a good dream.
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Actually those in Pure Land, those who are released from the lotus flower, they have seen through dreams and realised reality.Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:No matter where you go, it's always a bad dream unless your heart tells you it's a good dream.
And the other famous Buddhist saying... When Mind is pure, Land is pure. -
Those tibetan lineages have gone through so many rebirths so are they......Originally posted by bohiruci:Master Che Wu skillfully answered ," Wrong , Saha world is bad dream .Every rebirth ,one retrogress on the path of Bodhi , and cannot remember one practise unless with good Dharma teacher .The more u rebirth , the more stupid u become ."
........you know what I mean right ? 
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They are Bodhisattvas, not just any ordinary sentient beings. They are reborn out of compassionate vows, not pulled back to samsara due to karmic strength.Originally posted by maggot:Those tibetan lineages have gone through so many rebirths so are they...... ........you know what I mean right ?
If you are a Bodhisattva, you do not retrogress much in samsara.. even if you have not reached the 8th bhumi of non-retrogression (such a person can choose what conditions he wishes to appear in his next life and is never 'lost'), the retrogression is limited and you will definitely continue your path in another lifetime even as this one ended, when conditions are there (such as getting to know the dharma). -
I agree with what AEN saysOriginally posted by An Eternal Now:They are Bodhisattvas, not just any ordinary sentient beings. They are reborn out of compassionate vows, not pulled back to samsara due to karmic strength.
If you are a Bodhisattva, you do not retrogress much in samsara.. even if you have not reached the 8th bhumi of non-retrogression (such a person can choose what conditions he wishes to appear in his next life and is never 'lost'), the retrogression is limited and you will definitely continue your path in another lifetime even as this one ended, when conditions are there (such as getting to know the dharma).
they have at least the 8th Bhumi before they can decide to come back as lineage holder
unlike Mahayana .the Mahayana Patriach ,all does not wish to come back becos they know they will be make use politically -
That will still bring us to the discussion
Magical power >> Karmic power >> Vows Power
Sariputra tried to save 500 sakya ppl by using his alms bowl to bring them up in the mid-air ,but when he bring it down after the war ends ,its all blood water .
Vows Power will supercede Karmic Power if the Vows is sincere
Vows Power is inherent in the teachings of all Lineage Holder of Tibetan Buddhism ,by strong Vow power and practise with their Guru , they can strongly affect the next rebirth in an either humble family or even Western family where Buddhism is welcomed
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Icic..
Originally posted by bohiruci:
I think you arrow wrongly.. should be Magical power << Karmic power << Vows power
That will still bring us to the discussion
Magical power >> Karmic power >> Vows PowerSariputra tried to save 500 sakya ppl by using his alms bowl to bring them up in the mid-air ,but when he bring it down after the war ends ,its all blood water .
Mogallana
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Reverse the time of the blood water and you get back your 500 people
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There is no such thing as time travel. You can see the past, you can't change the past.Originally posted by maggot:Reverse the time of the blood water and you get back your 500 people
Anyway here's the full story of Mogallana attempting to save the 500 people:http://honsing.com/Disciples.htm
Mogallana (Also Moggallana, Maha-Maudgalyayana, foremost in possessing supernatural powers)
Mogallana followed the Buddha together with Sariputra. Mogallana gained Enlightenment within 7 days and attained supernatural powers. Why did Mogallana have such great supernatural powers? This is because in a previous live, Mogallana gave a treat to a Pacceka Buddha. The Pika Buddha was not very eloquent in explaining the Dharma through words, hence he illustrated using supernatural powers. Mogallana was impressed and vowed that he too would achieve in supernatural powers to propagate the Dharma.
Supernatural powers were quite common among Buddha's disciples. However the display of it was always discouraged by the Buddha, all except for Mogallana, he was even praised for using supernatural powers in propagating the Dharma. There were many interesting stories, including one giving rise to the Buddhist festival of Ullambana. However I shall mention one that is less heard of.
There was once where Kapilavastu was to be attacked by King Virudhara from the Kingdom of Kosala King. Buddha tried to prevent the war by sitting at the pathway leading to Kapilavastu on 3 separate occasions. King Virudhara always retreated whenever he saw Buddha. However King Virudhara's revenge and hatred could not be subdued. Buddha knew that there was no way to prevent the Karma further, thus he left them alone.
Mogallana had been successful in all his supernatural powered deeds. Hence he thought that more could be done in this case. Buddha explained to him that this was due to the past bad Karma of the people in Kapilavastu. The people remained arrogant, non-rependent, deceitful, and did not amend their ways, hence there was no way of substituting the fruits of Karma. Mogallana was unconvinced. The army surrounded Kapilavastu such that no one could escape. Mogallana used his supernatural powers to fly into the city, found 500 great men, transform them into his alms bowl, and flew out of the city to a safe spot. However when he opened the bowl to recover the men, he found a bow of blood water instead! Mogallana realized that supernatural powers cannot overcome Karma. (For more details, check out here for more details: http://www.geocities.com/Tokyo/Courtyard/1652/Massacre.html.)
This was a lesson for Mogallana. Finally one day Mogallana was ambushed by some Jain followers. They pushed rocks from a hill onto Mogallana. Mogallana knew this was his Karma and he did not use supernatural powers to overcome it. He died under the rocks. This was before Buddha's final Nirvana. -
Squeeze 500 people into a small alms bowl of course will become blood water
What I mean is not travel back in time but the "pull back" the time of the blood water
But it seems like it was a lesson rather than a story -
Originally posted by maggot:Squeeze 500 people into a small alms bowl of course will become blood water
What I mean is not travel back in time but the "pull back" the time of the blood water
But it seems like it was a lesson rather than a story 
Anyway, he did not squeeze the 500 ppl. What he did was he decrease the size of every single person so that they can feet into the bowl. -
oops
type too fast
correct ,AEN is correct ,decrease the size of 500 people into his bowl -
He should have changed himself to the size of a mountain and walk out covering the 500 people in his hands and step the army into pratasOriginally posted by An Eternal Now:
Anyway, he did not squeeze the 500 ppl. What he did was he decrease the size of every single person so that they can feet into the bowl. -
The point is the 500 men died even though the army could not find them. So even if the army died, the 500 men will still turn to blood because of their karma. Also, Mogallana who is an Arhat couldn't possibly kill someone. If you kill someone you're creating more bad karma, and does not help solve any of the 500 men's karma.Originally posted by maggot:He should have changed himself to the size of a mountain and walk out covering the 500 people in his hands and step the army into pratas -
From your understanding what can turn people into blood water
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The ripening of karmic seeds, a.k.a karmic consequence/effect.Originally posted by maggot:From your understanding what can turn people into blood water