How to politely decline invitations to church?
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one thing Christian friend of mine always say:Christian is a group of socialize people.,asking mi to church to join him as a brother of the group....than when i ask two question he is not able to answer mi....
1)is Christian always forcing people to go church to convert us as Christian or it on free will of a person that he want to go with him
2)if jesus is the onli god ...y do he need to kneel down n pray to his "father".if u read the quran i told him there is one god n god name is allah he need not pray to anyone but y jesus have to pray to someone " who is the father of jesus that he pray to " he silent after the second question
no racist thinking cos i believe in god of every single religion
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So can I presume you are a Muslim then? Good to hear from someone from another religion that is very established in many parts of the world.Originally posted by funnyboii:one thing Christian friend of mine always say:Christian is a group of socialize people.,asking mi to church to join him as a brother of the group....than when i ask two question he is not able to answer mi....
1)is Christian always forcing people to go church to convert us as Christian or it on free will of a person that he want to go with him
2)if jesus is the onli god ...y do he need to kneel down n pray to his "father".if u read the quran i told him there is one god n god name is allah he need not pray to anyone but y jesus have to pray to someone " who is the father of jesus that he pray to " he silent after the second question
no racist thinking cos i believe in god of every single religion
I have not really thought of the above points raised, thanks for your interesting input. -
Im glad.Originally posted by mrcoconut:
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lol, lol. very humourous.Originally posted by mrcoconut: -
tell him U believe in satan.Originally posted by Spnw07:Thank you for reading this long post.
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Hi,
Just to share with you some good links that you can read up:
Good Question, Good Answer
http://www.budsas.org/ebud/goodqa/goodqa-00.htm
Beyond Belief
http://www.budsas.org/ebud/beyond/beyond01.htm
What Not To Look For In A Relgion
http://www.moonpointer.com/essays/WhatNotToLookForInAReligion.pdf -
not a muslim anyway just that i read many book n got one time to boring go borrow bible n quran "english version" n found it alike in so way so pointed that point to friend
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You don't necessarily need to believe in a God mah.. look into Buddhism as an alternativeOriginally posted by funnyboii:one thing Christian friend of mine always say:Christian is a group of socialize people.,asking mi to church to join him as a brother of the group....than when i ask two question he is not able to answer mi....
1)is Christian always forcing people to go church to convert us as Christian or it on free will of a person that he want to go with him
2)if jesus is the onli god ...y do he need to kneel down n pray to his "father".if u read the quran i told him there is one god n god name is allah he need not pray to anyone but y jesus have to pray to someone " who is the father of jesus that he pray to " he silent after the second question
no racist thinking cos i believe in god of every single religion
Do look into the teachings if you can. -
u want to encourage inter religion cohesion, then u should go to church, walk the talk, dont just talk the talk.
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hahahah, I was an idiot to play with Christianity. But if you are human and you said all humans are idiot, I can agree with you.Originally posted by popmynutsy:u acting like an idiot. so i can say all humans are idiots? u urself said, u was a christian, u know what is happening. -
hahahha, but there is a crytic message here. Black Africa had its own god until the white man colonised Africa!Originally posted by mrcoconut:
Remember: The God Must Be Mad? -
Actually, the inter-religion harmony thingy is just talk only. Now and then, there are some 'organised' shows. But really, there is no love between different Gods!!!Originally posted by leddy:u want to encourage inter religion cohesion, then u should go to church, walk the talk, dont just talk the talk. -
It all comes down to saying no. Use the 'say no to drugs' fomula, edit it a little & you might found a solution.
I got this from a anti-drug website on how to say NO. You can just edit a little/fill in the blanks & use it in the same way
Role Play to teach effective ways to say "NO" to _____
It's inevitable that your child will be offered ________. You can help your child resist peer pressure and find an effective way to refuse. With practice, each child can find his or her own ways to say "no." Each child must be comfortable with the way they say no, and younger and older children will have different ways of saying no. Frequently practice with your child several situations in which they should say "no."
For example, here's one scenario: you're visiting your aunt and uncle for the weekend and while in the backyard with your 18-year-old cousin, _______offers you ______. What will you say and do?
Let your child tell you how he or she would respond to the situation. If he or she has difficulty, you may want to suggest and talk about some of the following responses:
bullet Say no. Don't argue. Don't discuss. Say no and show you mean it.
Other suggestions could include the following:
Suggest other things to do: 'Let's go to a movie', 'Let's play baseball'.
