Why are there so many religions?
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So which is the real one? or all are real?
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theres no real religion....all were created
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but Jesus Christ is not fictionOriginally posted by thehappybunny:theres no real religion....all were created -
How do you know that he is not fiction?Originally posted by Ferguson:but Jesus Christ is not fiction -
so tat ppl gt lotsa of choices mah
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Please read: What Buddhists Believe --Originally posted by Ferguson:So which is the real one? or all are real?
Man and Religion
...Man developed religion in order to satisfy his desire to understand the life within him and the world outside him. The earliest religions had animistic origins, and they arose out of man's fear of the unknown and his desire to placate the forces which he thought inhabited inanimate objects. Over time these religions underwent changes, being shaped by the geographical, historical, socio-economic, political and intellectual environment existing at that time.
Many of these religions have become organized and are flourishing to this day, backed by a strong following of devotees. Many people are drawn to organized religions because of the pomp and ceremony, while there are some who prefer to practice their own personal religion, inwardly venerating their religious teachers and applying moral principles in their daily life. Because of the importance of practice, every religion claims to be a way of life, not merely a faith. In view of their various origins and paths of development which religions undergo, it is hardly surprising that the religions of man should differ in their approach, the understanding and interpretation of their followers, their goal and how it can be achieved, and their concept of reward and punishment for deeds performed.... (continued in webpage)
Which is the Proper Religion?
....Which is the Proper Religion?
If any religion has the Four Noble Truths and the Eightfold Path, then it can be regarded as a proper religion.
It is a very difficult for a man to find out why there are so many different religions, and which religion is the true one. Followers of every religion are trying to show the superiority of their religion. Diversity has created some uniformity, but in matters of religion, men took upon each other with jealousy, hatred and disdain. The most respected religious practices in one religion are deemed ridiculous to others. To introduce their divine and peaceful messages some people have to resorted to weapons and wars. Have they polluted the good name of religion? It seems that certain religions are responsible for dividing instead of uniting mankind.
To find a true and proper religion, we must weigh with an unbiased mind what exactly is a false religion. False religion or philosophies include: materialism which denies survival after death; amoralism which denies good and evil; any religion which asserts that man is miraculously saved or doomed; theistic evolution which holds that everything is preordained and everyone is destined to attain eventual salvation through mere faith.
Buddhism is free from unsatisfactory and uncertain foundations. Buddhism is realistic and verifiable. Its Truths have been verified by the Buddha, verified by His disciples, and always remain open to be verified by anyone who wishes to do so. And today, the Teachings of the Buddha, are being verified by the most severe methods of scientific investigation.... (continued in webpage)
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Also see: http://www.jenchen.org.sg/vol5no1g.htm (A religion beyond this world[/url]
A Religion beyond this world
By Venerable Shen-Kai
It is commonly believed that all religions are the same because they all teach us to be good. In addition to teaching 'to do no evil and to perform all good deeds", Buddhism distinguishes itself by also teaching 'to purify the mind.' This is a very important difference because all things are created by the mind. Buddhism is also very broad, and it goes beyond the world as we know it - where we come from and where we headed for.
The word 'religion' originated from the Western countries. A religion is a system of faith and worship. In the Chinese language, 'religion' has a broader meaning and refers to the purpose of a teaching and the teaching itself.
Buddhism is more than a system of faith. A practitioner of Buddhism cultivates his mind and deeds, and seeks true freedom or liberation. The development of purity in the body, speech and mind will enlighten the inner wisdom of humanity. Buddhism is a religion based on the profound teachings of Buddha. Buddha's teachings are so broad and profound that sentient beings call Buddha the World Honoured One; the Saint of Saints; the Heaven of Heavens. Buddhism is called 'the illuminating Saintly Teaching', for it teaches what wisdom is and how to develop wisdom.
All religions, except Buddhism, exist in the Three Fields - the Fields of Desire, Form and Formlessness. They are in the cycle of the Six Realms - the Realm of Heaven, Asura, Human, Animal, Ghost and Hell.