Leave. When other steps have been tried, get out of the situation by going home or calling for a ride. [/b] -
Ask him go to church got buffet lunch to eat anot? If got then go, say that I go coz if food cannot finish sinful you know. At least I can reduce your sins by making sure that there are lesser leftovers. Christians like to talk about sin here sin there one...
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Inter-religious harmony is about respecting the rights of others to their religion. I respect a Christian's rights to believe in Christianity, hence I do not go about trying to de-convert Christians. Likewise, I expect Christians to respect my rights and leave me alone when I turn down their requests to go to church. Inter-religious harmony is not about yielding to every demand of Christians at the expense of my own freedom of belief and freedom of action.Originally posted by leddy:u want to encourage inter religion cohesion, then u should go to church, walk the talk, dont just talk the talk.
As it is, there are far more Buddhists attending churches than there are Christians attending dharma talks. -
Isn't marriages between christians and non-christians frowned upon esp since the paternal side consists of so many stuanch christians? Is there such a rule that christians are not supposed to marry non-christians and if they do, the non-christian spouse must convert to christianity?Originally posted by cycle:Hi Spnw07.
Actually, fr my father's side there r 3 pastors and almost the whole congregation of one church are my extended famiy members. It's like a mini clan association. Our "clan" has been christians since my grand-parents for 3 generations n counting
My mother's side are Taoists, free-thinkers, ming jain xing yang followers.
My mom n I hv been Buddhist for 20 yrs. We r the only 2 Buddhist in our families. But we r still on good terms with everybody, no problem at all. If they wan to know abt Buddhism, we try our best to explain to them. If they wan to "fight", we let them satisfy them own aggressions, then when they've cooled down or bored, we continue with our other topics n be jolly again. If they wan to preach, then we wld keep quite n listen, then say thank u n continue fr where we hv stopped n be jolly again. -
He said politely decline. That's not very polite and please look up the word 'faith' in the dictionary.Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:1. Tell him that you want to and will believe that there is a God/his God but he has to show you proof and evidence that God / his God exists. It is only fair is it not? He wants you to believe, he has to come up with the proof and evidence.
2. Tell him that the proof and evidence you require must be real proof and evidence and you cannot accept what "other people say" as proof and evidence.
3. Tell him that you cannot accept what the Bible say because you do not believe in the Bible.
4. Tell him the proof you require is of a very high standard and you need to see God in action (not the David Copperfield kind).
5. Tell him you don't need to see God directly but he must show you proof and evidence of indisputable acts of God (not the Thaipusam kind, indirect and can be open to other interpretations).
6. Tell him you need independent proof and evidence and not subjective proof and evidence and that you don't trust your own feelings and imaginations.
Let him tell you anything he wants and at the end of it tell him, "Sorry, but I require proof and evidence of a high standard before I believe."
If he tells you "go and see" for yourself. remind him of point 6.
Every time he talks to you again, just tell him "I want to believe but have you come up with the proof and evidence I require?" -
Originally posted by AndrewPKYap:1. Tell him that you want to and will believe that there is a God/his God but he has to show you proof and evidence that God / his God exists. It is only fair is it not? He wants you to believe, he has to come up with the proof and evidence.
2. Tell him that the proof and evidence you require must be real proof and evidence and you cannot accept what "other people say" as proof and evidence.
3. Tell him that you cannot accept what the Bible say because you do not believe in the Bible.
4. Tell him the proof you require is of a very high standard and you need to see God in action (not the David Copperfield kind).
5. Tell him you don't need to see God directly but he must show you proof and evidence of indisputable acts of God (not the Thaipusam kind, indirect and can be open to other interpretations).
6. Tell him you need independent proof and evidence and not subjective proof and evidence and that you don't trust your own feelings and imaginations.
Let him tell you anything he wants and at the end of it tell him, "Sorry, but I require proof and evidence of a high standard before I believe."
If he tells you "go and see" for yourself. remind him of point 6.
Every time he talks to you again, just tell him "I want to believe but have you come up with the proof and evidence I require?" -
Hmm although i am a christian, i would like to give you an objective view on the insistence for tangible evidence that God exist; and subsequently, i will also teach you how to turn down your friends invitation. ;-)
1) Can all occurance in this universe/nature be explained by Science? I believe the answer is no. Who fills in this gap? I believe it is God. Even from nature's point of view, why is it that birds are able to navigate across oceans to escape the winter to a warmer climate and yet be able to return to their point of origin? Why is it that after the sea turtles lay their eggs on the beach, these eggs hatch, the young turtles grows into adulthood and then they are able to navigate unaided to the same spot where their parents laid the eggs? If God took so much effort to take care of these animals, then how much more love he will expend on us human beings?