Buddhism teaches people 'to do no evil; to perform all good deeds; and to purify the mind.' If people do evil, their evil karma leads them to suffer in the Three Evil Realms - the Realms of Animal, Ghost and Hell. If people perform all good deeds, their good karma brings them the happiness of the Three Good Realms - the Realms of Heaven, Asura and Human. Those who perform great virtuous deeds will be reborn in the Heavenly Realm. There are 28 heavens in the world. In the highest heaven - the Heaven that is beyond the condition of thinking or non-thinking, the heavenly beings do not have a physical nor any form of body. They only have mind-consciousness. If those heavenly beings had committed killing in the past, and that karma presents to them from their mind, they will die immediately. They are then reborn in the Hell Realm because of the past karma of killing. That is why Buddha said 'no true freedom can be found in the Realm of Heaven.'
It is most important that Buddhist practitioners should seek to liberate from the Three Fields or the Six Realms. The practitioners of Hinayana Buddhism must liberate from the 28 heavens to attain Arahathood(the highest level of wisdom and freedom one can attain from the practice of Hinayana Budhism.) If people pursue Buddhahood and want to become a Buddha, they have to relinquish the Arahat path and cultivate the Bodhisattva path. To attain Buddhahood and the supreme enlightenment, people should not do any evil deeds. After performing all good deeds, they should not attach to the good deeds that they have performed. In this way, the ego dies and the true nature of oneself, the Buddha Nature, is revealed. When a person becomes Buddha, the Buddhahood one attains must also be relinquished.
Notes
1. Kalpa: A long period of time; an age. 1 small kalpa = 16.8 million years; 1 medium kalpa = 336 million years; 1 great kalpa = 1.344 billion years.
Buddhism is a profound religion that leads people to go beyond the world itself. Other religions exist in the domain of this mundane world. In Buddhism, 'world' means the Three Fields or the Six Realms. Buddhism will last forever whereas other religions may last hundreds or thousands of years. For example, a previous earth existed before the present earth was formed and existed during the time called the 'Kalpa[1]of Majesty'. There were a thousand Buddhas who appeared on the previous earth. The present time of this earth's existence is called the 'Kalpa of the Virtues'. A thousand Buddhas will appear on the present earth. Sakyamuni Buddha was the fourth Buddha on this earth. After the present earth decays and becomes empty, there will be a new earth. The time during the existence of the future earth is called the 'Kalpa of Stars'. There will also be a thousand Buddhas appearing on the future earth. Therefore, it is said that Buddhism will last forever. Sakyamuni Buddha taught this in a sutra called the "Names of Three Thousand Buddhas'.
Buddhism existed, exists and will exist in the past, the present and the future in worlds in the ten directions of the cosmos. People should feel happy and honoured being a Buddhist.
Most religions, including Buddhism teach people not to do evil and to perform good deeds. However, only Buddhism teaches people how to purify their minds. This is why Buddhism is more profound than other religions. -
All religions are created by human beings, including Christianity. Their founder, Jesus, was a human just like us -- though Christians consider him both God and Human.Originally posted by Ferguson:but Jesus Christ is not fiction
Similarly, the founder of Buddhism, Shakyamuni Buddha, was born a human just like us, he attained enlightenment and became the fully awakened Buddha. The word 'Buddha' means 'awakened one'.
Through his teachings all of us can become enlightened, and there are many people who have become enlightened, even today right now... even some in this forum.
In Buddhism we do not just tell people to blindly believe but to look into the dharma (teachings), practice, and see for yourself. We don't just believe in Buddha but practice so that WE ourselves can attain enlightenment. -
With regards to your question, the Buddha taught the Kalama Sutra.Originally posted by Ferguson:So which is the real one? or all are real?
The summarised version is this:
Kalama Sutra
"Rely not on the teacher/person, but on the teaching. Rely not on the words of the teaching, but on the
spirit of the words. Rely not on theory, but on experience.Do not believe in anything simply because you
have heard it. Do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations. Do
not believe anything because it is spoken and rumored by many. Do not believe in anything because it is
written in your religious books. Do not believe in anything merely on the authority of your teachers and
elders. But after observation and analysis, when you find that anything agrees with reason and is
conducive to the good and the benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it."
- the Buddha
Please do read the full version here: http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/an/an03/an03.065.than.html -
All religions, including Buddhism, are false. So far no religion, including Buddhism, has been able to give up its ID ego that it is correct, hence its self-righteous attitude.
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That view of yours is false and you have not given up your self-righteous attitude.Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:All religions, including Buddhism, are false. So far no religion, including Buddhism, has been able to give up its ID ego that it is correct, hence its self-righteous attitude. -
Originally posted by An Eternal Now:
thanks.
With regards to your question, the Buddha taught the Kalama Sutra.
The summarised version is this:
[b]Kalama Sutra
"Rely not on the teacher/person, but on the teaching. Rely not on the words of the teaching, but on the
spirit of the words. Rely not on theory, but on experience.Do not believe in anything simply because you
have heard it. Do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations. Do
not believe anything because it is spoken and rumored by many. Do not believe in anything because it is
written in your religious books. Do not believe in anything merely on the authority of your teachers and
elders. But after observation and analysis, when you find that anything agrees with reason and is
conducive to the good and the benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it."
- the Buddha
Please do read the full version here: http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/an/an03/an03.065.than.html[/b]
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Just posted in the Atheism forum:Originally posted by An Eternal Now:That view of yours is false and you have not given up your self-righteous attitude.
The Evolution of Religionquote:Originally posted by january:
buddhism believes in karma, nirvana, eternal bliss which to atheist is rubbish stuff.
Except that in Buddhism, this is not a belief system, but something that is observable and experience-able for anyone who investigates according to Buddha's instructions. Therefore, it is actually a science, but it is spiritual science... not 'material science'. It concerns the individual's experience.
Nirvana is also not an after-life thing, but something actualize-able, attainable, experience-able this very life. And many people have experienced it, in the past, and also now.. even some in sgforums.
In Buddhism, we teach that 'eternalism' and 'nihilism' are extremes -- notions of 'eternity' and 'annihilation' does not exist for an enlightened being, because he has eradicated the view that he is a separate, permanently existing self. -
No prob. In the original/full version of the sutra, the Buddha taught this sutra on the occasion where the Kalamas asked the same question as the TS.Originally posted by corebooster:thanks.
As they sat there, the Kalamas of Kesaputta said to the Blessed One, "Lord, there are some priests & contemplatives who come to Kesaputta. They expound & glorify their own doctrines, but as for the doctrines of others, they deprecate them, revile them, show contempt for them, & disparage them. And then other priests & contemplatives come to Kesaputta. They expound & glorify their own doctrines, but as for the doctrines of others, they deprecate them, revile them, show contempt for them, & disparage them. They leave us absolutely uncertain & in doubt: Which of these venerable priests & contemplatives are speaking the truth, and which ones are lying?"
To which Buddha answered, "Of course you are uncertain, Kalamas. Of course you are in doubt. When there are reasons for doubt, uncertainty is born. So in this case, Kalamas, don't go by reports, by legends, by traditions, by scripture, by logical conjecture, by inference, by analogies, by agreement through pondering views, by probability, or by the thought, 'This contemplative is our teacher.' When you know for yourselves that, 'These qualities are unskillful; these qualities are blameworthy; these qualities are criticized by the wise; these qualities, when adopted & carried out, lead to harm & to suffering' — then you should abandon them. (continued in
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/an/an03/an03.065.than.html) -
Quoted from Ken Wilbur who every scientist is jeering at because it's just merely coincedental.Originally posted by An Eternal Now: -
What coincidental? No ideas what you're talking about. And I have no memory of quoting from Ken Wilber for the past few days. Therefore, what you are saying is completely off-topic and shouldn't be here.Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:Quoted from Ken Wilbur who every scientist is jeering at because it's just merely coincedental. -
Just proven true by your answer.Originally posted by An Eternal Now:That view of yours is false and you have not given up your self-righteous attitude.
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Originally posted by An Eternal Now:What coincidental? No ideas what you're talking about. And I have no memory of quoting from Ken Wilber for the past few days. Therefore, what you are saying is completely off-topic and shouldn't be here.
Wilber describes the current state of the "hard" sciences as limited to "narrow science", which only allows evidence from the lowest realm of consciousness, the sensorimotor (the five senses and their extensions). What he calls "broad science" would include evidence from logic, mathematics, and from the symbolic, hermeneutical, and other realms of consciousness. Ultimately and ideally, broad science would include the testimony of meditators and spiritual practitioners. Wilber's own conception of science includes both narrow science and broad science, e.g, using electroencephalogram machines and other technologies to test the experiences of meditators and other spiritual practitioners, creating what Wilber calls "integral science".
He's quoting methodology not science as I have always stated.