2) There are also many documented documentaries on the miracles of God, the live testimonies of people who have in one way or another being cured of incurable diseases, illness, or physical deformities. Just do a quite check online and read these testimonies. Sure, you may question then why are there still sick people around? But say in a evangilical service, if only 100 people out of 100,000 people who attended the service are cured of their illnesses, then we shoud rejoice and be happy for this 100 people who are cured, and nt be griefed that the balance were not cured.
3) In the same logic just as people demand to see the tangible being of God, can you also ask if you can see the tangible being of the Gods of other religions? (Please do not count the wooden idols which are worshipped. Those are not tangible proofs too. ;-) )
4) Lastly, I think there are quarters of christians in Singapore who are overtly zealous in trying to bring salvation to their friends. You see, there is a God's eventual timeline for a person to be saved from salvation. But when these christians push it too far, they are using their own efforts, which then now involves their own pride and ego, their pride to want to use humanly effort to bring a person to salvation;cz they believe in using their own efforts to please God, and these mindset would then revert to the system of Laws in the old testament; for in the new testament, God has invoked a new convenent, to embrace grace rather than laws.
Just take the incident when the Korean missionary group was kidnapped in Iraq. Im sure in all wisdom, the holy spirit and God told the group not to proceed, but they still did, in a bid to use human effort to win, to outshine and proof that their church is the most gung-ho in South Korea. The result of course is tragic with the loss of 2 lives.
5) Hence, i believe in this case the best reply to decline your friend's invitation is, "God's timeline is not up yet for me to embrace him.". Because Jesus is such a gentlemen, he will only come in when u knock on his door. And this being said, also be aware that God always place us at the right time and right place to be saved. So ha, you will never know in near future, or decades from now, you would embrace him.
Alrites, this is my 2 cents worth of comment. Please accept my apologies if i offended anybody. -
I see, it's good that you are aware and concern on your interpersonal communication skills and spiritual cultivation. I think since you'd been to churches, then just politely decline their invitation citing that you're not interested with a smile.Originally posted by Spnw07:Thanks for your advice. Perhaps you are better in your terms of wit and communication skills and that your Christian friends have already somehow, I don't know, just know when to back off.
I have been to churches at the invitation of friends before, this is definitely not my first time.
Yes, this may be a little thing. But if not handled properly, not only will I not be able to continue interacting with people from different religions, I will not be growing in terms of interpersonal communication skills and spiritual cultivation.
I think if you go on to explain about what Buddhism is and why you don't believe in Christianity, etc, will make matters more awkward.
=) -
imo, the best polite way to decline the invitations is not to tell him off, but to show him how sincere and serious you are into Buddhism ( if you have decided that Buddhism is right for you ) . See if you can show by actions and keep yourself busy doing these: deligently study the Dharma, learn meditation, be a vegetarian on certain day in a week, sincerely chants Sutra or name of Buddha or Bodisattaw you prefer (without causing any disturbance to your family members), etc. Set a strict routine for all these. Once you have proven yourself, and he observed it, he probably will stop inviting you.
By the way you are protected by Singapore Constitutional law to profess in any lawful faith you choose. No one has the right to force you. -
Hmm... this is the first time I'm going to counter Christian claims directly (other than the one on creationism) for.. I dunno how long At least on the public forum.
Excerpts taken from http://www.budsas.org/ebud/beyond/beyond02.htm, http://www.budsas.org/ebud/beyond/beyond01.htm (Beyond Belief)Originally posted by New Creation:
The Argument from Design
Hmm although i am a christian, i would like to give you an objective view on the insistence for tangible evidence that God exist; and subsequently, i will also teach you how to turn down your friends invitation. ;-)
1) Can all occurance in this universe/nature be explained by Science? I believe the answer is no. Who fills in this gap? I believe it is God. Even from nature's point of view, why is it that birds are able to navigate across oceans to escape the winter to a warmer climate and yet be able to return to their point of origin? Why is it that after the sea turtles lay their eggs on the beach, these eggs hatch, the young turtles grows into adulthood and then they are able to navigate unaided to the same spot where their parents laid the eggs? If God took so much effort to take care of these animals, then how much more love he will expend on us human beings?
In response to the above refutation, the Christian will maintain that the universe does not merely exist but its existence shows perfect design. There is, a Christian might say, an order and balance which point to its having been designed by a higher intelligence, and that this higher intelligence is God. But as before, there are some problems with this argument.