According to Wilber's theory, narrow science trumps narrow religion, but broad science trumps narrow science. That is, the natural sciences provide a more inclusive, accurate account of reality than any of the particular exoteric religious traditions. But an integral approach that evaluates both religious claims and scientific claims based on intersubjectivity is preferable to narrow science. -
Off topic.Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:He's quoting methodology not science as I have always stated. -
No. I never said I'm right, there is no need to. I said you're wrong, or rather to rephrase your own words, "You are false. So far you have not been able to give up your ID ego that you are correct, hence your self-righteous attitude."Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:Just proven true by your answer.
In the first place Buddhism is not merely a belief system but testable. I am not self righteous because I do not tell you to blindly believe in someone or that just because someone said so, the theory must be right.Originally posted by An Eternal Now:
No fanaticism
Of Buddhism alone can it be affirmed it is free from all fanaticism. Its aim being to produce in every man a thorough internal transforming by self-conquest, how can it have recourse to might or money or even persuasion for effecting conversion? The Buddha has only shown the way to salvation, and it is left to each individual to decide for himself if he would follow it.
- Prof. Lakshmi Narasu, "The Essence of Buddhism" -
If I am false, then I wouldn't be able to reply you in the first place. If Buddhism doesn't rely on the power of persuasion then how does it transmit? By sentient beings or not even needing any means of transmission? So it can be seen that even a religion that professes to have no self to have an ID ego due to the general behaviour of its practitioners. Case closed.Originally posted by An Eternal Now: -
I think with appearance of technology, it both helps and brings down the buddhist faith.Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:If I am false, then I wouldn't be able to reply you in the first place. If Buddhism doesn't rely on the power of persuasion then how does it transmit? By sentient beings or not even needing any means of transmission? So it can be seen that even a religion that professes to have no self to have an ID ego due to the general behaviour of its practitioners. Case closed.
Never has it been so that information can be disseminate at speed and mass audience in this manner in the past.
I think the idea of no-self is often exaggerately elaborated. I'm not exactly sure did AEN give a inferior representation or HZ yourself deliberately choose to twist the meaning.
No-self is a concept in Buddhism which the Buddha said that there is no conditioned phenomenon exist on its own. This means to say that due to many other contributing causes and factors, then the varies phenomenon exist. And such phenomenon do not last forever. How do we ever imagine forever to be how long?
So no-self here simply refers to that there is not sole entity that pops out of nowhere (as compared to the christian god) and last forever. And that doesn't mean HZ you don't exist. Now HZ exist. How about 50 years ago? Or say 2000 years down the road? Will HZ still exist? Or in fact HZ is just a brand name of your ID in this forum. In fact comparing to the HZ now and 10 years ago, definitely your perception, thinking, maturity, etc would have changed. The HZ you are now is not the HZ 10 years ago.
Your HZ physical form may retain (though it changes too, ageing, no one can stop it) but your other attributes changes as well.
Bhante S Dhammika gave an analogy on football. He was citing that Manchester United exist as a football team. Despite they have changed players, tactics, etc, they still exist and known by the label as Manchester United but however, the attributes (the different strengths in different players) changes.
So in the short time spent, we do have an ID and I mentioned in another thread, it depends what you want to do with your life (ID). Say if you want to be a singer, then probably go through some proper singing school (to change your attributes to your current ID), etc. Therefore because of no-self, there is room for changes and most importantly improvements.
My understanding is Buddhism certainly has persuasion. Buddha Himself told the Sangha that 'let no two walk the same direction, for the good and the benefit of all, share the Dhamma generously'. However, I think there are various degrees of persuasion and how is it done is really up to the individual. Most buddhists are more passive; whereas some buddhist cults are more aggressive (I like that though haha).
However, I really agree with you that buddhists (not all though) usually has a self righteousness issue. They always like to bring down other people's religion. And many times, they have little idea what are these other religions about and quick to label them as spirits, gui3 shen2. But this cannot blame them as many are quick into believe the so-called masters' words.
HZ, if you notice, buddhists are more tolerating to christianity than chinese deities, and to think that most people here are chinese. Haha -
I must admit that yamizi has a better grasp of the many different concepts and the prevailing environment. I was referring to the philosophical ID ego which something that Freud came up with years ago. (Buddhism can be broken down into the religious side and philosophical side so it seems.) That is different from the word identity.Originally posted by yamizi:I think with appearance of technology, it both helps and brings down the buddhist faith.
Never has it been so that information can be disseminate at speed and mass audience in this manner in the past.
I think the idea of no-self is often exaggerately elaborated. I'm not exactly sure did AEN give a inferior representation or HZ yourself deliberately choose to twist the meaning.
No-self is a concept in Buddhism which the Buddha said that there is no conditioned phenomenon exist on its own. This means to say that due to many other contributing causes and factors, then the varies phenomenon exist. And such phenomenon do not last forever. How do we ever imagine forever to be how long?
So no-self here simply refers to that there is not sole entity that pops out of nowhere (as compared to the christian god) and last forever. And that doesn't mean HZ you don't exist. Now HZ exist. How about 50 years ago? Or say 2000 years down the road? Will HZ still exist? Or in fact HZ is just a brand name of your ID in this forum. In fact comparing to the HZ now and 10 years ago, definitely your perception, thinking, maturity, etc would have changed. The HZ you are now is not the HZ 10 years ago.
Your HZ physical form may retain (though it changes too, ageing, no one can stop it) but your other attributes changes as well.
Bhante S Dhammika gave an analogy on football. He was citing that Manchester United exist as a football team. Despite they have changed players, tactics, etc, they still exist and known by the label as Manchester United but however, the attributes (the different strengths in different players) changes.
So in the short time spent, we do have an ID and I mentioned in another thread, it depends what you want to do with your life (ID). Say if you want to be a singer, then probably go through some proper singing school (to change your attributes to your current ID), etc. Therefore because of no-self, there is room for changes and most importantly improvements.
My understanding is Buddhism certainly has persuasion. Buddha Himself told the Sangha that 'let no two walk the same direction, for the good and the benefit of all, share the Dhamma generously'. However, I think there are various degrees of persuasion and how is it done is really up to the individual. Most buddhists are more passive; whereas some buddhist cults are more aggressive (I like that though haha).
However, I really agree with you that buddhists (not all though) usually has a self righteousness issue. They always like to bring down other people's religion. And many times, they have little idea what are these other religions about and quick to label them as spirits, gui3 shen2. But this cannot blame them as many are quick into believe the so-called masters' words.
HZ, if you notice, buddhists are more tolerating to christianity than chinese deities, and to think that most people here are chinese. Haha
Buddhism certainly has good ideas and bad ideas but it relies solely on faith and hope, somethings not everyone has. Thus you can see, it is not the ultimate teaching as transmission must be from person to person. If it is an ultimate teaching, then it doesn't even rely on a person to transmit the teachings. -
Faith is merely one component in Buddhism, not all. And it is not blind faith. Just faith is invested in science as well.Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:I must admit that yamizi has a better grasp of the many different concepts and the prevailing environment. I was referring to the philosophical ID ego which something that Freud came up with years ago. (Buddhism can be broken down into the religious side and philosophical side so it seems.) That is different from the word identity.
Buddhism certainly has good ideas and bad ideas but it relies solely on faith and hope, somethings not everyone has. Thus you can see, it is not the ultimate teaching as transmission must be from person to person. If it is an ultimate teaching, then it doesn't even rely on a person to transmit the teachings. -
So you claim that faith is an unimportant component in Buddhism? If not, why the schism in working with the basic sciences?Originally posted by An Eternal Now:Faith is merely one component in Buddhism, not all. And it is not blind faith. Just faith is invested in science as well. -
Originally posted by Herzog_Zwei:
I never said it is unimportant. I said it is 'merely one component' and it is not blind faith.
So you claim that faith is an unimportant component in Buddhism?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_Powers
The Five Powers (Pali: pañca bala), similar to the Spiritual Faculties, in Buddhism are: Faith, Effort, Mindfulness, Concentration, and Wisdom.
Faith and Wisdom balance each other, as do Energy and Concentration. The Five Faculties are ‘controlling' faculties because they control or master their opposites. The faculties and powers are two aspects of the same thing.
1. Faith (saddha) - controls doubt
2. Energy/Effort/Persistence (viriya) – controls laziness
3. Mindfulness (sati); - controls heedlessness
4. Concentration (samadhi) - controls distraction
5. Wisdom (panna)/Discernment – controls ignoranceIf not, why the schism in working with the basic sciences?
Who said there is?