Firstly, how does the Christian know that it was his God who is behind creation? Perhaps it was the gods of non-Christian religions who designed and created the universe.
Secondly, how does the Christian know that only one God designed everything? In fact, as the universe is so intricate and complex we could expect it to need the intelligence of several, perhaps dozens, of gods to design it. So if anything the argument from design proves that there are many gods, not one as Christians claim.
Next, we would have to ask, is the universe perfectly designed? We must ask this because if a perfect God designed and created the universe, then that universe should be perfect. Let us first look at inanimate phenomena to see whether they show perfect design. Rain gives us pure water to drink but sometimes it rains too much and people lose their lives, their homes and their means of livelihood in floods. At other times it doesn't rain at all and millions die in drought and famine. Is this perfect design? The mountains give us joy as we see them reaching up into the sky. But landslides and volcanic eruptions have for centuries caused havoc and death. Is this perfect design? The gentle breezes cool us but storms and tornadoes repeatedly cause death and destruction. Is this perfect design? These and other natural calamities prove that inanimate phenomena do not exhibit perfect design and therefore that they were not created by a perfect God.
Now let us look at animate phenomena to see whether they reveal perfect design. At a superficial glance, nature seems to be beautiful and harmonious; all creatures are provided for and each has its task to perform. However, as any biologist will confirm, nature is utterly ruthless. To live, each creature has to feed on other creatures and struggle to avoid being eaten by other creatures. In nature, there is no time for pity, love or mercy. If a loving God designed everything, why did such a cruel design result? The animal kingdom is not only imperfect in the ethical sense, it is also imperfect in that it often goes wrong. Every year millions of babies are born with physical or mental disabilities, or are stillborn or die soon after birth. Why would a perfect creator God design such terrible things?
So if there is design in the universe, much of it is faulty and cruel. This would seem to indicate that the universe was not created by a perfect all-loving God.2) There are also many documented documentaries on the miracles of God, the live testimonies of people who have in one way or another being cured of incurable diseases, illness, or physical deformities. Just do a quite check online and read these testimonies. Sure, you may question then why are there still sick people around? But say in a evangilical service, if only 100 people out of 100,000 people who attended the service are cured of their illnesses, then we shoud rejoice and be happy for this 100 people who are cured, and nt be griefed that the balance were not cured.
Miracles
Christians claim that miracles are sometimes performed in God's name and that the fact that this happens proves that God exists. This is an appealing argument until it is looked at a little more closely.
While Christians are quick to claim that because of their prayers the blind could see, the deaf could hear and crooked limbs were straightened, they are very slow in producing evidence to back up their claims. In fact, some Christians are so anxious to prove that miracles have occurred at their prayer meetings that the truth often gets lost in a flood of wild claims, extravagant boasts, and sometimes even conscious lies.
It is true that things which are unusual and difficult to explain do sometimes happen during religious events - but not just for Christians. Hindus, Muslims, Taoists, etc. all claim that their God or gods sometimes perform miracles. Christianity certainly does not have a monopoly on miracles. So, if miracles performed in God's name prove the existence of the Christian God, then miracles performed in the name of numerous other gods must likewise prove that they too exist.
Christians may try to overcome this fact by claiming that, when miracles occur in other religions, they are done through the power of the Devil. Perhaps the best way to counter this claim is to quote the Bible. When Jesus healed the sick, his enemies accused him of doing this through the power of the Devil. He answered that healing the sick results in good and if the Devil went around doing good he would destroy himself (Mk 3:22-26). Therefore the same could be said for the miracles performed by Hindus, Jews or Sikhs. If these miracles result in good, how can they be the work of the Devil? -
3) In the same logic just as people demand to see the tangible being of God, can you also ask if you can see the tangible being of the Gods of other religions? (Please do not count the wooden idols which are worshipped. Those are not tangible proofs too. ;-) )
First of all, Buddhists do not worship any God or Gods. We only pay respects to Buddhas and Bodhisattvas, who are not gods, but enlightened beings. All Buddhists aim to attain Enlightenment, Buddhahood, so the Buddha merely shows us the way -- he is just a teacher. We do not worship them, much less any wooden idols. Pls do not confuse Buddhism with the folk religion.
http://www.jenchen.org.sg/vol7no4c.htm
All forms are illusions
Buddhism is truly detached from idols
People who think that Buddhism is the worshipping of an image of the Buddha, or that the Buddha is somebody whom we can appeal to for favours, should know of two very profound verses from the Diamond Sutra that contradict these popular beliefs. To the intellectual, they can lay to rest the suspicion that Buddhism is superstition. To those who are used to praying for divine intervention, they can become self reliant through their own virtuous karma.
It is stated in the Diamond Sutra, “He who sees me (Buddha) in forms or seeks me in sounds is on a heterodox path and cannot see the Tathagata (Buddha).” It further states that, “All forms are but illusions, in seeing that all forms are illusory, one sees the Tathagata”. It is only when we have attained a certain advanced level in the learning and practising of Buddhism that we will be able to understand the profound meaning of these verses. If you were to tell a person who has just started to learn Buddhism that learning Buddhism is like these verses, then he would find them too profound. He would not be able to make out what Buddha is like. Of course, he knows what human beings are like and quite naturally he will assume that only those who are similar in form to human beings are Buddhas. We can say that this is correct, but we can also say that this is wrong. For example, kindergarten teachers may use drawings of an old man and old woman when teaching the young children about grandfathers and grandmothers. Thereafter, when the children see other old folks in such resemblance they know that they are someone else’s grandparents. But, to university students it would be inappropriate for professors to use the same approach when talking about such blood relationships.
It is the same in learning Buddhism. When we encourage a new student of Buddhism to pay respect to the Buddha in the temple or monastery, he will not be frightened when he sees that the Buddha is the same as a human being. At the same time, when he sees that the Buddha and Bodhisattva images are so dignified and compassionate, it will give rise to a feeling of joy and reverence and lead him to learn Buddhism.
Often we come across people who have been learning Buddhism for a long time saying that they saw this Buddha or that Bodhisattva in their dreams. Initially, when we do not know about their level of understanding of Buddhism, we may praise them by saying, “Oh! You have such good affinity with Buddha and Bodhisattva that you can even see their images!” But it is wrong if we always praise them like this. If they report dreams like this for more then 3 times, you have to tell them, “The Mara is here, you have seen the Mara! All the Zen masters advise to obliterate the Buddha when the Buddha appears, and obliterate the Mara when the Mara appears [1].” We cannot praise them any more because they have already developed an attachment to forms.
In the same way, when we are dealing with people who are already advanced in Buddhism, we should use the method of the Diamond Sutra rather than the kindergarten method:
“He who sees me (Buddha) in forms or seeks me in sounds is on a heterodox path and cannot see the Tathagata (Buddha).”
“All forms are but illusions, in seeing that all forms are illusory, one sees the Tathagata.”
At this level, people will realize that Buddhism is the only religion that eradicates superstition and attachment to all forms.
Critics often say that the Buddha image is an idol. They criticize that Buddhism worships idols. In reality, the cross, the Jesus Christ image and Mother Mary, they are also idols. In this sense, is there a religion that does not worship idols? Therefore, we cannot say that Buddhism is the only religion that worships idols. The fact is that only Buddhism does not worship idols. The Diamond Sutra states, “All forms are but illusions, in seeing that all forms are illusory, one sees the Tathagata.”!
The essence of the Buddha, the Buddha Nature is omnipresent in the space of the Dharma realm, and the Dharma Nature is omnipresent in the space.
Notes:
1. To ignore and not to be attached to such forms;. Mara is the Evil One, described as a murderer, hinderer, disturber, destroyer, etc.4) Lastly, I think there are quarters of christians in Singapore who are overtly zealous in trying to bring salvation to their friends. You see, there is a God's eventual timeline for a person to be saved from salvation. But when these christians push it too far, they are using their own efforts, which then now involves their own pride and ego, their pride to want to use humanly effort to bring a person to salvation;cz they believe in using their own efforts to please God, and these mindset would then revert to the system of Laws in the old testament; for in the new testament, God has invoked a new convenent, to embrace grace rather than laws.
I personally like this part of the Christian teachings, aside from the plenty of Christian dogmas which I do not agree on.
Just take the incident when the Korean missionary group was kidnapped in Iraq. Im sure in all wisdom, the holy spirit and God told the group not to proceed, but they still did, in a bid to use human effort to win, to outshine and proof that their church is the most gung-ho in South Korea. The result of course is tragic with the loss of 2 lives.
I posted some interesting Christian stuff in For my thoughts are not your thoughts, a topic created by Omniknight. -
Wisdom and Miracle.
There is a story about a Mother and her dead child. It happened during Jesus and Buddha time.
A dispaired Mother brought her dead child to see Jesus. In a similar senario, another dispaired Mother brought her dead child to see Buddha. Both seeking help, but the result were totally different.
Anyone knew about this story? Or can make a guess about the outcomes ?